Don't worry about motorhome payload

[haybal]

Hi Funsters,

We have been to look at 2 MH's today at the same dealership, we were told by the sales man if we needed anything just ask, he then left us to look around which was great. Every now and then someone came to check we were ok and to see if we needed any help, then I asked a question about usable payload and was told " Don't worry about payload most people run over weight with the amount of gear they carry.
This wasn't the response I was expecting, so when I ask that if there was an accident and the MH was over weight could that not invalidate the insurance his reply was "probably not".

would appreciate your thoughts on this please, this is our first MH we are looking to buy and want it all above board so to speak.

Cheers,
Barry and Hayley

 

[funflair]

Hi Martin, As my licence is from May '97 I'm subject to all of the well publicised limitations. I looked for a solution to cycle carrying without them impacting too heavily on the MH's payload, the Tracker's is around 350kg. A Thule rear mounted carrier and it's cycle weight capacity is around 70kg's, as it's fixed to the body it is deducted from the 350kg.

Mounting a detachable carrier on a tow bar impacts the 750kg trailer weight I'm allowed instead, I keep the 350kgs.

We opted for the Maxxraxx as it's less bulky and easier to store in the garage. Weighing only 6kg and adding the 48kg of both bikes I'm well within the 75kg max tow ball weight and it doesn't add a disproportionate load to the 1650kg max rear axle weight... most cycle carriers on motorhomes are rear wall mounted. Allowing for a conservative 5% nose weight of 175kg, I'm well within that too.

Sorry IMO if its on your tow bar on inside the van weight is weight and hanging off the back it puts it on the rear axle and transfers some from the front.

750kg you mention is for a trailer on its own wheels, and again you have to take the nose weight off your payload.

Martin

 

[MikeD]

Hi Martin, As my licence is from May '97 I'm subject to all of the well publicised limitations. I looked for a solution to cycle carrying without them impacting too heavily on the MH's payload, the Tracker's is around 350kg. A Thule rear mounted carrier and it's cycle weight capacity is around 70kg's, as it's fixed to the body it is deducted from the 350kg.

Mounting a detachable carrier on a tow bar impacts the 750kg trailer weight I'm allowed instead, I keep the 350kgs.

We opted for the Maxxraxx as it's less bulky and easier to store in the garage. Weighing only 6kg and adding the 48kg of both bikes I'm well within the 75kg max tow ball weight and it doesn't add a disproportionate load to the 1650kg max rear axle weight... most cycle carriers on motorhomes are rear wall mounted. Allowing for a conservative 5% nose weight of 175kg, I'm well within that too.

Unless the weight you are adding are on their own wheels like a trailer it definitely comes off your payload.

If you add a tow bar - around 30kg - and then a towbar mounted bike rack and bikes it will make a serious dent into your 350kg payload.

Really you want to get it weighed, if possible both axles and see what you can do.

 

[Jonno1103]

Unless the weight you are adding are on their own wheels like a trailer it definitely comes off your payload.

If you add a tow bar - around 30kg - and then a towbar mounted bike rack and bikes it will make a serious dent into your 350kg payload.

Really you want to get it weighed, if possible both axles and see what you can do.

Bloody hell, I understood that the tow bar reduced the payload hence the 350kg but was led to believe the rack was categorised differently... I've been pootling along all this time possibly running around 50kg overweight!
There are one or two out there who I'll be having a little 'chat' with...

Thanks Mike.

 

[MikeD]

If it is like this ie: with wheels then the makers states 80% of the weight is taken by its wheels and only 20% of the load + towbar weight is taken by your rear axle and from your payload.

View media item 22241
If it is like this - taken from Watling Towbar UK site than all the weight is on the rear axle of the motorhome and taken from your payload

View media item 22813

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[funflair]

And if its hanging off the back the load on the rear axle is disproportionate to the actual load because of the lever or moments affect.

Martin

 

[Jonno1103]

Lad's I really appreciate the knowledge, thank you.

