Motorhome take over at CAMC

[Cheshirecat57]

Top one looks nice, bottom one looks horrible far too regimented and prim & proper sort of place I hate.

Just goes to show we are all different ,eh?

And deep down, aren’t we all glad to be different

 

[Cheshirecat57]

None of my children’s friends have even considered towing. They are mainly looking at PVC’s.

Personal opinion, Caravanning has a future, but not in it’s present guise
The big, twin axle gin-palaces that weigh close to 2 tonnes will struggle to find buyers in the young generation because you not only need the licence, but you need a hefty tow-car that may not fit your lifestyle
The manufacturers will have to focus on <1000kg sports compacts ( Swift Basecamp) or even Pods that fall into the better-than-a-tent category, but can be pulled by a small car and stay under 3500 kg total MAM

EVs , as they mature, will get homologated to pull these lower weight trailers and ‘vans

The manufacturers will not just roll over and become extinct

 

[Fragle]

C&MC (and I guess C&CC) do provide facilities for motorhomes but maybe not the ones you want. It does confound me that folk join knowing what they provide and then complain. Perhaps a bit like joining a golf club and complaining they don't have a pool table in the clubhouse?
As for forward planning there's no reason why a motorhomer can't turn up (or phone ahead) at a Club site in the hope there's a free pitch, happened yesterday when someone pitched up next to us, but you get a pitch with facilities as that's what the Club provides. If that's not what you want you would surely go to another location that offers a different product. 10 non-electric pitches on a site last week had one campervan on for one night out of 5 so 49 pitches empty when the site was quite busy. And, most nights there were at least 2 units parked up ignoring the "No overnight parking" signs on the beach \ picnic area next door.
As for charging extra for shower facilities it would be very difficult to manage \ police cost effectively. I've seen \ heard a warden on a C&MC site get abuse from a non-resident because he challenged a woman about to enter the facilities block. She had walked onto the site from an external parking area so, I would assume (maybe wrongly), not even a Club member.

A number of sites in Scotland (eg Garlieston, Brora, etc) frequently have their grass pitches off due to weather \ ground conditions. Garlieston was flooded (seawater) during last winter again. I've seen wardens going around with a garden fork "testing" grass pitches and then subsequently taking them off. Better that than getting a unit bogged down on it.

When We actually joined the caravan club 30 years ago with a caravan it was a caravan club. Now we have a Motorhome and they claim to be a Motorhome club as well
So not asking for anything other than what they themselves claim to be.
They along with commercial sites continue to obstruct the introduction of an continental Aires type model but in 30 years have not changed there own model to the needs of a changing market. If they can’t supply it then stop using the power and position they have to block the introduction of Aires. You can’t have it both ways.

 

[jongood]

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It would help those of us who are trying to see the rights and wrongs in this debate from an objective and generalist (rather than personal) point of view, if people who make assertions that this organisation is doing that to stop whatever from happening would actually come forward with the hard evidence.

This is a forum not a hearing, but if you're a member why not ask them?
I did when I was a member and the answer I got was that they discourage d it hence my membership was very short, but always worth asking again, maybe they will revisit it.

 

[Ivory55]

When We actually joined the caravan club 30 years ago with a caravan it was a caravan club. Now we have a Motorhome and they claim to be a Motorhome club as well
So not asking for anything other than what they themselves claim to be.
They along with commercial sites continue to obstruct the introduction of an continental Aires type model but in 30 years have not changed there own model to the needs of a changing market. If they can’t supply it then stop using the power and position they have to block the introduction of Aires. You can’t have it both ways.

Do they object to privately funded Aires or just tax payer subsidised ones ?

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[boxtraveller]

Just back from 3 weeks touring in Scotland, CL's, small private sites, bit of wilding and one CMC, motorhomes everywhere but what was very obvious was the many 30 somethings in their PVC's, spoke to one or two and it was their dual purpose vehicle for work and play, no intention of buying a caravan cos nowhere to park it, too much hassle etc, motorhome maybe one day but other priorities.
So it would seem the young have already decided the future of caravanning and motorhoming and its small and nimble and dual purpose.

 

[Lenny HB]

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This is a forum not a hearing, but if you're a member why not ask them?
I did when I was a member and the answer I got was that they discourage d it hence my membership was very short, but always worth asking again, maybe they will revisit it.

My niece is their community relations officer (or some other fancy title), I asked her she said we keep getting asked that, but as far as she is aware they have no intention of changing their standpoint.

