A letter to clubs about site prices (1 Viewer)

[SalcombeRegis]

Prices were inevitably going to rise significantly. Having just sold a Park in Devon it was a full time job to keep up to speed with rising costs. It is not just about energy costs but every other single cost we experience. The two that most people overlook is Rates and Insurance. These have gone through the roof.

My rates last year were £26,000 and insurance £8,000. That is £34,000 I had to recoup in a 7 month season. Our peak rate was £36 for an electric pitch which means after VAT we got £30. To put it into perspective I had to sell 1,133 nights just to satisfy only 2 overheads. The rest add up to significantly more.

Whereas I accept that Europe are cheaper you have to one get there but also they have a longer season to recoup their costs. It is a lot to take on as we have not seen rises like this for years but in the UK if they don’t put up prices they will not be in business too long.

Another consideration is that customer expectations are higher and parks have to keep high standards. I reinvested £750,000 back into the Park over a 9 year period that came from pitch fees. It is not all about profiteering.

 

[sbbots]

This was Easter weekend for Caravan. Grass pitch no electricity. Ridiculous.

 

[wp1234]

Businesses aren't putting up their prices at the moment to take the piss. We have buy to let properties rented out now and the mortgage repayments are more than the rent we are getting.

Yes but your house is going up in value …. Just sell if your not happy

 

[Coolcats]

Prices were inevitably going to rise significantly. Having just sold a Park in Devon it was a full time job to keep up to speed with rising costs. It is not just about energy costs but every other single cost we experience. The two that most people overlook is Rates and Insurance. These have gone through the roof.

My rates last year were £26,000 and insurance £8,000. That is £34,000 I had to recoup in a 7 month season. Our peak rate was £36 for an electric pitch which means after VAT we got £30. To put it into perspective I had to sell 1,133 nights just to satisfy only 2 overheads. The rest add up to significantly more.

Whereas I accept that Europe are cheaper you have to one get there but also they have a longer season to recoup their costs. It is a lot to take on as we have not seen rises like this for years but in the UK if they don’t put up prices they will not be in business too long.

Another consideration is that customer expectations are higher and parks have to keep high standards. I reinvested £750,000 back into the Park over a 9 year period that came from pitch fees. It is not all about profiteering.

If yours was the site we stayed on last year that has now been sold have to say you had an amazing site, our bookings were honoured during the pandemic when we couldn't get there and your staff were 1st class, thank you.

Jim I think SalcombeRegis post should be at the top of any post where people are complaining of costs as they have eloquently outlined why costs are why they are and clearly there are many more expenses on top of those spoken about.

 

[Gina M]

Yes but your house is going up in value …. Just sell if your not happy

Read my post after about this. We know we are still in profit (when we sell) so for now we are not going to put the rent up

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[Gina M]

What’s the chance of that happening anywhere ?
I do a lot of Aires thru France and have never seen anything like that happening.

I know but like I have said before I over think things. It annoys the hell out of Mr Ginam. I am ok with Aires but not with parking up in fields, laybys or remote places. Can I sue Stephen King for scaring the hell out of me

 

[8250]

A number of people who frequented the tea tent at the Newbury Show were commenting on the rise in pitch fees. I don't stop on many sites so can't really comment.

If this is the case I thought I'd write to the two big clubs and try and get some reasoning for this. I know we have some wages inflation as well as higher electricity costs, but I suspect, like a lot of industries there might be a bit of "Greedflation" in their prices.

To give my letter some legitimacy it would be nice to know what proportion of our membership are their members, so please choose an option above.

Also can you let us know about some of the increases you have seen. Thanks

Won’t renew as I think they are overpriced

 

[tinkerbell]

We are in both, but not used often, but worth it when you do. We wanted 2 nights in the Lake District last week, a Thursday and Friday, before they realised we were members they asked for 99.00 for two nights, i nearly died and said I am a member, apparently a Thursday is the new Friday so higher prices are now on a Thursday as well as Sundays.

 

[Jim]

@Jim I think @SalcombeRegis post should be at the top of any post where people are complaining of costs as they have eloquently outlined why costs are why they are and clearly there are many more expenses on top of those spoken about.

Why? That is specific to his business and a long way removed from a club that takes tens of millions in club fees before it parks a single van on a pitch.

I agree with you and he that sites are more expensive to run than many think, and if the clubs reply I'm sure they will justify the prices to their satisfaction, whether that satisfies their members is another story. We'll just be asking the questions, why are we seeing such big price hikes that many members are reporting.

