P&O Ferries told to stay in port

DuxDeluxe
Probably in a much better way than UK and many other countries around the world. Monaco As an example is utterly irrelevant
You say probably, what does that mean?
Who are the top earners, what do they do?
How do the earnings of manual workers compare with the high earners?
 
DuxDeluxe

You say probably, what does that mean?
Who are the top earners, what do they do?
How do the earnings of manual workers compare with the high earners?
The same or similar as in every other country

On the planet.
 
It is called world trade. Supply and demand and it makes the whole economy of everything work
It is world trade and it's complicated because some countries wanted their people to have a better standard of living than the world average. Are there any major economies with high standards of living for their poor but no tariffs?
 
DuxDeluxe

You say probably, what does that mean?
Who are the top earners, what do they do?
How do the earnings of manual workers compare with the high earners?
Could be like some of the middle eastern countries locals reasonably off but cheap labour shipped in with no rights and crap wages.
 
Also there are government aid projects for people on low or no incomes - people who are not legal residents of Singapore don’t get this.
o_O What an outrageous policy. If we did that in the U.K. it would encourage illegal entrants to work under the radar at cash jobs or turn to crime.............


.................nah, surely not, our Border Force and Immigration authorities would catch and deport them. Flying pig.png

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Just a couple of articles about Singapore that may be informative to the weird discussion going on about P&O and their illegal machinations . . .
It seems to me that the difference between the UK and Singapore is that we won't permit the migrant labour (however badly paid) so our own workers have to fill the gap, and we are cutting the government support for our own low paid workers, thus getting the best (worst) of both worlds . . .

I could read more but it's sunny outside and I've got to walk the dog.
 
The same or similar as in every other country

On the planet.
Singapore ranks 158 out if 180 in human rights.
Singapore has one of the highest income inequalities in the world.
Singapore has the highest ratio of millionaires per capita in the world.
Singapore has become a significant tax haven.
You say that my comparison with Monaco is fallacious!!
On the other hand there is an excellent social security system.
A benevolent dictatorship springs to mind keeping everyone in their place and under control.
All this from Wikipedia, of course I have never been there so have no personal experience but have to make opinions by reading and listening to others opinions and hope that published figures are reasonably accurate.
It seems to me that the Economy of Singapore is based on dealers and middlemen of which I have in general a very low opinion.
If you have actual facts rather than generalisations to disprove any of the above I will be happy to be corrected.
 
Probably in a much better way than UK and many other countries around the world. Monaco As an example is utterly irrelevant
Monaco has no industry, just a huge influx of obscenely wealthy people who have made their money elsewhere and pay no taxes where earned because they live in a tax exile country, Not difficult to see why their per capita wealth is so high !!
 
Just a couple of articles about Singapore that may be informative to the weird discussion going on about P&O and their illegal machinations . . .
It seems to me that the difference between the UK and Singapore is that we won't permit the migrant labour (however badly paid) so our own workers have to fill the gap, and we are cutting the government support for our own low paid workers, thus getting the best (worst) of both worlds . . .

I could read more but it's sunny outside and I've got to walk the dog.
I bet the inequalities report doesn't include the migrant workers I how the figures would look then?. I employing migrant workers like that with no rights and deportation if sacked would be classed as trafficking in the UK and quite rightly.

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Monaco has no industry, just a huge influx of obscenely wealthy people who have made their money elsewhere and pay no taxes where earned because they live in a tax exile country, Not difficult to see why their per capita wealth is so high !!
Exactly. Why I said it was irrelevant
 
Nothing really changes as a young apprentice I recall asking for a pay rise, the workshop manager quipped back and said ‘A fair days pay for a fair days work’ and that sort of stuck with me the. I heard the same line again and it was something written in 1881 by Friedrich Engels, yes he was a Marxist but we all want a fair pay for our time we give to our working lives. We can’t all be paid squillions of pounds but….we cannot accept usury Amounts either. We can all justify what we have or or being paid and the benefits that go with our jobs. I just feel very sorry for the P&O staff that have lost thier jobs and for those on the measly new pay and conditions.
 
