Best Oil

[LancashireLad]

I’m sure the oil question has been asked many times here but can I ask what is the most suitable engine oil for a 19 year old Peugeot Boxer Engine? Thanks

 

[highwood122]

An A3 B3 10W/30. Stay away from cheaper brands. My husband is a professional automotive engineer.

i agree go with reputable brands did some research some time ago,about 2 years, and i think oil companies self certify their products to be up to spec,one brand small obscure that was budget had a person of putins citizenship on the board

 

[Daffy64]

Most important is the specification. Always use the grade and API specification as written in the handbook.

Engine and Oil technology does develop over time, and the specification evolves and improves. There is no danger at all in using a later/more modern API spec in your engine, as long as the grade as stipulated by the engine OEM is used.

The oil grade will be something like this, 10W40 or 5W30 or even the old 20W50 ‘multi grade’ - the old term used to describe the blended and more engineered and often semi synthetic oils first introduced to provide far greater protection over a range of temperature.

The first bit refers to the required W or winter viscosity. The second bit refers to the oils viscosity when hot. A 10W40 multi grade oil will exhibit the characteristic resistance to flow (viscous) behaviour of a very thin base oil (one with a dynamic viscosity of 10 centistokes) when it is cold, and it will exhibit the characteristic resistance to flow behaviour of a heavier base oil (one with a basal dynamic viscosity of 40 centistokes) at high or operating temperature.

All mineral oils will quickly degrade over time. This is traditionally mitigated by adding stabilisers, preservatives and conditioners and other additives to prolong life. These oils are called part or more commonly semi synthetic.

The very best oils are fully synthetic. The best oil you can put in your engine is any modern fully synthetic oil of the correct grade (as stated by your vehicle manufacturer) that meets the latest API spec which I think is currently API-CJ or CK4

Why? it will work harder, resist thermal and chemical breakdown better, produce less deposits and stay in grade longer.

I don’t want to rain on your parade but I disagree with much of what you have said, the viscosity is important especially in an older engine but synthetic oils are not necessarily better in older engines as they may not have been designed to run with them and they can in fact be harmful in the wrong application.

The API spec referred to usually relates to engines in the US, for a European engine it better to think of the ACEA spec for diesel as it will be what the manufacturer worked to- it is important that you use the right ACEA spec as they have different properties some of which can be damaging to the wrong engine - this is probably more important than the viscosity - as a rule of thumb if you get a choice of 2 viscosities go for the higher numbers in a worn engine unless you are operating in extreme cold.

Castrol Magnatec is a good oil if they do your spec and viscosity.

 

[Silver-Fox]

Most important is the specification. Always use the grade and API specification as written in the handbook.

Engine and Oil technology does develop over time, and the specification evolves and improves. There is no danger at all in using a later/more modern API spec in your engine, as long as the grade as stipulated by the engine OEM is used.

The oil grade will be something like this, 10W40 or 5W30 or even the old 20W50 ‘multi grade’ - the old term used to describe the blended and more engineered and often semi synthetic oils first introduced to provide far greater protection over a range of temperature.

The first bit refers to the required W or winter viscosity. The second bit refers to the oils viscosity when hot. A 10W40 multi grade oil will exhibit the characteristic resistance to flow (viscous) behaviour of a very thin base oil (one with a dynamic viscosity of 10 centistokes) when it is cold, and it will exhibit the characteristic resistance to flow behaviour of a heavier base oil (one with a basal dynamic viscosity of 40 centistokes) at high or operating temperature.

All mineral oils will quickly degrade over time. This is traditionally mitigated by adding stabilisers, preservatives and conditioners and other additives to prolong life. These oils are called part or more commonly semi synthetic.

The very best oils are fully synthetic. The best oil you can put in your engine is any modern fully synthetic oil of the correct grade (as stated by your vehicle manufacturer) that meets the latest API spec which I think is currently API-CJ or CK4

Why? it will work harder, resist thermal and chemical breakdown better, produce less deposits and stay in grade longer.

