Hydrogen powered commercial vehicles.

[Gromett]

Guys been reading with interest the topic on hydrogen. You can run your vehicle right now on hydrogen by simply fitting a HHO generator kit to your vehicle. The kit costs about £200. All your doing is introducing the gas into the intake. This will give you an instant boost in power, better fuel economy and far cleaner emissions. The kit is easily sourced and fitted.

Scam

 

[Gromett]

Nice explanation do you have any links for these kits?

I don't even need to get into the science on this the economics speak for themselves.

If they worked, don't you think the car manufacturers would fit them as standard? They are having to pay massive fines for CO2 production. If they could increase their efficiency by fitting one of these devices don't you think they would?

I am not going to get into a debate on this. if you want to pay good money for unproven "tech" that may damage your engine and is highly unlikely to provide the claimed benefits go for it.

I will leave you with this;

The Law of conservation of energy tells us we can't get something for nothing, but we refuse to believe it. - Isaac Asimov

 

[Coolcats]

I don't even need to get into the science on this the economics speak for themselves.

If they worked, don't you think the car manufacturers would fit them as standard? They are having to pay massive fines for CO2 production. If they could increase their efficiency by fitting one of these devices don't you think they would?

I am not going to get into a debate on this. if you want to pay good money for unproven "tech" that may damage your engine and is highly unlikely to provide the claimed benefits go for it.

I will leave you with this;

The Law of conservation of energy tells us we can't get something for nothing, but we refuse to believe it. - Isaac Asimov

Horizon Fuel Cell Technologies

With a global HQ in Singapore, Horizon is a world leading developer and manufacturer of liquid-cooled and air-cooled PEM fuel cells and integrated products up to 370kW single modules, targeting heavy duty applications from MW-level stationary systems to heavy vehicles (trucks and coaches).

www.horizonfuelcell.com

 

[Coolcats]

I don't even need to get into the science on this the economics speak for themselves.

If they worked, don't you think the car manufacturers would fit them as standard? They are having to pay massive fines for CO2 production. If they could increase their efficiency by fitting one of these devices don't you think they would?

I am not going to get into a debate on this. if you want to pay good money for unproven "tech" that may damage your engine and is highly unlikely to provide the claimed benefits go for it.

I will leave you with this;

The Law of conservation of energy tells us we can't get something for nothing, but we refuse to believe it. - Isaac Asimov

I said it was a nice explanation and have asked for the link always look before you jump or criticise

 

[Gromett]

Horizon Fuel Cell Technologies

With a global HQ in Singapore, Horizon is a world leading developer and manufacturer of liquid-cooled and air-cooled PEM fuel cells and integrated products up to 370kW single modules, targeting heavy duty applications from MW-level stationary systems to heavy vehicles (trucks and coaches).

www.horizonfuelcell.com

Huh? That is hydrogen fuel cells a proven technology. I was responding about the HHO scam. 2 totally different things.

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[Gromett]

I said it was a nice explanation and have asked for the link always look before you jump or criticise

What? Huh? No idea what you are on about sorry. Very confused now

 

[Coolcats]

What? Huh? No idea what you are on about sorry. Very confused now

Dark_Comet kindly provided an explanation regarding HHO I know nothing about the technology and requested a link to view what he has been looking at you came back and said ‘Scam’ until I / others / you have seen what it actually is (placing any previous bias to one side) it’s hard to jump to conclusions and say ‘Scam’. Maybe it is maybe it isn’t. Being open minded I’d love to review any link that Dark_Comet can provide.

 

[Gromett]

Dark_Comet kindly provided an explanation regarding HHO I know nothing about the technology and requested a link to view what he has been looking at you came back and said ‘Scam’ until I / others / you have seen what it actually is (placing any previous bias to one side) it’s hard to jump to conclusions and say ‘Scam’. Maybe it is maybe it isn’t. Being open minded I’d love to review any link that Dark_Comet can provide.

The basic idea is you electrolyse water which produce Hydrogen and Oxygen. You then feed this into the engine to increase efficiency and power.

IT has been around for a long time and has been debunked many times, in the same way as magnets around the fuel line have. I haven't just jumped to this conclusion, I have seen it a long time ago.

Oh and even mythbusters tested them all out. Sorry this is the only video I could find. you will need to click through to watch it on youtube.

