Cam belt change required?

Toady

Toady

Joined
Jan 1, 2019
Posts
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Location
Pembrokeshire
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57,780
MH
Hymer B704 PL
Exp
Since 2017
I own a Hymer B704 PL 2017 and it has nearly 17K on the clock.

The MH is now 6 years old and it has not had a cam belt change yet.

Fiat state cam belt change at 5 year or 100K miles (or maybe 100K Km)

I have joined Nationwide Flex Plus for the breakdown cover after being covered by Driver Guardian for the last year.

I personally don’t think it is necessary to have the cam belt changed yet due to the low mileage but a check of the T&Cs on breakdown cover changed my mind.

The MH is booked in with Adams Morley for a cam belt change before we catch the ferry in January.
 
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Toady said:
I own a Hymer B704 PL 2017 and it has nearly 17K on the clock.

The MH is now 6 years old and it has not had a cam belt change yet.

Fiat state cam belt change at 5 year or 100K miles (or maybe 100K Km)

I have joined Nationwide Flex Plus for the breakdown cover after being covered by Driver Guardian for the last year.

I personally don’t think it is necessary to have the cam belt changed yet due to the low mileage but a check of the T&Cs on breakdown cover changed my mind.

The MH is booked in with Adams Morley for a cam belt change before we catch the ferry in January.
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Just out of curiosity why are you using a main stealer, especially when you out of warranty???
They will cost nearly double or triple what a specialist would charge you???
I've had hundreds changed over the past 40 years in the motor trade, and I can honestly say (touch wood) never had one customer come back with a broken belt, only a broken drive/alternator or a/c belt. No danage only inconvenience !
I would alway's find a reputable garage with a sensible labour rate, £40-£50 an hour and use oem parts, like oil's, filters and kit's all guaranteed and recognised and compatible with the warranty conditions.
 
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Sammy 🍺 said:
Just out of curiosity why are you using a main stealer, especially when you out of warranty???
They will cost nearly double or triple what a specialist would charge you???
I've had hundreds changed over the past 40 years in the motor trade, and I can honestly say (touch wood) never had one customer come back with a broken belt, only a broken drive/alternator or a/c belt. No danage only inconvenience !
I would alway's find a reputable garage with a sensible labour rate, £40-£50 an hour and use oem parts, like oil's, filters and kit's all guaranteed and recognised and compatible with the warranty conditions.
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From what I found out getting prices was that that specialist I found was 650.00. Main dealership Iveco 1,100.00, Travelworld 1336.78 (antifreeze extra) and a guy in Middlewich who had never done an A class guessed at 2,200.00 as he thought he would have to take the engine out.
 
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I was looking to upgrade my VW Tiguan as it was 12 years old and the cam belt etc was due for a change as it was nearly 6 years since it was last done. The main VW dealer in Ipswich checked the service record and mentioned the belt was still good to 120,000 miles. They said the UK was the only country that said 5 years or mileage. They now say 120,000 miles only. I said I wouldn't do that kind of mileage in 20 years. They said for peace of mind change it every 10 - 15 years? I phoned the main VW dealer in Colchester who said exactly the same thing. I was surprised that VW uk have changed there stance of belt replacement on the Tiguan to mileage only irrespective of age, whilst independent garages are still advising every 5 years or mileage?
I know this is a different beast to the Fiat Ducato which I will get the belt replaced again in a couple of years time.

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Toady said:
Another quick question.

Would you insist on the water pump being replaced whilst the cam belt is being replaced?
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Not on my 2007 Fiat X250, Fiat say it is good for the life of the engine and I believe them.

Of course change it if there is any obvious problems but by disturbing the joints unnecessarily, one is asking for leaks.
 
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Toady said:
Another quick question.

Would you insist on the water pump being replaced whilst the cam belt is being replaced?
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Also a water pump will wear more than most mechanical parts on an engine, with coolant being the main culprit.
They can either be internal or external dependent on the make and model.
If they start leaking say on a 2,500 mile holiday, this can lead to blown head gaskets or worse. I alway's take a bottle of rad weld (Radiator seal) or Steel seal (Head gasket seal) on a trip, as this would get you either to a garage or possibly back to UK.
Like a bulb kit, or a spare alternator belt. You try and get one in the EU at a drop of a hat, very difficult or impossible . . .
Alway's replace the pump, drive belt, coolant etc, it's not worth taking the risk, especially in Europe where you're on your own.
 