 

[jongood]

My niece is their community relations officer (or some other fancy title), I asked her she said we keep getting asked that, but as far as she is aware they have no intention of changing their standpoint.

Thanks Lenny, I'm not really surprised, they seem to be far more interested in generating profits than representing. Their membership. Shame they're not more like NZMCA

 

[TDub49]

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This is a forum not a hearing, but if you're a member why not ask them?
I did when I was a member and the answer I got was that they discourage d it hence my membership was very short, but always worth asking again, maybe they will revisit it.

Maybe because I am not bothered? What does bother me is the proliferation of opinion and subjectivity over fact and evidence that characterises much "social media" traffic these days. Maybe the evil CC and CMC, working in cahoots with the money grabbing site owners, are objecting at every opportunity to a network of aires being established, maybe they're not. If they are, where is the evidence?

In the meantime, the proliferation of motor homes in this country is proceeding at an astounding rate so if there is a viable market to be found on providing cheap and basic minimum space pitches, you can be sure that site owners will take advantage of it whatever the clubs say.

 

[Brains]

we have stayed on 4 C&MHC sites in the last couple of weeks
CL site nr Farnham - 3 caravans, 1 M/H
CL site nr Rye - 0 Caravans, 3 M/H
Totness - 3 Caravans, 20+ M/H
Cornwall - 1 M/H

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[Langtoftlad]

Who is supposed to pay for these "Aires"?
Land in most of the UK is expensive, local authorities already have too much demand on their scant resources.
Unless there is hard evidence that the cost of providing & maintaining such a facility is outweighed by the income generated, why would they?
Unless forced by statute, the risks are too great in most areas.

 

[Littlewheels]

Do they object to privately funded Aires or just tax payer subsidised ones ?

Since objections are nationwide my view is these large established clubs and sites see it as competition.
It’s all well and good stating that there are xxxxxthousands of pitches available in the UK but as we are all aware it’s very difficult to get on the ones in a good location near amenities,therefore,the demand creates a cost and many are saying £30/£50 per night is high,they object because simple cost effective Camperstops/Aires would drive there clients onto them.
This thread has already highlighted the amount of Motorhomes on sites at anyone time imagine if the vision of Camperstops/Aires became a reality and successful like in say France the current establishments would have to drop their prices in order to be competitive which at the moment they do not need to be.

 

[Ivory55]

Since objections are nationwide my view is these large established clubs and sites see it as competition.
It’s all well and good stating that there are xxxxxthousands of pitches available in the UK but as we are all aware it’s very difficult to get on the ones in a good location near amenities,therefore,the demand creates a cost and many are saying £30/£50 per night is high,they object because simple cost effective Camperstops/Aires would drive there clients onto them.
This thread has already highlighted the amount of Motorhomes on sites at anyone time imagine if the vision of Camperstops/Aires became a reality and successful like in say France the current establishments would have to drop their prices in order to be competitive which at the moment they do not need to be.

But are they objecting to private funded or tax payers subsidy ones , you don’t say.

 

[Ivory55]

If it’s such a marvellous buisness idea you could always start buying land and open them . Or does it need to be subsidy by tax payers ?

 

[M-J]

Back on topic the motorhome to caravan ratio evened out to around 50/50 yesterday. Still great to see many more motorhomes than normal.

On another note I would say the average age is also getting lower from what I could see.

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[Littlewheels]

But are they objecting to private funded or tax payers subsidy ones , you don’t say.

It appears to be all as they in my opinion are seen as competition.

 

[Cheshirecat57]

Im afraid I dont buy into the notion that “Aires” in the UK could be cost effective in villages/towns/cities
With or without objections from clubs and general public, the land/rates/insurance/H&S puts up too many barriers( pun intended)
There is also little or no ferrel teen problem in France (i assume)
Imagine rocking up to a uk Aire, full of litter, tap broken and the Elsan with an uprooted tree shoved down it for a wheeze, with 5 youths in Black hoodies on BMXs “loitering” waiting for you to park up and pop to the pub.......
We need a dramatic culture change I’m afraid......unfortunately I will be sustaining a rose-bush by the time that comes

 

[Pekepal]

I am at CAMC Baltic Wharf and out of the 55 pitches, there are about 5 caravans

Have caravanned and motorhome here many times. So sad it’s closing.

 

[Ivory55]

It appears to be all as they in my opinion are seen as competition.

Well if owned a buisness of any sort and was threatened with loss of business from a tax payers subsidiesed operator I would not be to happy either. If it was a private buisness with loan repayments etc then it would be fair.

