Motorhome Payload Stop Checks

[Crazy Grandad]

Have any of you funsters ever been stopped in the UK and had your weight checked. Just been on weighbridge and wondered if there is any leeway with regard to carrying extra food and fuel on a 3500 van weight

 

[Nigel P]

My overall view is that once the rules are disregarded it can easily become a free for all, one man decides a two bike rear rack is enough but another bloke decides that is too restrictive so does his own thing, where does it end!

 

[Nirvanauk]

Have any of you funsters ever been stopped in the UK and had your weight checked. Just been on weighbridge and wondered if there is any leeway with regard to carrying extra food and fuel on a 3500 van weight

Not sure if it matters if you are carrying food or fuel. If you are over weight then you are overweight.

 

[David and Sally]

Just have a massive d**p before you travel. Huge increase in payload

 

[Carpmart]

Now don't get me wrong, I am not suggesting anyone do this

On many motorhomes, especially A class there is more than one weight plate, with final registration on purchase, there is a lower limit on the newest plate. However it is just as easy to point to the higher weight plate regardless of what was written on the v5 when checked. Claim a simple clerical error in the paperwork if your licence has c1 on it. This of course leaves a possibility of just having a plate made up and fit it without paying the £100 for irrelevant paperwork

Anything likely to cause a lot of paperwork with little chance of a prosecution, and most of the police officers I know would simply give a verbal warning to get the paperwork sorted if still within the limits of "the plate on the van". Far too few police and no time to invest in such harmless cases these days. Remember, sometimes you can go for weeks without seeing a police car out on the road. Even then, they prioritise the cases involving violence. The old days of a full shift being detailed to do a courtesy to DVLA stops is getting to be a thing of the past. Maybe in cities near a motorway, but definitely not in towns and villages.

Locally they have just torn the police station down and the local office is in a back room of the firestation. Never seen more than 3 police cars and a camera van in the carpark. There isn't space. Go 10 miles to the nearest big town and there are 10 marked cars and vans parked up unused

But they (the enforcers ) will use the DVLA data which will show your original plated weight, not your ebay purchased spurious one!

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[Lenny HB]

A lot of the EU raised the weights the other week I believe.

Only for EV's for commercial use I believe.

 

[Barclaybasher]

No, I get all that and I apologise if my response was a bit short fused.

To answer your question about threshold, because my 3500 MH could go to 3850 tomorrow, you might have thought that I considered that the safe weight for me? No, I am looking at less than 5%. At 3500kg, that is a max of 175 kg over. No way am I near that.

My van was plated at 3850kg with air assist on the rear and appropriate wheels and tyres.
It's now plated at 3500kg
It has a towbar which would allow me to tow l believe 750kg without a C1 meaning I would need to brake 4250kg ......does that make any sense?
Dropping the weight means my sons can drive it, I don't have to keep my C1, the van will be easier to sell.
In France there are so many 3500kg restrictions, cheaper vignettes in other countries

 

[Folkranger]

Each Force can vary but as a general rule of thumb it is 5%. So in my Force up to 5% a warning. Over that then a Prohibition Order and a fine. The fine is variable depending on the percentage over. So if I put you over a weigh bridge and you are in excess of 5% then you have to remove sufficient to take it back down to your plated weight. You will then need to go over the weigh bridge again. So if I put you over at 3.55pm and you're over and the weighbidge closes at 4pm then there's a good chance you will be parked up for the night until it opens again the following morning which may necessitate the use of a security chain through the front wheels. However if there's children on board or elderly with medical needs etc then discretion can be used so that if I consider you have removed sufficient then you will be allowed to continue your journey. If I were to allow you to continue without removing weight it could be held that I have condoned the offence.
With regard the Enforcement Sanction Policy I would argue that a motorhome is used regularly and as such is not a one off as the driver should know what he/she is carrying and the weights involved.
If memory serves the fines are - Up to 10% = £100. 10 to 14% = £200. 15% and over £300. Over 30% a court summons.
Hope that helps.

Laurence

Well, cheaper than running a heavy caravan and having to get C1.

 

[our poppy llll]

What I find difficult to comprehend is, what are you putting in your Moho to make it over weight. With a payload weight of 1005kg I only get 1/2 way there fully loaded, small vehicles with little garages can’t carry that much, unless you are doing an Italian job and only blowing the garage doors off..
When we finish loading the road kill (chickens, pheasants, wild boar, cyclists, kids in the bike tow pram) you know general stuff.. we are still no where over weight.