I’ve taken in all you’ve said.

Can I just ask, as I was told a good few years ago, don’t use fully synthetic when semi is specified.

I was told it can can cause harm to an engine, we are talking about older engines here.

Will be interested in any comments you have

dawsey

 

[Silver-Fox]

Anyone else remember years ago when we used to go to Halfords and pick up GTX or similar

Never worried about spec etc

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[LancashireLad]

Oil used to be so simple lol! I started this thread with the idea that someone would say “ yes just use this oil it’s ideal for an older motorhome” No chance I’m more confused than ever
Although thanks to everyone for trying to answer the question.

 

[Daffy64]

Anyone else remember years ago when we used to go to Halfords and pick up GTX or similar

Never worried about spec etc

Engines have changed a lot since then, if you’re still running around in the same car or van then GTX is still a good oil for it. I used to prefer duckhams as it was green - that’s it…

Fact is that most of the improvements in engines over the last 20 years have been about the capacity of the oil to cope.

 

[LancashireLad]

My Peugeot Boxer (19 years old, 29000 miles) handbook recommends:

Use at least semi-synthetic grade

ACEA B3
Esso Ultra
Esso Ultra Diesel
Total Quartz Diesel 7000

Esso Ultron Diesel
Total Quartz 9000
Total Quartz Diesel 9000. These are all all Synthetic

Any idea what the modern equivelant is?

 

[Daffy64]

My Peugeot Boxer (19 years old, 29000 miles) handbook recommends:

Use at least semi-synthetic grade

ACEA B3
Esso Ultra
Esso Ultra Diesel
Total Quartz Diesel 7000

Esso Ultron Diesel
Total Quartz 9000
Total Quartz Diesel 9000. These are all all Synthetic

Any idea what the modern equivelant is?

Esso oils became Mobil, if you want to use an ‘Esso’ oil then go for a Mobil oil B3 spec and of the correct viscosity.

In fairness if it’s just for top ups go to Halfords and buy a ltr of a known brand in B3 spec with the correct viscosity.

You’ll not go far wrong.

 

[LancashireLad]

Thanks

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[dawsey]

I don’t want to rain on your parade but I disagree with much of what you have said, the viscosity is important especially in an older engine but synthetic oils are not necessarily better in older engines as they may not have been designed to run with them and they can in fact be harmful in the wrong application.

The API spec referred to usually relates to engines in the US, for a European engine it better to think of the ACEA spec for diesel as it will be what the manufacturer worked to- it is important that you use the right ACEA spec as they have different properties some of which can be damaging to the wrong engine - this is probably more important than the viscosity - as a rule of thumb if you get a choice of 2 viscosities go for the higher numbers in a worn engine unless you are operating in extreme cold.

Castrol Magnatec is a good oil if they do your spec and viscosity.

Fee free to rain on any parade you choose, and disagree with whoever you like. But if you are going to make claims then cite evidence to support what you say.

There is zero evidence that any modern oil of the correct grade will ‘damage’ any older engine, especially engines of the relatively modern ages and designs as referenced by the OP. Great care is taken to ensure this is not possible. If you actually do research on backward compatibility, all you will come up with is some very old studies relating to ester based oils and very old seal materials, it relates only to pre 1960s engine designs.

https://wayfarerinsurancegroup.com/blog/can-you-use-synthetic-oil-in-your-classic-car/#:~:text=Today's%20synthetics%20are%20perfectly%20safe,before%20oxidizing%20and%20losing%20efficacy.

Yes API is the American Pertoleum Institute. They have been the foremost oil grading and certification agency for many decades.

 

[dawsey]

I’ve taken in all you’ve said.

Can I just ask, as I was told a good few years ago, don’t use fully synthetic when semi is specified.

I was told it can can cause harm to an engine, we are talking about older engines here.

