A Frame Disaster

Status
Not open for further replies.
Conal said:
Landy Andy My understanding is that the longer the distance between the hitch point and the towed wheels, the harder it is to reverse. A small trailer would be just as difficult for me. I would agree with you if there was no way of solving the problem of not being able to reverse. I don’t see why anyone just object to someone else solving their own problems without inconveniencing others.
There are also people who think only those who know how to fix cars should be allowed to drive them, and that everyone should be able to replace a punctured wheel. I am not one of them.
Click to expand...
The issue I have with this is that if, my mum, a lorry, a tractor, a anything meets you head to head on a road you are expecting them to reverse. Why? That to me is not how it should be, both parties should be able to reverse. I understand those that possibly aren’t good at it, but it should be a possibility. I can reverse a trailer, so am happy to tow one if required. I would not tow one if I could not reverse it.
 
Landy Andy I agree with your point that’s why I tow an A Frame. It only take seconds to unhitch then to reverse both vehicles separately. Once the other cars have gone I re-hitch and carry on. I have always stopped often in laybys or at convenient times to let faster traffic pass our motorhome even when not towing.
I agree so much with you that I try to avoid towing on narrow roads and research before-hand. I will not tow on the Applegate portion of the NC500 for the same reason.
We only took the decision to spend the best part of £3,000 and tow because we are getting old and decrepit and can not walk or cycle as far as we used to be able to; and because COVID has forced our hand to explore the more remote (points of interest) in mainland UK.
 
Last edited:
Realist said:
But what gets to me is selling a A Frame with no break away cable or means to stop it if it comes away from the Motorhome
Click to expand...
I agree, but.....the breakaway system only works if the A frame detaches from the tow ball.
As the handbrake lever, the key part of the system, is attached to the frame there is nothing to apply the brakes, except very momentarily, if the A frame leaves the car.
 
I have towed with trailer for a while but for many years have used an a frame , a car is far more stable sitting on its four wheels than on a more often than not two wheel trailer and a higher centre of gravity.
I have an inertia braking system that operates the cars brakes and has a remote unit in the motorhome cab for information and adjustment , it is possible to reverse as brakes are not applied as in an overrun system but is limited by steering although a reasonable distance is possible when a small shuffle forward to straighten car wheels is carried out.

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 
Langtoftlad said:
Tony Marie is a well known vociferous anti A Frame advocate

No breakaway cable says it all.
Click to expand...
Yes he winds it up occasionally and if he doesn’t like a frames and doesn’t use one I haven’t a clue what his problem is.
 
chaser said:
It is totally unbelievable to me that anyone who can't reverse a trailer can be allowed on the road with one. :doh:
Click to expand...
And to think they are scrapping the test to tow larger trailer..
I can reverse and agree the longer the trailer the easier to reverse.. However if you can't reverse you can't reverse regardless of size of trailer.
Jesus have you watched some folk trying to reverse a car on its own with no trailer.
 
poppycamper said:
And to think they are scrapping the test to tow larger trailer..
I can reverse and agree the longer the trailer the easier to reverse.. However if you can't reverse you can't reverse regardless of size of trailer.
Jesus have you watched some folk trying to reverse a car on its own with no trailer.
Click to expand...
It's not hard though is it, four year old kids can do it here with garden tractors after a couple of days.
The biggest thing an old driver told me and I tell all the kids here, is follow your trailer, don't get to far out of line.
But one thing with tractors , it's bloody hard to reverse a four wheel trailer as all your normal reversing training goes out the window so is trying to back a four wheel car the same.
 
Yup, I just saw the other day that they were scrapping the trailer test. I know a couple of people who have just recently passed theirs at a cost of just over £700 !
A quick tip for anyone trying to reverse a trailer is to grip the wheel with one hand at the "six o'clock" position and to make the trailer go left, move your hand to the left and vice versa.

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 
jockaneezer said:
Yup, I just saw the other day that they were scrapping the trailer test. I know a couple of people who have just recently passed theirs at a cost of just over £700 !
A quick tip for anyone trying to reverse a trailer is to grip the wheel with one hand at the "six o'clock" position and to make the trailer go left, move your hand to the left and vice versa.
Click to expand...
Yes but a four wheel trailer is opposite to this, is a car the same?
 
Wife's Suzuki Alto with the A frame attachment bolted to the chassis on either side, made by me, its 3mm box section steel.
The hole on the right which I assume they used as a mounting point, wasn't in my opinion be suitable for an A frame attachment point and it appears I was right.

