2030 no new diesel vans. What's your plan?

glenn2926 said:
A little story of why EVs are not the way forward in the real world.
Picked up the trailer, straight to the fabrication place and lad d the brewery. How’s your EV doing? Keeping up?
Left the fabricators and straight to Hull for the overnight ferry to zeebrugge. Oh topped off diesel before ferry. Still keeping up in your EV? Next morning and off we go. Chamonix here we come. Can’t stop over as the brewery on the trailer is far to expensive to leave unattended overnight. Also I have a dinner date in Chamonix at 20.00 the same night. Stopped twice for diesel and coffee. Lovely dinner that evening. Next morning delivered the brewery. Hope you managed to keep up in your EV. What do you mean no you didn’t? Surely you were there before me. EVs are the future, they’re more advanced than my beat up old pickup. Still hooked the trailer back on and Chamonix to Zeebrugge then ferry overnight, drop off the trailer and home just after lunch.
EVs the future? Yeah right.
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EV's are the future. Agreed, wouldn't do that run today. Just wait.
 
glenn2926 said:
So you cannot do that today but I did in a 2007 vehicle and that’s progress?
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You do know what progress is. You 2007 vehicle is the result of 100 years of development of the ICE.
Electric vehicles have only really got going in the last 8 years and only really took off in the last 3.
At least give them 10 years...

Anyway, on your trailer job. There are already power assisted trailers. They have a small battery pack and motor in the axle. They take pretty much all the strain off the EV so there is little if any penalty to towing it.

Even caravan makers are preparing for the EV market exploding.

www.outandaboutlive.co.uk

What’s the future of electric cars and caravans?

The move to electric cars and reduced emissions is gaining momentum across the developed world. But, when it comes to caravanning, the big question is whether electric cars can cope with towing our ca
www.outandaboutlive.co.uk www.outandaboutlive.co.uk
 
Gromett said:
You do know what progress is. You 2007 vehicle is the result of 100 years of development of the ICE.
Electric vehicles have only really got going in the last 8 years and only really took off in the last 3.
At least give them 10 years...

Anyway, on your trailer job. There are already power assisted trailers. They have a small battery pack and motor in the axle. They take pretty much all the strain off the EV so there is little if any penalty to towing it.

Even caravan makers are preparing for the EV market exploding.

www.outandaboutlive.co.uk

What’s the future of electric cars and caravans?

The move to electric cars and reduced emissions is gaining momentum across the developed world. But, when it comes to caravanning, the big question is whether electric cars can cope with towing our ca
www.outandaboutlive.co.uk www.outandaboutlive.co.uk
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The pick up cost £7000. Which EV can I buy for that much? It doesn’t need to tow the tri axle trailer just the single axle one I’ve been using the last two days.
 
glenn2926 said:
The pick up cost £7000. Which EV can I buy for that much? It doesn’t need to tow the tri axle trailer just the single axle one I’ve been using the last two days.
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A 2007 EV does not exist. You cannot compare a new one to an old one because the EV revolution is only just starting. As I said your 2007 ICE pickup has 100+ years of development behind it.
Give them a chance
 
If you had an electric car is it possible to charge say a family size car using Solar Panels , and does anybody know how many Solar panels you are allowed on a house

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glenn2926 said:
So now I have to but a new trailer as well? Not many people are going to be able to carry on motoring in your EV future are they?
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No you don't have to. In 2030 you will no longer be able to buy a new ICE car. But you will still be able to buy a 13 year old pickup if EV's still aren't for you.

The same goes for caravans and trailers. Stick with your ICE and your un-powered trailer.

The caravan above won't have to carry a gas cylinder as the entire caravan is electric, heating, water and cooking. It is progress. But you are not going to be forced to do it. I don't know how old you are. I am 49 and if I insisted I could still be driving ICE and a 20 year old caravan long into my 70's.

You don't have to like it. We even agree it is not practical today, you don't even have to plan to do it in 10 or 20 years. You can stay doing things as you are now.
 
Gromett said:
No you don't have to. In 2030 you will no longer be able to buy a new ICE car. But you will still be able to buy a 13 year old pickup if EV's still aren't for you.

The same goes for caravans and trailers. Stick with your ICE and your un-powered trailer.