 

[Coolcats]

Why? That is specific to his business and a long way removed from a club that takes tens of millions in club fees before it parks a single van on a pitch.

I agree with you and he that sites are more expensive to run than many think, and if the clubs reply I'm sure they will justify the prices to their satisfaction, whether that satisfies their members is another story. We'll just be asking the questions, why are we seeing such big price hikes that many members are reporting.

Totally understand, no one likes price hikes and peoples funds are being battered from all directions. From food to mortgages to the price hikes in new Motorhomes a MoHo costing £50k plus around 2018-2019 is now around £80k. Even the two private sites I posted about are similar price hikes to CAMC. No one wants to pay these but when you go to these sites they are full or nearly full. So whilst SalcombeRegis may have had costs unique to them it is probably not so dissimilar across the industry and gives a good perspective from someone within the industry. I remember you mentioning the cost of the damaged blade in your lawnmower and how many nights it would take in pitch fees to pay for it and that is just one mower.

It is a good thing that you are doing and I don’t think anyone is saying you should not do it as it may help all.

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[Pete n Sal]

A number of people who frequented the tea tent at the Newbury Show were commenting on the rise in pitch fees. I don't stop on many sites so can't really comment.

If this is the case I thought I'd write to the two big clubs and try and get some reasoning for this. I know we have some wages inflation as well as higher electricity costs, but I suspect, like a lot of industries there might be a bit of "Greedflation" in their prices.

To give my letter some legitimacy it would be nice to know what proportion of our membership are their members, so please choose an option above.

Also can you let us know about some of the increases you have seen. Thanks

we were in both of the big clubs but now are just ccc as we like the members run groups and affordable camping as they describe it, Called District Associations who charge on average £10 to £14 per unit per night without electricity.

 

[chaser]

It's ok quoting these costs, and so it maybe for providing toilets , showers , electric and whatever else tenters and caravaners need but the fact remains all a motorhome needs is a few square yards of parking space which isn't costing the club anything over if it is empty or filled.

 

[Dave and Jan]

We are members of both. There are still some good prices to be had with the CCC using the O60s discount, whereas the CMC prices have gone stupid. No doubt the cost of energy is partly responsible. Maybe they could adopt a more European approach with 6 or 10 amp outlets which severely restricts what you can use. I also don’t like how they advertise. You’ll look at a site advertised from £21pn. By the time you’ve added a second person and chosen your date it’ll bump up to around £35-40. Same with insurance. They guarantee to save you £25 but by the time you’ve built in breakdown etc it works out more expensive. I do enjoy the CMC monthly magazine though.

 

[nickq]

Supply and demand that's all it is. Camping, caravanning and motorhome/campervan use exploded around covid, I suspect that flood of demand has not tailed off yet. So they charge what they like because they can. (I'm talking CAMC not private sites)

I appreciate many on this forum have the luxury of not booking CAMC sites in the school holidays. I can tell you they are normally all full (if they are worth going to).
Last site I went to was Pembrey, it was so full I had to pay for a serviced pitch, yes maybe I'm stupid but when you are stuck with nowhere to go in the school holidays... It cost £60 a night, I stayed 1 night, didn't use any facilities as I never do other than topping up water and dumping waste.

Suggesting motorhome users are a bigger drain on CAMC is nonsense imo. We turn up, stay a couple of nights and move on. Grass isn't dead, didn't heat an awning on their electricity, didn't use the facilities so very little cleaning cost from me (admittedly sometimes I use the sinks to wash the bbq) and we take up less space, don't pop out in the car every few hours or so keeping the site more peaceful. Yes I have seen many caravan users driving their car around the site just to empty the toilet!

Our summer holiday is always over the channel, mainly for the weather and to get away from the brits (sorry but you know who I mean) but the lack of motorhome friendly stopping places in the UK is a very close second. A "free" pub car park when I'm then spending well over £50 on food for 3 is not my idea of a suitable stopping place, maybe a nice one off occasion only.

I firmly believe CAMC should divide their sites into caravans and motorhomes. Motorhome section could be more compact to fit more in, like a cross between an aire and an old french municiple. Motorhome spaces should not be bookable 6 months in advance but maybe only a week and maybe even reserve some pitches for turn ups. This would look more like a motorhome club to me. Stopping a couple of days to explore the local area and then moving on is what makes the motorhome so much more interesting and this is very hard to do in the UK, especially in the holidays and must put a lot of european visitors off.

