Friendly but firm police caution re A frame in France

I just love the soft blue cheese's like dolcelatte. A really strong Cheddar is nice as well.
 
Larrynwin said:
I think the point is being missed. There was mention earlier in the thread stating that caravans on Aires was a problem but trailers not included in the post.
Aires I understand are for Camping Cars ie Motorhomes and it's likely if a motorhome is towing a trailer it's not a problem whereas a caravan is entirely different.
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I was on the aire at Mirembeau just prior to Twin Lakes. The rules did not preclude trailers and there was one MH with a trailer and one with an A-frame, both French. Though it was an aire for MHs, a caravan came in for the night.

Not bad value, 8 euro, big spaces and 16 amp electric points, Super U opposite.
 
wiljoy said:
Talked to many French motorhomers this year and it is illegal to use a tow frame. Much the same as all of Europe. Depends on the policeman that stops you.
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Is it the A frame that's illegal or as in Spain it's illegal to tow any vehicle by ANY means be it a A frame, rope,chain or straight bar? ONLY licensed garages ( Grua ) can tow in Spain.
 
I purchase a 'A Frame' from TowBars2TowCars two years ago and have toured France and Spain without any problems.

I purchased from TowBars2TowCars as I found it to be very light in comparison with others, very easy to fit and with their magic electrical braking system it meant that there was little modification required to the car being towed and no modification needed to the Motorhome just the 13 pin electrics.

It also has EUROPEAN TYPE APPROVAL PAPERS which was very useful when in Spain this year talking to a Spanish Police Officer that spoke perfect English as he had spent most of his childhood in the UK. I asked if I could take my Motorhome and Tow Car to the 'ITV' the Spanish equivalent to our 'VOSA' in Motril.

Here they fully examined the system and reviewed all my paperwork and after a discussion with their superiors declared my outfit completely safe as they deemed the vehicle being towed to be a 'Trailer'

We found the inspectors to be very friendly and understanding, they even made us coffee, all I can say is I don't know what all the fuss is about. All these stories about being 'Fined' I have not meet anybody yet that can say that they had definitely been stopped and fined!!

Off to Spain again next Feb so see you on the road.
 
Midnightflyer said:
I purchase a 'A Frame' from TowBars2TowCars two years ago and have toured France and Spain without any problems.

I purchased from TowBars2TowCars as I found it to be very light in comparison with others, very easy to fit and with their magic electrical braking system it meant that there was little modification required to the car being towed and no modification needed to the Motorhome just the 13 pin electrics.

It also has EUROPEAN TYPE APPROVAL PAPERS which was very useful when in Spain this year talking to a Spanish Police Officer that spoke perfect English as he had spent most of his childhood in the UK. I asked if I could take my Motorhome and Tow Car to the 'ITV' the Spanish equivalent to our 'VOSA' in Motril.

Here they fully examined the system and reviewed all my paperwork and after a discussion with their superiors declared my outfit completely safe as they deemed the vehicle being towed to be a 'Trailer'

We found the inspectors to be very friendly and understanding, they even made us coffee, all I can say is I don't know what all the fuss is about. All these stories about being 'Fined' I have not meet anybody yet that can say that they had definitely been stopped and fined!!

Off to Spain again next Feb so see you on the road.
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It has never been suggested that you cannot tow a car on an A frame in either France or Spain. Only that it is illegal according to the available information from their respective Governments' .
 
Midnightflyer said:
All these stories about being 'Fined' I have not meet anybody yet that can say that they had definitely been stopped and fined!!
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I don't think my Mum has met any, but just because she hasn't doesn't mean they don't. '\ I personally know quite a few (more than 6) who have been stopped and fined in Spain.

Our Government warns motorhome drivers specifically..

Tow a car with a motorhome
Towing a car behind a motor home using an A-frame is illegal in Spain and you will be fined for using one. https://www.gov.uk/guidance/living-in-spain
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Midnightflyer said:
I purchase a 'A Frame' from TowBars2TowCars two years ago and have toured France and Spain without any problems.

I purchased from TowBars2TowCars as I found it to be very light in comparison with others, very easy to fit and with their magic electrical braking system it meant that there was little modification required to the car being towed and no modification needed to the Motorhome just the 13 pin electrics.

It also has EUROPEAN TYPE APPROVAL PAPERS which was very useful when in Spain this year talking to a Spanish Police Officer that spoke perfect English as he had spent most of his childhood in the UK. I asked if I could take my Motorhome and Tow Car to the 'ITV' the Spanish equivalent to our 'VOSA' in Motril.

