Interesting article about grey water disposal on "highway drains"....

[L' Hobo]

Rock salt is mostly sodium chloride* with the addition of various trace elements. The deposits were formed when ancient seas dried up.

* The stuff you put on your chips.

My 'man' puts Sea Salt on my chips. Yes, and on my Pop corn!

 

[dazandandrea]

But these dead animals will be picked up along with most of the litter long before it turns to liquid

So is that any less " nasty " than whats in a usual grey tank? .

 

[mitzimad]

Has the grass died or is it looking as healthy as the rest?

lusher

 

[georgio]

No wonder the courts and the legal profession are so overwhelmed with cases with all this sort of nonsence. Soapy water is very good for getting rid of greenfly.

 

[L' Hobo]

No wonder the courts and the legal profession are so overwhelmed with cases with all this sort of nonsence. Soapy water is very good for getting rid of greenfly.

Shame greenfly don't eat grass!

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[Headrush]

When I used to drive a gully sucker/jetting lorry, we had the same situation. Once you have collected the water and sludge out of the gully, it is your responsibility to dispose of it correctly, even though it came off the road in the first place. As has been noted, there is lots of nasty stuff coming off the road, heavy metals, hydro-carbons, rubber etc. In an ideal world, none of it would be going into the water courses.
However, that doesn't mean you should deliberately do it.

Just because there's litter on the ground doesn't make it acceptable to drop more. And I would also dispute that grey waste is harmless.
Read the list of ingredients on washing up liquid, they're all designed to break organic substances down. Not to mention that people put bleach in to clean the tank and remove the smell.

In short, if you wouldn't drink it, don't put it down a roadside gully.

 

[Barclaybasher]

When I used to drive a gully sucker/jetting lorry, we had the same situation. Once you have collected the water and sludge out of the gully, it is your responsibility to dispose of it correctly, even though it came off the road in the first place. As has been noted, there is lots of nasty stuff coming off the road, heavy metals, hydro-carbons, rubber etc. In an ideal world, none of it would be going into the water courses.
However, that doesn't mean you should deliberately do it.

Just because there's litter on the ground doesn't make it acceptable to drop more. And I would also dispute that grey waste is harmless.
Read the list of ingredients on washing up liquid, they're all designed to break organic substances down. Not to mention that people put bleach in to clean the tank and remove the smell.

In short, if you wouldn't drink it, don't put it down a roadside gully.

Presumably you only collected what was in the drain or gully - nasty stuff. The odd inconsiderate motorhomer dumping grey waste just doesn't justify the coverage here or anywhere......

 

[Old Gibber]

Most of the 'salt' that goes on our roads, comes from a mine in England, I THINK! So maybe? not as harmful as might be first thought?

The fact that it comes from a mine in England is irrelevant. The salt in that mine formed millions of years ago when that part of the country was a sea.

I used to live on a main road, and for sure the salt spread on the road severely damaged a laurel hedge we had there. Garden side was fine but the side facing the road turned brown and died every spring. In the end I replaced it with privet which is salt tolerant.

If you don't believe me try putting a decent sprinkling of salt on your garden.

 

[Headrush]

Presumably you only collected what was in the drain or gully - nasty stuff. The odd inconsiderate motorhomer dumping grey waste just doesn't justify the coverage here or anywhere......

I disagree for several reasons.
Firstly, many people don't realise that road gulleys go directly to the nearest water course with no treatment.
Secondly, if you need to have a list of exceptions that are allowed down the gulleys, then it's not much of a rule to follow. Far better to have a blanket ban then there's no misunderstanding or argument.
Lastly, I really don't like the attitude that says its OK to dump anything we don't want anymore somewhere in nature. Out of sight, out of mind.
It's lazy and disrespectful not to mention self defeating.
So now I've said my piece I'll return you to your regular programming.