Rant over

 

[chaser]

One thing that puzzles me is why it is less to pitch a tent than park a motorhome, by the nature of the things tenters are going to use more of the facilities than someone in a self contained mh, and the size of some of these modern tents they take up as much room or even more than a van.

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[Anjistar]

My biggest beef with the clubs is being unable to cancel and get a refund. So we rarely use the sites, and will let our membership lapse this year.
As we don't need to travel in peak times, we haven't been too affected by the price rises, though we have heard how shockingly high some of them appear to be.

 

[Twitters]

I am a member of CAMC and was up until recently a member of the CCC, didn't really use the CCC last year only about a couple of times, used the CAMC a little more but not much, not sure is i will renew with the CAMC is due, the prices for the pitches on both are quite expensive and have gone up quite a bit from last year.

 

[hja]

We are members of both. There are still some good prices to be had with the CCC using the O60s discount, whereas the CMC prices have gone stupid. No doubt the cost of energy is partly responsible. Maybe they could adopt a more European approach with 6 or 10 amp outlets which severely restricts what you can use. I also don’t like how they advertise. You’ll look at a site advertised from £21pn. By the time you’ve added a second person and chosen your date it’ll bump up to around £35-40. Same with insurance. They guarantee to save you £25 but by the time you’ve built in breakdown etc it works out more expensive. I do enjoy the CMC monthly magazine though.

I agree completely except for your last sentence. It takes me one short coffee break to read it!

 

[enark]

Great idea Jim, hope it gets a result.

I will think very carefully about renewal as tbh member discounts are not great and probably equally achievable through other discounts……veterans card?

 

[Mike Warland]

I am at a CL at the moment for three nights. £20 per night + electric coin meter.( pay for what you use).
What about private site prices in the U.K., I am sure they would have put all there prices up also because of the price of electric etc. I priced up two in Devon where I lived and know the sites and in peak time both were about £55-£65 per night for two adults.

Were on Seaview Haven site at Weymouth 5 nights £11 per night for fully serviced pitch. It's a special arrangement with the Motorcarsvanners Club.

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[chatteris]

I joined ccc last year mainly for access to the service points although i have booked for a night on 2 occasions, if i thought price for night was too much i would have just used the service point, stayed 1 night at tregurrian at beginning of month grass pitch with hook up, total £24.50 with age discount for two of us, its a lovely site so thought price reasonable and booked same day

 

[Albacore]

We used to stay at Carnon downs multiple times a year pre pandemic it was around £26 per night. Last year it was £46 and we decided we could not afford to stay there anymore. This year I think the price for a serviced pitch is a few pence off £50. With that in mind we decided to come to France for 2 weeks instead, still cheaper with ferry included. Most pitches we have stayed on are essentially serviced (as standard offering) all for no more than €21 with pools and restaurant on site etc. My current site is €19 and even if I am here a month (mum still in hospital) it will be cheaper than 2 weeks at Carnon. Uk prices are ludicrous and there is sheer profiteering going on by the clubs. I joined the clubs as they used to be much better value than commercial sites. When I first got the van in mid October we wanted to stay on a site in Wareham for a night. Hunters moon was £36, wareham forest touring park £22. How can they justify that for a patch of gravel off season. No wonder the sites are no longer full. We will not stay on club sites any longer cl's and cs's or commercial /abroad from now on.

 

[Molly A]

Same old arguments europhiles always use conveniently ignoring the time, distances and costs of crossing the channel & driving hundreds of miles to get to these cheap sites.

Also conveniently forgetting there are many places in the UK one can overnight for free, or for just a few pounds.

But it's okay.
No one's choice is "best"
It doesn't have to be a competition, EU vs UK.
Long live freedom of choice

Same old arguments that those who are blinkered to the way motorhomers are ripped off for substandard accommodation in the UK use to justify the supine way they put up with it. For example, you can use as much fuel getting to Scotland as you do getting to France, depending, of course on where you live. And then there are the ferries if you want to visit the islands.....The number of places you can stay for free in the UK is negligible compared to over the channel. Let's, face it, one is generally ripped off for even day time parking, assuming that you can find a car park without a height restriction. But, yes, freedom of choice is key, and as many people who have expressed an opinion on this thread have opined, the club sites are ridiculously expensive compared to better options just over the channel, where motor homes are welcomed and valued.