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Soycd said:
If it’s out of warranty then Adams Morey is the expensive option in terms of labour costs. I’ll be using them whilst the new van is under warranty but don’t think I’d use them otherwise.
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No need to use them while under warranty either. Just find a good independent garage with sensible labour rates and use Fiat parts. It will still be valid for warranty.
 
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VXman said:
No - I was talking to him about cambelt changes as I know he had never had one done so he went to the VW dealer and this is what they told him. Even if it wasn't 180000 miles he definitely said it was 15 years.
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Same info on the Seat forums at the moment.
 
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Sammy 🍺 said:
Just out of curiosity why are you using a main stealer, especially when you out of warranty???
They will cost nearly double or triple what a specialist would charge you???
I've had hundreds changed over the past 40 years in the motor trade, and I can honestly say (touch wood) never had one customer come back with a broken belt, only a broken drive/alternator or a/c belt. No danage only inconvenience !
I would alway's find a reputable garage with a sensible labour rate, £40-£50 an hour and use oem parts, like oil's, filters and kit's all guaranteed and recognised and compatible with the warranty conditions.
Click to expand...
I am in the same position needing to change my cam belt as low mileage since the last time it was done. Firstly we are in the Algarve and the look blank at the word Cam belt but understand what a Timing Belt is.
Secondly and more importantly Cam (Timing) Belt do wear low mileage and broken can mean new engine. Why ? Because when diving the engine pistons are out of seek and top and bottom mean in simple terms, they crash.
Yes you, like me need to get it done asap !
 
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Had the belt changed on previous van at @ 27000miles. Belt was fine however one of the pulley bearings was worn. I would change it for piece of mind.
 
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No water pump swap for me. It’s got no wearing parts apart from bearings. I won’t be changing may alternator that also relies on bearings.
 
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Do not gamble on cam belts. It is very expensive if they break. At 7 years you are pushing your luck. Also change the tensioner and anything else the belt runs on.

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Sammy 🍺 said:
Manufacturer via the supplier, you can claim off them, have done it before, but only with a juddering clutch on a Subaru 🤷‍♂️
They replaced clutch kit and paid the labour to swap . . .
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I understand that in theory, but, when it comes to a flexible timing belt, (slightly different from a rigid object where a mistake is obvious) won't the manufacturers say, "it must have been installed incorrectly as it was okay when it left the factory " especially if a multi thousand pound claim for a new engine is involved?
 
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Landy Andy said:
No water pump swap for me. It’s got no wearing parts apart from bearings. I won’t be changing may alternator that also relies on bearings.
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For the cost of the pump it’s worth doing if it’s cam belt driven.

After changing the cam belt and the pump fails or leaks you have to get back in a undo the good work.

That being the case I’d fit a new belt again.

Everything depends on your own risk assessment.
 
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It's a well know fact
L' Hobo said:
I understand that in theory, but, when it comes to a flexible timing belt, (slightly different from a rigid object where a mistake is obvious) won't the manufacturers say, "it must have been installed incorrectly as it was okay when it left the factory " especially if a multi thousand pound claim for a new engine is involved?
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No not if you let the workshop fitters supply the kit with a water pump like (INA) and then the warranty is with them, do not supply your own part's, especially if they ask you to, would walk away, as they know they're not liable then !
 
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Someone mentioned a Toyota HiLux. This has the same 3 litre D4D engine as the Landcruiser. A Bullet Proof engine by all accounts. I bought a new Landcruiser, every service up to warranty done by the Toyota garage. Every service after that done by me. 74000 mikes knock knock. KNOCK. KNOCK. 10 years old but still a beautiful car. Toyota did not want to know unless I paid for the strip down and inspection. Bottom line a big end, will never know why. car was, scrapped. Cam chain was fine though. Years before that had a cam belt go on a Bedford CF 2.3 litre engine.. Good design as valves and piston do not meet. Much later a cam belt tensioner failure on a Vauxhall Astra diesel. Another write off.
Even Hyundai and Kia use chains. The posh knobs have a gear train. Thats aftermarket for a Mk 1 Discovery or a Ferrari.
CHANGE THE BLOODY BELT AND ALL THE ASSOCIATED BITS. The alternative is unpaletable.

