Stopped by the police

[Madcaravanner]

Which documents did you have checked? I didn't know we were required to carry any.

You are SUPPOSED to carry your
Driving Licence
Insurance
V5

if you do not you can be expect to take them to a Police Station of your choice within 7 days (but don't be a plonka and say Penzance when you live in North Yorkshire as that's the station you will be expected to attend

 

[Tony50]

​

What Is A Criminal Offence?​

A criminal offence is an act or action that is punishable by law. As speeding is punishable by law with fines, penalty points and driving bans, it is a criminal offence to speed. If caught speeding drivers can face hefty fines and penalty points on their licence after being issued with a notice of intended prosecution setting out the speeding offence code. Speeding offence codes for speeding range from SP10 – SP50 as outlined below.


Is Speeding A Criminal Offence? A Definitive Answer
https://www.motordefencelawyers.co.uk/motoring-advice/is-speeding-a-criminal-offence/
Is speeding a criminal office? Yes, speeding is a criminal offence that is punishable by law. If caught speeding on public roads, drivers will be issued an SP30 or SP50 penalty code by the police and they can face a maximum £1000 fine if on a road and £2500 if on a motorway and 6 penalty points on their licence. Drivers can also be disqualified from driving in the most serious cases of speeding or as a result of accumulating 12 penalty points (a “totting up” disqualification).

It seems that it is a Criminal offence and a record is kept for x period of time

As speeding is a criminal offence That's why probably why 90% of crimes that are " solved" in statistics that are published are speeding fines !!

 

[iandsm]

As speeding is a criminal offence That's why probably why 90% of crimes that are " solved" in statistics that are published are speeding fines !!

Speeding offences are not recordable offence for police crime recording purposes and have no impact on solved crime mounters.

There are a few non-imprisonable offences that go on a criminal record. The only motoring offences are failing to provide a preliminary breath test and tampering with a motor vehicle.

Cautions do go on a criminal record.

These motoring offences are not imprisonable and do not appear on a criminal record:

• Speeding
• Careless driving
• Construction and use offences (including using a mobile phone)
• Failing to observe traffic a sign
• Failing to provide driver details

These motoring offences are imprisonable and do appear on a criminal record:

• Drink driving
• Drug driving
• Failing to provide a breath/blood/urine specimen
• Failing to stop or report an accident
• Dangerous driving

 

[Jonno1103]

You are SUPPOSED to carry your
Driving Licence
Insurance
V5

if you do not you can be expect to take them to a Police Station of your choice within 7 days (but don't be a plonka and say Penzance when you live in North Yorkshire as that's the station you will be expected to attend.

Not strictly true.

There is no law that states you must carry any documentation with you whilst driving in the U.K., that includes your driving licence. There is no law which states that you must produce at your local police station either, the only caveat is that said documents must be for your current address... you can have all the documents in the world but if the address is out of date then that is an offence in itself.

The prosecutable offence only takes place after the 7 days has elapsed.

 

[sospan]

Not strictly true.

There is no law that states you must carry any documentation with you whilst driving in the U.K., that includes your driving licence. There is no law which states that you must produce at your local police station either, the only caveat is that said documents must be for your current address... you can have all the documents in the world but if the address is out of date then that is an offence in itself.

The prosecutable offence only takes place after the 7 days has elapsed.

The only exception to this is for fleet cars, where the insurance details may not necessarily include the persons home address or even the vehicles details.

There can be cases where fleet cars are registered to a holding or lease company instead of an employees company.

All of this can be be a real pain at the roadside because when a check is run a different vehicle keeper may come back compared to the driver or his employer. Similarly, it is not uncommon for someone to have a copy of a family member or mates company insurance certificate and presents it as being applicable to their own vehicle. In the old days it used to take a lot of checking to verify credentials.

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[Wabs]

Except the Burglar !!!

A dead burglar,,in my house

 

[Coolcats]

Not strictly true.

There is no law that states you must carry any documentation with you whilst driving in the U.K., that includes your driving licence. There is no law which states that you must produce at your local police station either, the only caveat is that said documents must be for your current address... you can have all the documents in the world but if the address is out of date then that is an offence in itself.

The prosecutable offence only takes place after the 7 days has elapsed.

PNC would state tax MOT and insurance my guess is if you show your licence and every thing else is good you may not have to go to the local station which is probably shut.

 

[cyberyacht]

Since most of this stuff is checkable online, I'd be surprised if that "produce within 7 days" happens now. The only thing I ever have in the UK with me is my driving licence.

 

[JoshnPen]

Those revolving number plates could be handy in a 'rip-off' car park. Swap back to the kosher ones as you go in and out on the public roads.

Exactly what I was thinking!

 

[Sapper520]

You are SUPPOSED to carry your
Driving Licence
Insurance
V5

if you do not you can be expect to take them to a Police Station of your choice within 7 days (but don't be a plonka and say Penzance when you live in North Yorkshire as that's the station you will be expected to attend

I’m a bit out of touch, but what I do know is that there is not one Police Station open to the public in the whole of North Somerset.

