Buy British, why not?

[Lenny HB]

Yes, I got the dealer to get a weigh bridge ticket so that I could check how much of the 5% tolerance the manufacturer had used. I guess I was already committed to the purchase but it was useful information when working out what extras I could manage.

You didn't need to do that I told you it would be 130kg over, I was only 2 kg out.

 

[ceejayt]

RS ? What version of RS are you referring to? They've gone bust owing thousands several times. Its a Phoenix.

Kind of old news, speaking as an owner on their third Elysian over about 10 years, always been good to me. Also, whilst what you say is true I have never heard any owner on here say they lost out financially, of course the same may not have been true for suppliers.

All I can tell you is that on a recent visit to the factory they are stacked out building vehicles and seem to be doing well.

 

[Folkranger]

I think Lenny HB was referring to the 5% tolerance manufacturers are allowed when quoting weights. Carthago are quite good at making full use of this allowance.

I thought the VOSA 5% was only advice to their staff but doesn’t stop them from refusing to let you move on until your vehicle is within legal weight limits. A friend of mine was stopped for an overloaded trailer being towed behind a car. He wasn’t prosecuted but was only allowed to proceed when he had redistributed his load. There are other factors too, are the Police held to the same 5% tolerance when investigating an accident and looking for someone to blame? Also worth remembering that they can prosecute for each overloaded axle as well as the overall weight and if the 375kg was all on one axle you might be into the serious overload territory.

Its the same as speedometers. Find me a car where the speedo doesn't flatter the speed by 10%.

 

[Folkranger]

It's all very well people saying all you have to do is buy new, check the manufacturer's listed weight, add 5% on then work out the weight of all extras you might need including your own contents etc. but it would be so much simpler if every dealer (new or used) had by law to provide and display a current weighbridge ticket when selling a motorhome. Not too much to ask when the sales values are so high, is it?

 

[pandas]

It's all very well people saying all you have to do is buy new, check the manufacturer's listed weight, add 5% on then work out the weight of all extras you might need including your own contents etc. but it would be so much simpler if every dealer (new or used) had by law to provide and display a current weighbridge ticket when selling a motorhome. Not too much to ask when the sales values are so high, is it?

totally agree. They should also include the usual suspects: driver, passenger, 25% of water, full fuel, gas bottles full (I am sure I am missing something obvious) and ensure the calculations do not include food, clothes, drive away awnings, bikes etc. By coincidence our clothes seem to be around the same as flying bucket class circa 25kg and the wine about 1 ton.

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[kevenh]

Its the same as speedometers. Find me a car where the speedo doesn't flatter the speed by 10%.

Lots of cars are over reading less than 10% nowadays.
My old 2015 Mazda 3 and current 2018 Pug 108 are less than 2% out.
I was surprised about how accurate the Mazda 3 was as I often allowed for a bit of speed creep assuming 10% was typical. Luckily I used a portable satnav to compare features with the built and saw the speedo reading was close to real speeds.

 

[jongood]

Kind of old news, speaking as an owner on their third Elysian over about 10 years, always been good to me. Also, whilst what you say is true I have never heard any owner on here say they lost out financially, of course the same may not have been true for suppliers.

All I can tell you is that on a recent visit to the factory they are stacked out building vehicles and seem to be doing well.

Its not that old, last time 2017/18 debts of £2M they re now RS Motorhome Sales(South Yorkshire)Ltd and they have more than a bit of form.

I don't want to knock them, because they produce the best UK built Motorhome. But Would I feel comfortable giving them a deposit for a build?

 

[The Wino]

Its the same as speedometers. Find me a car where the speedo doesn't flatter the speed by 10%.

 

[Lenny HB]

Its the same as speedometers. Find me a car where the speedo doesn't flatter the speed by 10%.

Thats more to do with the constructions and use regs.
Speedo tolerance is - 0/+10%+10kmh for the life of the vehicle. So they have to allow for tyre wear vans tend to be worse because the tread depth is getting on for twice the tread depth on car tyres.
But it doesn't explane why a Fiat kmh speedo is more accurate than an mph one.

 

[Lenny HB]

It's all very well people saying all you have to do is buy new, check the manufacturer's listed weight, add 5% on then work out the weight of all extras you might need including your own contents etc. but it would be so much simpler if every dealer (new or used) had by law to provide and display a current weighbridge ticket when selling a motorhome. Not too much to ask when the sales values are so high, is it?

Unfortunately not much help with a factory order, every van we have had has been a factory order. Not been a problem for us as I'm well awear of payloads.

As for the stupid scam that you should only travel with 20 Lt of water that makes it unusable as a Motorhome.

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[Folkranger]

Thats more to do with the constructions and use regs.
Speedo tolerance is - 0/+10%+10kmh for the life of the vehicle. So they have to allow for tyre wear vans tend to be worse because the tread depth is getting on for twice the tread depth on car tyres.
But it doesn't explane why a Fiat kmh speedo is more accurate than an mph one.