 

[jongood]

Who is supposed to pay for these "Aires"?
Land in most of the UK is expensive, local authorities already have too much demand on their scant resources.
Unless there is hard evidence that the cost of providing & maintaining such a facility is outweighed by the income generated, why would they?
Unless forced by statute, the risks are too great in most areas.

In many cases all that's needed is a rule change on existing car parks and can then be managed with pay and display etc. There are quite a few such arrangements coming on line but nowhere near enough yet

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[Swifter]

i know where I’d rather be staying

View attachment 497217View attachment 497218

That’s Love2stay ( the bottom picture )
Our favourite site

 

[Hawkstone]

Personal opinion, Caravanning has a future, but not in it’s present guise
The big, twin axle gin-palaces that weigh close to 2 tonnes will struggle to find buyers in the young generation because you not only need the licence, but you need a hefty tow-car that may not fit your lifestyle
The manufacturers will have to focus on <1000kg sports compacts ( Swift Basecamp) or even Pods that fall into the better-than-a-tent category, but can be pulled by a small car and stay under 3500 kg total MAM

EVs , as they mature, will get homologated to pull these lower weight trailers and ‘vans

The manufacturers will not just roll over and become extinct

True and there are some beaut little pods out there.

 

[Littlewheels]

Well if owned a buisness of any sort and was threatened with loss of business from a tax payers subsidiesed operator I would not be to happy either. If it was a private buisness with loan repayments etc then it would be fair.

I have been in business for fifty years on a n international level and do not have loan repayments and never had as have many thousands of successful businesses a business plan doesn’t need subsidies.
l will leave there.

 

[Ivory55]

Just never surprises me how many experts on here that know how to run another persons buisness or have ideas on how to spend others or tax payers money.

 

[Fragle]

Do they object to privately funded Aires or just tax payer subsidised ones ?

Irrelevant really. We all pay our taxes.
what it will take is it’s made law to provide at least one in every town/village.
car parking is already there and mostly not used at night and sometimes they already have toilet there
As someone said it just a change of use and the cost?
I would say more than covered at £5 a night 6 till 8
As said earlier by someone else club are not in

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[Ivory55]

Personally if I was an outsider reading the opinions of motorhome owners on here about Aires, I would think that they seem to think that they are entitled. They seem to think it’s their right, they seem to think they are doing people a favour by visiting their area, and wondering why their tax money should be spent on subsidising someone who has more money then them to have a cheap holiday.

 

[jongood]

That’s Love2stay ( the bottom picture )
Our favourite site

Which is miles out of town and right next to a very busy junction. My wife did a craft shoe there and found it really noisy.

 

[jongood]

Irrelevant really. We all pay our taxes.
what it will take is it’s made law to provide at least one in every town/village.
car parking is already there and mostly not used at night and sometimes they already have toilet there
As someone said it just a change of use and the cost?
I would say more than covered at £5 a night 6 till 8
As said earlier by someone else club are not in

It's a minor addional purpose to an existing resource, in most cases it would be very easily and cheap ly accomplished

 

[Langtoftlad]

Irrelevant really. We all pay our taxes.
what it will take is it’s made law to provide at least one in every town/village.
car parking is already there and mostly not used at night and sometimes they already have toilet there
As someone said it just a change of use and the cost?
I would say more than covered at £5 a night 6 till 8
As said earlier by someone else club are not in

With all due respect, you're just guessing at costs.
IIRC it was GJH who mentioned that the carpark might not be constructed to take 3500kg+ vans.

Who is going to pay for the wardens to enforce payment from the overnighter?

Let's face it, there just isn't the demand to force a change in law...

 

[hja]

We tend not to use cmc sites because we don’t want to pay £30 for a pitch. We don’t use the site facilities. We will use non facility sites like Thetford Forest. We tend to use CLs. We have never taken our van abroad (when travelling overseas we had a caravan) so have never used an aire. We would consider a Britstop or aire in this country if in the correct location. As others have said it’s about sites with easy access to towns/villages and public transport. We don’t mind paying for an aire, we don’t want to wildcamp. The aire at Canterbury p & r seems a brilliant idea to me, and one we would definitely look to use if visiting Canterbury. So we would pay for the aire and buy things in Canterbury. So we contribute to local businesses and to the running of the aire. Less likely to visit if no convenient stop. It’s not about entitlement. We swapped from caravan to van for a variety of reasons, but wanted to continue with camping holidays. The alternative for us would be get rid of the van and have very few holidays at all. So no contribution to local economy.

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