 

[Pulteney]

Member of both at the moment, using mostly CL’s and CS’s which for my money are a great way to tour around. I’ve kept both going over the years to give me the best geographical spread but I’m seriously considering dropping one - probably the CCC.

 

[Janine]

Same old arguments that those who are blinkered to the way motorhomers are ripped off for substandard accommodation in the UK use to justify the supine way they put up with it. For example, you can use as much fuel getting to Scotland as you do getting to France, depending, of course on where you live. And then there are the ferries if you want to visit the islands.....The number of places you can stay for free in the UK is negligible compared to over the channel. Let's, face it, one is generally ripped off for even day time parking, assuming that you can find a car park without a height restriction. But, yes, freedom of choice is key, and as many people who have expressed an opinion on this thread have opined, the club sites are ridiculously expensive compared to better options just over the channel, where motor homes are welcomed and valued.

I note your points but not everyone wants to travel abroad for various personal reasons.

It doesn’t make them ‘blinkered’, it means they are enjoying their time in this country even if it costs more.

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[SalcombeRegis]

It's ok quoting these costs, and so it maybe for providing toilets , showers , electric and whatever else tenters and caravaners need but the fact remains all a motorhome needs is a few square yards of parking space which isn't costing the club anything over if it is empty or filled.

Having been at the receiving end of this very point on many occasions, it would only work if you had a dedicated overnight parking area that was separate from the rest of the Park. I say this because after having this debate with motor-homers claiming they will not be using the facilities, you then witness them coming out of the shower block with a towel over their shoulder and when leaving putting all sorts of rubbish/chairs/tables next to the waste points for us to dispose of, walking the dog in our dedicated dog walking area and using our bins and bags for dog waste, dumping their grey water and filling their tanks with over 100 litres of fresh water.

The amount of times I had to remind a customer that they had not paid for electric but were plugged in was more than you would imagine and the excuse was always “I changed my mind and was coming to see you”.

I know I am generalising and mostly deal with honest people but there are chancers out there that ruin it for the majority - so you end up with one rule for all.

The next consideration is that an overnight space that you are sleeping in still requires the 6m gap between units. Really difficult to do and most sites don’t comply with that anyway and use 3m. Each parking space would really have to be a minimum 6m and park in the middle.

Most local councils have now opened their car parks for overnight parking for MH’s and charge a lot less than camp sites so it is a matter of choice. You just will not have any facilities at all or the security most sites offer.

 

[OutTheOffice]

Same old arguments that those who are blinkered to the way motorhomers are ripped off for substandard accommodation in the UK use to justify the supine way they put up with it. For example, you can use as much fuel getting to Scotland as you do getting to France, depending, of course on where you live. And then there are the ferries if you want to visit the islands.....The number of places you can stay for free in the UK is negligible compared to over the channel. Let's, face it, one is generally ripped off for even day time parking, assuming that you can find a car park without a height restriction. But, yes, freedom of choice is key, and as many people who have expressed an opinion on this thread have opined, the club sites are ridiculously expensive compared to better options just over the channel, where motor homes are welcomed and valued.

I have to agree with you, about 75% of our annual mileage is over the water in France / Spain / Germany etc etc. So much to see and do and made welcome where ever you go . This year we are heading to Norway for the first time and will be away for 86 nights. Everyone has a preference, but if we could not take our van across to Europe twice a year then I would sell it.

 

[urban_biker]

Everyone has a preference, but if we could not take our van across to Europe twice a year then I would sell it.

If I could only explore the Uk then I think I'd buy a caravan and appropriate tow car. Right now motorhoming is very limiting in the UK given location of sites and need to book everywhere.

 

[Mr porky]

We are members of both but I'm keeping CAMC as they have the bury site which makes visiting friends in Manchester an easy option.
The CCC will be allowed to lapse as the website is so infuriating that we never seem to be able to book anything.
Costs are an issue on club sites but if we need to be somewhere we do bite the bullet and pay.
We loved to stay on Abbeywood site with the easy access to London but if the cost of travelling into the zone will get excessive we won't be doing that anymore.

 

[hja]

"Most local councils have now opened their car parks for overnight parking for MH’s and charge a lot less than camp sites so it is a matter of choice. You just will not have any facilities at all or the security most sites offer." SalcombeRegis - I dont think this is true at all. In Lincolnshire, for example, where I live, many car parks have been closed to mohos even during the day, let alone at night.

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