Towing a car on a trailer

[Nightrider]

Thanks for the confirmation bigtwin

PeteH all the micro maxis are 1300kg.

Phill D yes I am trying to find an open weigh bridge near Stansted Airport to weigh the motor home and the Morris (separately of course).

Between Hatfield Heath and CHELMSFORD.
Boyton Hall Farm Boyton Hall Lane Roxwell Chelmsford Essex CM1 4LN
Up to 50 tonnes Tel: 01245 248664 £12.00 Inc. VAT 8.00am - 4.00pm Mon- Fri

 

[62272]

The weight that can be towed is the difference between the GVW which is 4500 and the plated train weight which is 5500 so where does it say that the vehicle can tow 1500kg.

Not quite accurate; without a trailer the GVW is the max permissible weight (if placed on a weighbridge with all axles on the scales) (ignoring separate axle weights). The gross train weight (towing weight) is the maximum permissible if you placed the combination (vehicle and trailer) both on the weigh-bridge scales at the same time. therefore, it is perfectly legally possible to have a trailer which exceeds in weight the difference between the two manufacturer‘s stated weights for GVW and GTW. So long as the combination doesn’t exceed the stated GTW.

 

[Mikeco]

Not quite accurate; without a trailer the GVW is the max permissible weight (if placed on a weighbridge with all axles on the scales) (ignoring separate axle weights). The gross train weight (towing weight) is the maximum permissible if you placed the combination (vehicle and trailer) both on the weigh-bridge scales at the same time. therefore, it is perfectly legally possible to have a trailer which exceeds in weight the difference between the two manufacturer‘s stated weights for GVW and GTW. So long as the combination doesn’t exceed the stated GTW.

Perhaps legal, perhaps not,, especially if you are exceeding the towing weight advised by the chassis manufacturer which is the difference between the GTW and GVW.

 

[Conal]

Nightrider
Thanks, that’s closer to me than Hoddesdon. I will give them a ring

 

[poppycamper]

How oh how can such a simple issue cause so much grief and heartache and different views between so called knowledgeable and educated Funsters.???

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[pappajohn]

How oh how can such a simple issue cause so much grief and heartache and different views between so called knowledgeable and educated Funsters.???

That's the monster that is a public forum.

 

[Conal]

I am grateful for the interest. Looking back at my first post I realise I should have looked at the weight plates when we bought the motorhome - I just took the brochure as gospel.
I know more now so the forum has done its job... as usual.

 

[Paulypaul]

With regards to weigh bridges, you could try the aggregate yard down at Station Approach, Harlow Mill. Just off the Gates' roundabout in Harlow. I used to run out of a transport yard next door but I think that's gone now and us an extension of the aggregate yard.

It used to be Yeomans but I havent been down there in years so I'm not sure if yeomans still run out of there. Might be worth a call to see if they can help. Closer to Stortford than Hoddesdon.

Good luck

 

[gus-lopez]

Perhaps legal, perhaps not,, especially if you are exceeding the towing weight advised by the chassis manufacturer which is the difference between the GTW and GVW.

But on a basic van if it says 2T for towing the manufacturer still has to ensure that it can tow a 3,5T trailer as the law allows all the under weight of the vehicle to be added to the trailer,legally. As long as it remains under the overall MTW.

** Like my Tranist 330mwb.The actual Ford plate states 3300kgs for MGW & 4500 for MTW BUT the techinical log book from Trafico allows me to tow 750 kgs unbraked & 2400kgs with brakes.
The 2400kgs assumes that the van , which has an unladen weight of 1737 originally, would be running at under 2100kgs when weighed on its own**

 

[Augusta08]

There's plenty of good advice on what's legal here, but the OP should also observe the rule of 85% recommended by the RAC. Too heavy a trailer can lead to the tail wagging the dog! unless you're an experienced tow-er I think a rule of 50% is a safer bet.

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[Speve]

We are around 4000 kg when fully laden for three month trip to Spain and trailer laden is 1600kg it tows really well you don’t know it’s there and in 8 years never had any tail wagging.
It is twin axle Phoenix car transporter.