 

[Barclaybasher]

I disagree for several reasons.
Firstly, many people don't realise that road gulleys go directly to the nearest water course with no treatment.
Secondly, if you need to have a list of exceptions that are allowed down the gulleys, then it's not much of a rule to follow. Far better to have a blanket ban then there's no misunderstanding or argument.
Lastly, I really don't like the attitude that says its OK to dump anything we don't want anymore somewhere in nature. Out of sight, out of mind.
It's lazy and disrespectful not to mention self defeating.
So now I've said my piece I'll return you to your regular programming.

Do you really think that Joe public knows or even cares what goes down a drain?

It's Joe public you should be addressing (washing their cars, weeding their driveways etc) not the very rare motorhomer who empties his grey tank

So back to your regular programming...

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[Jays2]

This thread has opened my eyes to this dilemma.

I can personally hold my hand up and say I’ve done that, and sometimes it’s embarrassing what I did.

Hopefully I hope I now behave better, and this thread has been enlightening, and in the future I will more respectful.

 

[Jays2]

We've not been in a position to consider dumping grey into drains as we are newbies (6 months) and have, to date, been able to book fully serviced pitches or use the service points at the sites we've been to, so not really considered this issue and have enjoyed all the comments on this thread. However, on a recent trip to Whitemead in the Forest of Dean we witnessed three different motorhomes dumping their grey waste on the roads within the site as they were driving off, leaving a fairly substantial trail of pretty mucky looking waste in places, which we were both thought was pretty inconsiderate seeing as there were a large number of children playing, cycling and scootering on these roads, as well as people walking dogs etc. There was a perfectly good service point to use, which we did when leaving, so I was more than a little surprised that people would be happy to dump in this way. I spoke with the site manager about this and she said the issue has become so much worse since 'lockdowns', with far more people now seemingly not caring and simply ignoring the clearly noted rules (her words and thoughts).

In addition to this, on another site in Hastings we saw the motorhome on the pitch next to us dump off his whole grey tank on his grass pitch when we were no more than 50 yards from a clearly visible service point with grey dump.

We're really enjoying our entry into motor homing, using it quite a lot, but things like this have been a bit of a surprise and a disappointment for us personally as the facility is there, why not use it?

Hope you are enjoying the experience of camper life.

We can always tell on a roundabout if a camper has left the drain valve open, the tell tale streak of water.

Its not always intentional.

 

[Barclaybasher]

Hope you are enjoying the experience of camper life.

We can always tell on a roundabout if a camper has left the drain valve open, the tell tale streak of water.

Its not always intentional.

I always leave my drain valve open after emptying - just to make sure it is empty. I close it before using any sink or shower though...
...

 

[Old Gibber]

I always leave my drain valve open after emptying - just to make sure it is empty. I close it before using any sink or shower though...
...

Why?

 

[Barclaybasher]

Why?

Because where I drained might not be level and it might get rid of the stink..

Then I add the dreaded bleach!

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[chippie]

If grey is so dangerous why are Narrow boats allowed to discharge grey water straight into a canal or river with all its flora and wildlife.
Many of these canals have draw off points for irrigation of crops and alot of canals link with rivers which have draw off points for treatment to make drinking water.
According to the canal and river trust the Gloucester and Sharpness canal provides half of the water for bristol and the Llangollen canal provides part of Chesters water..all polluted with grey water but perfectly exceltable and allowed under current legislation...seems a case of double standards when it suits !!!

 

[L' Hobo]

If grey is so dangerous why are Narrow boats allowed to discharge grey water straight into a canal or river with all its flora and wildlife.
Many of these canals have draw off points for irrigation of crops and alot of canals link with rivers which have draw off points for treatment to make drinking water.
According to the canal and river trust the Gloucester and Sharpness canal provides half of the water for bristol and the Llangollen canal provides part of Chesters water..all polluted with grey water but perfectly exceltable and allowed under current legislation...seems a case of double standards when it suits !!!

Possibly, when one thinks about it, the grey water released by narrow boats is a very low percentage of the water already in the canal plus, it may be like vehicles, if an old car was produced with trafficators, instead of indicators, they are still allowed on British road but not new vehicles. I think more and more canals now require pump out of black water when once even that was released.

