Current U.K. law on up plating has been changed WITHOUT consultation

[Barclaybasher]

The plan is to increase the weight entitlement for B Class licence. That means that if you have B1, then you can drive up to 4250, instead of 3500. Nothing will change on your licence.

Much on the thread is speculation and hope.
For many reasons it has made sense to increase PHG to 4250kg but I wouldn't be surprised if they kept medicals at 70 for drivers of vehicles with revenue weights over 3500kg.......just saying.....

 

[L' Hobo]

Much on the thread is speculation and hope.
For many reasons it has made sense to increase PHG to 4250kg but I wouldn't be surprised if they kept medicals at 70 for drivers of vehicles with revenue weights over 3500kg.......just saying.....

Why start at 70, why not 65?

It doesn't make sense as 70 is now the new 60!

 

[Gellyneck]

It doesn't make sense as 70 is now the new 60!

Hey you! Stoap it!

I'm still working on the principle that 70 is the new 40 (well, I'm trying to convince myself that it is!).

 

[JaG]

Much on the thread is speculation and hope.
For many reasons it has made sense to increase PHG to 4250kg but I wouldn't be surprised if they kept medicals at 70 for drivers of vehicles with revenue weights over 3500kg.......just saying.....

I watched the YouTube video, made at the NEC recently and from what I can make of it, the EU 4th directive, or whatever it is may be:....keep the medical at 70, extend it to five years instead of three however, medicals more often, say yearly, self assessment unless disclosed medical conditions. Absolutely pointless, in my opinion.

 

[The Artilleryman]

Much on the thread is speculation and hope.
For many reasons it has made sense to increase PHG to 4250kg but I wouldn't be surprised if they kept medicals at 70 for drivers of vehicles with revenue weights over 3500kg.......just saying.....

If Category B adds "motorcaravan not exceeding 4250kg" it will remain a class 1 vehicle and renewing licence at 70 will be the same as now.

D4 medical at 70 only comes about as C1 (on grandfather rites) becomes class 2 at age 70. This is a fudge as vocational licences (class 2 vehicles), have an initial medical on application, then every 5 years 45 - 65, then yearly after that.

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[Molly A]

I wouldn't trust the new lot not to screw us rich, pensioner, passion wagon owners if, (when) they are given the chance.

What worse than the ladt ot did, raising tax levels to the highest since the end of WW2?

 

[Tony50]

What worse than the ladt ot did, raising tax levels to the highest since the end of WW2?

The only money government has is from the people and businesses, the bird has come home to roost, money was poured in to keep people in jobs , COVID has/ had to be payed for whichever government.

 

[martin2603]

No doubt the Insurance Companies will be rubbing their grubby hands together with premium increases for all those heavier Motorhomes.
I believe that these changes were discussed to overcome the E V Van manufacturers who were basically unable to manufacture a Van with a viable payload. It will be interesting to see what happens here, It could have far reaching consequences for the VOSA Dept , re taco fitting over 3.5t or not! EU rules have now taken 3.5t vehicles into Operater Licensing!
If the DL licence B category is adopted here life will be easier for a lot of us .
Time of course will tell.

 

[poppycamper]

Strange but I have just read, maybe true maybe false, and never mentioned on here but a driver with a car license can drive a minibus upto a max 3500kg.
However of said minibus is fitted with passenger aids, i.e. wheel chair lift etc it can then weight max 4250kg... interesting.... SO
if I convert said minibus to motorcaravan AND keep wheelchair lift, does that mean I can then legally drive it at 4250kg.. ????

 

[The Artilleryman]

Not if you change it to a "motorcaravan".

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[Minxy]

Only in the UK.
When it's in Europe it can't be picked up by UK anpr etc so unless they physically drive round to your registered address how would they know? And as no address given on a sorn declaration nothing states it has to be stored at the registered address.

AND if eu doesn't have access to UK system anymore how would anyone in the EU know the vehicle wasn't taxed.

They can check just as everyone else does as you can easily search online to find out, along with MOT status.

 

[Minxy]

It's these in/out, up/down, black/white, left/right responses from gus-lopez Richard, which makes me want to vote for him as Prime Minister if he was ever in the running. That and his possible draconian (but very effective) choices of punishment to deal with life's scrotes.

Bring it on Richard.

Jock.

Are you mad!!!!!! He's all for making everyone pay the higher rate of road tax so those of us only paying £165 a yera will get a massive increase!!!

