Euro 4 and 5

[ashleyalcaline]

Hello everyone, this question keeps coming up
Just trying to get a general idea of how people are dealing with restriction to anything below euro 6 ? Is this a bigger problem for commercial users ? My current van is only euro 5 but looking at coach conversion which within my budget tends to be euro4 - would appreciate your answers
Regards

 

[ivorantony]

Planning ahead I've a 1989 mercedes 709d ...6 years time it's excempt from all these restrictions. Added bonus it will also be free from mot and road tax.

If you buy newer you will constantly be forced to buy newer as the craziness grows.

Meanwhile big business is pumping loads of crap in to the air while Joe blogs pays for it

You are assuming that the powers that be won’t move the goalposts,
my classic Land Rover missed out when they changed the classic classification from
25 years to 40 years, nothing to stop them doing it again,

 

[Brains]

A link from Guardian a leftie rag - aye right a virtue of all truth
implement this sort of policy and tourist will go elsewhere

If you think the Gaudian is a 'Leftie rag' you really need to look at one of the many Media Bias charts.
The Guardian is just left of centre,
The BBC is 0.67 degrees, so very slightly right of centre
Both classed as 'reliable'

The Daily Mail, for example, is 3 degrees right, but only 34% reliable, which is even less than Fox News!

 

[Neil S]

.

 

[Northernraider]

You are assuming that the powers that be won’t move the goalposts,
my classic Land Rover missed out when they changed the classic classification from
25 years to 40 years, nothing to stop them doing it again,

Yep possibly although the 25yrs was never mot exempt only tax exempt . I had lots of those.
Currently 3 million historic vehicles registered in the UK if they move the goalposts I'll just buy an older one again that's already covered. To be honest if one came up that suited before 2030 I'd buy it anyway

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[Northernraider]

If you think the Gaudian is a 'Leftie rag' you really need to look at one of the many Media Bias charts.
The Guardian is just left of centre,
The BBC is 0.67 degrees, so very slightly right of centre
Both classed as 'reliable'

The Daily Mail, for example, is 3 degrees right, but only 34% reliable, which is even less than Fox News!

I don't believe any of those statistics

 

[herald_400rl]

Just a thought, is there a maps app that avoids these zones?

 

[LesW]

Just a thought, is there a maps app that avoids these zones?

Green-Zones app is good, the free version shows LEZ throughout Europe.

 

[Brains]

I don't believe any of those statistics

There are many versions of the Media Bias charts, covering different sectors on the media sector, TV, Newspapers, Podcasts, etc. etc.
British, American, Australian, South Africa, Indian, and other English language news producers (such as Iran, Russia, North Korea, etc.)

The bottom line however, is all the Media Bias charts broadly use the similar metrics to measure media bias between left/right, truth/lies, bias/non bias.

All news stories contain 'spin' of some sort,
"Fog In the Channel, Continent Cut Off'
can be read many different ways, depending on how you you write the story.

 

[jongood]

If you think the Gaudian is a 'Leftie rag' you really need to look at one of the many Media Bias charts.
The Guardian is just left of centre,
The BBC is 0.67 degrees, so very slightly right of centre
Both classed as 'reliable'

The Daily Mail, for example, is 3 degrees right, but only 34% reliable, which is even less than Fox News!

That tells you more about statistics than about MSN. BBC rightwing - glad I don't have stitches

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[denisejoe]

Pay to pollute is being rolled out at more and more cities but so far never had any problems with our Euro IV 4 25t van except for Abbey Wood in that there London no longer being an option but public transport exists there, all the other cities have pretty woeful public transport so if I need to go to then it could be a problem

At present Abbey Wood is accessible as the ULEZ is inside the north and south circular roads you just have to work out the best route

 

[dunnah01]

At present Abbey Wood is accessible as the ULEZ is inside the north and south circular roads you just have to work out the best route

The TFL map and postcode lookup show it well inside the LEZ which is an extra £200 minimum for us so not taking a chance.

 

[stuartholmes]

There are many versions of the Media Bias charts, covering different sectors on the media sector, TV, Newspapers, Podcasts, etc. etc.
British, American, Australian, South Africa, Indian, and other English language news producers (such as Iran, Russia, North Korea, etc.)

The bottom line however, is all the Media Bias charts broadly use the similar metrics to measure media bias between left/right, truth/lies, bias/non bias.

All news stories contain 'spin' of some sort,
"Fog In the Channel, Continent Cut Off'
can be read many different ways, depending on how you you write the story.

And when the Titanic sank, the Press & Journal, Aberdeen's daily paper, headlined the front page with: ''Aberdeen man dies at sea''.

The Guardian, the BBC, the Telegraph all have a left wing bias or a right wing bias, depending on where you're looking from.