 

[chippie]

Black water is pump out and is obviously very different from grey water.
There are more boats on the waterways than ever before, try cycling the 10 miles between Bradford on avon and Bath, 8 of those miles are packed with narrowboats with no gaps and often moored 2 deep, that's not unusual on our waterways and all putting grey water into the canals and rivers, don't forget some boats have washing machines and dish washers, that is not an insignificant amount of grey waste.
My point is temporary holiday sites in some areas have been cancelled because of regulations regarding safe disposal/treatment of grey water and that it may reach a water course but narrow boats can discharge straight into a water course without any issues or breaking any regulations.

 

[funflair]

Black water is pump out and is obviously very different from grey water.
There are more boats on the waterways than ever before, try cycling the 10 miles between Bradford on avon and Bath, 8 of those miles are packed with narrowboats with no gaps and often moored 2 deep, that's not unusual on our waterways and all putting grey water into the canals and rivers, don't forget some boats have washing machines and dish washers, that is not an insignificant amount of grey waste.
My point is temporary holiday sites in some areas have been cancelled because of regulations regarding safe disposal/treatment of grey water and that it may reach a water course but narrow boats can discharge straight into a water course without any issues or breaking any regulations.

I thought surely not so googled and the Canals & River Trust web site said,

"The rules for boaters as to what is acceptable to go overboard into the water are simple.

There are only two things that are permitted: clean water and 'grey' water. Grey water is the waste water from washing-up dishes and cooking utensils, showers, sinks and washing machines only"

 

[dazandandrea]

After spending much time on the canals .
Pretty much anything and everything is discharged into the water, except black waste.
As said above black waste will usually be pumped out or toilets will be emptied via cassette, much as our vans are .

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[L' Hobo]

Black water is pump out and is obviously very different from grey water.
There are more boats on the waterways than ever before, try cycling the 10 miles between Bradford on avon and Bath, 8 of those miles are packed with narrowboats with no gaps and often moored 2 deep, that's not unusual on our waterways and all putting grey water into the canals and rivers, don't forget some boats have washing machines and dish washers,o that is not an insignificant amount of grey waste.
My point is temporary holiday sites in some areas have been cancelled because of regulations regarding safe disposal/treatment of grey water and that it may reach a water course but narrow boats can discharge straight into a water course without any issues or breaking any regulations.

While there appears to be more narrow boats on the canals, I still maintain that grey water discharge is low based on my own in my MH. Many narrow boats are not lived in 12 months of the year and others, because every drop has to be carried to the boat, the boat owner are frugal with waste, unlike some MH's who just fill up from a campsite pipe.
To be honest, as a canal lock can hold between 30,000 and 50,000galls, I doubt if the people, in the stretch you spoke of, tip a lock full of grey water into the canal a week/month? The good thing is, every time the locks along the K&A get operated, (and there are about 10 just outside of Devizes, not to mention others) this grey waste discharged by the boats, is diluted into the greater canal.

 

[L' Hobo]

Black water is pump out and is obviously very different from grey water.
There are more boats on the waterways than ever before, try cycling the 10 miles between Bradford on avon and Bath, 8 of those miles are packed with narrowboats with no gaps and often moored 2 deep, that's not unusual on our waterways and all putting grey water into the canals and rivers, don't forget some boats have washing machines and dish washers,o that is not an insignificant amount of grey waste.
My point is temporary holiday sites in some areas have been cancelled because of regulations regarding safe disposal/treatment of grey water and that it may reach a water course but narrow boats can discharge straight into a water course without any issues or breaking any regulations.

While there appears to be more narrow boats on the canals, I still maintain that grey water discharge is low based on my own in my MH. Many narrow boats are not lived in 12 months of the year and others, because nearly every drop has to be carried to the boat, the boat owner are frugal with waste, unlike some MH's who just fill up from a campsite pipe.
To be honest, as a canal lock can hold between 30,000 and 50,000galls, I doubt if the people, in the stretch you spoke of, tip a lock full of grey water into the canal a week/month? The good thing is, every time the locks along the K&A get operated, this grey waste discharged by the boats, is diluted into the greater canal.

