Remap or not - pre adblue euro 6 Fiat (1 Viewer)

[Folkranger]

Mine is a 2017 150bhp 2.3
Quite a few people with these, both on this site and elsewhere, find them either underpowered or too high geared. Mine certainly is compared to my previous 2014 150bhp Ducato which flew along motorways without the need to change down on hills.

Has anybody any experience or knowledge of remapping these particular engines? There are many companies listing them and showing expected performance figures.

 

[Pausim]

Wouldn't the MOT test find any infringement in polution levels?

Possibly, not sure but if not now they probably will in the future.

 

[Folkranger]

Possibly, not sure but if not now they probably will in the future.

The number of people who arre happy with these suggests that the MOT is not an issue.

I suppose if that future ever materialised one could always reset the ecu back to its default setting.

 

[Steve and Denise]

Wouldn't the MOT test find any infringement in polution levels?

From what I was told by an engine development company MOT stations emissions testing is very basic equipmen and would not detect small changes.

 

[Fragle]

Interesting thread. I thought about a remapping but looking at some quoted mpg figures here we are not too bad. I mean we are comformatic Euro6 no ad blue and achieve at least 30 mpg.
Cruise control and 55mph max obviously doing the job.

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[Folkranger]

Interesting thread. I thought about a remapping but looking at some quoted mpg figures here we are not too bad. I mean we are comformatic Euro6 no ad blue and achieve at least 30 mpg.
Cruise control and 55mph max obviously doing the job.

For me, 25 to 27 overall, can do 30+ on quite long stretches but always settles to an average of about 26.

 

[Folkranger]

Interesting thread. I thought about a remapping but looking at some quoted mpg figures here we are not too bad. I mean we are comformatic Euro6 no ad blue and achieve at least 30 mpg.
Cruise control and 55mph max obviously doing the job.

What RPM at 55mph? just curious as to what people get as 55mph in top gear would run at about 1750 RPM which is well below maximum torque for my model.

 

[Folkranger]

Interesting thread. I thought about a remapping but looking at some quoted mpg figures here we are not too bad. I mean we are comformatic Euro6 no ad blue and achieve at least 30 mpg.
Cruise control and 55mph max obviously doing the job.

What RPM at 55mph? just curious as to what people get.

 

[Neilj]

I used to have a euro4 2.3 120bhp on 15inch wheels. Now I have a euro6 130bhp on 16 inch wheels and get 5mpg less and like many have to change down on hills. My take on this conversation is that over 90% of fiat vans come out of the factory on 15inch wheels and this is what the gearbox and final drive were designed for. Dealers and moho owners love to specify 16inch alloys (vanity wheels actually) but the rolling circumference of these is 9% greater than 15inch wheels. Nobody designs a gearbox and final drive with the expectation that owners will add 9% to the final ratio. Hence the problem. Personally I would love to get my hands on an old set of 15inch wheels and try them for 1000 miles just to test the difference.

 

[gus-lopez]

What is wrong is that you shouldn't have to be changing down so regularly. In my situation I would expect that as in my last van I could do most motorway driving without hardly ever changing down.

There is nothing worse than having to change gears continually on a motorway. Years ago I used to have a 1400 escort van that could detect a 1" rise over 10 miles & you'd have to change down in to 4th. horrendous thing.

About the optimal rpm for good torque and economy

I think my range on the transit is marked on the tacho?

why would you ? Defeats the object of having 6 gears really if the answer is to drive in 5th everywhere

You're in spain, no spaniard uses any of them 4th ,5th, 6th ,.etc gears unless on an autovia.Most wander along here in 3rd at 80kph. Neighbour with 2 x alfas rarely sees 5th or 6th except on autovia.

. I assume Fiat set the gear ratios to achieve better fuel consumption and emissions

Yes they do,the same as VW did & got slaughtered for.Use a giant 6th gear for low emissions that isn't a feasible gear when in the real world.

I suppose if that future ever materialised one could always reset the ecu back to its default setting.

Exactly ! & no different to what VW was doing & got fined for? That is all they were doing complying with the regulations that the emissions had to be below xxx when tested.
No one said they had to be the same on the road? & that is what many do in germany , France & here in spain , including me, for the Contrôle Tecnique, TÜV or ITV, adjust, reset or remove whatever isn't homologated & replace after.

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[Fragle]

What RPM at 55mph? just curious as to what people get.

To be honest I’m not sure but will look this week when we move the van

 

[MartinandBev]

You're in spain, no spaniard uses any of them 4th ,5th, 6th ,.etc gears unless on an autovia.Most wander along here in 3rd at 80kph. Neighbour with 2 x alfas rarely sees 5th or 6th except on autovia

Lol - very true but when I’m France and Italy on the motorways you have to be ready for the next nutter to cut you up lol

 

[Fdhadi]

View attachment 628882

Looking at the above I thought the engine no’s for 130 & 150 were different.
Thought the engine no for 2.3 130bhp was F1AE3481D
Engine for 2.3 150bhp was F1AE3481E
The pictures above show them as the same.

 

[Jackd]

Looking at the above I thought the engine no’s for 130 & 150 were different.
Thought the engine no for 2.3 130bhp was F1AE3481D
Engine for 2.3 150bhp was F1AE3481E
The pictures above show them as the same.

You may well be right, but the picture was to show it’s the same turbocharger.

