Beating the 90/180 day Schengen rule

[MarionK]

It’s at home. In the uk. It’s left for a short time on its own. Jan 1st. Fly out have a long weekend. Fly back home. That will start the clock ticking April 1st drive MH into Europe for 78 days leave it at a park for three or four days your choice fly home and that will have completed your 90 in 180. Then return and complete your first 90 in the next 180 and drive MH back home.

Rolling means that the next 180 day period doesn't start when you used up your 90 days. It's any 180 consecutive days. In your example you would have spent 78 from the 1st of April, that means that you only have 12 days left until 180 days from 1st April. i.e. if you go for more than 12 days before the end of September (give or take a couple of days) you would be over the 90 days. After end of Sep. (i.e. 180 days from 1st April) then you start a fresh 90/180. If you do get stopped, tell them the truth, that you really thought you had another x days. I'm sure you won't be the first to have got it wrong.

 

[ukfetchfan]

Ian.s - using the hypothetical dates you have suggested in your earlier post the online Schengen calculator gives the following results. You would not be able to enter the EU again until late September.

Do use the calculator, put your actual dates in and see what the computer says! At least then you will be sure

 

[jongood]

I have. I’m also doing it. You have put in your calculations three months from the first of Jan. That not what I said. Fly out 1st Jan fly back 2nd. The clock has started ticking. Drive back out in your MH at the end of March and stay near three months. Stil 90 day in 180. Then repeat in Reverse Do the first 90 days of your next 180. As for costs. I didn’t say it was cheap. But is cheaper than taking the MH back and forth

what you are missing is its a rolling 90/180 and you have to effectively count backwards from the end.

 

[Ian.s]

Rolling means that the next 180 day period doesn't start when you used up your 90 days. It's any 180 consecutive days. In your example you would have spent 78 from the 1st of April, that means that you only have 12 days left until 180 days from 1st April. i.e. if you go for more than 12 days before the end of September (give or take a couple of days) you would be over the 90 days. After end of Sep. (i.e. 180 days from 1st April) then you start a fresh 90/180. If you do get stopped, tell them the truth, that you really thought you had another x days. I'm sure you won't be the first to have got it wrong.

I haven’t. I think there’s a misunderstanding in the description. I’m actually doing it now no problems with customs

 

[jumar]

I would only wish that anyone on here who knows a way around the 90/180 day ruling or bringing fresh produce into Europe, smuggling produce back into the UK, therefore bending or breaking the rules please, please, KEEP IT TO YOURSELF....If you have successfully managed to avoid being caught out, fined, deported, or SHOT then keep it under your hat....
There are some law abiding, genuine motorhomers on here that might not know or understand what the Withdrawal Agreement really means to them....therefore these innocent folk might be led into following the Cavalier approach of others, which could be something they didn't really sign up for..
If posts are to gain Smugness points...Look what I've done, I've Beaten the system, then I believe you are not doing anyone any favours...
Please let others decide for themselves, if they want to foul the system then so be it..
Let folk decide for themselves if it's really worth taking a chance..

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[jumar]

Don't you think people can think for themselves? You sound like some school teacher who likes to keep the children in the dark because unlike you they are too stupid to make choices.

In respect to the 90 day limit, I pointed out everyone in the EU regardless of their nationality has a 90 day limit, a French guy in Spain and a German in France and so on. The loop holes are clear and millions all over Europe use them, it's the fault of stupid laws that contradict each other why it's ignored, Anyone who takes on here what is said as fact without checking with other sources , is like a person who is told jumping off a cliff is safe and then does it.

Those in the UK when entering the EU at any point have 90 days and should leave any EU point before that date or risk a fine and the possibility of not been able to return, where in the EU you spend those 90 days is unenforceable and almost impossible to prove, if you exercise your right to not incriminate yourself.

A simple response would be to Dis-agree, point out why they are wrong and explain what you know or think, lecturing to people to follow your dictates and vitue signalling at the same time is not a good look.

Have a nice day.

Actually, I hadn't seen any of your posts, I was referring to some other post that could be encouraging to others who would led to believe that breaking or bending Withdrawal ruling was quite OK to do....nothing more than that...Thanks for wishing me a good day...may I return the greetings to you...,

I've just found your post....you write with a meaningful tone....I see you are a newcomer here...Welcome, We look forward to your subscription,..you don't know me... I'm a Spanish resident.....have been for a while.
My post was to ask some posters not to encourage others to break the rules directly, deferring to the WA....nothing at all to your post about parking next to a No Motorhome sign....by the way... I've never been a School Teacher....perhaps I could have been...