PS. Our Hymer is Sprinter based, a chain.

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Clive Mott said:
Every service after that done by me. 74000 mikes knock knock. KNOCK. KNOCK. 10 years old but still a beautiful car. Toyota did not want to know unless I paid for the strip down and inspection. Bottom line a big end, will never know why. car was, scrapped.
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Didn’t you consider doing the engine?
Brilliant cars and still hold their money.
 
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Clive Mott said:
Someone mentioned a Toyota HiLux. This has the same 3 litre D4D engine as the Landcruiser. A Bullet Proof engine by all accounts. I bought a new Landcruiser, every service up to warranty done by the Toyota garage. Every service after that done by me. 74000 mikes knock knock. KNOCK. KNOCK. 10 years old but still a beautiful car. Toyota did not want to know unless I paid for the strip down and inspection. Bottom line a big end, will never know why. car was, scrapped. Cam chain was fine though. Years before that had a cam belt go on a Bedford CF 2.3 litre engine.. Good design as valves and piston do not meet. Much later a cam belt tensioner failure on a Vauxhall Astra diesel. Another write off.
Even Hyundai and Kia use chains. The posh knobs have a gear train. Thats aftermarket for a Mk 1 Discovery or a Ferrari.
CHANGE THE BLOODY BELT AND ALL THE ASSOCIATED BITS. The alternative is unpaletable.

PS. Our Hymer is Sprinter based, a chain.
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Plenty of engines with chains have issues. They wear through the guides. Or the hydraulic tensioners fail. And occasionally the chain just snaps. Then, instead of just worrying about the head, you've got metal and plastic chunks bouncing in your timing cover and into your oil pan, so additional fun to sort. Timing chains doesn't mean it's a good engine. Several of the reliable Hilux engines are... belt driven.
 
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Thanks for all the responses and suggestions.

I have been researching another thread today started by Jim, on the topic of cam belts and recommended dealers/garages.

Its interesting how the prices have been rising, especially in relation to A classes.

I intend to contact a couple of suggested garages tomorrow to see their availability and pricing.

I am not particularly requiring a Fiat workshop but I live in Pembrokeshire and I can tell you know, there are few garages that want to take on the job and what ones are available, only have appointments available in the New Year.

I am willing to travel to get the job done but it’s got to be the right fitter doing the job.
 
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Silver-Fox said:
Didn’t you consider doing the engine?
Brilliant cars and still hold their money.
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Defo as last time I saw one in auction it did £10K+ a secky engine off Ebay couple grand only as anything Jap goes cheap because of their reliability can't sell them 🤷‍♂️
 
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Found the same problem a few weeks ago living in Pembrokeshire with one fiat garage saying January others not willing and others very slow coming back with price. One wanted a photo. Am Portsmouth got back within minutes. Quote £ 820 inc vat for cam belt and 2 aux bets for a 2018 Rapidio a class 2.3 Ducato. Booked appointment for work to be done the following week. Had it all done 2 weeks ago. At same time had full service and mot done. Bill all itemised for parts and labour. Spent 2 nights on the marina. Cost me time and diesel but very happy with service.
 
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The POPs said:
Yes recommend
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Yes to water pump change and totally agree why use main dealer when twice as expensive. My issue is 3.1meter high and 4.2 ton. Need someone who has a lift to raise the motorhome or pit as change the Cam (Timing) Belt requires underneath access.
 
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Anyone happen to know - does the Ives DAILY 70C21 AUTO have a belt or a chain and what the service interval is. Currently 4 years old and 39000 miles

Thanks
 
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Ed Pirates said:
Found the same problem a few weeks ago living in Pembrokeshire with one fiat garage saying January others not willing and others very slow coming back with price. One wanted a photo. Am Portsmouth got back within minutes. Quote £ 820 inc vat for cam belt and 2 aux bets for a 2018 Rapidio a class 2.3 Ducato. Booked appointment for work to be done the following week. Had it all done 2 weeks ago. At same time had full service and mot done. Bill all itemised for parts and labour. Spent 2 nights on the marina. Cost me time and diesel but very happy with service.
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Hi Ed,
Good to hear.
We are heading out of the country on the 11/1 via a ferry at Portsmouth so all booked in with AM for the 8/11.
Bit of a nightmare in Pembs right now to get anybody to look at an A class.

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