Current U.K. law on up plating has been changed WITHOUT consultation

[Jonno1103]

Current U.K. law on up plating has been changed WITHOUT consultation.

When up plating from 3500kg RFL will continue to be £365 pa. IT IS NOT being reduced to the PHG rate of £165.

Secondly, the DVLA are no longer changing the V5c to illustrate your new weight. The MTPLM will remain at 3500kg. This means that if your motorhome is detected on road installed Weight In Motion Sensors - WIMS, you WILL be classed as overweight. Currently there is no plan to prosecute although you will receive a letter advising you of weight limits etc.

This legislation is causing a great deal of harm to companies such as SvTech who are currently in constant communication with HMG and it is fully expected to be escalated and discussed on the floor in the House of Commons.

However, one of the reasons why in the short term this is in force is due to the EU's 4th directive and once in place will mean that RFL will illustrate the new entry weight limit. Vans & Moho's will need to be over 4250kg in order to qualify for the reduced RFL.

The Fourth Directive...

The EU will ratify this and it will be in force from January 2025. This means that drivers with post 1997 licences can drive upto 4250kg whether EV or ICE powered. Licences will become digital and some medicals will be self assessment.

Current information from Downing Street strongly suggests that the U.K.'s original stance was to also adopt this following an announcement during the March 2025 budget. The U.K. has historically adopted the first 3 directives and will also adopt No4.

There is now however a strong suggestion that this will be announced during the late October budget and will be in place for newly registered motohomes from March 1st.

This is of course still to be confirmed.

 

[dunnah01]

So in order to carry an extra ton of electrical fuel to carry the same goods that we already carry we have to up the driving weight category - how is that saving the planet. It's a nice knock on effect that it helps mohos just because they need to be a certain size to be comfortably self sufficient but for the vast majority of vans it's madness

 

[PaulW2]

So in order to carry an extra ton of electrical fuel to carry the same goods that we already carry we have to up the driving weight category - how is that saving the planet. It's a nice knock on effect that it helps mohos just because they need to be a certain size to be comfortably self sufficient but for the vast majority of vans it's madness

It entails a greater amount of kinetic energy with much less (or no) fossil fuels being burned and no impact on local air quality?

 

[dunnah01]

It entails a greater amount of kinetic energy with much less (or no) fossil fuels being burned and no impact on local air quality?

I get the argument for EVs but not for lugging a ton of batteries around everywhere

 

[PaulW2]

I get the argument for EVs but not for lugging a ton of batteries around everywhere

The EV is the ton of batteries and drivetrain, like the ICE engine is the drivetrain and fuel tank?

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[dunnah01]

The EV is the ton of batteries and drivetrain, like the ICE engine is the drivetrain and fuel tank?

But proper EVs (trams and high speed trains) don't carry much battery weight

 

[PaulW2]

But proper EVs (trams and high speed trains) don't carry much battery weight

Well no, but their roads are electrified.

 

[PaulW2]

Well no, but their roads are electrified.

We should be careful what we wish for:

There was a young man who said "Damn!
I perceive with regret that I am
But a creature that moves
In predestinate grooves
I'm not even a bus, I'm a tram." (Maurice Hare, 1905)

To which the nanny state has a reply:

"Young man you should stay your complaint,
For the grooves that you call a constraint
Are there to contrive
That you learn to survive
Trams arrive, buses may or they mayn't."

 

[yvonneid]

Strange. Mine does not have anything next to vehicle category.

Nor does mine.

 

[suavecarve]

No we can't as it does not state that.
It states "A sorn cannot be made if the vehicle is taken out of the UK" Which means you cannot sorn then take it out of the UK.It does not mean that you cannot take it out of the uk THEN sorn it? Two completely different things & why these people should not be allowed to write rules & regs & laws.

Youre reading it differently from me.

"Made" is not future tense nor is "Taken" A SORN is "made" at the point of making it, just like a cake.
If it were future tense they would say "Is to (or will) be taken out of the UK" Or The SORN will not continue if the vehicle is taken out of the UK

I dont intend to continue. I have my viewpoint, you have yours. I wont be agreeing with yours. And I suspect you wont agree with mine.

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[WESTY66]

Well I for one wouldn’t risk the hassle for the sake of VED
But that’s just me

 

[suavecarve]

Well I for one wouldn’t risk the hassle for the sake of VED
But that’s just me

Oh Go on, please, and put an end to this thread drift !

 

[Emmit]

Just to add fuel to the fire,
(and I know I have said further up that I am now in the 'cant SORN it' camp.

I've just read the GOV site that says, quite clearly that if your vehicles VEL does not run out at the end of the month in which you apply to SORN it then the application for SORN does not take place immediately,but the following month.
From where I stand, that means that if your VEL does not run out that month, you could make the application on the 1st or 2nd of the month and you would have the rest of the month, with a non SORNed vehicle to drive it with a current VEL, over to Europe and put it on a site off the road.
Discuss please

 

[gus-lopez]

Just to add fuel to the fire,
(and I know I have said further up that I am now in the 'cant SORN it' camp.