I have just reread your post. Your right, so possibly not the same turbo. More research needed

 

[acropolis22]

I used to have a euro4 2.3 120bhp on 15inch wheels. Now I have a euro6 130bhp on 16 inch wheels and get 5mpg less and like many have to change down on hills. My take on this conversation is that over 90% of fiat vans come out of the factory on 15inch wheels and this is what the gearbox and final drive were designed for. Dealers and moho owners love to specify 16inch alloys (vanity wheels actually) but the rolling circumference of these is 9% greater than 15inch wheels. Nobody designs a gearbox and final drive with the expectation that owners will add 9% to the final ratio. Hence the problem. Personally I would love to get my hands on an old set of 15inch wheels and try them for 1000 miles just to test the difference.

I see what you are saying, but many of us, myself included, are unhappy with the hill performance despite being on standard 15 inch wheels. 16 inch wheels may make it worse, but there seems to be a problem even when on stock wheels.

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[Neilj]

I see what you are saying, but many of us, myself included, are unhappy with the hill performance despite being on standard 15 inch wheels. 16 inch wheels may make it worse, but there seems to be a problem even when on stock wheels.

I was never unhappy with the hill performance on 15inch wheels, both vans 3.5 ton. Which suggests that the euro 6 engine is simply a dog, despite the bhp figures.

 

[Folkranger]

I see what you are saying, but many of us, myself included, are unhappy with the hill performance despite being on standard 15 inch wheels. 16 inch wheels may make it worse, but there seems to be a problem even when on stock wheels.

Don't know what the tyre circumferences are but a 16" wheel has 14% more circumference than a 15" wheel.

 

[Folkranger]

I used to have a euro4 2.3 120bhp on 15inch wheels. Now I have a euro6 130bhp on 16 inch wheels and get 5mpg less and like many have to change down on hills. My take on this conversation is that over 90% of fiat vans come out of the factory on 15inch wheels and this is what the gearbox and final drive were designed for. Dealers and moho owners love to specify 16inch alloys (vanity wheels actually) but the rolling circumference of these is 9% greater than 15inch wheels. Nobody designs a gearbox and final drive with the expectation that owners will add 9% to the final ratio. Hence the problem. Personally I would love to get my hands on an old set of 15inch wheels and try them for 1000 miles just to test the difference.

Don't know what the tyre circumferences are but a 16" wheel has 14% more circumference than a 15" wheel.

 

[Folkranger]

I was never unhappy with the hill performance on 15inch wheels, both vans 3.5 ton. Which suggests that the euro 6 engine is simply a dog, despite the bhp figures.

I was absolutely satisfied with my 2014, 2.3, 150bhp on 15" wheels but my 2017, 2.3, 150bhp on 16" wheels is well underpowered/overgeared.

 

[BusyBuilder]

Probably why my (4250kg) 2.3 130bhp on 16" wheels struggles a bit on our highland hills. The main problem we have is lots of the hills 1 in 4 or steeper have bends at the bottom making us slow down to start with.

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[Jamesh]

My transit needs to drop down on hillier routes like Devon a39, A34 m62 saddleworth moor,

But on normal motorway inclines it's happy at 62mph at 2000rpm on 16" wheels.

Perhaps for got it right for once or it has more torque???

 

[Folkranger]

Probably why my (4250kg) 2.3 130bhp on 16" wheels struggles a bit on our highland hills. The main problem we have is lots of the hills 1 in 4 or steeper have bends at the bottom making us slow down to start with.

Not surprised. My 150bhp slows down on slight motorway gradients not highland 1-4 hills.

 

[Folkranger]

Just check loads of revews for quantum tuning and although they seem to get 5 stars from the vast majority, the thing that comes through every time is if you have problems, they don't want to know.

The number of remaps having problems is between 5% on Trust pilot, 7.5% on Google and something like 20% on Facebook. Ignoring Facebook the odds still seem too high to risk anything with Quantum.

 

[IRHP]

View attachment 628882

Odd, because Fiat say they are different turbos.

 

[acropolis22]

Odd, because Fiat say they are different turbos.

Looks like the 150 and 180 are the same? Can't quite make it out.

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[acropolis22]

Update. As promised, reporting back with my impressions of the effect of my remap. First day of our trip to Scotland. Left Bury, headed down M66, then East on M62. Several long uphill drags before reaching Halifax. Stormed up in 6th, whereas previously I would have been dropping to 4th and holding up HGVs . Distinct improvement, I'm happy to say. Better than I expected.

 

[Fdhadi]

Found this.

Ducato Conversion Engine - Fiat Professional Islanda

www.fiatprofessional.is

Definitely different Turbo on 130 & 150hp engines.

 

[Guigsy]

It used to be that the 120 got a fixed turbo and the 150 got a variable gain vane turbo.

I'm not sure an MOT emissions test would ever show a difference with a remap as they don't put the engine under load.

 

[dunnah01]

Don't know what the tyre circumferences are but a 16" wheel has 14% more circumference than a 15" wheel.

A typical 215/70-15 tyre has a 9% smaller circumference than a 225/75-16 tyre.

 

[Pausim]

I'm not sure an MOT emissions test would ever show a difference with a remap as they don't put the engine under load.

I expect you are right, it would probably be easier to just check the ECU for non compliant configuration. Who knows what the future holds.

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[Folkranger]

A typical 215/70-15 tyre has a 9% smaller circumference than a 225/75-16 tyre.

Quite right. I confused my circumference with the area calculation. My apologies for dud info.