Criticism of any news outlet based on it's 'bias', tells more about the critic than about the criticised.

 

[gus-lopez]

They'll only lock you up if you don't pay the ever increasing daily fines/Tolls.

I would never pay any fine.

 

[denisejoe]

ULEZ: Where and when

Where and when the ULEZ will operate

tfl.gov.uk

ULEZ Expansion 2023

To help clear London's air, the Ultra Low Emission Zone (ULEZ) expanded across all London boroughs on 29 August 2023.

tfl.gov.uk

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[Brains]

I would never pay any fine.

Well at least you'll be getting free accommodation courtesy of the King (Filipe VI or Charles III)

 

[Brains]

And when the Titanic sank, the Press & Journal, Aberdeen's daily paper, headlined the front page with: ''Aberdeen man dies at sea''.

The Guardian, the BBC, the Telegraph all have a left wing bias or a right wing bias, depending on where you're looking from.

Criticism of any news outlet based on it's 'bias', tells more about the critic than about the criticised.

The Titanic headline is correct, as you say it depends on perspective.

However media bias is not subjective.
It can, and is, measured, on a daily basis by multiple sources.

Whilst there are very small micro-percentages differences between the various media bias charts, the Guardian, The BBC and the Telegraph all come out as 'accurate' reporting.

The Guardian is slightly left of centre (0.8%)
The BBC is very slightly right of centre (0.67%)
The Telegraph is very right of centre (20%)
'Extreme right' which is over 50%, is 'news' companies such as GB News, (who are now paying six figure fines to OffCom for telling lies)

The news sources deemed 'most accurate' in the UK are, in order, the FT, The Guardian, The Times and the BBC.

If your main source of news is, for example, the Daily Mail and GB News you would be classed as 'extreme right wing' you would also possibly believe that Jeremy Corbin was a fully paid up member of the Communist Party.

If your main source of news is, for example, The Morning Star and Squarkbox you would be classed as 'extreme left wing' and you would possibly believe that Suella Braverman was a fully paid up member of the Nazi Party

Ultimately you should get your news from a variety of sources, but use the FT/Guardian/Times/BBC as the main 'anchor' source and then see the 'spin' your chosen source of news is putting on the story.

 

[Bobby dazzler]

It's so easy for people to say they would never own anything below a euro 6 for many that's simply not a option. What ever way you look at it restricting travel in this way is communism. Everyone be the same except us that can afford it. What is happening is undemocratic and at the same time a massive money making scandal.

I worked very hard to get my old motorhome and will I give it up not on there nelly

 

[Brains]

It's so easy for people to say they would never own anything below a euro 6 for many that's simply not a option. What ever way you look at it restricting travel in this way is communism. Everyone be the same except us that can afford it. What is happening is undemocratic and at the same time a massive money making scandal.

I worked very hard to get my old motorhome and will I give it up not on there nelly

Don't confuse 'Freedom of movement' with 'restricting the method of transport'

Older diesel engines are killing people with the particulates.
They have to be removed, particularly from the urban environment, as soon as possible.
Fossil fuelled vehicles in the long term also need to be removed as it's killing the planet.

So if by 'communism' you mean for the overall good of the community, then yes.

Just keep in mind, motorised vehicles require an annual 'licence' to be on the road.
Motorised vehicles have no 'rights' at all.

People on foot, on horses and on cycles however have the 'right' to be on the road, and have 'freedom of movement'

(Therefore, legally and morally, the horse rider, the cyclist and pedestrian all have 'right of way' over the larger motorhome in a narrow lane)

 

[herald_400rl]

Don't confuse 'Freedom of movement' with 'restricting the method of transport'

Older diesel engines are killing people with the particulates.
They have to be removed, particularly from the urban environment, as soon as possible.
Fossil fuelled vehicles in the long term also need to be removed as it's killing the planet.

So if by 'communism' you mean for the overall good of the community, then yes.

Just keep in mind, motorised vehicles require an annual 'licence' to be on the road.
Motorised vehicles have no 'rights' at all.

People on foot, on horses and on cycles however have the 'right' to be on the road, and have 'freedom of movement'

(Therefore, legally and morally, the horse rider, the cyclist and pedestrian all have 'right of way' over the larger motorhome in a narrow lane)

Billionares are taking joy rides to space and I'm being pestered because the vehicle I have that does less than 6k miles a year is polluting.

I'll get on board when the general public stop driving Range Rovers for status, and private flights covered by domestic routes are banned.

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[gus-lopez]

What ever way you look at it restricting travel in this way is communism.

This^^

Older diesel engines are killing people with the particulates.

You can't keep everyone alive.Look at the poroblems now with overcrowding
Just imagine that the powers that be eventually manage to reduce emissions to zero, road accidents the same.
Where is the money coming from to finance alkl the schemes now the golden goose is dead?
How are you feeding all the people ,along with all the extra ones who would normally have died?