The original cross member its pressed steel probably 1mm thick or less
after.jpg


The new cross member 100x50x3mm
before.jpg
 
Last edited:
chaser said:
It's not hard though is it, four year old kids can do it here with garden tractors after a couple of days.
The biggest thing an old driver told me and I tell all the kids here, is follow your trailer, don't get to far out of line.
But one thing with tractors , it's bloody hard to reverse a four wheel trailer as all your normal reversing training goes out the window so is trying to back a four wheel car the same
Click to expand...
No it is NOT but if you do struggle go out and practise..
On a different track I just love driving on single track roads.
Just back from a week up north.. No not NC500 and the number of mohos I encountered (no toad or trailer) who couldnt/wouldn't reverse back to passing place they just past expecting me to reverse 400/500 yrds to the one I passed.
At first I did then thought no and just sat there and stared them out until they eventually got message but I must say it was a tad embarising watching their attempt.
 
I wonder if the possibility of that kind of thing is the reason A Frames aren't legal in most countries?
 
chaser said:
Yes but a four wheel trailer is opposite to this, is a car the same?
Click to expand...
No , you have no control on the cars steering as you would on a four wheel trailer as the steering pivot is very basically ahead of the wheel and acts like a caster going forwards but not reversing.
 
Langtoftlad said:
Tony Marie is a well known vociferous anti A Frame advocate

No breakaway cable says it all.
Click to expand...
A legend in his own lunch time
He should give up forums untill he learns to read post properly he constantly ruins good informative threads as soon as he sees a comment he thinks he can challenge often out of context and more times than not changes the topic by quoting outdated trailer law to prove a point no one but himself is making!!!!
Weird foutain of knowledge pre ocupied by inertia braking regardless of the posts subject.
 
I had a towbar professionally fitted a few years ago and the twit just used the bumper carrier bolts, the main strength was in the angle iron that slotted into the chassis he hadn't bothered to bolt up 😳

Fortunately I found out what he'd done a few months later when the thing dropped as I hitched up.

The only reason I didn't fit it myself is I couldn't source one cheaper.
Every towbar I've had fitted has been a balls up.. I never learn 🙄

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 
Richard n Ann Like most expensive things I buy I try to find the best appropriate purchase. For us an all singing all dancing A Frame would be overkill as the Morris is under 750Kg, no steering lock, and very limited electrics. I always look for recommendation, both here and elsewhere.
 
Easy to reverse car on an "A" frame...... Just need a switched on driver to steer the car.. (y)

And explain to them which way you want them to steer.. and where you hope to end up...

Don`t work with some wimmen... Trust me..... been there nearly got the tea shirt... :doh:
 
chaser said:
But one thing with tractors , it's bloody hard to reverse a four wheel trailer as all your normal reversing training goes out the window so is trying to back a four wheel car the same.
Click to expand...
Its not the same.....with an A frame the car basically becomes a rear axle trailer as you have no control over the front wheels.
When reversing around a left corner the cars front wheels go to opposite (r/h) lock due to steering geometry
 
is it not up to the driver to check that all towing points are connect up and that include break away cables
 
Realist said:
But what gets to me is selling a A Frame with no break away cable or means to stop it if it comes away from the Motorhome.
Click to expand...
Since the A-frame has broken away from the car a break away cable, which activates the hand brake on the frame is not going to work. Neither is a secondary retention device which is allowed up to a certain weight, because that will also be attached to the frame not the car. The average user will put his trust in the installer and other than users of this site is probably unaware that using the towing eyes and original beam is dangerous.

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 
2bob said:
is it not up to the driver to check that all towing points are connect up and that include break away cables
Click to expand...
yes it is, but the average driver does not take the bumper off to check the hidden mounts for damage and they trust that the installer did a proper job
 
old-mo said:
Easy to reverse car on an "A" frame...... Just need a switched on driver to steer the car.. (y)

And explain to them which way you want them to steer.. and where you hope to end up...

Don`t work with some wimmen... Trust me..... been there nearly got the tea shirt... :doh:
Click to expand...
Your right mo, got the wife to steer as I reversed, I gave up after about 5'. I disconnected the hitch she then drove to a parking spot with me holding it up in the air.
 
Burgo said:
I
Click to expand...
Realist said:
Don’t forget this thread is for information relating to the original post and anything that relates to it, please no finger pointing or accusations.
Click to expand...
Unfortunately the very subject has always been a fertile area of discussion so the OP sowed the seed especially as the author or the article is to say the least anti a frame.
 
I contacted one of the popular A frame suppliers asking the question could they fit a frame to our ‘92 Eunos Roadster (JDM Mx5) and he explained there was nothing to fasten one too as the crossmember was too far back. Top marks to him, he didn’t try to sell me something not fit for purpose hence………


7CC350F9-03CB-4769-8AEC-3AA7580F442A.jpeg

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Latest journal entries

Back
Top