Here they fully examined the system and reviewed all my paperwork and after a discussion with their superiors declared my outfit completely safe as they deemed the vehicle being towed to be a 'Trailer'

We found the inspectors to be very friendly and understanding, they even made us coffee, all I can say is I don't know what all the fuss is about. All these stories about being 'Fined' I have not meet anybody yet that can say that they had definitely been stopped and fined!!

Off to Spain again next Feb so see you on the road.
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When I read people saying, " We have been to Spain / France for 20 years using an A frame it
Blood%2Bboil.jpeg
I can only say you have been very lucky.

On our very 1st trip with our RV towing our car we drove from Santander to Alicante without problems and passed several Police cars, however upon moving to Javea as I queued to pay my toll I noted the Traffico Police with a truck driver just outside the toll booths, upon clearing the booth he immediately stopped me then walked around my vehicles shaking his head.
Now I don't know whether it was because I was alone, near my destination or if it was his lunch or end of shift time but he just got into his 4x4 and drove off without fine or any paperwork.

On our return to the UK we decided to get a trailer to carry the car, okay if you get stopped you may get a €60+ fine and told to separate, now doing that a few times is a lot cheaper than buying a £1,000+ car trailer, however as my wife doesn't drive upon the Police leaving I would have to reconnect and resume my journey,but then what if that Police car is further up the road?? Bigger fine, vehicles confiscated?

The decision and risk is yours, good luck.

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Stopped in Germany. Reduced fine from €160 to €25 once we proved we had the correct licences and insurance. I argued the case that we had paperwork saying it was legal and showed them that too. We were fined for towing a vehicle that was not motor functional. We had to unhitch and leave the country in two vehicles the German police man told us to go to Holland we would be welcomed to tow vehicle there.
 
Do you need a court case now to decide the issue if the A frame is illegal under EU regulations and EU regulations are going to be cut and paste into UK regulations then the A frame will be illegal here under UK regulations ?

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AFAIK this is not about EU regulations as different countries have different laws as to what vehicles they allow on their roads. Compare how most of the rest of Europe treat caravans and trailers as requiring separate registration whereas we do not. No EU wide law on that, is there.

Mutual recognition of other countries' vehicles is not covered by EU law but by the much earlier Vienna Convention.
 
These past few winters away I have met many, and i do mean many motorhomes of ALL nationalities including believe it or not a German towing an old Fiat Secienta on an A frame and he had been doing so for the past 11years he said, he disappeared into his van and reappeared with all his relevant paperwork,in German of course and it appeared to be the same sort of paperwork as we are supplied with by A frame suppliers and he says he has never had a problem and this was in Mikki’s place so he has actually travelled through about 5 different countries,he didn’t deny having been stopped a few times but said he just presents his paperwork and they eventually wave him on his way.I will say now that he was multi lingual and in my honest opinion I think this has a lot to do with it, if you get pulled on a roadside stop and can “debate”the issue with them in their language I think it makes all the difference when you have all the relevant paperwork and relevant legal “knowledge” so to speak,generally in our case most of us can only speak English and so we just have to accept what they say,I think if we Brits were more multi lingual like the majority of Europeans we would be shown a little more respect,so to speak, for this reason I don’t take my car on my A frame,and have no desire to be involved or drawn into a long never ending debate,as so often follows on this most discussed subject,so that is the only contribution I wish to make.gwyntaxi.
 
Charlie said:
For the record.

I think with hindsight my comments have been a wee bit to the point. Brutal even.

In no way have I set out or intended to be disagreeable or insulting so to those who have caught the winds of my frustration over this legal or not question I unreservedly apologise .....

Not great times for us and further hindrance to our already shredded plans is getting on top so perhaps it's time to withdraw from the forum as no one deserves to listen to an unreasonable idiot like me just because I'm hacked off.

Charlie.
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Well it's going to get boring now then! I quite like reading your comments, even though you do seem to get worked up a bit, a bit like me that's why I only enter silly remarks now ( not this one mind) (y)
 
spitfire said:
Have seen the fun fair folks with a lorry, trailer then a caravan but they are an exception after all it is France and you guys are not on French plates so fair game lol
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Passed 2 lots in the Uk just after the August bank holiday on the A303 . lorry, trailer, caravan 20mph both lots.
Midnightflyer said:
I purchase a 'A Frame' from TowBars2TowCars two years ago and have toured France and Spain without any problems.

I purchased from TowBars2TowCars as I found it to be very light in comparison with others, very easy to fit and with their magic electrical braking system it meant that there was little modification required to the car being towed and no modification needed to the Motorhome just the 13 pin electrics.

