Domestic solar system

[Bolti]

Any suggestions welcome !

Installing yourself is not difficult, it is basic wiring and the installation of a small consumer unit to keep things safe. As I have said before you are welcome to look at our setup, we shall be in Spain now until March. A neighbour of ours resently had a solar and battery system fitted I will ask them who installed it.

 

[dunnah01]

Any suggestions welcome !

I DIY installed this earlier this year as part of an ongoing house refurbishment- 2x2Kw grid tied with a diverter to heat water. It was about £1500 mostly second hand - £650 panels, £220 inverters, £600 cables and electrical safety gubbins. Earthing was a bit of a head scratch due to location of inverters and TT earth system in house (installed a new and separate TT system for outbuilding). Batteries were too expensive for me at the moment so abandoned that idea.
We're averaging a whopping 100 Watts today in the UK winter rubbish weather but in summer 4kW peak is often achieved.

 

[Bolti]

Does anyone know if there is a max amount of DC that can be fed into an inverter or does the inverter just discard more than it can handle?
I ask because I want to install panels on my garage that faces east\ west south has tree cover. My thinking was two strings of 2kw / 2.5kw feeding into a 3 kw inverter. The garage is a distance from the house so I do not want to overload the wiring it is 2.5 armoured cabled and due to hard paving unable to run a second cable.

 

[68c]

You should have the DC feed to the inverter as short as possible. The longer cable would then carry the 240volt AC. The lower the voltage the higher the current for any given wattage and vice versa.

 

[dunnah01]

Does anyone know if there is a max amount of DC that can be fed into an inverter or does the inverter just discard more than it can handle?
I ask because I want to install panels on my garage that faces east\ west south has tree cover. My thinking was two strings of 2kw / 2.5kw feeding into a 3 kw inverter. The garage is a distance from the house so I do not want to overload the wiring it is 2.5 armoured cabled and due to hard paving unable to run a second cable.

The inverter needs to be matched to the max cumulative voltage, you can overload the inverter with too many panels with too many volts.

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[Bolti]

The inverter needs to be matched to the max cumulative voltage, you can overload the inverter with too many panels with too many volts.

So it is the voltage of the panels added together? 32v X number of panels, does the two strings make any difference?

 

[Bolti]

So now I am confused. It is a Solis inverter I am looking at and looking on the spec sheet all the inverters from 3kw Upto 6kw all have a max input DC voltage of 600v and a rated DC voltage of 330 volts the only difference on the spec sheet seems to be the output.

 

[dunnah01]

So it is the voltage of the panels added together? 32v X number of panels, does the two strings make any difference?

Yes that;s correct. Most manufacturers seem to limit the DC voltage to 450-500V below 2.5kW and 550-600V above 2.5kW irrespective of inverter capacity.
You may also find the inverter size limited by the AC side. Your 2.5mm SWA probably has a 16A MCB as a radial circuit so the inverter max AC output shouldn't exceed this.
Even if it's a double MPPT controller for the 2 strings the max 600V total will still apply.
You really need an electrician that knows about solar to advise on the safest setup.

 

[autorouter]

The 2.5mm2 cable isn't really a big problem. 5kW of solar would give a current of 21A. Using the voltage drop calculator, that would result in a voltage drop of 2.66% over a run of 20m, which is not ideal but certainly acceptable. Also it wouldn't be at 100% output for very long anyway.

Voltage Drop Calculator | 12 Volt Planet

Use our Voltage Drop Calculator to select the correct Cable for your campervan, motorhome or boat wiring application. Auto and Marine Electrical Components from 12 Volt Planet - Cable Size Calculator

www.12voltplanet.co.uk

 

[dunnah01]

The 2.5mm2 cable isn't really a big problem. 5kW of solar would give a current of 21A. Using the voltage drop calculator, that would result in a voltage drop of 2.66% over a run of 20m, which is not ideal but certainly acceptable. Also it wouldn't be at 100% output for very long anyway.

Voltage Drop Calculator | 12 Volt Planet

Use our Voltage Drop Calculator to select the correct Cable for your campervan, motorhome or boat wiring application. Auto and Marine Electrical Components from 12 Volt Planet - Cable Size Calculator

www.12voltplanet.co.uk

My grunt understanding from speaking to my tame electrician and Google is that the 2.5mm cable is essentially an exterior radial circuit so needs to be limited to 16A (although 20A could be used if other factors allow) and have 30mA RCD protection.
The Inverter capacity is based on nominal current and manufacturers will specify a suitable AC Breaker size to cope with the maximum current. Unfortunately, there is a Catch 22 whereby the 16A RCD on the 2.5mm cable limits the maximum breaker size and the nominal inverter current allowed has to be reduced accordingly. For my typical Afore inverter a max 16A RCD would limit me to a 2kW inverter but different manufacturers will have different requirements.