Well at least you'll be getting free accommodation courtesy of the King (Filipe VI or Charles III)

Excellent . a least they will have recieved sweet fa from me.

 

[gus-lopez]

I'll get on board when the Trojan horse running London stops driving armoured Range Rovers for status,

I have corrected that for you
I have no idea why a council politician receives such a vehicle?

 

[Bobby dazzler]

Don't confuse 'Freedom of movement' with 'restricting the method of transport'

Older diesel engines are killing people with the particulates.
They have to be removed, particularly from the urban environment, as soon as possible.
Fossil fuelled vehicles in the long term also need to be removed as it's killing the planet.

So if by 'communism' you mean for the overall good of the community, then yes.

Just keep in mind, motorised vehicles require an annual 'licence' to be on the road.
Motorised vehicles have no 'rights' at all.

People on foot, on horses and on cycles however have the 'right' to be on the road, and have 'freedom of movement'

(Therefore, legally and morally, the horse rider, the cyclist and pedestrian all have 'right of way' over the larger motorhome in a narrow lane)

Sorry mate but a horse isn't freedom to my self and personally don't believe all the properganda that's out there the air we breathe has never been cleaner in my life time. Theres a natural progression for vehicles being updated in 20 years time I would be happy to have a euro 6. As above restrictions on movement via peoples ability to pay is undemocratic. When it's a freedom that people died for its communism

 

[L' Hobo]

Have a google.

There have been several reports of councils and national parks looking into introductions of policies that limit the pollution/number of vehicles, which means something similar to the London Congestion Charge
(Where locals and EV were exempt or got reduced fees)

If London can do a Congestion/LEZ with millions of daily movements on a 125 mile border with thousands of entry/exit points all covered by ANPR, it would be dead easy in the Lake District, as a couple of dozen ANPR cameras could cover all the entry/exits west of the M6

If there is a way of extracting more money from motorists, why would any authority turn down the easy option ?

One article is here but there are many more if you dig around

It will all be controlled by AI by 2030 and the traffic terrorists will have got in and changed the parameters OR, us OAP will have to start a 'Convey' , on our disability scooters, down the M1 to Parliament!

 

[L' Hobo]

Don't confuse 'Freedom of movement' with 'restricting the method of transport'

Older diesel engines are killing people with the particulates.
They have to be removed, particularly from the urban environment, as soon as possible.
Fossil fuelled vehicles in the long term also need to be removed as it's killing the planet.

So if by 'communism' you mean for the overall good of the community, then yes.

Just keep in mind, motorised vehicles require an annual 'licence' to be on the road.
Motorised vehicles have no 'rights' at all.

People on foot, on horses and on cycles however have the 'right' to be on the road, and have 'freedom of movement'

(Therefore, legally and morally, the horse rider, the cyclist and pedestrian all have 'right of way' over the larger motorhome in a narrow lane)

I read a vegetarian report that said 'a lot of pollution is caused by cows farting', if we all returned to owning a horse, would that not cause similar problems? Just asking.

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[Flairy]

I’ve never heard so much crap

 

[pagey]

I read a vegetarian report that said 'a lot of pollution is caused by cows farting', if we all returned to owning a horse, would that not cause similar problems? Just asking.

Yes but you would have lovely roses

 

[ChrisL]

People on foot, on horses and on cycles however have the 'right' to be on the road, and have 'freedom of movement'

Whilst foot and cycles may be an eco friendly method of transport for short distances, travelling further afield requires some other form of travel and if you think horses might be suitable you'd be very wrong, instead of dieing from lung disease people would be dieing from fly born diseases from the millions of flies living on the tons of horse dung that would be littering our streets. Don't believe me? We've been there before, read the following article and you'll get the idea.

The Great Horse Manure Crisis of 1894

By the late 1800s, large cities all around the world were drowning in horse manure. The London Times predicted in 1894 that in 50 years time, every street in London would be buried under nine feet of manure.

www.historic-uk.com

 

[denisejoe]

Don't confuse 'Freedom of movement' with 'restricting the method of transport'

Older diesel engines are killing people with the particulates.
They have to be removed, particularly from the urban environment, as soon as possible.
Fossil fuelled vehicles in the long term also need to be removed as it's killing the planet.

wrong they are not being removed people just pay to take them in to LEZ
if it was really needed they would be banned it’s a money making scheme
have you looked at the scrappage scheme not worth applying for it.

 

[pagey]

OK it seems official we should all turn our m homes into shed and return to the dark ages but we won't be able to light fires to cook and keep warm so what next

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[Orion]

How are you feeding all the people ,along with all the extra ones who would normally have died?

Soylent Green?