 

[Northernraider]

They can check just as everyone else does as you can easily search online to find out, along with MOT status.

Aye

Like anyone is going to check or care .

No one in the EU cares if you have paid roadtax in the UK.

 

[Minxy]

Aye

Like anyone is going to check or care .

No one in the EU cares if you have paid roadtax in the UK.

Yeah I know, but they will care if someone is in any sort of incident and then if they find they're falling foul of UK requirements they EU bods may be more interested and/or inform the DVLA etc ... mind you the DVLA mob would be as confused as hell as they haven't a clue how stuff should be applied in in the UK normally so trying to sort out how it applies when a UK vehicles is used abroad is likely to give them palpitations!

 

[PaulW2]

Aye

Like anyone is going to check or care .

No one in the EU cares if you have paid roadtax in the UK.

But if they have reason to be concerned about you they may check.

You're on their roads and you may get away with it but sometimes you'll get caught.

For instance like when they check a UK-registered vehicle to discover it was last MOT'd 5 years ago but has strangely not been registered as an import or been plated as it should have been in the European country.

Then bad things happen.

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[PaulW2]

Yeah I know, but they will care if someone is in any sort of incident and then if they find they're falling foul of UK requirements they EU bods may be more interested and/or inform the DVLA etc ... mind you the DVLA mob would be as confused as hell as they haven't a clue how stuff should be applied in in the UK normally so trying to sort out how it applies when a UK vehicles is used abroad is likely to give them palpitations!

Simpler than that I think.

Your vehicle isn't legal on UK roads and therefore not legal on ours.

It is confiscated.

You can sue us in a French court if you like, once you've appointed a French lawyer. But you're not an EU citizen and have no EU-wide framework to rely on; it's just you vs France. Bonne chance.

Reverse it, to make it clearer. Some .... say Romanian turns up, in a Romanian vehicle, and is in an incident in the UK. It transpires on investigation that the vehicle isn't legal on Romanian roads and so also not legal here. What happens?

 

[pagey]

Simpler than that I think.

Your vehicle isn't legal on UK roads and therefore not legal on ours.

It is confiscated.

You can sue us in a French court if you like, once you've appointed a French lawyer. But you're not an EU citizen and have no EU-wide framework to rely on; it's just you vs France. Bonne chance.

Reverse it, to make it clearer. Some .... say Romanian turns up, in a Romanian vehicle, and is in an incident in the UK. It transpires on investigation that the vehicle isn't legal on Romanian roads and so also not legal here. What happens?

%$-* all

 

[martin2603]

The other oddity is the Ci E category, if you have the above you can drive a combination up to 12 tons!

 

[JockandRita]

Are you mad!!!!!! He's all for making everyone pay the higher rate of road tax so those of us only paying £165 a yera will get a massive increase!!!

Money well spent I'd say Mel, especially if invested back into the road system, (which it currently isn't), and if he gets rid of those shysters from office who are only there for their own gain, rather than to serve their countrymen in the manner expected of them.
gus-lopez for Prime Minister.

Cheers,

Jock.

 

[Apacheman]

Just an example and I know everyone is different. Left the UK for France and Spain on 12th April this year. Returned on the 12th June.
I get to Europe whilst the vehicle is taxed and then SORN it. But I still lose the remainder of Aprils tax. Before returning home I have to tax it for the full month of June.
I save 1months tax for May just over £13.
I spend the whole of the time it’s not taxed abroad with a niggly feeling in case anything happens and what the outcome might be.
Just not worth the hassle!

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[PaulW2]

Just an example and I know everyone is different. Left the UK for France and Spain on 12th April this year. Returned on the 12th June.
I get to Europe whilst the vehicle is taxed and then SORN it. But I still lose the remainder of Aprils tax. Before returning home I have to tax it for the full month of June.
I save 1months tax for May just over £13.
I spend the whole of the time it’s not taxed abroad with a niggly feeling in case anything happens and what the outcome might be.
Just not worth the hassle!

And, maybe, the knowledge that you did it fraudulently and can be had for that if they find out. (Per the SORN document can’t be done if you take the vehicle abroad. What are you going to do? Rely on a pedantic lay grammarian? )

 

[martin2603]

Having just spoken to SVTECH they state that the only change is the non change in RFL when you go up from 3500 kg to whatever you chose. If your vehicle was origionally 3500kg you will NOT benefit fron the Private HGV rate. Al the rest is total pie in the sky.
Sorry chaps,

 

[L' Hobo]

Aye

Like anyone is going to check or care .