I've just read the GOV site that says, quite clearly that if your vehicles VEL does not run out at the end of the month in which you apply to SORN it then the application for SORN does not take place immediately,but the following month.
From where I stand, that means that if your VEL does not run out that month, you could make the application on the 1st or 2nd of the month and you would have the rest of the month, with a non SORNed vehicle to drive it with a current VEL, over to Europe and put it on a site off the road.
Discuss please

I think I'll stick with my "taxed for the year " that's it. No refunds ,sorn or whatever.

 

[David and Sally]

Just to add fuel to the fire,
(and I know I have said further up that I am now in the 'cant SORN it' camp.

I've just read the GOV site that says, quite clearly that if your vehicles VEL does not run out at the end of the month in which you apply to SORN it then the application for SORN does not take place immediately,but the following month.
From where I stand, that means that if your VEL does not run out that month, you could make the application on the 1st or 2nd of the month and you would have the rest of the month, with a non SORNed vehicle to drive it with a current VEL, over to Europe and put it on a site off the road.
Discuss please

So they keep a month’s VEL as well as the VEL from your application month?

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[Emmit]

So they keep a month’s VEL as well as the VEL from your application month?

Probably. My head hurts.

 

[PaulW2]

Just to add fuel to the fire,
(and I know I have said further up that I am now in the 'cant SORN it' camp.

I've just read the GOV site that says, quite clearly that if your vehicles VEL does not run out at the end of the month in which you apply to SORN it then the application for SORN does not take place immediately,but the following month.
From where I stand, that means that if your VEL does not run out that month, you could make the application on the 1st or 2nd of the month and you would have the rest of the month, with a non SORNed vehicle to drive it with a current VEL, over to Europe and put it on a site off the road.
Discuss please

Well, the condition of SORN-ness isn't allowed to coexist with the condition of out-of-UK-ness. That is the meaning behind that highlighted sentence in the SORN document.

So you've violated that. We're then in the domain of how they detect it and what the penalties/remedies are if they do.

 

[WESTY66]

There’s only one sure thing that will happen here.
If you have a crash whilst no tax abroad the insurance will pay the third party, you WILL then wish you had taxed it when/if they come after you for recompense! Especially if you have took someone’s life!
Just looked at gov.co.U.K. It says it must be taxed to drive in the EU
That’s all I’ve got to offer

 

[suavecarve]

Just to add fuel to the fire,
(and I know I have said further up that I am now in the 'cant SORN it' camp.

I've just read the GOV site that says, quite clearly that if your vehicles VEL does not run out at the end of the month in which you apply to SORN it then the application for SORN does not take place immediately,but the following month.
From where I stand, that means that if your VEL does not run out that month, you could make the application on the 1st or 2nd of the month and you would have the rest of the month, with a non SORNed vehicle to drive it with a current VEL, over to Europe and put it on a site off the road.
Discuss please

Were you in the MT department ?


Mental Torture

 

[DerryW]

Probably. My head hurts.

Your head hurts …… Christ, if anyone read the title of the OP’s thread they’d be a confused unless they started with page one.

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[Emmit]

Were you in the MT department ?


Mental Torture

As I quoted to Fogwell Flax ( No. Really. A comedian on cruise ships going back.)

He was doing warm up for the Capt's chat in the theatre on board.
He had a joke for every occupation and , inevitably, he asked the audience, "Have we got any Police in here, serving or retired"
I reluctantly put up my hand and Foggy zoned in on me.
"What job did you do" microphone in hand."
"I looked after people when they had nowhere to go". I replied.
"You looked after people when they had nowhere to go. What job was that in the Police.?"
"I worked in the cells and when they came in, we'd put them in one, close the door, they couldn't go anywhere and we looked after them."
Oh! How we all laughed.

I suppose you're right. It's now classed as torture.

 

[The Artilleryman]

I've just read the GOV site that says, quite clearly that if your vehicles VEL does not run out at the end of the month in which you apply to SORN it then the application for SORN does not take place immediately,but the following month.
From where I stand, that means that if your VEL does not run out that month, you could make the application on the 1st or 2nd of the month and you would have the rest of the month.
Discuss please

NO, if you have x months left, then SORN starts the day you declare it sorted.

 

[JockandRita]

No we can't as it does not state that.
It states "A sorn cannot be made if the vehicle is taken out of the UK" Which means you cannot sorn then take it out of the UK.It does not mean that you cannot take it out of the uk THEN sorn it? Two completely different things & why these people should not be allowed to write rules & regs & laws.

Because it doesn't say that you cannot do that ? It states that you cannot sorn it THEN take it out

It does not state that anywhere.In fact it is the opposite. It states you cannot sorn it THEN take it out

I don't even know why they allow any type of reduction whatsoever. Here, in spain,if you 'sorn' a vehicle the itv(Mot) is cancelled immediately even if it passed the day before.
To remove the sorn the vehicle has to be ITV'd but legally cannot travel on the road to get to it & must be transported on a trailer or recovery truck.
Plus you pay to put it on a sorn
then you have to pay to get it taken to the itv station
then pay for a new itv
then you can pay to get it taken off the sorn


as said you need to read the 9 pages you missed

It's these in/out, up/down, black/white, left/right responses from gus-lopez Richard, which makes me want to vote for him as Prime Minister if he was ever in the running. That and his possible draconian (but very effective) choices of punishment to deal with life's scrotes.

Bring it on Richard.

Jock.