The caravan above won't have to carry a gas cylinder as the entire caravan is electric, heating, water and cooking. It is progress. But you are not going to be forced to do it. I don't know how old you are. I am 49 and if I insisted I could still be driving ICE and a 20 year old caravan long into my 70's.

You don't have to like it. We even agree it is not practical today, you don't even have to plan to do it in 10 or 20 years. You can stay doing things as you are now.
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That’s good to know as I need to do things like transport brewing equipment, tow trailers full of rubbish or logs now and for the foreseeable future.
It’s just that as transport has evolved over the years it has up until now improved. As in a car is faster over a long distance than a horse, it can carry more weight, more people. It doesn’t need to rest for a day between trips. EVs seem at the moment to be a worse choice than the transport they are meant to be replacing. Which to me is a backward step.
People moved from horses to cars without being told/ forced to. This was because the car was better than the horse.
If the EV is better than ICE then people will move to it without being told/forced into it.
As you said earlier there is 100 years of technology in my ICE pickup. Do we have to wait 10, 20, 30 years to get back to where we already are?
 
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Tony50 said:
My thoughts are that any government in power will backtrack on banning Diesels in this timescale , imagine even with the advanced batteries coming online the size and weight the said battery would have to be to power a 44tonne truck delivering from Felixstowe Docks to the Midlands Hub and back (over 300 miles,) on one charge. More worry would be for me if I owned an electric car is in the next 2 to 3 years with far better batteries being fitted to new cars it is reported that current electric cars values will plummet
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The problem for lorries in the UK now,& drivers hours, is somewhere to park.
There isn't anywhere.
Add in to this they would need a charging point it becomes nearly impossible. Yes the Uk might be different but it certainly is never going to work here in spain at present. Not only do we not have enough electricity in the summer but any type of agricultural/non-housing buildings out in the country side have no access to electricity due to legislation banning the supply.
They either have to have solar or huge generators. Go on many industrial estates & any needing large amounts of electricity have generators once again.
I can see that most of the lorry parks here would have to have the electrical charging points run from generators.
Gromett said:
But note it says "For now". Not "Never". This is just about who will change before they a
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Yes but to get a really accurate appraisal there should be a 5th section " Not as long as I have a hole in .........""which are now all grouped in with " not at present"
 
glenn2926 said:
So now I have to but a new trailer as well? Not many people are going to be able to carry on motoring in your EV future are they?
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That's the whole point.

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glenn2926 said:
If the EV is better than ICE then people will move to it without being told/forced into it.
As you said earlier there is 100 years of technology in my ICE pickup. Do we have to wait 10, 20, 30 years to get back to where we already are?
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People are moving to EV's as they discover the areas where they are superior.
No it won't take 20 or 30 years. I think the 10 year timescale is more than enough.
 
gus-lopez said:
Yes but to get a really accurate appraisal there should be a 5th section " Not as long as I have a hole in .........""which are now all grouped in with " not at present"
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No, because then it would be a different question. The question being asked was about a move to EV's BEFORE the 2030 end of new ICE's. Not ever
 
Gromett said:
People are moving to EV's as they discover the areas where they are superior.
No it won't take 20 or 30 years. I think the 10 year timescale is more than enough.
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Which areas are EVs superior to ICE? I can’t think of one. Not range, not speed, not cost, certainly not aesthetically, looking at Tesla alone certainly not build quality.
 
glenn2926 said:
Which areas are EVs superior to ICE? I can’t think of one. Not range, not speed, not cost, certainly not aesthetically, looking at Tesla alone certainly not build quality.
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Benefit in Kind tax efficiency...there’s one
but i suspect that won’t affect you, so it won’t count

Never having to stand in someone elses ( probably yours) spilt Diesel , but that won’t count either I suspect

Unbelievable acceleration, but as you pull a trailer with an ancient pick up....that won’t count

Quiet as a mouse.....I suspect that won’t count because the blinkers make you hard of hearing/( thinking)

Cost...to me as a company car driver....sorry cant count that again, see point 1

Build quality (Kia) , but I admit their ICE cars are just as good, 7 year bumper to bumper warranty........