No one in the EU cares if you have paid roadtax in the UK.

But they might in Morocco if the find they can charge you 50% more for not complying with UK law if you're involved in an accident?

 

[Northernraider]

Just an example and I know everyone is different. Left the UK for France and Spain on 12th April this year. Returned on the 12th June.
I get to Europe whilst the vehicle is taxed and then SORN it. But I still lose the remainder of Aprils tax. Before returning home I have to tax it for the full month of June.
I save 1months tax for May just over £13.
I spend the whole of the time it’s not taxed abroad with a niggly feeling in case anything happens and what the outcome might be.
Just not worth the hassle!

What about if you went on a real holiday for 6 - 9 months. Would it be worth it then ?

 

[Orion]

Having just spoken to SVTECH they state that the only change is the non change in RFL when you go up from 3500 kg to whatever you chose. If your vehicle was origionally 3500kg you will NOT benefit fron the Private HGV rate. Al the rest is total pie in the sky.
Sorry chaps,

Does that apply to both M1 and N1 vehicles?

Did they give any indication if the F.1 Max. Permissible Mass entry on the V5C would still be updated to reflect the new increased weight? Could be very important if stopped by the authorities outwith the U.K. as ‘Revenue Weight’ would mean nothing to them.

Going forward, and if the revision to 4250kg does happen but the PLG/PHGV cutoff doesn’t alter, then I can see an awful lot of vans that came out of the factory plated at 3650kg plus by Fiat etc. being registered at that as a minimum by the converters/dealers. DVLA and Govt. would stand to lose a lot more RFL revenue then rather than the minimal amount through denying the up plated RFL ATM.

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[WESTY66]

Does that apply to both M1 and N1 vehicles?

Did they give any indication if the F.1 Max. Permissible Mass entry on the V5C would still be updated to reflect the new increased weight? Could be very important if stopped by the authorities outwith the U.K. as ‘Revenue Weight’ would mean nothing to them.

Going forward, and if the revision to 4250kg does happen but the PLG/PHGV cutoff doesn’t alter, then I can see an awful lot of vans that came out of the factory plated at 3650kg plus by Fiat etc. being registered at that as a minimum by the converters/dealers. DVLA and Govt. would stand to lose a lot more RFL revenue then rather than the minimal amount through denying the up plated RFL ATM.

I can see all 4250kg (if the weight goes up from 3.5 to 4.25) and under paying the £345 or whatever that goes up to, they have a 22 billion black hole to fill

 

[gus-lopez]

No one in the EU cares if you have paid roadtax in the UK.

Unfortunately they do in the event of an accident. First thing the lawyers do is ask " are they resident?"
" has the licence been changed"
if tourist then "is it taxed insured mot'd etc. in own country?"
If there are injuries or a death then it's even worse. I've had it tried on with me being a foreigner in an accident with injuries. Not realising that I spoke spanish & in a police station where the copper put him straight.
Or the woman at a red light T boned by a drunk who fell asleep.First thing asked was 'has the licence been changed ' as she was resident.No .whole lot down to her & her own insurance would not pay out for her new car as she was "driving without a licence" They paid for the drunks replacement car though even though he got banned.
You have to be whiter than white.

The other oddity is the Ci E category, if you have the above you can drive a combination up to 12 tons!

C1E is only 8250kgs under grandfather rights.

 

[Orion]

I can see all 4250kg (if the weight goes up from 3.5 to 4.25) and under paying the £345 or whatever that goes up to, they have a 22 billion black hole to fill

That’ll be fun to see with the light haulage, courier, delivery industry, unions, etc. etc. as yet another pack of dogs to rag them all the way to the next election in 2029 - if not before!

 

[WESTY66]

That’ll be fun to see with the light haulage, courier, delivery industry, unions, etc. etc. as yet another pack of dogs to rag them all the way to the next election in 2029 - if not before!

Might just be for motorhomes and conversions
He’s not frightened of unpopular decisions is two tier

 

[Northernraider]

I can see all 4250kg (if the weight goes up from 3.5 to 4.25) and under paying the £345 or whatever that goes up to, they have a 22 billion black hole to fill

So can I.

So I'll be continuing to have vans over that weight

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