 

[62272]

Free movement of persons | Fact Sheets on the European Union | European Parliament

Read about the free movement of persons. Fact Sheets provide an overview of European integration and the role of the European Parliament.

www.europarl.europa.eu

this may help in regards to EU citizens and their spouses.

A EU citizen may stay indefinitely in another member states‘ country, but there are rules and requirements listed within the fact sheet (registration with authorities/not being a burden on the state etc…)

 

[62272]

Also, some very confusing concepts or explainations on here about how the 90/180 rule works.

It is really simple, count back 180 days from now (or wherever you plan to return to the UK (or go outside Schengen) and you should only be able to count no more than 90 days of being in the Schengen area, to be within the rules for the UK agreement.

If you use your entire 90 day allowance in one go, then you have to remain outside Schengen states for a full 90 days, after which you start to clear each day of your initial 90 days, therefore go out for another full 90 days, repeatedly, 90 on/90 off.

 

[jumar]

Free movement of persons | Fact Sheets on the European Union | European Parliament

Read about the free movement of persons. Fact Sheets provide an overview of European integration and the role of the European Parliament.

www.europarl.europa.eu

this may help in regards to EU citizens and their spouses.

A EU citizen may stay indefinitely in another member states‘ country, but there are rules and requirements listed within the fact sheet (registration with authorities/not being a burden on the state etc…)

...Do you know any Funsters who are EU Citizens by any chance...perhaps Frankie...any others, I wonder? Perhaps those with a Irish Passport....of course..

 

[bigtwin]

Six months are possible without visas. It’s 90 days in 180. Let’s say you fly out 1st of January Have a day or two in your chosen county. Fly back and the clock starts ticking. Then travel out in the MH for the last 88 days or so of your first 180 days. On the last few days fly back exit the country see your family etc. Then fly back and start the first of you next 90 days in 180. Not as complicated as it seems and six months with a trip to see the folks back home in between

A question if I may; How many 180 day periods do you believe exist in a single calendar year?

Ian

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[Ian.s]

A question if I may; How many 180 day periods do you believe exist in a single calendar year?

Ian

2

 

[Ian.s]

A question if I may; How many 180 day periods do you believe exist in a single calendar year?

Ian

Two and irrelevant.

 

[nicholsong]

A question if I may; How many 180 day periods do you believe exist in a single calendar year?

Ian

Your question should have been how many rolling 180 day periods, because that is the measurement prescribed.

The answer is 365/366(Leap year)

 

[jongood]

I would only wish that anyone on here who knows a way around the 90/180 day ruling or bringing fresh produce into Europe, smuggling produce back into the UK, therefore bending or breaking the rules please, please, KEEP IT TO YOURSELF....If you have successfully managed to avoid being caught out, fined, deported, or SHOT then keep it under your hat....
There are some law abiding, genuine motorhomers on here that might not know or understand what the Withdrawal Agreement really means to them....therefore these innocent folk might be led into following the Cavalier approach of others, which could be something they didn't really sign up for..
If posts are to gain Smugness points...Look what I've done, I've Beaten the system, then I believe you are not doing anyone any favours...
Please let others decide for themselves, if they want to foul the system then so be it..
Let folk decide for themselves if it's really worth taking a chance..

This would be a fairer comment, if there werent quite so many brits determined to gold plate the rules and then try and enforce their own stance; some are really dictatorial about it, which must make it pretty difficult for the newbies trying to assimilate useful information. Having said that I like the balance that is normally achieved and that its mostly done without rancour.

 

[StephandJohn]

Does this rule apply to Southern Ireland?

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[Billylou]

Does this rule apply to Southern Ireland?

No

 

[StephandJohn]

Thanks. Didn't think so.

 

[HarryML7]

Some good clear information regarding visas on DriverAbroad.com

 

[bigtwin]

Two and irrelevant.

Very relevant, and just reinforces that you don’t understand the process.

As nicholsong points out, there are actually 365 different 180 day assessment periods in a year.

Your question should have been how many rolling 180 day periods, because that is the measurement prescribed.

The answer is 365/366(Leap year)

You are, of course, correct.

Ian

 

[62272]

...Do you know any Funsters who are EU Citizens by any chance...perhaps Frankie...any others, I wonder? Perhaps those with a Irish Passport....of course..