Bored now
 
Gents said:
There is no security in buying a brand new vehicle of any shape, unless it’s through your business. The newest , i ever bought was a 6 month old Audi 100LS from a motor dealer/ accountant we were doing business with. Second best car I ever owned! Paid 2k for it, kept it 9 years sold it for£900. Back in the day, a dealer freind would hold a party at the showroom, on the 31st July, people would buy there new car and drive it away at midnight, just to be the first on the road with their new car!
What a sad bunch !!!
I also new another Sad B, who lived with his family, in absolute squaller, and drove a Roller, it made him feel important whilst out and about. What a saddo.
I’ve had great second hand vehicles all my life, for personal use, and loved every one of them, cause I owned them! They didn’t own me! By bricks and mortar if you want security.
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No new? sad, so sad. My first vehicle was new - the smell of plastic and bare metal and the feel of the wire line to open the door of my .........1961 Minivan £359 (no Purchase Tax) and since then I have bought new vehicles - none .......... all secondhand, minis and BMWs, ...oh and a N&B MH now had it 11 years.

Now the bricks and mortar bit? Not sure, as if sold it would only buy me 3-4 x Morelos, but meanwhile keeping me very comfortably off.

Geoff

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glenn2926 said:
So you cannot do that today but I did in a 2007 vehicle and that’s progress?
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You would not be able to do that with a majority of ice cars so I cant see your point.
 
Gromett said:
No, because then it would be a different question. The question being asked was about a move to EV's BEFORE the 2030 end of new ICE's. Not ever
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But unless you know who refused to answer 1 to 4 on the grounds they woul d never buy one you do not know if they were discounted or , as more than likely, added in to "not a the moment" No; 4
Cheshirecat57 said:
Benefit in Kind tax efficiency...there’s one
but i suspect that won’t affect you, so it won’t count
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It shouldn't affect anyone. should never have been introduced, any type of allowance for reps to run around . eed to travel take a train & bus.
Cheshirecat57 said:
Quiet as a mouse.....I suspect that won’t count because the blinkers make you hard of hearing/( thinking)
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so are most vehicles.t unfortunately you are going to have to pay to make yours nosisy by next july as you said it hasn't been fitted as legally required & retrofit is due by then.
Cheshirecat57 said:
Cost...to me as a company car driver....sorry cant count that again, see point 1
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as above .should be completely banned along with any type of school run.
chrisgreen said:
You would not be able to do that with a majority of ice cars so I cant see your point.
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I can't think of many that wouldn't ? :unsure: I ran a 208 back here from Poitiers with only a short kip.
Jag back from Flensborg to here last monday/tuesday 2700kms , 1000monday1700+ tuesday. (neighbour)
 
Gromett said:
No you don't have to. In 2030 you will no longer be able to buy a new ICE car. But you will still be able to buy a 13 year old pickup if EV's still aren't for you.

The same goes for caravans and trailers. Stick with your ICE and your un-powered trailer.

The caravan above won't have to carry a gas cylinder as the entire caravan is electric, heating, water and cooking. It is progress. But you are not going to be forced to do it. I don't know how old you are. I am 49 and if I insisted I could still be driving ICE and a 20 year old caravan long into my 70's.

You don't have to like it. We even agree it is not practical today, you don't even have to plan to do it in 10 or 20 years. You can stay doing things as you are now.
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Karl

I will not say you are backtracking on where we will be in 10-15 years time, but you are starting to recognise that for MHomers at least there are still long-term alternatives to EV. After all there are stiil 30 year-old Hymers around still giving good service, so buying similar in 2029 could take one to 2060.

I think there might be a split market in the 2030's a bit like the split between petrol and diesel cars which still exists. In the truck chassis market, both for commercial trucks and MHs on those chassis I think that split market will go on a lot longer, as no government has started to promulgate a date for banning the sale of those. I imagine the likes of Morelo and Phoenix who rely mostly on truck chassis for their market will not be envisaging looking for EVs for some years yet. N&B and Carthago who rely a lot on Ducatos might have to start a bit earlier.

Another point which might affect the EV MH market is how well the new construction techniques using lightweight materials stand up to use. We will need nearly all of the next 9 years to assess that.

Geoff

Geoff
 
gus-lopez said:
I can't think of many that wouldn't ? :unsure: I ran a 208 back here from Poitiers with only a short kip.
Jag back from Flensborg to here last monday/tuesday 2700kms , 1000monday1700+ tuesday. (neighbour)
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what towing a loaded 3 axle trailer?
 
we do about 600 miles a month in our EV costs us nothing can you do that in a diesel.
and since having our diesel car mot in September its done 63 miles cost about £7 and only drive it to give it a runout.
 

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