 

[Gromett]

Dark_Comet kindly provided an explanation regarding HHO I know nothing about the technology and requested a link to view what he has been looking at you came back and said ‘Scam’ until I / others / you have seen what it actually is (placing any previous bias to one side) it’s hard to jump to conclusions and say ‘Scam’. Maybe it is maybe it isn’t. Being open minded I’d love to review any link that Dark_Comet can provide.

PS: But as I said. Have at it. fit it to you car and enjoy your £200 worth of efficiency and power gains

 

[Gromett]

Coolcats a much better test of a commercially available HHO system.

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[olley]

Hho has been touted for years, it gets debunked and then a few years later reappears, as grom says its a scam.
Wonder if musky will start pushing it?

 

[Gromett]

How about attaching a wind turbine to vehicle and driving the wheels directly? That has to be scam right?

Well not so fast.

The reason I am posting this is because I am apparently accused of being closed minded. I watched the veritasium video and now Rosie has explained it. WOW!!! mind blowing lol.
I am open to anything within reason, but will look into it and base my response on what I find. I am neither closed minded nor do I jump to conclusions. I check stuff out.

Here is the difference between the windmill and the HHO system. One has proven to work, the other has been proven NOT to work, both in scientifically valid and controlled experiments.

 

[olley]

I saw that vid the other day, still don't understand it but don't disbelieve it.

 

[tonyidle]

Guys been reading with interest the topic on hydrogen. You can run your vehicle right now on hydrogen by simply fitting a HHO generator kit to your vehicle. The kit costs about £200. All your doing is introducing the gas into the intake. This will give you an instant boost in power, better fuel economy and far cleaner emissions. The kit is easily sourced and fitted.

So the vehicle makes its own fuel which is then used to power it. Perpetual motion at last. It has been a long wait .

 

[tonyidle]

How about attaching a wind turbine to vehicle and driving the wheels directly? That has to be scam right?

Well not so fast.

The reason I am posting this is because I am apparently accused of being closed minded. I watched the veritasium video and now Rosie has explained it. WOW!!! mind blowing lol.
I am open to anything within reason, but will look into it and base my response on what I find. I am neither closed minded nor do I jump to conclusions. I check stuff out.

Here is the difference between the windmill and the HHO system. One has proven to work, the other has been proven NOT to work, both in scientifically valid and controlled experiments.

Yachtsmen have been doing it since sails were attached to boats. Nothing new but nevertheless a very clever application.

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[Gromett]

I saw that vid the other day, still don't understand it but don't disbelieve it.

I watched the veritasium video because of the Bet. I didn't expect it to work but was surprised. I don't mind being proven wrong like that. It was fascinating.

 

[Coolcats]

The basic idea is you electrolyse water which produce Hydrogen and Oxygen. You then feed this into the engine to increase efficiency and power.

IT has been around for a long time and has been debunked many times, in the same way as magnets around the fuel line have. I haven't just jumped to this conclusion, I have seen it a long time ago.

Oh and even mythbusters tested them all out. Sorry this is the only video I could find. you will need to click through to watch it on youtube.

Let’s see what Dark_Comet links are it may be the same it may be not everyone has a right to be heard Grommet

 

[Coolcats]

So the vehicle makes its own fuel which is then used to power it. Perpetual motion at last. It has been a long wait .

Isnt that what solar panels do....generate energy. There is of course the energy to produce them and transport them....

 

[Gromett]

Isnt that what solar panels do....generate energy. There is of course the energy to produce them and transport them....

Not quite the same thing. Solar panels convert incoming energy from the sun into electric. That is external energy being introduced into your vehicle.
HHO takes existing energy in the battery to convert water to H2 and O2 and feed this into the engine. The engine then has to work harder to power the alternator to replace the charge to the battery.

 

[Gromett]

Let’s see what Dark_Comet links are it may be the same it may be not everyone has a right to be heard Grommet

Where did I say he didn't have a right to be heard? I have simply pointed out it was a scam, and given a video that conclusively shows that it is so.

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[Dark_Comet]

Have a look at hydroxsystems uk. You can see a video and full explanation, components required and the hho generator in use Also simply google hho generator kits uk for a bundle of links. I rather like the hydroxsystem because they provide a PWM in the kit which automatically controls the amperage to the hho generator. Permit me to correct an error I made in my original post where I said torque converter, I meant to say turbo charger.

