Are you allowed in the outside lane of a motorway?

[B+W vanman]

I think a few of you need to do a speed awareness course. Like what I did. Came out still confused.

Then why should we do the course?

 

[vzac]

Then why should we do the course?

You might not be confused I only have very tiny brain cells and I am sure they get less by the day

 

[Brains]

If the middle or outer lane slow and/or stop, are you, in the inner lane constrained to do so too?

See post #84 for clarification.

Perhaps his line should have said "At normal motorway speeds" ........ Undertaking in any circumstances is illegal and not a matter of opinion.

Undertaking (at normal motorway speeds) is dangerous, bad manners, and would imply the undertaker does not know how to drive.

The Undertaker final Journey.

 

[Oldrat]

Define slow moving

 

[bigtwin]

Define slow moving

There speaks a man familiar with the vagaries of the law.

Ian

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[bigtwin]

Undertaking in any circumstances is illegal and not a matter of opinion.

As has already been noted/posted by others there are specific circumstances when, in fact, it is legitimate (legal). Opinion doesn’t come into it.

Ian

 

[Grummyb]

No trailers or caravans are allowed in the outside lane of a 3 or more lane high speed dual carriageway.
Undertaking in any circumstances is illegal and not a matter of opinion.

can someone point me in the direction of the legislation thats says trailers are not allowed in the outside lane of a 3 or more lane highway please as this is a constant e of debate in our office and ive also asked traffic police to verify it and I havnt found 1 that can prove it im sure the legislation covers motorways ie roads wuth blue signage not normal roads with green signage.

 

[Dave and Jen]

Define slow moving

opposite of fast moving!
Cheers, Dave

 

[gus-lopez]

Rule 265​

The right-hand lane of a motorway with three or more lanes MUST NOT be used (except in prescribed circumstances) if you are driving

• any vehicle drawing a trailer
• a goods vehicle with a maximum laden weight exceeding 3.5 tonnes but not exceeding 7.5 tonnes, which is required to be fitted with a speed limiter
• a goods vehicle with a maximum laden weight exceeding 7.5 tonnes
• a passenger vehicle with a maximum laden weight exceeding 7.5 tonnes constructed or adapted to carry more than eight seated passengers in addition to the driver
• a passenger vehicle with a maximum laden weight not exceeding 7.5 tonnes which is constructed or adapted to carry more than eight seated passengers in addition to the driver, which is required to be fitted with a speed limiter.

Herein above lies the main problem . When they first started constructing motorways & dual carriageways of more than three lanes the above should have been changed to "None of the above in any lanes excpet the first two"
It is common to find elephant racing in 4 lanes of the M25

Weather coaches (without a speed limiter ??) are permitted in lane three is a different discussion,
I was under the impression they were not allowed, but we have all seen them.

Yes they are

Yet, we have all been overtaken by coaches holding a steady 70mph.

if you are in a private vehicle without tacho & not using gps then the limit shown on your speedo is over reading.I go through road works with it set to the limit & why I get so annoyed with the " I'm doing x so you aren't going past"

but we are overtaking, just on a slower scale, where lane changes may be measured in minutes rather than seconds.

I was taught to overtake , check mirrors, indicate out , accelerate, indicate ,check mirrors mback in You do not overtake at half a mile an hour taking minutes.Yes the trucks might have to do it but that could be constarined by legislation the same as in europe Truck can't overtake truck.

HGV's are linked with the brakes

To my knowledge the speed limiter is connected to the fue supply?

assing a vehicle to your right by maintaining your speed and course is not, IMV, an undertake

& they should be prosecuted for not being in the farthest lane to the left

As I understand it, overtaking on the left (in the UK) is only legal if the traffic lanes are queuing and the left lane is moving more quickly. One car lane hogging wouldn't count as a queue.

Even at 70mph you are queuing.

Be careful about this as often, motorhomes that have been up-plated are licensed as Private Heavy Goods vehicles, so there is a case that they are considered to be a goods vehicle.