A question, we are looking at a 3 wheel Piaggio and a corresponding side loading trailer. Apart from obviously staying within 750kg I take it that the main issue will be determining my actual nose weight?

Oh, trailer itself weighs around 140kg with a small box attached and the bike 270kg with a full tank.

 

[Blue Knight]

Bloody hell, I understood that the tow bar reduced the payload hence the 350kg but was led to believe the rack was categorised differently... I've been pootling along all this time possibly running around 50kg overweight!
There are one or two out there who I'll be having a little 'chat' with...

Thanks Mike.

This payload-thing can be complicated sometimes.

A few calculations for you sir: An Autotrail towbar weighs 35kg and if you have a rear bumper bar fitted then that adds a further 15kg too.

If we ignore the 15kg bumper for a second and just add the 6+48+35kg (89kg in total) then you will probably find that 89kg will equate to 125kg on the rear axle, potentially more.

If I then make a few adjustments to your quoted MIRO figure of your AT Tracker (due to the potential weight variation of the materials being used) then you may only be left with a realtime payload of between 100kg and 125kg (bikes loaded) if your van is registered at 3.5T

A weighbridge trip would help verify the figures.

All the best,

Andrew

 

[funflair]

Lad's I really appreciate the knowledge, thank you.

A question, we are looking at a 3 wheel Piaggio and a corresponding side loading trailer. Apart from obviously staying within 750kg I take it that the main issue will be determining my actual nose weight?

Oh, trailer itself weighs around 140kg with a small box attached and the bike 270kg with a full tank.

Do you mean a proper trailer or a Hydratrail as quoted by @MikeD earlier, the Hydratrail option demands a decent tow bar with a face plate rather than a swan neck type.

Martin

 

[Jonno1103]

This payload-thing can be complicated sometimes.

A few calculations for you sir: An Autotrail towbar weighs 35kg and if you have a rear bumper bar fitted then that adds a further 15kg too.

If we ignore the 15kg bumper for a second and just add the 6+48+35kg (89kg in total) then you will probably find that 89kg will equate to 125kg on the rear axle, potentially more.

If I then make a few adjustments to your quoted MIRO figure of your AT Tracker (due to the potential weight variation of the materials being used) then you may only be left with a realtime payload of between 100kg and 125kg (bikes loaded) if your van is registered at 3.5T

A weighbridge trip would help verify the figures.

All the best,

Andrew

Thanks Andrew. the 350kg was determined after a weighbridge visit in Knaresborough when we bought the van, the tow bar was already fitted... suffice to say until further changes are invested in the bikes will remain in the garage. We take them to be used as and when rather than for specific use.

The actual figure was 353kg which I was surprised at as there was nearly half a tank of water in it at the time too. I'm planning to weigh her again before May.

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[Jonno1103]

Do you mean a proper trailer or a Hydratrail as quoted by @MikeD earlier, the Hydratrail option demands a decent tow bar with a face plate rather than a swan neck type.

Martin

Sorry Martin I should have given more info. They are built by CMF and are found by scrolling down the page.
http://www.cmftrailers.co.uk/side-load-trailers.html

Iain.

 

[Blue Knight]

Thanks Andrew. the 350kg was determined after a weighbridge visit in Knaresborough when we bought the van, the tow bar was already fitted... suffice to say until further changes are invested in the bikes will remain in the garage. We take them to be used as and when rather than for specific use.

The actual figure was 353kg which I was surprised at as there was nearly half a tank of water in it at the time too. I'm planning to weigh her again before May.

That's great news Jonno The new AT Tracker range (@3.5T registered) only give you between 200 and 300kg payload (excluding water and MIRO variations) so the slightly older version is definitely much better for overall weight.

All the best,

Andrew

 

[funflair]

Hi @Jonno1103

OK thats a proper trailer so less critical on the tow bar type, any legal tow bar should be fine.

The nose weight will not be excessive IMO and could be tweaked slightly by the exact position of the 3 wheeler on the trailer ie further back = less nose weight but don't be tempted to go too far back as it will adversely affect the trailer stability both on and off the tow ball.

Martin