 

[Dark_Comet]

Guys this is a well proven system. Im driving a ford transit connect using a hho generator. I get far better engine response, more power, cleaner engine and emissions. My fuel economy is up 30 to 40 % at least. Hydrogen is the most abundant element on the planet. All you doing is simply adding a catalsyt namely potasium hydroxyide, easily and cheaply purchased, to distilled water. 1 litre of water gives you a range of 800 to 1000 miles. The 25 amps which is taken right off the alternator via a relay, would produce very little extra effort from the engine, most moderm alternators are putting out over 100 amps easy. Were talking here about at least a 2 litre diesel at least which is fitted to most motorhomes. The mechanical effort would be negligable. The added hydrogen to the combustion process ensures total combustion of all available hydrocarbons in the fuel. The carbon buildup in the combustion chamber and inlet tracts in time gets eliminated so the engine breathes more easily. The exhaust is far cleaner and you got greater power, better engine response, smoother engine and much better fuel econony. The kit fitted takes about 1 to 2 hours and can be removed and refitted to any other vehicle. The important thing is to install the hho generator lower than the water container and use a bubbler and spark arrestor.

 

[Gromett]

And there you have it... 30-40% better fuel economy at least... you have Dark_Comet word on it.

Buy one before the car companies find out and start installing them as standard and avoiding the CO2 fines they are getting from the EU.

Slap one in your old banger that is failing the emissions test at the MOT to help it pass as your exhaust will be cleaner.

Oh and it won't put any additional load on your alternator. It's only 25 amps, this is dead easy for the engine to generate without using any extra fuel.

</sarcasm>

 

[Gromett]

I will post this again. A real test...

 

[gpat]

I saw that vid the other day, still don't understand it but don't disbelieve it.

I suggest you start disbelieving it

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[Coolcats]

Not quite the same thing. Solar panels convert incoming energy from the sun into electric. That is external energy being introduced into your vehicle.
HHO takes existing energy in the battery to convert water to H2 and O2 and feed this into the engine. The engine then has to work harder to power the alternator to replace the charge to the battery.

How do you think Solar panels are made and the energy and the type of materials used to make them? How much usable energy (not just generated) do you think it takes before a panel makes a difference

 

[Gromett]

How do you think Solar panels are made and the energy and the type of materials used to make them? How much usable energy (not just generated) do you think it takes before a panel makes a difference

Huh? Gone off topic again. This is not about embedded energy. I am not biting.

 

[Dark_Comet]

Ok so the chemical formula for water as we all know is H2O. Two hydrogen atoms and one oxygen atom. Through the use of simple electrolosis we can cause the hydrogen to seperate from the oxygen. The preferred water is distlled water with a cheap very available potasium hydroxide added to the water as a catalyst. This serves to speed up the electrolosis. From one litre of water you get a range of about 800 to 1000 miles of hydrogen. Your not storing the hydrogen. All your doing is creating it and adding it to the combustion immediately via the air intake downstream from the map sensor. The hho generator requires max 25 amps which any modern alternatot can produce effortlessly with no mechanical effect. The kit can be purchased complete for about £200 and fitted in 1 to hrs or less. The kit can be easily removed and transferred to another vehicle. You simply purchase the kit with a hho generator to suit the size of your engine which would be typically between 2 to 3 litres. The circuit is very simple. The main water tank has 2 outlets. The bottom one supplys water to the generator once the hydrogen and oxygen atoms seperate the gas is fed up into the water container and released out the top of the container and via a spark arestor to a bubbler where any steam that maybe present is removed. From the bubbler the gas goes to to the engine. The electrics is very simple. The system can be turned off and on at will via a switch you fit where you prefer on the dash. You store zero hydrogen. No tanks whatsoever.

 

[Wanderlust]

Interesting programme on R4 the other morning talking more of using H as energy storage rather than powering vehicles, it's apparently a more efficient use as batteries not great for storing excess wind and solar.

 

[Gromett]

Interesting programme on R4 the other morning talking more of using H as energy storage rather than powering vehicles, it's apparently a more efficient use as batteries not great for storing excess wind and solar.

Batteries are more efficient, better round trip efficiency. But for bulk storage hydrogen may be cheaper long term. I think Hydrogen definately has a place for storage, but we do need to start producing some green hydrogen first. Current brown hydrogen is worse than just using methane directly.
And initial production of green hydrogen would be better directed at shipping, cement and steel production which are dirtier.

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