It’s a bit equivocal to me as there are separate definitions for Goods vehicles, but I wouldn’t like to be a test case.

It is the "private" bit that exempts them : otherwise they would also be prosecuted for no tacho

Undertaking on a motorway when traffic is moving at normal speeds is dangerous and therefore unsurprisingly it also illegal.

as above, the traffic is queuing otherwise they are all legally required to be in the farthest lane to the left & if they aren't then the traffic is queing ,albeit at a faster speed

Undertaking in any circumstances is illegal and not a matter of opinion.

then why is gov.uk not stating that & saying when it can be done?

can someone point me in the direction of the legislation thats says trailers are not allowed in the outside lane of a 3 or more lane highway please as this is a constant e of debate in our office and ive also asked traffic police to verify it and I havnt found 1 that can prove it im sure the legislation covers motorways ie roads wuth blue signage not normal roads with green signage.

here?
go down to "motorways"

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/tow-a-trailer-with-a-car-safety-checks
I'm always amazed at how many do use the outside lane? It should be automatic revocation of licence & crushing on the spot for anyone caught basically for not knowing what the rules are,

& for those who do it without number plates is it still legal to nudge the back corners of the ,usually caravans, to attempt to turn them over?

 

[Grummyb]

here?
go down to "motorways"

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/tow-a-trailer-with-a-car-safety-checks

Thats for motorways and im fully aware what the law is on motorways its "A" roads im questioning
Just for clarification a motorway has road signs with a blue background and other roads have signs with green backgrounds

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[jongood]

If under 7.5t GVW yes

Not if its a phgv, they are allowed in lane 3 regardless of the gvw.

 

[L' Hobo]

Not if its a phgv, they are allowed in lane 3 regardless of the gvw.

Really! You don't see many Horseboxes in the fast lane?

 

[Lizbiebrowne]

In reference to the “actual” speed l am travelling at l totally ignore the speedometer knowing the Sat-Nav to be truly accurate.

GPS measures your speed along the surface of the earth. Strictly speaking it is only truly accurate if you’re travelling along a level road; it’s less accurate if you’re travelling up or down hill. This is because you are travelling along the hypotenuse of the right angled triangle rather than the base. It’s a small difference: 3% if you’re travelling along a 1 in 4 slope, but different nonetheless.

 

[jongood]

As has already been noted/posted by others there are specific circumstances when, in fact, it is legitimate (legal). Opinion doesn’t come into it.

Ian

The fact is that the police believe themselves to be too busy to mess about with the vagaries of the people who even now refer to lane 1 as the slow lane, so you/we are very unlikely to be prosecuted for just motoring past them on the inside without disrupting their myopia.

 

[bigtwin]

The fact is that the police believe themselves to be too busy to mess about with the vagaries of the people who even now refer to lane 1 as the slow lane, so you/we are very unlikely to be prosecuted for just motoring past them on the inside without disrupting their myopia.

Agreed Jon but the only potential issue these days is the risk that a self-righteous middle-Laner decides to submit their dash-cam footage of your (and their ) misdemeanour to the authorities.

Ian

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[JockandRita]

As far as I am aware, undertaking IS NOT ILLEGAL, however, if by your actions you are involved in a RTC, (Road Traffic Crash), the Highway Code can be used in a court of law to apportion blame.

can someone point me in the direction of the legislation thats says trailers are not allowed in the outside lane of a 3 or more lane highway please as this is a constant e of debate in our office and ive also asked traffic police to verify it and I havnt found 1 that can prove it im sure the legislation covers motorways ie roads wuth blue signage not normal roads with green signage.

I am not trying to be controversial, but I am genuinely astonished that a qualified driver should ask such a question, and the fact you and your colleagues who I am assuming are also qualified drivers, are actually debating the subject.

The Highway Code is your friend.............and has been since you and your colleagues passed your driving test.