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[Bolti]

My grunt understanding from speaking to my tame electrician and Google is that the 2.5mm cable is essentially an exterior radial circuit so needs to be limited to 16A (although 20A could be used if other factors allow) and have 30mA RCD protection.
The Inverter capacity is based on nominal current and manufacturers will specify a suitable AC Breaker size to cope with the maximum current. Unfortunately, there is a Catch 22 whereby the 16A RCD on the 2.5mm cable limits the maximum breaker size and the nominal inverter current allowed has to be reduced accordingly. For my typical Afore inverter a max 16A RCD would limit me to a 2kW inverter but different manufacturers will have different requirements.

View attachment 688964

I think you are answering my question based on your own system

My cable to garage is a dedicated feed with its own rcd at the consumer unit currently 16A

My question was as the garage roof is east /west it will never attain full production of the panels so is it ok to max out on panels but keep yield controlled by using a 3kw inverter and thank you my question was answered the inverter can handle up to 6kw of panels.

 

[autorouter]

Unfortunately, there is a Catch 22 whereby the 16A RCD on the 2.5mm cable limits the maximum breaker size and the nominal inverter current allowed has to be reduced accordingly.

You don't need to have the RCD and MCB breaker combined together, which is known as an RCBO. You can have the RCD separate from the breaker. A typical garage RCD will enforce the 30mA leakage protection, but will be capable of use in circuits up to say 40A or 63A. It's usual to put an MCB breaker next to it, which can be whatever you want up to the limit of the RCD max amps rating. 16A, or 20A, or whatever the inverter manufacturer specifies. The breaker is there to protect the cable in a fault condition, it's not meant to limit the inverter output.

 

[Bolti]

A lot of our neighbours have solar in Spain.

A friend who has had solar in Spain has said it’s not worth it as it takes too long to pay back.

But we have a swimming pool heat pump and I’ve installed an electric hot water tank as a backup in-case the boiler fails.

So I think our house would benefit greatly. Iberdrola quoted me over €17,000 for a system (without batteries). I’m trying to find the quote to see how big the system was.

So I’m looking at a DIY Instalation. Just not sure where to start. Installed lots of motorhome and caravan solar, but that a different and much easier task.

This is my backup hot water for summer rentals. First photo

How many kw’s do we guess my neighbour has (has this on Two sides).

View attachment 687515View attachment 687516

Neighbour got back to me, she looks to have about 5kw of panels and a 3kw battery. Cost €12,500 installed by these folks
Paperwork is still being processed so no idea of payback from iberdrola for export.

Solar | Clean Energy Solutions | San Fulgencio

Clean Energy Solutions - for all your solar energy requirements. Electricity and hot water. 15+ years experience.

www.cleanenergysolutions.es

 

[gus-lopez]

A lot of our neighbours have solar in Spain.

A friend who has had solar in Spain has said it’s not worth it as it takes too long to pay back.

It does .the Feed-in-tariff never pays you anything.You just pay less for electricity on an hourly basis.

So I think our house would benefit greatly. Iberdrola quoted me over €17,000 for a system (without batteries). I’m trying to find the quote to see how big the system was.

You also have to remember that in spain any work done on the electrical system requires a new 'boletin' (certificate that states that the WHOLE electrical system now complies with the current regulations. Last revise I believe was 2017?) If installed prior to thaat anything that doesn't comply needs upgrading. Like no more plastic/fibreglass/grp housings for meter but now steel)So that would all have to be added on.
In my case 10k to rewire whole house then Iberdrola would want the indoor meter moved to the street + installation of 2 new poles & all the overheads moved . + planning . Doesn't even bear thinking of cost for that

Neighbour got back to me, she looks to have about 5kw of panels and a 3kw battery. Cost €12,500 installed by these folks
Paperwork is still being processed so no idea of payback from iberdrola for export.

Solar | Clean Energy Solutions | San Fulgencio

Clean Energy Solutions - for all your solar energy requirements. Electricity and hot water. 15+ years experience.

www.cleanenergysolutions.es

AS above here is a link to the daily rates you pay hourly for electricity.
sorry You need to download the app Tarifaluzhora as the laptop one only shows house price no fit.


If you have no solar & are paying peasants rate hourly the prices are in green for cheapest hour & In red the dearest. On the app these are shown as a picture of a house. Below them is a red € sign that denotes the prices you pay if you have solar on the feed-in-tarrif

Paperwork is still being processed so no idea of payback from iberdrola for export.