Singapore ranks 158 out if 180 in human rights.
Singapore has one of the highest income inequalities in the world.
Singapore has the highest ratio of millionaires per capita in the world.
Singapore has become a significant tax haven.
You say that my comparison with Monaco is fallacious!!
On the other hand there is an excellent social security system.
A benevolent dictatorship springs to mind keeping everyone in their place and under control.
All this from Wikipedia, of course I have never been there so have no personal experience but have to make opinions by reading and listening to others opinions and hope that published figures are reasonably accurate.
It seems to me that the Economy of Singapore is based on dealers and middlemen of which I have in general a very low opinion.
If you have actual facts rather than generalisations to disprove any of the above I will be happy to be corrected.
To be honest, I have better things to do….. I stand by ITF rates being fair and reasonable for global seafarers
 
Could be like some of the middle eastern countries locals reasonably off but cheap labour shipped in with no rights and crap wages.
We were talking about ITF rates for seafarers. I have worked all over the Mid East and seen effective slavery first hand
 
I see that the Pride of Hull sailed, no passengers from Hull to Europoort on Wednesday evening. I also see that the Pride of Rotterdam is sailing from Rotterdam tonight with passengers, and you can book tickets from Hull for the return journey tomorrow night. I was booked on Saturday nights crossing, but have changed it to Harwich.

And, for those people travelling Saturday night, you will need to put your watches on by 2 hours,
Losing 2 hours sleep !

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Well, we liked it there!:love:

View attachment 599214
Therein lies the nub of the problem.
We in the western(1st?) world live the lifestyles we do on the backs of cheap labour in the 3rd world, don't know what happened to the 2nd world!
I include myself in that.
To get back on topic slightly the P&O situation arrises because we as customers are not prepared to pay fares that will enable P&O to employ UK employees and the same applies to most of the products and services that we use or consume.
 
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We were talking about ITF rates for seafarers. I have worked all over the Mid East and seen effective slavery first hand
One of the problems here is that the media have heard this £1.80 per hour and everyone believes it. In reality there are additions to this, leave enhancement, bank holiday entitlement, overtime payments and something always overlooked is that all food, heating etc is also paid for.

Also this is the lowest pay rate which applies to a junior ER rates or OS, Officers (by which I include Engineers, we have earned it) rates are higher.
 
One of the problems here is that the media have heard this £1.80 per hour and everyone believes it. In reality there are additions to this, leave enhancement, bank holiday entitlement, overtime payments and something always overlooked is that all food, heating etc is also paid for.

Also this is the lowest pay rate which applies to a junior ER rates or OS, Officers (by which I include Engineers, we have earned it) rates are higher.
Yes but people do like to pursue their own agenda
 

Maybe it's a bit like the States a nice place if you're wealthy not if you're poor, ill without private healthcare etc. I seem to recall they're not very keen on freedom of speech and freedom to protest.
Ah yes Singapore, a Fine city

1648208396066_copy_600x627.jpg


Great place to visit
...but to live :unsure:?
For the masses, illusion of freedom. Told where to live.

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Ah yes Singapore, a Fine city

View attachment 599235

Great place to visit
...but to live :unsure:?
For the masses, illusion of freedom. Told where to live.
So what? Their house, their rules.

All the people that I know who actually live there say it is a great place to live. The best rule there is “No Durians” ….. if you know, you know… :wink:
 
To get back on topic slightly the P&O situation arrises because we as customers are not prepared to pay fares that will enable P&O to employ UK employees and the same applies to most of the products and services that we use or consume.
Even if people did pay a fair amount companies wouldn't pay decent wages just treat it all as extra profit. Same withg anything.

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Wh
This government would not allow that to happen they are the friend of such people not the workers. Brexit allowed this to happen it couldn’t happen to EU workers.
what about Irish_Ferries and Brittany Ferries Ireland ? Ireland is part of the EU. Very few Irish crew on those ships.
 
One of the problems here is that the media have heard this £1.80 per hour and everyone believes it. In reality there are additions to this, leave enhancement, bank holiday entitlement, overtime payments and something always overlooked is that all food, heating etc is also paid for.

Also this is the lowest pay rate which applies to a junior ER rates or OS, Officers (by which I include Engineers, we have earned it) rates are higher.
I recall as youngish engineer working Saturdays @ time and half and Sundays at Double time, this helped to pay for my mortgage, and other things at the time I was on around £17K the pay at P&O is stated at £5.50 an hour which for a 40 hour week is £11K per year even with overtime you would be hard pushed to get to £17K. the benefits you mention are standard for most who work all of course Food.

I have worked in Offices which are heated, have had Biscuits and Coffee tea's etc all at the companies expense. Many firms used to provide Luncheon vouchers (OMG). The poor individuals on £11K what sort of retirement are they going to have.....certainly not one with a Motorhome let alone a place they can call thier own.

When I employ a Labourer I pay them £200 per day, I have a good group of guys who I can rely on, when one had an accident recently and there was breakage on a customer's property I was called immediately, they told me what had happened and were truly mortified they thought it was going to cost them personally £500, I acquired the replacement for £180, helped fix the damage and split the cost with them, so they did not lose a days wage, this is called ethical employment.

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