Will be interested in any comments you have

dawsey

Synthetic oils are superior in every way. This is why they cost more. It’s just a better product. I have no idea why someone would say that, it may be down to cost, older low tech low stress low revving low power unturbocharged lumps didn’t need a high quality synthetic oil, and maybe that was the reason you were told this.

However, pretty much any diesel engine now will be turbocharged, and this places high thermal stress on the engine oil, which is used to lubricate and cool the extremely hot turbocharger. Most/all will now be using very high pressure 1800-2200 bar common rail pumps, and even van engines are running higher specific powers and have greater thermal management challenge.

All OEM (manufacturer) will now specify at least a semi, which is a good low cost compromise, recognising that the expensive fully synthetic oils, while perfect for your Merc AMG, your 911 or your Ferrari are a bit much for a van engine.

The OP asked the question what is the bast oil for his engine, so I answered, it is any modern fully synthetic oil of the correct grade.

Does his van need such an oil? No. Will the oil benefit his engine ? Depends. If, for example, he were to leave 15000 miles between oil changes, then without a doubt, all else equal, there would be a far lower chance of sludge build up, engine wear and damage if he was using a synthetic as opposed to a semi, and far less so than if it was an old fashioned pure mineral oil.

There we are. The real benefit, should you choose to avail yourself of it, is you can go a bit longer between changes as fully synthetic oils are far less prone to thermal and chemical breakdown, will hold onto their film strength far longer, and are full of active additives that keep the engine clean. It’s just like the difference between putting a decent fuel in and a supermarket fuel. You won’t see anything in the short term, but in the long term, all else equal, you will.

https://wayfarerinsurancegroup.com/blog/can-you-use-synthetic-oil-in-your-classic-car/#:~:text=Today's%20synthetics%20are%20perfectly%20safe,before%20oxidizing%20and%20losing%20efficacy.

 

[scotjimland]

It’s just like the difference between putting a decent fuel in and a supermarket fuel.

and what is the difference..?

are you suggesting the supermarket fuel is inferior, and if so, do you have evidence of which company or refinery is supplying it ?

I worked in the oil and gas exploration and refining industry for more than 20 years .. so know a little bit about the process.

 

[LancashireLad]

Does it matter if you top up with a different oil from the one that is in there already?

 

[dawsey]

and what is the difference..?

are you suggesting the supermarket fuel is inferior, and if so, do you have evidence which refinery is supplying it ?

I worked in the oil and gas exploration and refining industry for more than 20 years .. so know a little bit about the process.

Most stuff sold as 95 octane or the ‘budget’ fuel, wherever sold in supermarkets or not will meet the relevant minimum spec. Perhaps I should have been clearer about the differentiation between the 97-99 Ron or ‘super’ versions that tend to cost a little more. These fuels are absolutely better than the 95Ron standard stuff. There’s several reasons for the petrols, less for the diesels but the result is the same, they are better. You get what you pay for.

I can’t cite anything particular or substantive that would suggest that a supermarket supplied 95 would be substantively different to a 95Ron fuel sold by one of the big refiners/retailers. As you say, it likely comes from the same refinery.

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[dawsey]

Does it matter if you top up with a different oil from the one that is in there already?

No. Oil of any sort isn’t like antifreeze and different types and grades won’t react and turn into marzipan in your engine. Just try to ensure that the grade is the same. In an emergency (you’ve lost some oil somehow and have no other choice) you can even disregard that and put a litre of pretty much any engine oil in and it won’t do any harm due to the dilution effect. The principle is any oil is better than no or low oil….

Just remember to do a decent change when next you can.

For info, diesel engines are really hard on their oil. I try to change oil on my diesel engines every 4000-7000 miles, the higher number if I’ve been lucky enough to pick up 5-7ltr of fully synthetic and an decent filter online for £40. Amazon is great for that. Remember it is not the fancy label or the known make - it is the specification (universal is API), the grade, and it being fully synthetic that counts.