It also has EUROPEAN TYPE APPROVAL PAPERS which was very useful when in Spain this year talking to a Spanish Police Officer that spoke perfect English as he had spent most of his childhood in the UK. I asked if I could take my Motorhome and Tow Car to the 'ITV' the Spanish equivalent to our 'VOSA' in Motril.

Here they fully examined the system and reviewed all my paperwork and after a discussion with their superiors declared my outfit completely safe as they deemed the vehicle being towed to be a 'Trailer'

We found the inspectors to be very friendly and understanding, they even made us coffee, all I can say is I don't know what all the fuss is about. All these stories about being 'Fined' I have not meet anybody yet that can say that they had definitely been stopped and fined!!

Off to Spain again next Feb so see you on the road.
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If you know Spain then you will realise that it isn't one country but 17 autonomous provinces. What is happily accepted, whether legal or not, in one area will not matter one iota 200kms up the road even in the same province.

peterc10 said:
Compare how most of the rest of Europe treat caravans and trailers as requiring separate registration whereas we do not. No EU wide law on that, is there.

n.
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Yes there is ,the UK fought long & hard to opt out ,unfortunately, seeing some of the rubbish people tow around.
 
Well I had an Aframe for some years stopped and fined stopped and warned and in spain told to unhook no fine, then one day the a frame snapped written off car and French Fine for towing it so i use a trailer now, never been stopped or fined :)

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tattytony said:
Well I had an Aframe for some years stopped and fined stopped and warned and in spain told to unhook no fine, then one day the a frame snapped written off car and French Fine for towing it so i use a trailer now, never been stopped or fined :)
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Yours is the very First case I have come across in Europe AND the USA, of an actual "failure" of an "A" frame. I used to tow a 4WD Toyota pickup in the US with a Blue Ox. Brilliant device and controlled braking too. Most are so "over engineered" as to be virtually bomb proof. So what actually failed? (guess, poor welding?).
 
moulin 87 said:
Once you commit an offence that requires points to be put on your licence, then you would be required to apply for a French licence so the points can be applied..
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Sorry but this is false. Cos I'm a naughty boy I have twice been flashed and had to pay the piper ... the points cannot be adjusted. I have had an extended discussion with Gendarmes as I drive a French registered HGV for a French company on an English Licence with and English CPC, French version being a F.I.M.O. in all instances where I type English accept "European" for the moment.
 
LuckyLuke said:
you keep your last uk address on it... and yes if I commit an endorsable offence then I have to get a French licence.
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False ... read my previous comments
 
jetlag03 said:
Sorry but this is false. Cos I'm a naughty boy I have twice been flashed and had to pay the piper ... the points cannot be adjusted. I have had an extended discussion with Gendarmes as I drive a French registered HGV for a French company on an English Licence with and English CPC, French version being a F.I.M.O. in all instances where I type English accept "European" for the moment.
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Depends on what the French residency requirements are as here you've no chance of retaining a UK licence , whether employed or not, once you are a Spanish resident.
 
The Gendarmes will try and force the issue, they have with me at HGV checkpoints, I simply and politely tell them, my licence is a european one and I have no intention of changing it unless a French court and judge insists ... that results in the well known French shoulder shrug, my papers firmly thrust into my hand and to be usually told that they will investigate, more than nine years later, and I've heard nothing. Can't help but think that after Brexit is final there will be a team of Gendarmes at my door... oh 'eck

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JJ said:
My latest invention should sort these things out...
View attachment 182754

JJ :cool:
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In Spain, it is and as always been illegal to tow a vehicle with a vehicle regardless of the method, A frame, rope, chain, straight bar or even a Fun members invention. :ROFLMAO:
 
Having a 8.7m motorhome it is difficult to "pop down" to the shops and/or explore the area we are visiting and so a car towed behind is a bonus. In our case, and probably most others, life is about choices! We choose to have a large motorhome and choose to tow a car behind it! QED
 
PeteH said:
Yours is the very First case I have come across in Europe AND the USA, of an actual "failure" of an "A" frame. I used to tow a 4WD Toyota pickup in the US with a Blue Ox. Brilliant device and controlled braking too. Most are so "over engineered" as to be virtually bomb proof. So what actually failed? (guess, poor welding?).
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Mine was being used behind a tag towing a Peugeot 307 and snapped across the main bar that ran from behind the bumper Left to Right
 
jetlag03 said:
Sorry but this is false. Cos I'm a naughty boy I have twice been flashed and had to pay the piper ... the points cannot be adjusted. I have had an extended discussion with Gendarmes as I drive a French registered HGV for a French company on an English Licence with and English CPC, French version being a F.I.M.O. in all instances where I type English accept "European" for the moment.
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Do you live in France?

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