After spending much time on the canals .
Pretty much anything and everything is discharged into the water, except black waste.
As said above black waste will usually be pumped out or toilets will be emptied via cassette, much as our vans are .

After helping to repair boat engines etc at a friend's marina, I thought I heard that ALL Black Water HAD to be disposed at pumping stations & disposal points, not just usually?

 

[dazandandrea]

Theres always the " special " people.

 

[dazandandrea]

Theres always the " special " people.
" usually " pump out " or" elsan point.
And theres also the composting types . God knows where they are getting rid of it now as Crt will not accept bagged waste any more.
Lots of Continual cruisers are using compost type now .

 

[bigtwin]

because every drop has to be carried to the boat, the boat owner are frugal with waste, unlike some MH's who just fill up from a campsite pipe.

Those cases must be few and far between. Most Narrowboats fill their (large) tanks from a water point in the same way as MHs do.

Many narrowboats have plumbed in washing machines. Those wouldn’t be viable if they didn’t have easy access to water points.

Ian

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[Pausim]

I think there will be far more full timers on canals and rivers than motorhome full timers. Canal boats do not have payload issues and their tanks are usually much bigger.

 

[L' Hobo]

Those cases must be few and far between. Most Narrowboats fill their (large) tanks from a water point in the same way as MHs do.

Many narrowboats have plumbed in washing machines. Those wouldn’t be viable if they didn’t have easy access to water points.

Ian

You are talking about 'Residential Moorings' an alternative to house living. Not what I would call Narrow Boating!

 

[Pausim]

To be honest, as a canal lock can hold between 30,000 and 50,000galls, I doubt if the people, in the stretch you spoke of, tip a lock full of grey water into the canal a week/month? The good thing is, every time the locks along the K&A get operated, this grey waste discharged by the boats, is diluted into the greater canal.

The top pound of the K&A is famously short of water which is why they have pumping schemes to pump the water back up to the top after it goes through the locks. Not as much dilution as you might think.

 

[BouncyBoatFolk]

While there appears to be more narrow boats on the canals, I still maintain that grey water discharge is low based on my own in my MH. Many narrow boats are not lived in 12 months of the year and others, because nearly every drop has to be carried to the boat, the boat owner are frugal with waste, unlike some MH's who just fill up from a campsite pipe.
To be honest, as a canal lock can hold between 30,000 and 50,000galls, I doubt if the people, in the stretch you spoke of, tip a lock full of grey water into the canal a week/month? The good thing is, every time the locks along the K&A get operated, this grey waste discharged by the boats, is diluted into the greater canal.

After helping to repair boat engines etc at a friend's marina, I thought I heard that ALL Black Water HAD to be disposed at pumping stations & disposal points, not just usually?

Even grey waste adds an element of nutrients to the canal water. This feeds many invasive species such as the pernicious "floating pennywort" . This is a blanketing weed which if left unchecked will spread bank to bank, for almost the length of some canals, The Wey navigation is particularly afflicted with it despite efforts from Nation Trust and canoe clubs along it's course.
Water buffalo, that's what we need, herd's of em, they can eat the weed, and we, [ WARNING non carnivores do not read from here on in only, ]can eat said Buffalo's, a virtuous circle, and something else to look at on the canals.
Mike.

 

[L' Hobo]

The top pound of the K&A is famously short of water which is why they have pumping schemes to pump the water back up to the top after it goes through the locks. Not as much dilution as you might think.

They have had this problem since the canal was built, that's the reason they built a, now listed I believe , pumping station at the same time as the canal or shortly after.
Still a few 100galls in 30,000 is a fair old dilution and I, who visit the Devizes area regularly for the past 50yrs, have never encountered any problems with nature or smells.

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