As above you always pay. Today cheapest hour for me is 8c & feed-in-tariff pay 5c- Dearest hour for me is 20c & FIT pay10,1c.

 

[Bessy765]

Further to my earlier post we ended up with 6kWh of solar 16 panels a Solax Hybrid 5kWh inverter and 2 x 5.8 Kw batteries.
came out at £12750. This is on our garage roof some 20 metres from our house. Supply from garage to house is 4mm twin and earth armoured.

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[PeterCarole29]

Quote from one supply and fit , is it a good price
28 x Longi 405w black panels
28 solaredge optimisers
10kw solaredge inverter based on solaredge design tool
1 x solax 10kw
1 x solax 10kw AC inverter
1 x 9kw solax battery
£16,500

OR without battery £12, 300

 

[OldAgeTravellers]

Quote from one supply and fit , is it a good price
28 x Longi 405w black panels
28 solaredge optimisers
10kw solaredge inverter based on solaredge design tool
1 x solax 10kw
1 x solax 10kw AC inverter
1 x 9kw solax battery
£16,500

OR without battery £12, 300

Wow, I have just had a quote for:
17 x 395w panels
1 x solar edge hybrid inverter
1 x 10kw Solar Edge Energy Bank
£22,519
but mine are “in roof” panels which would add between £1,700 & £3,400 but a massive amount more. and you have 11 panels more. The trouble is they also do not itemise the quote. I am hoping another company will quote this week.

 

[the1andonly]

back again wife has decided i'm not fit enough to kill myself on the roof.
So got a quote today and reading this thread again a bit of a shocker.
6Kwh solar 13x 455W and 5-6kw battery £17k. solar only £12k .
Think i need some suggestions for Midlands, only 55 miles from Amersham. Wouldnt concider an hybrid invertor without battery now.

 

[Raul]

back again wife has decided i'm not fit enough to kill myself on the roof.
So got a quote today and reading this thread again a bit of a shocker.
6Kwh solar 13x 455W and 5-6kw battery £17k. solar only £12k .
Think i need some suggestions for Midlands, only 55 miles from Amersham. Wouldnt concider an hybrid invertor without battery now.

Wow, 2k per kwp installed, then 1k per kWh of battery. You can price the parts yourself and see what’s the marking up.

 

[MisterB]

back again wife has decided i'm not fit enough to kill myself on the roof.
So got a quote today and reading this thread again a bit of a shocker.
6Kwh solar 13x 455W and 5-6kw battery £17k. solar only £12k .
Think i need some suggestions for Midlands, only 55 miles from Amersham. Wouldnt concider an hybrid invertor without battery now.

I've just assembled my own battery 13.4kw

Fogstar are now selling the complete kit for £2396 ..... took me a few hours to put together and sort out a couple of issues, I could do it in about 3 hours or less now I know what to do !!

It's a lot less per kWh than your quote !

SEPLOS Mason 280L and x16 Grade A EVE LF280K Battery Bundle

Our Seplos Mason battery bundle contains everything you will need to create a DIY 48V 14.3kWh battery. As part of this bundle you’ll receive a SEPLOS Mason 280L (vertical) kit and 16 Grade A LF280K EVE LiFePO4 cells with the SEPLOS Grade A Busbars.This is the ideal DIY kit for home energy and...

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[the1andonly]

That's more in my capabilities.
Need the solar side sorting and correct selection of electrics/electronics for a 48W system. Making me think again

 

[EuroTrotters]

my Quote in Spain

 

[mikebeaches]

I've got an array of 20 x 375 watt panels on the roof

Two of these Growatt 6.5kWh lithium storage batteries = 13kWh:

Growatt 6.5KWH Solar Battery GBLI6532 IP55

<p>Established in 2011, Growatt is a global leading distributed energy solution provider, specialising in sustainable energy generation, storage and consumption, as well as energy digitalisation. Growatt design, develop and manufacture PV inverters, energy storage products and smart energy...

www.tradesparky.com

And a Growatt 5kW hybrid inverter:

Growatt SPH5000 5.0kW Hybrid Solar Inverter

<p>Established in 2011, Growatt is a global leading distributed energy solution provider, specialising in sustainable energy generation, storage and consumption, as well as energy digitalisation. Growatt design, develop and manufacture PV inverters, energy storage products and smart energy...

www.tradesparky.com

Also have a standby supply from the batteries in case of grid outage.

The whole lot professionally installed 16 months ago cost circa £12.5k including scaffolding. Done through a 'Solar Together' initiative via the Local Council.

For May - last month - exported £208.22 of electricity on the Flux tariff, an invoice of £22.98 for standing charges and 18kWh of electricity consumed - so a Net credit for the month of £185.24. Happy with that.