Sounds plausable. So does santa Claus. I've mever had a car that does not overestimate speed regardless of age of tyres. 'Course thats just my experience.

 

[Coastal Cruiser.]

As for the stupid scam that you should only travel with 20 Lt of water

That’s less than 1 shower for Mrs CC

 

[Folkranger]

Unfortunately not much help with a factory order,

I suppose the main problem is dealer forecourt vans anyway.

 

[funflair]

Its not that old, last time 2017/18 debts of £2M they re now RS Motorhome Sales(South Yorkshire)Ltd and they have more than a bit of form.

View attachment 565463

I don't want to knock them, because they produce the best UK built Motorhome. But Would I feel comfortable giving them a deposit for a build?

To be fair Jon it's one reason we didn't include them in our search criteria.

 

[funflair]

That’s less than 1 shower for Mrs CC

I fill the tank to stop it slopping around, 360 litres as you know.

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[Coastal Cruiser.]

I fill the tank to stop it slopping around, 360 litres as you know.

I know someone who filled up 360ltrs in Germany drove over 200 miles up, down and around mountains into Switzerland and parked on site 4ft away from a standpipe

Will not say who

 

[funflair]

It's all very well people saying all you have to do is buy new, check the manufacturer's listed weight, add 5% on then work out the weight of all extras you might need including your own contents etc. but it would be so much simpler if every dealer (new or used) had by law to provide and display a current weighbridge ticket when selling a motorhome. Not too much to ask when the sales values are so high, is it?

I don't know who said "all you have to do is buy new" but no that is not the the answer, but if you are buying new it is worth knowing what you are going to get once all the options have been ticked, in our case we had to pay for the van when it came off production so no chance of them taking it to a weighbridge and telling them to shove it. I agree though that new stock vans should have a weight ticket and it wouldn't be that difficult for a manufacturer to get a weight as it comes off production but then a dealer would need to declare the weight of any options they add.

 

[funflair]

I know someone who filled up 360ltrs in Germany drove over 200 miles up, down and around mountains into Switzerland and parked on site 4ft away from a standpipe

Will not say who

You didn't know though, oh it wasn't you

 

[Coastal Cruiser.]

You didn't know though, oh it wasn't you

 

[Folkranger]

I don't know who said "all you have to do is buy new" but no that is not the the answer, but if you are buying new it is worth knowing what you are going to get once all the options have been ticked, in our case we had to pay for the van when it came off production so no chance of them taking it to a weighbridge and telling them to shove it. I agree though that new stock vans should have a weight ticket and it wouldn't be that difficult for a manufacturer to get a weight as it comes off production but then a dealer would need to declare the weight of any options they add.

To be honest, with modern production and materials there is no need for a new van to be 200kg or more over so new vans should be able to give a reasonable weight including purchased extras.

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[Folkranger]

You didn't know though, oh it wasn't you

I always fill up before travelling as I never book in advance and so don't know where my next fill up may be.

 

[Lenny HB]

To be honest, with modern production and materials there is no need for a new van to be 200kg or more over so new vans should be able to give a reasonable weight including purchased extras.

I don't think it's anything to do with that by taking advantage of the 5% tolerance they can pretend they have more payload.
Carthago for example their smaller vans always come out of the factory 130kg over and it never varies by more than a couple of kg. If they can build them that consistently its not down to material variations.

 

[Folkranger]

I don't think it's anything to do with that by taking advantage of the 5% tolerance they can pretend they have more payload.
Carthago for example their smaller vans always come out of the factory 130kg over and it never varies by more than a couple of kg. If they can build them that consistently its not down to material variations.

That's my point. When Manufacturing was very labour intensive and materials like wood varied in density, there was a need for a good tolerance but with computer aided design and manufacture and engineered materials it's probably time that these sales weight tolerances were brought into line. and manufacturers prevented from taking advantage of this.

When I worked in a rubber and plastics business modern manufacturing techniques allowed us to tighten our tolerances and reduce material usage to the minimum of the legally allowed thickness, saving money for the company and therefore the customer.

 

[SpeedyDux]

Its the same as speedometers. Find me a car where the speedo doesn't flatter the speed by 10%.

Quite surprisingly, our Honda digital speedo when compared against the GPS Garmin shows approx. 51 mph at true 50 and 72 mph at true 70 so I'm now wary about exceeding mandatory speed limits. It has a speed limiter gizmo but these devices are distracting to set up.

 

[pandas]

That's my point. When Manufacturing was very labour intensive and materials like wood varied in density, there was a need for a good tolerance but with computer aided design and manufacture and engineered materials it's probably time that these sales weight tolerances were brought into line. and manufacturers prevented from taking advantage of this.

When I worked in a rubber and plastics business modern manufacturing techniques allowed us to tighten our tolerances and reduce material usage to the minimum of the legally allowed thickness, saving money for the company and therefore the customer.

Related - well not at all, one of the high street brands used to dial down or up the relationship between fats/water and meat for their burgers related to the margins they wanted to achieve which on their volume used to make a significant difference.

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