Or french

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[jimdob]

That’s my point. The only checks on your passport are at point of entry and exit from U.K. I’m sure there’s a way of tracking your vehicle’s movement across borders and there may be a way of linking passports to vehicles but we’re getting into deep state surveillance stuff there and I doubt the bloke in the box at Calais has the password for that particular database!

In some countries in the EU you are not allowed dash cams as they are wary of surveillance. So figure, I think you would be alright

 

[Ian.s]

Very relevant, and just reinforces that you don’t understand the process.

As nicholsong points out, there are actually 365 different 180 day assessment periods in a year.



You are, of course, correct.

Ian

But only two where I would be assessed

 

[Ian.s]

But only two where I would be assessed

Indeed there are but I answered your question literally. For the last two years I have been entering and leaving Europe using my described method. I can reaffirm that I don’t spend any more than 90 days in any 180 period. The key is how long you stay in Europe when you start the clock ticking. The method I use enables a quick trip home in between my six month stay. Still I seem to be having a problem getting that across. Works for me

 

[bigtwin]

But only two where I would be assessed

No, there are 365 assessment periods in every year.

You mentioned ‘starts the clock’. The clock is ticking everyday of the year. Each day has its own 180 day assessment period.

Each day, you have to count back 180 days to see how many days in that period you have already spent in the Schengen Zone. If you have already spent 90 days in that period, then you couldn’t travel into the zone. You need to do this assessment every day. Alternatively, use one of the many 90/180 day calculators to assess your situation. Those calculators allow you to input planned future trips and will tell you whether you can enact your plans without exceeding your 90 day allowance. If they show that you’ll exceed your allowance then you’ll need to revise your plans either by delaying your departure, or reducing the duration of your trip.

Ian

 

[Ian.s]

No, there are 365 assessment periods in every year.

You mentioned ‘starts the clock’. The clock is ticking everyday of the year. Each day has its own 180 day assessment period.

Each day, you have to count back 180 days to see how many days in that period you have already spent in the Schengen Zone. If you have already spent 90 days in that period, then you couldn’t travel into the zone. You need to do this assessment every day. Alternatively, use one of the many 90/180 day calculators to assess your situation. Those calculators allow you to input planned future trips and will tell you whether you can enact your plans without exceeding your 90 day allowance. If they show that you’ll exceed your allowance then you’ll need to revise your plans either by delaying your departure, or reducing the duration of your trip.

Ian

I agree. I’ll choose an arbitrary day. Jan 1st. Fly out to Spain for two days. Get back home and start counting back. I then return to Spain on April 2nd and continue counting back. I return home 88 days therefore using my 90 in 180. Two days later return to Spain and use the first 90 of my 180. Then return home for three months before I start again. I have been doing this for two years with no problems. Unless I have been lucky. The clock ticking only applies to me

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[Camdoon]

My dog is now Spanish. Does that entitle me to any parental rights?

 

[nicholsong]

Your question should have been how many rolling 180 day periods, because that is the measurement prescribed.

The answer is 365/366(Leap year)

Of course had your question been how many rolling 180 day periods exist entirely within a single calendar year , the answer would have been about 182, because some 180 day periods, which started at the end of June would not have completed before the end of the calendar year.

 

[Billylou]

Hi Ian.s, not wishing to get involved but I thought this might help. Ive put your dates into a Schengen calculator and you’ll see you will have overstayed. This is something I’ve read a lot about and from what I’ve learnt bigtwin is correct. I hope this helps.

 

[bigtwin]

I agree. I’ll choose an arbitrary day. Jan 1st. Fly out to Spain for two days. Get back home and start counting back. I then return to Spain on April 2nd and continue counting back. I return home 88 days therefore using my 90 in 180. Two days later return to Spain and use the first 90 of my 180. Then return home for three months before I start again. I have been doing this for two years with no problems. Unless I have been lucky. The clock ticking only applies to me

I return home 88 days therefore using my 90 in 180.

Presumably you meant “I return home AFTER 88 days ….”?

Two days later return to Spain and use the first 90 of my 180.

I don’t understand what you mean by “use the first 90 …”

I think you’re saying that you were in Spain for 88 days, you then flew home for 2 days before returning to Spain again for 90 days. Is that correct?

If so, in a 180 day period you spent 178 days in Spain? Is that correct?

Ian

 

[bigtwin]

Of course had your question been how many rolling 180 day periods exist entirely within a single calendar year , the answer would have been about 182, because some 180 day periods, which started at the end of June would not have completed before the end of the calendar year.

Agreed.

Ian

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