 

[Coolcats]

I've got an array of 20 x 375 watt panels on the roof

Two of these Growatt 6.5kWh lithium storage batteries = 13kWh:

Growatt 6.5KWH Solar Battery GBLI6532 IP55

<p>Established in 2011, Growatt is a global leading distributed energy solution provider, specialising in sustainable energy generation, storage and consumption, as well as energy digitalisation. Growatt design, develop and manufacture PV inverters, energy storage products and smart energy...

www.tradesparky.com

And a Growatt 5kW hybrid inverter:

Growatt SPH5000 5.0kW Hybrid Solar Inverter

<p>Established in 2011, Growatt is a global leading distributed energy solution provider, specialising in sustainable energy generation, storage and consumption, as well as energy digitalisation. Growatt design, develop and manufacture PV inverters, energy storage products and smart energy...

www.tradesparky.com

Also have a standby supply from the batteries in case of grid outage.

The whole lot professionally installed 16 months ago cost circa £12.5k including scaffolding. Done through a 'Solar Together' initiative via the Local Council.

For May - last month - exported £208.22 of electricity on the Flux tariff, an invoice of £22.98 for standing charges and 18kWh of electricity consumed - so a Net credit for the month of £185.24. Happy with that.

View attachment 775349

Ours is from the solar together scheme, had a similar build and it was a similar cost

 

[Bessy765]

Ours has produced 2.30 MWH from being installed 10/2022 with the batteries and extra 4 panels installed 27/10/2022. It was out of action for 4 weeks April this years as it developed a software fault and we were away at the time. Second photo is its production this month. Have only used 2 units from the grid in the last 30 days. 16 panels rated at 5.86 kw in total 3 kw Solax hybrid inverter 2 x 5.8 kw Triple Power Batteries.
mounted on our garage roof just east of due south, incline at approx 10 degrees. We dont use the SEG tarrif as we have a small array on the house roof we were one of the first and we now get 68p per unit deemed at 50% usage whether we use it or not. You cant have both tariff at the same time from the same address so the FIT pays better than even if we went to Scottish power at 12 p.

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[MisterB]

Got the go ahead from the electrician earlier and have just spent a couple of hours trying to turn the Sofar inverter on !! checked everything twice, still nothing ...... went through everything, tested for power etc, which was def getting to the inverter, so i thought the issue must be inside the inverter, took the front off, checked the main fuse inside, then realised the ribbon connector to the front control panel wasnt even connected !!

plugged it in, screwed the front back on and BINGO !! All ready to go and programme it !

will set it all up tomorrow .....hopefully LOL

 

[Coolcats]

I've got an array of 20 x 375 watt panels on the roof

Two of these Growatt 6.5kWh lithium storage batteries = 13kWh:

Growatt 6.5KWH Solar Battery GBLI6532 IP55

<p>Established in 2011, Growatt is a global leading distributed energy solution provider, specialising in sustainable energy generation, storage and consumption, as well as energy digitalisation. Growatt design, develop and manufacture PV inverters, energy storage products and smart energy...

www.tradesparky.com

And a Growatt 5kW hybrid inverter:

Growatt SPH5000 5.0kW Hybrid Solar Inverter

<p>Established in 2011, Growatt is a global leading distributed energy solution provider, specialising in sustainable energy generation, storage and consumption, as well as energy digitalisation. Growatt design, develop and manufacture PV inverters, energy storage products and smart energy...

www.tradesparky.com

Also have a standby supply from the batteries in case of grid outage.

The whole lot professionally installed 16 months ago cost circa £12.5k including scaffolding. Done through a 'Solar Together' initiative via the Local Council.

For May - last month - exported £208.22 of electricity on the Flux tariff, an invoice of £22.98 for standing charges and 18kWh of electricity consumed - so a Net credit for the month of £185.24. Happy with that.

View attachment 775349

I am toying with the idea of one of these, I am going to stick up an anemometer to measure wind speed and if looks like it works then it should help at

 

[Bolti]

I am toying with the idea of one of these, I am going to stick up an anemometer to measure wind speed and if looks like it works then it should help at

4,200 euros seems a lot for 300w

 

[Coolcats]

4,200 euros seems a lot for 300w

I dont disagree hence toying with the idea, what I do like is

Environmental friendly
^
Animal secure
^
Noiseless
^
100 % green
^
Fully recyclable

 

[MisterB]

There's a guy on you tube Robert Murray-Smith that does a lot of experiments and designs from rocket stoves to wind turbines, including 3D printing his own! He really is worth a watch.

I'm not convinced domestic wind power is a cost effective 'project', but as a project it doesn't need to be! Good luck and keep us informed!

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