 

[Silver-Fox]

Engines have changed a lot since then, if you’re still running around in the same car or van then GTX is still a good oil for it. I used to prefer duckhams as it was green - that’s it…

Fact is that most of the improvements in engines over the last 20 years have been about the capacity of the oil to cope.

Yeah I appreciate engines are a lot different these days

But it was so easy back in the 70’s

 

[Just smiffy]

Opie oils.. put your reg in and they tell you what you need…

 

[Northernraider]

This is what i use

SHELL HELIX HX7 10W-40 SEMI SYNTHETIC ENGINE OIL ACEA A3 B4 API SN PLUS 5L 5011987107755 | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for SHELL HELIX HX7 10W-40 SEMI SYNTHETIC ENGINE OIL ACEA A3 before API SN PLUS 5L at the best online prices at eBay! Free delivery for many products.

www.ebay.co.uk

You will need 2 as it holds 6 litres

 

[Northernraider]

It’s just like the difference between putting a decent fuel in and a supermarket fuel. You won’t see anything in the short term, but in the long term, all else equal, you will.

https://wayfarerinsurancegroup.com/blog/can-you-use-synthetic-oil-in-your-classic-car/#:~:text=Today's%20synthetics%20are%20perfectly%20safe,before%20oxidizing%20and%20losing%20efficacy.

The difference between supermarket fuel and any other fuel


Zero ...no difference

They come from the same tanks in the same refinery. No petrol station adds anything to their fuel at the station and there is not separate tanks at refineries for every different brand of station. In Scotland for example all fuel comes from Grangemouth refinery.


Anything else is a myth

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[bobnick]

May i take this oil business further.
How easy is it to change the oil and filter on a 22 plate Peugeot Boxer 2.2. Could i a non mechanical person do it?

 

[Silver-Fox]

Synthetic oils are superior in every way. This is why they cost more. It’s just a better product. I have no idea why someone would say that, it may be down to cost, older low tech low stress low revving low power unturbocharged lumps didn’t need a high quality synthetic oil, and maybe that was the reason you were told this.

However, pretty much any diesel engine now will be turbocharged, and this places high thermal stress on the engine oil, which is used to lubricate and cool the extremely hot turbocharger. Most/all will now be using very high pressure 1800-2200 bar common rail pumps, and even van engines are running higher specific powers and have greater thermal management challenge.

All OEM (manufacturer) will now specify at least a semi, which is a good low cost compromise, recognising that the expensive fully synthetic oils, while perfect for your Merc AMG, your 911 or your Ferrari are a bit much for a van engine.

The OP asked the question what is the bast oil for his engine, so I answered, it is any modern fully synthetic oil of the correct grade.

Does his van need such an oil? No. Will the oil benefit his engine ? Depends. If, for example, he were to leave 15000 miles between oil changes, then without a doubt, all else equal, there would be a far lower chance of sludge build up, engine wear and damage if he was using a synthetic as opposed to a semi, and far less so than if it was an old fashioned pure mineral oil.

There we are. The real benefit, should you choose to avail yourself of it, is you can go a bit longer between changes as fully synthetic oils are far less prone to thermal and chemical breakdown, will hold onto their film strength far longer, and are full of active additives that keep the engine clean. It’s just like the difference between putting a decent fuel in and a supermarket fuel. You won’t see anything in the short term, but in the long term, all else equal, you will.

https://wayfarerinsurancegroup.com/blog/can-you-use-synthetic-oil-in-your-classic-car/#:~:text=Today's%20synthetics%20are%20perfectly%20safe,before%20oxidizing%20and%20losing%20efficacy.

All noted and thanks for taking the time to reply.

I have an older shogun as a tow car for my trailer and that is an oil change every 6k miles.
Given it’s age I’m guessing the short mileage time is down to older oil specs.