(Disclaimer we never really run over cyclists or kids, it was a joke.)

 

[Alex and Lesley]

Any Driving Licence law change made in the UK increasing the C1 entitlement up to 7.5 tonne or whatever may be decided will not necessarily help anyone taking their vehicle to Europe as the Driving Licence will (probably) not be recognised over there as it is now with the Category B+E change that the Government made here in 2021.

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[Jez1966]

There is a network of sensors on the motorways able to weigh veichicles as they pass. They only stop the vans they already have an indication are over (probably beyond 5%). Theres a few articles about the sensor network on the fleet news type channels.

I'm very interested to understand how this "network of sensors on the motorways able to weigh vehicles" work?
What are they sensing?

 

[Coastal Cruiser.]

One of my contracts years ago was to renew the VOSA offices at their Leatherhead depot.
Was an eye opener for sure a constant procession of all types of vehicles on the weigh bridge then a manual inspection.
Most were ok but an awful lot were locked in the yard and waiting for others to come sort them out before they got releasedno doubt accompanied by a large fine!!

 

[DDJC]

Have just read part of first page and part of page 5 so maybe I have missed a few pertinent points BUT.
Seems quite a few people think it's OK to run overweight.
If you knowingly drive overweight then you are a complete ********.

That is not very nice thing to say amongst friends.

Nor is it particularly sensible comment.
I have already explained that my MH exceeds the specification for an up-plate, if I cough up a hundred quid.
So Jack, at what point, bearing this in mind, do I move from being your "complete ********" and become a safe and responsible driver? After I have undertaken a pointless bureaucratic process?
My bus is safe to go to 3850. I doubt that I am overweight by even 5%, when we are going on a long trip. I never exceed the speed limit. I never ever drive if I have had even one drink in the last 24 hours. Never. Can you say that?
Let he who is without sin, cast the first stone.

 

[Lenny HB]

What I find difficult to comprehend is, what are you putting in your Moho to make it over weight. With a payload weight of 1005kg I

We couldn't cope with a payload that small, our ls is 1350kg and we run with about 200kg spare.

 

[DDJC]

What I find difficult to comprehend is, what are you putting in your Moho to make it over weight. With a payload weight of 1005kg I only get 1/2 way there fully loaded, small vehicles with little garages can’t carry that much, unless you are doing an Italian job and only blowing the garage doors off..
When we finish loading the road kill (chickens, pheasants, wild boar, cyclists, kids in the bike tow pram) you know general stuff.. we are still no where over weight.



(Disclaimer we never really run over cyclists or kids, it was a joke.)

LOL, but an easy answer.
Payload from the dealer was about 600kg. We added some for an auto gearbox (Mrs DDJC has back issues that prevents us from having a manual)
Eldest son is disabled, 19, 6'4" and about 90 kilos. Second son is 16, 5'9" and about 45 kilos, and also disabled. The amount of extra kit (and special food) we have to put in for them is immense, and much of it we load into the trailer. We uprated the mattress for them and it was double the weight. We travel with empty water and empty grey water. You get the picture.

I imagine any motorhomer that still has to have their kids with them either gets a heavier bus or juggle weight.

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[DDJC]

My van was plated at 3850kg with air assist on the rear and appropriate wheels and tyres.
It's now plated at 3500kg
It has a towbar which would allow me to tow l believe 750kg without a C1 meaning I would need to brake 4250kg ......does that make any sense?
Dropping the weight means my sons can drive it, I don't have to keep my C1, the van will be easier to sell.
In France there are so many 3500kg restrictions, cheaper vignettes in other countries

The most concerning thing about your post is that you are willing to let your sons drive it.
You are an extremely brave man!

However, anything we do does not affect that we too, can plate up or down as our family circumstances dictate.

Currently, we probably need to up-plate to 3850. However, I can see a time when we could return to 3500. Not that it will change the fact that it is increasingly likely that C1 category will be awarded to B cat driving licences, so would not be necessary. I consider the strictures on >3500 vehicles in Europe (max speed, stickers, overtaking, lanes, etc) to not be an inconvenience, as I treat my MH as a heavier vehicle anyway. I have had C & D categories in my life, but didn't need them so let them lapse. C1 is fine for me.