Motorways - Lane discipline (264 to 266)

You should always drive in the left-hand lane when the road ahead is clear. If you are overtaking a number of slower-moving vehicles, you should return to the left-hand lane as soon as you are safely past.

www.highwaycodeuk.co.uk

Regards,

Jock.

 

[Vanman]

As far as I am aware, undertaking IS NOT ILLEGAL, however, if by your actions you are involved in a RTC, (Road Traffic Crash), the Highway Code can be used in a court of law to apportion blame.


I am not trying to be controversial, but I am genuinely astonished that a qualified driver should ask such a question, and the fact you and your colleagues who I am assuming are also qualified drivers, are actually debating the subject.

The Highway Code is your friend.............and has been since you and your colleagues passed your driving test.

Motorways - Lane discipline (264 to 266)

You should always drive in the left-hand lane when the road ahead is clear. If you are overtaking a number of slower-moving vehicles, you should return to the left-hand lane as soon as you are safely past.

www.highwaycodeuk.co.uk

Regards,

Jock.

Did you miss 268?

268
Do not overtake on the left or move to a lane on your left to overtake. In congested conditions, where adjacent lanes of traffic are moving at similar speeds, traffic in left-hand lanes may sometimes be moving faster than traffic to the right. In these conditions you may keep up with the traffic in your lane even if this means passing traffic in the lane to your right. Do not weave in and out of lanes to overtake.

 

[stewartwebr]

Really! You don't see many Horseboxes in the fast lane?

That’s because they are carrying goods

 

[JockandRita]

Did you miss 268?

268
Do not overtake on the left or move to a lane on your left to overtake. In congested conditions, where adjacent lanes of traffic are moving at similar speeds, traffic in left-hand lanes may sometimes be moving faster than traffic to the right. In these conditions you may keep up with the traffic in your lane even if this means passing traffic in the lane to your right. Do not weave in and out of lanes to overtake.

No, I did not miss out Rule No 268, and as you have quoted above, there are circumstances where it is permissable, however, the onus is upon the individual driver carrying out an overtaking manoeuvre on the left, to exercise extreme caution.
Must not, should not, and do not all have different references.

If you read any of the Highway Code, you’ll notice that points are marked by ‘must/must not’, ‘should/should not’ and ‘do/do not’. The first group of terms signify actual laws of the roads, while the latter two groups denote points which won’t result in prosecution alone – but could still be used as evidence in court.

We all have a duty to act responsibly when sharing the road with others.

Regards,

Jock.

 

[L' Hobo]

That’s because they are carrying goods

No, their horse is no different from ones dog!
If they were carrying 'goods' they could not be a PHGV but a normal HGV and an Operators licence as the goods would be classed as hire & reward.

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[Grummyb]

am not trying to be controversial, but I am genuinely astonished that a qualified driver should ask such a question, and the fact you and your colleagues who I am assuming are also qualified drivers, are actually debating the subject.

The Highway Code is your friend.............and has been since you and your colleagues passed your driving test.

Your not being controversial Jock but your not answering my question and it seems no one knows the answer

 

[Vanman]

Your not being controversial Jock but your not answering my question and it seems no one knows the answer

Your question seems a bit ambiguous ... is this the text you are looking for?

Rule 265​

The right-hand lane of a motorway with three or more lanes MUST NOT be used (except in prescribed circumstances) if you are driving

• any vehicle drawing a trailer

 

[VXman]

Isn’t that a caravan?

Yes - I realised just after I posted but thought I'd the the thread run an see how many people noticed.

 

[Scottish Scrutineer]

GPS measures your speed along the surface of the earth. Strictly speaking it is only truly accurate if you’re travelling along a level road; it’s less accurate if you’re travelling up or down hill. This is because you are travelling along the hypotenuse of the right angled triangle rather than the base. It’s a small difference: 3% if you’re travelling along a 1 in 4 slope, but different nonetheless.

Not many motorways have 25% (1 in 4) gradients

 

[Stoosal]

To be amended

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