She runs on semi synthetic now, I use Morris oils as it comes as as kit from Milner off road.

Thanks again I love all this info

 

[Silver-Fox]

May i take this oil business further.
How easy is it to change the oil and filter on a 22 plate Peugeot Boxer 2.2. Could i a non mechanical person do it?

In a short answer

Yes

If you can raise the car enough to get to the sump plug.

Something to catch the old oil with.

Tools required.
Socket set or correct socket size or Allen key socket.

Something to remove under tray, probably cross head screwdriver.

Gloves to keep hands clean.

Possibly filter spanner, not sure how filter is held on that car.

 

[L' Hobo]

Any oil is better than none/too little

You won't get very far with Olive!

 

[L' Hobo]

In a short answer

Yes

If you can raise the car enough to get to the sump plug.

Something to catch the old oil with.

Tools required.
Socket set or correct socket size or Allen key socket.

Something to remove under tray, probably cross head screwdriver.

Gloves to keep hands clean.

Possibly filter spanner, not sure how filter is held on that car.

and a new copper washer for your sump plug.

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[Hettie's Crew]

I’m sure the oil question has been asked many times here but can I ask what is the most suitable engine oil for a 19 year old Peugeot Boxer Engine? Thanks

Go to the FUCHS oils website and put your vehicle details in.
I use this in ours (2014 Fiat 2.3) after discovering that it’s what the Fiat Professional dealer used during the five years we had it serviced with them.
Or, if as you said in post #12 you trust your service garage, just ask them for some to use for topping up.

 

[The Wino]

I used to own a 1968 vitesse 2l straight six and a lot in the owners club use modern synthetic oil they claim less engine wear but as far as I know no hard evidence to back it up. On the major brands thing if it keeps people happy why not I tend to think of it like own brand food at the supermarket can be just as good and a lot cheaper. Our kitchen is full of own brand stuff!

 

[Silver-Fox]

and a new copper washer for your sump plug.

In that case an oil filter and oil

 

[Northernraider]

I used to own a 1968 vitesse 2l straight six and a lot in the owners club use modern synthetic oil they claim less engine wear but as far as I know no hard evidence to back it up. On the major brands thing if it keeps people happy why not I tend to think of it like own brand food at the supermarket can be just as good and a lot cheaper. Our kitchen is full of own brand stuff!

A lot of own brand stuff is also the Same as the named brand. Supermarkets don't have their own factories either.

When I worked as a courier driver I had a few customers like this

Buttons biscuits for example. They used to give us boxes of biscuits that failed quality control , there would be packets amongst them with ,sainsbury. Asda, spar, tesco etc etc all the same biscuits only the name on the packet was changed.

Miller sweets was another one.


But some own brands are also shit ...research required

 

[Daffy64]

The difference between supermarket fuel and any other fuel


Zero ...no difference

They come from the same tanks in the same refinery. No petrol station adds anything to their fuel at the station and there is not separate tanks at refineries for every different brand of station. In Scotland for example all fuel comes from Grangemouth refinery.


Anything else is a myth

Not true - the fuel comes from the same tank in the refinery, the different outlets have their own blend of additives which are added at the terminal when the tanker is being filled - the driver has a key or a code which defines which additive pack is added.

Esso fuel is different to shell fuel etc etc.

Modern diesel without additives would not be good for the moving parts in your fuel systems as diesel ceased to be self lubricating when the majority of the sulphur was removed - the additive packs contain a lubricity enhancer amongst other things how much and how good depends on who’s fuel, as they say you gets what you pays for.

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[cyberyacht]

My first car(petrol) was a real oil-burner. I used to buy recycled oil. Did a trip up to London from Portsmouth. On the return, I stopped near Kingston - "Four gallons(19L) of petrol and four pints of oil, please". "Do you want to put the oil in your boot?" "No, the engine". "What, all of it?" "Yep". 25 miles to the pint.