 

[dunnah01]

Just drop the licence for C1 to 2 tons and removed grandfather rights then everybody would have to take a test and show that they are competent to drive a large van. We can then choose any size Moho that fits our requirements, no more trying to put a pint in a half pint 3500kg pot and the revenue goes to the tax coffers - win win

 

[our poppy llll]

LOL, but an easy answer.
Payload from the dealer was about 600kg. We added some for an auto gearbox (Mrs DDJC has back issues that prevents us from having a manual)
Eldest son is disabled, 19, 6'4" and about 90 kilos. Second son is 16, 5'9" and about 45 kilos, and also disabled. The amount of extra kit (and special food) we have to put in for them is immense, and much of it we load into the trailer. We uprated the mattress for them and it was double the weight. We travel with empty water and empty grey water. You get the picture.

I imagine any motorhomer that still has to have their kids with them either gets a heavier bus or juggle weight.

Wow I see your problem! Ever thought about getting a Monaco coach! Or a double decker bus or 4 MoHos!..

 

[our poppy llll]

Just drop the licence for C1 to 2 tons and removed grandfather rights then everybody would have to take a test and show that they are competent to drive a large van. We can then choose any size Moho that fits our requirements, no more trying to put a pint in a half pint 3500kg pot and the revenue goes to the tax coffers - win win

Having driven hundreds of vehicles from a 50cc scooter to a 44tonne Artic and trailer, I can assure you, there is no difference driving 3.5 tonne to 4.5 tonne to 7.5 tonne. RHD/LHD it makes no difference, once you have been in one for a few minutes they are all the same.

 

[DDJC]

Wow I see your problem! Ever thought about getting a Monaco coach! Or a double decker bus or 4 MoHos!..

Love to, although they are too expensive for us at present. And to that effect, I have recently invested in a secret diamond mine in the Congo, through a very nice chap in the internet. Want the details?

Mrs DDJC couldn't drive anything over 3500 due to the stupid law change back in 1997, when the UK decided to remove Cat C1 from any future people that pass their B test. Hoping that the government (this or next) sees sense and reverts.

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[DDJC]

Having driven hundreds of vehicles from a 50cc scooter to a 44tonne Artic and trailer, I can assure you, there is no difference driving 3.5 tonne to 4.5 tonne to 7.5 tonne. RHD/LHD it makes no difference, once you have been in one for a few minutes they are all the same.

Absolutely agree. As have I. I have A, B, C1 etc and in a previous life, I had C and D.

 

[our poppy llll]

Love to, although they are too expensive for us at present. And to that effect, I have recently invested in a secret diamond mine in the Congo, through a very nice chap in the internet. Want the details?

Mrs DDJC couldn't drive anything over 3500 due to the stupid law change back in 1997, when the UK decided to remove Cat C1 from any future people that pass their B test. Hoping that the government (this or next) sees sense and reverts.

Na I’ll stick with the 5.08%, 4.25% 4,75% & 4.80% interest from YBS, Santander & Skipton! Diamonds are unfortunately the pretty flamingos favourite stone.. if I invested I’d be skint in a day… you could sell the wife and kids to the Congo bloke! In fact he could buy mine too… mmm second thoughts what’s his address..

 

[Pausim]

Just drop the licence for C1 to 2 tons and removed grandfather rights then everybody would have to take a test and show that they are competent to drive a large van. We can then choose any size Moho that fits our requirements, no more trying to put a pint in a half pint 3500kg pot and the revenue goes to the tax coffers - win win

For me the problem is the Group 2 medical requirements that go with a licence for over 3500kg. Group1 medical conditions for licences under 3500kg are far easier to meet. Group 2 now means I have to have a DVLA stress test and having passed this once I have no intention of taking it a second time. Until last year I was happily trotting along thinking I was good for a heavier licence for several years to come but health issues can change without warning.

If there are some very welcome changes to the licence categories I hope the Group 1 medical requirements are also extended. Is it beyond the bounds of possibility that extending licence categories will come with some new rules about medical requirements, particularly for older drivers?

 

[Barclaybasher]

Just drop the licence for C1 to 2 tons and removed grandfather rights then everybody would have to take a test and show that they are competent to drive a large van. We can then choose any size Moho that fits our requirements, no more trying to put a pint in a half pint 3500kg pot and the revenue goes to the tax coffers - win win

Well it would empty the roads for years, delivery drivers waiting for tests......

Is there really a problem with overweight vehicles causing accidents?

