Towing A frame in France
- Thread starter John n Jinny
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Its easy enough if your competent and confident driver and have a decent set of towing mirrors fitted and correctly adjusted giving you maximum vision down both sides of your outfit
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pappajohn
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Probably the same as in the days of illegal 27mh AM CB radio.
It was legal to sell and to own one....but illegal to use one.
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Just back from Spain and only saw one motorhome towing a car on a frame , but many more were using trailers
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As I said originally.. it's potluck, I have seen toads in France, but the occasion with my friends definitely happened.
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OK
Here is a French version. (A bit more exiting as it's on a big bike)
The roads in Brittany are not a lot different to Cornwall and the roads in the Alps can be similar to Scotland
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Coolcats
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Now we all have views regarding insurance companies who, when someone is involved in an accident can refuse to pay out or apply a reduced payment.
Given that there are grey area's that cannot be agreed upon here can you imagine the agro dealing with an insurance company who may interpret an individual country's rules different to what an individual does. In this instance you can see the insurance company off loading responsibility for the decision to use an A Frame to a driver.
"You’ll also need to check that your insurance policy covers towing with an A-frame. Even if it does, using the A-frame incorrectly could invalidate a claim so make sure everything is in place and working before you set off"
Buyer beware springs to mind....
Given that there are grey area's that cannot be agreed upon here can you imagine the agro dealing with an insurance company who may interpret an individual country's rules different to what an individual does. In this instance you can see the insurance company off loading responsibility for the decision to use an A Frame to a driver.
"You’ll also need to check that your insurance policy covers towing with an A-frame. Even if it does, using the A-frame incorrectly could invalidate a claim so make sure everything is in place and working before you set off"
Buyer beware springs to mind....
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- Apr 12, 2020
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It’s not a grey area, it’s illegal! In the code de la Route (the French Highway Code), it is illegal to tow one motorised vehicle with another.
It also contravenes the UNECE regulations (which is the over-riding legislation of movement of international traffic) as (unlike the U.K.) a ‘trailer’ has to be « DESIGNED » to be towed, the U.K. accept « designed or adapted ».
That said, many do it and get away with it, enforcement is patchy at best!
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There is plenty of evidence of serious issues, I know of 4 in the last year, just in the U.K., but don’t confuse safety with legality.Yep. Exactly. No evidence of serious issues but the pen pushers simply say it’s illegal because it’s not legal.
IIRC everything in France is illegal until laws are passed to make it legal. Wonder when they legalised nookie?
It’s UNECE that say it’s illegal, not pen pushers on here!
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BikerGraham
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- camping and caravanning since a kid. New to motorhomes
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It’s not illegal to manufacture and supply an a-frame, only to use it!
The French are well renowned for applying their own version of the regs, regardless of the actual! Some get away with it, some don’t….
my eldest son and his family are French residents and I have first hand reports of the French behaviour, lovely as they are!
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Towing one motorised vehicle with another is a category 4 offence in France, read the ‘code de la Route’.
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The difference is (and it’s the bit that UNECE recognise, unlike the uk’s DfT) is that a ‘TRAILER’ is designed to be towed rather than adapted.
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62272
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We ‘A’ frame regularly in France and have never been stopped. have passed numerous Gendarmes and municipal Police without any of them being remotely interested. I agree that according to EU legislation the A-frame arrangement does not fall within the definition of a trailer (which is where it falls down). However there is no reason why it could not be accepted as circulating visitor traffic, but accept if I was stopped and challenged I would happily de-couple or pay a fine if is came to that (cheaper than paying hire charges).
Insurance - no problem whatsoever, my insurers for MOHO and Toad have explicitly agreed that I am covered fully comp A-Framing in EU, 365 days per year (Motorhome and Caravan club and previously Adrian Flux).
Its all a question of tolerance to risk. A-framing is a safe way of towing, with a lower centre of gravity than a conventional car transporter trailer. Just need to make sure that the A frame kit is fitted by a reputable manufacturer and checked regularly by them (also follow all the fitting instructions).
There is however on these forums a number of members who find it abhorrent and will argue to the ’n’th degree that you must not use one. Your choice at the end of the day
Insurance - no problem whatsoever, my insurers for MOHO and Toad have explicitly agreed that I am covered fully comp A-Framing in EU, 365 days per year (Motorhome and Caravan club and previously Adrian Flux).
Its all a question of tolerance to risk. A-framing is a safe way of towing, with a lower centre of gravity than a conventional car transporter trailer. Just need to make sure that the A frame kit is fitted by a reputable manufacturer and checked regularly by them (also follow all the fitting instructions).
There is however on these forums a number of members who find it abhorrent and will argue to the ’n’th degree that you must not use one. Your choice at the end of the day
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We ‘A’ frame regularly in France and have never been stopped. have passed numerous Gendarmes and municipal Police without any of them being remotely interested. I agree that according to EU legislation the A-frame arrangement does not fall within the definition of a trailer (which is where it falls down). However there is no reason why it could not be accepted as circulating visitor traffic, but accept if I was stopped and challenged I would happily de-couple or pay a fine if is came to that (cheaper than paying hire charges).
Insurance - no problem whatsoever, my insurers for MOHO and Toad have explicitly agreed that I am covered fully comp A-Framing in EU, 365 days per year (Motorhome and Caravan club and previously Adrian Flux).
Its all a question of tolerance to risk. A-framing is a safe way of towing, with a lower centre of gravity than a conventional car transporter trailer. Just need to make sure that the A frame kit is fitted by a reputable manufacturer and checked regularly by them (also follow all the fitting instructions).
There is however on these forums a number of members who find it abhorrent and will argue to the ’n’th degree that you must not use one. Your choice at the end of the day
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It didn’t, that’s 2 different incidents! The first was in the U.K., a non-approved a-frame fitted by a major U.K. supplier.
The second is a Blue Ox, an approved a-frame in the USA, though I believe this was in Australia. Simply, some vehicles just aren’t suitable for a-framing,…
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Think they may call that scaremongering
As you are well known for posting these on loads of motorhome forums
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Scaremongering? These things happened!
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I don't see it as scaremongering more giving information so you can assess the risk
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Would you be referring to me as ‘a trailer salesman’?
I was a designer and manufacturer, of bespoke trailers (up to 3.5T MAM) and motorhome towbars. I also provided training to the NTTA on trailer maintenance and Towbar fitting….
However, I’m thick skinned!
I was a designer and manufacturer, of bespoke trailers (up to 3.5T MAM) and motorhome towbars. I also provided training to the NTTA on trailer maintenance and Towbar fitting….
However, I’m thick skinned!
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Reversing a ‘proper’ trailer isn’t that difficult. It took me about 30 minutes to teach my wife how to reverse a double horsebox behind a LandRover Discovery…. The ‘horsey’ girls put caravanners to shame TBH when it comes to reversing!
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Most motorbikes don’t have a reverse gear….
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Caravans have motor movers fitted (quite rightly) for parking in tight spots on storage sites.…. I’d hate to think my caravanning neighbour was trying to reverse into an 8’ wide space next to my precious MoHo!Is that why a very large percentage of caravans have motor movers fitted
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Rubbish! They’re not checking every vehicle for every possible misdemeanour !
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They don’t need to check it they can see it in plain sight.
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At entry and exit points, they are more interested in the people…. illegal immigrants or whatever?
Border Force are not traffic cops…
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