 

[Conal]

Essex joins the second tier of COVID limitation tomorrow - I live about 1km away from the boundary - so that may limit my choice of weigh bridge- or it may not

 

[62272]

Perhaps legal, perhaps not,, especially if you are exceeding the towing weight advised by the chassis manufacturer which is the difference between the GTW and GVW.

Still not illegal, although advisable, the officer would have to prove the combination was dangerous under the con and use regs, if purely relying on the manufacturers‘ recommendations or specification this would be difficult to prove in court. In the case stated here there was a discrepancy between the GVW - v- GTW and Manufacturers ‘specification’ on the max towing weight of 500 kgs.

 

[scally]

Why not a towing dolly as per the RAC use. It's a lot lighter than a trailer Anne it don't stick out like an a frame

 

[Manic]

Why not a towing dolly as per the RAC use. It's a lot lighter than a trailer Anne it don't stick out like an a frame

Because they are only legal for recovery companies

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[Freo]

Right, just returned from a bike ride to the storage yard.

Photos below but no description of what they refer to, and no mention of 5500

View attachment 433365View attachment 433366

It is my understanding that the ‘habitaion’ manufacture (e.g. Autotrail or whoever) fit a 3rd weight plate. This 3rd plate supersedes both the Fiat and Alko plates and is the plate to use for all weight ratings. This is certainly true of my own motorhome. Your manufacturer’s handbook might indicate the location of this plate. (It is sometimes found at a low level just inside the habitation door.)

 

[pappajohn]

Because they are only legal for recovery companies

And they have no means of applying the brakes which is a requirement in law.
Recovery companies are exempt from many towing laws.

 

[Geo]

And they have no means of applying the brakes which is a requirement in law.
Recovery companies are exempt from many towing laws.

Must keep up John Dollies have had brakes for over ten years ive got two ex RAC both with brakes
But as you say recovery use only very slow speed restrictions apply. and question 2 x trailer regs.
trailer 1 dolly, trailer 2 car
you may need a showmans licence i understand for private use

 

[Conal]

Freo
Thanks, I will look for it.
Conal

 

[pappajohn]

Must keep up John Dollies have had brakes for over ten years ive got two ex RAC both with brakes
But as you say recovery use only very slow speed restrictions apply. and question 2 x trailer regs.
trailer 1 dolly, trailer 2 car
you may need a showmans licence i understand for private use

The dolly maybe has.... But so has the car and if brakes are fitted they must operate and meet trailer brake standards..... How can the brakes work on a dolly.
We never used a dolly as we had a fleet of spec frame transits and a couple of flatbed.

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[Geo]

The dolly has overun brakes and als a thick Bowden cable goes through side window of car and pushes cars brake peddle down, clumsy but it works.

 

[pappajohn]

The dolly has overun brakes and als a thick Bowden cable goes through side window of car and pushes cars brake peddle down, clumsy but it works.

So this bowden cable has multiple pivot joints or is very flexible yet still has the ability to exert a force on the pedal and adjustable for every vehicles different pedal position.
I'd love to see a photo of that ready to go.
Better still Geo, can I have some of what you've been drinking.

 

[Itsmcb]

Just spotted this photo today

 

[Conal]

Itsmcb
Great!
I will follow this up!

 

[Itsmcb]

I saw it on a Facebook group called 'motorhome happiness' I believe the posters name is in the picture. Maybe join and get in touch? Hope it will be of some help, at least shows it can be done

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[Conal]

Itsmcb
Thanks again. I have contacted Peter and he gave me the Aframe manufacturer. I left a message for them and will follow up tomorrow.
I have also joined the Facebook group,m; it see

 

[Conal]

I am having a tow bar fitted in December at Watling Engineers which can tow a trailer or an A Frame, and an A Frame fitted to my Morris Minor in March next year (the earliest available date) at TowingAframes in Chesterfield.
If we ever get to travel to Spain again I will buy a small trailer.
Thanks to all for your advice