 

[Apacheman]

Having driven hundreds of vehicles from a 50cc scooter to a 44tonne Artic and trailer, I can assure you, there is no difference driving 3.5 tonne to 4.5 tonne to 7.5 tonne. RHD/LHD it makes no difference, once you have been in one for a few minutes they are all the same.

For you the transition between vehicles was easy. I too hold C and D and find it easy. However somebody jumping from a Fiat 500 to a 7.5t flatbed for the first time might struggle. Lost count of how many times people have said they could never drive anything the size of our Moho (Ducato 7.3m). It is a bit of a farce though that a Moho can go from 3500kgs to 3650 or 3860kgs with just a bit of paper. Even heavier with some minor suspension or tyre alterations. The length, width and handling doesn’t alter. Yet you need a different class of licence?

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[starquake]

I'm very interested to understand how this "network of sensors on the motorways able to weigh vehicles" work?
What are they sensing?

DVSA Weigh in Motion Sensors (WIMS)

<p><img src=

www.solentscales.co.uk

That explains the UK system without giving game away about where it is deployed.

 

[SpeedyDux]

Just have a massive d**p before you travel. Huge increase in payload

If pulled over by the Cops, that might happen spontaneously ... always carry spare underwear ...

 

[TheBig1]

But they (the enforcers ) will use the DVLA data which will show your original plated weight, not your ebay purchased spurious one!

I feel you are missing the point made. A plate affixed to the vehicle that is correct for over 3500kg throws doubt onto the data recorded by DVLA. We all know that they regularly get data entry wrong. Just that potential for it to be official error and some evidence that the van complies with requirements to be driven at a higher revenue weight are enough to complicate any potential prosecution. "They" the police at a roadside check may well look the vehicle up on the database, but it is likely they will just advise you to get the matter of the paperwork sorted. It costs money and a lot of man hours to prosecute and the situation these days is that both are in short supply. Better that resources get used for more serious and clearcut cases

Again, I am not suggesting anyone deliberately test this. If it went to court, I am sure that any good solicitor would use the evidence that the vehicle could be legal in your defence

 

[DDJC]

Is it beyond the bounds of possibility that extending licence categories will come with some new rules about medical requirements, particularly for older drivers?

I would say that it is definitely within the boundaries of possibility.
But fitness and ability to drive is something that I believe should be assessed far more rigorously than it is now. And isn't necessarily the preserve of those of an advanced age. I see many cases of younger drivers who I wouldn't trust to sit on a park bench safely.

 

[nicholsong]

DVSA Weigh in Motion Sensors (WIMS)

<p><img src=

www.solentscales.co.uk

That explains the UK system without giving game away about where it is deployed.

It is known that DVSA(ex-VOSA) are responsible for the technical operations of vehicle safety incl. CofC, IVA and MOT and that they operate the WIMS, as described in the link attached above.

In that link, which is produced by Solent, the manufacturer of the WIMS equipment, it states that the readings obtained are checked against the DVSA Database, not DVLA.

Is there then a separate database held by DVSA? and does it differ from the DVLA one? Maybe it is fed from information supplied by anyone who is authorised to issue weight plates and is more accurate than the DVLA one.

If DVSA use their own database then what do the Police Forces use?

Maybe some of the ex-Police Officers who have contributed to this thread are able to answer the questions. TIA.

[It has always surprised me that applications to uprate or downrate vehicle authorised weights are submitted to DVLA and not DVSA, since the latter have more technical knowledge. Do DVLA submit those applications toDVSA for cross-checks, or are the decisions made by the same people who cannot fill in forms correctly?]

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[Northernraider]

For you the transition between vehicles was easy. I too hold C and D and find it easy. However somebody jumping from a Fiat 500 to a 7.5t flatbed for the first time might struggle. Lost count of how many times people have said they could never drive anything the size of our Moho (Ducato 7.3m). It is a bit of a farce though that a Moho can go from 3500kgs to 3650 or 3860kgs with just a bit of paper. Even heavier with some minor suspension or tyre alterations. The length, width and handling doesn’t alter. Yet you need a different class of licence?

I think it's all in people's heads.
I passed my test in 1990 in a kia pride , 2 days later I was driving a transit flatbed pickup with a vw type 2 camper on the back towing a 21 foot beavertail trailer with a vw beetle on it through the heart of Glasgow... OK so I had a few sketchy moments but I managed no problem and I was driving big vehicles since