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[68c]

Dropped my motorbike going too fast at a roundabout. Mate called an ambulance, did not call the cops although they turned up anyways. Taken to hospital with a very painful shoulder, released later as only muscle bruising. A few months later found one of those producer slips in my pocket. Spoke to mate who said I was breathalysed in the ambulance but as I was on and off gas and air did not remember it. I never heard a word from the police about not producing documents in seven days. So if you get one ignore it.

 

[David and Sally]

A few months later found one of those producer slips in my pocket. . So if you get one ignore it.

No.no.no.no…see you in court.

 

[tattytony]

True. But on multi-agency operations there are Customs & Revenue, VOSA, LA waste checks, drugs squad, police checks on the vehicle, the occupants. etc
It's surprising what offences show up. Not all police vehicles have anpr.

Also Benefits agency check to see if people are claiming and working while travelling

 

[TonyEmm]

Last week we were traveling to Lincolnshire for a break in the MH on the A38 when we were flagged down by a police motorcycle and told to follow him to a service station (A51), there was a very big police set up and we were told that were concentrating on MH and caravans for spot checks, anyway to cut a long story short we had all our docs checked and were then weighed, fortunately we were fine for both axle and overall weight and actually had 250kg to spare but were told by the police that they had already had several failures that morning and that the checking of MHs and caravans will likely increase as we approach the holiday season.

I’d doubt they were just targeting caravans! More likely all catO2 trailers… (which includes caravans).

So they should! A recent conversation with a DVSA Vehicle Inspector revealed that 66% of O2 trailers have prohibitions issued after being inspected…

The photo attached is a selection I saw at a recent agricultural auction in Lincolnshire (A17).

#TowSafe4Freddie

 

[Blaydon]

Hi there. It seems many Motorhome owners complain I’d the police do spot checks, yet in another thread in this week’s round up, outlines the problem of Motorhome theft, with owners complaining that the police should be doing more. Surely, if the police/government officers do spot checks properly, the delays are short, the overloaded will be picked up, and the stolen might be found.
It would be good if spot checks are done in an educational way. Those just over axle weight should have a chance to repack without punishment. Those who have minor issues have a chance to rectify.
just a thought.

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[IanFraser]

Pro- active policing nice to hear about.

And here’s me on another thread re theft of MoHos saying not like them to try anything pro-active like checking them disappearing off abroad on ferries! Nae money to be made from that kind of pro-active policing!

 

[Northernraider]

Twenty years ago I was riding around London on my new BMW M/C complete with a new handmade set of BKS leathers when I was pulled over by a Copper on a M/C. We then had a debate as to whether I was a m/c courier working without business insurance or declaring my earnings to HMRC. I was naturally quite amused by this and asked for the justification of his assumption. Apparently, he had noticed me riding around the area quite frequently. The conversation went r round and round him trying to prove I was a courier, asking for proof of my employer and getting more and more arrogant and agitated. Myself seeking clarification on his assumption based on my appearance and frequency in the area and lack of a courier bib or dispatch bag. It came to a crunch when he demanded to inspect the contents of my motorcycle panniers. I informed him he doesn't want to do that as he will get an unpleasant surprise. Inside was my own Police gear, laptop and cap with lots of braid on the peak. Needless to say his time on traffic was fairly short after that. So indeed there is a small section of the law enforcement community that don't follow the best practice. However, most officers do respond well to unintentional or unexpected breaches of the various rules and regulations.

The responses to this thread underline why the Police, Vosa and the other agencies undertake periodic initiatives over vehicle and enforcement checks. Whilst there may be many offences recorded and warnings given, word soon gets around that there are now checks on M/C's, MH, caravans and certain other types vehicles. So it does pay dividends.

However, what is the biggest burden on Policing that takes officers away from "crime" is the amount of paperwork needed to pursue even a minor crime through the courts system. In business terms it would not make sense, the amount of hours taken to detect and record the crime, write the reports, run it via the crown prosecution services, book the court, the courts time, the defence and prosecution solicitors time. Just to see someone get a £150 fine and no real consequences. A copper may attend 12 incidents in a day which will result in several days of paper work, follow ups and reviews. Time they would prefer to be out FINING the public.

Fixed that for you

 

[TonyEmm]

The maximum gross weight may be 3500 but empty it will weigh less than that. The difference is what you can put in it. Some motorhomes the difference is not enough to be useful though. Beware of anything a salesman tells you, their priority is making a sale.

Hi there. It seems many Motorhome owners complain I’d the police do spot checks, yet in another thread in this week’s round up, outlines the problem of Motorhome theft, with owners complaining that the police should be doing more. Surely, if the police/government officers do spot checks properly, the delays are short, the overloaded will be picked up, and the stolen might be found.
It would be good if spot checks are done in an educational way. Those just over axle weight should have a chance to repack without punishment. Those who have minor issues have a chance to rectify.
just a thought.

A number of years ago (when vosa actually was VOSA), I attended a 1 day spot check in Nottinghamshire, targeting catO1 and O2 trailers.(including caravans).
Many of the issues raised were easily rectified and a lot of information was passed on regarding noseweights, axle weights and breakaway cables. It was all done in a very relaxed, informative manner. HOWEVER, there were many serious safety issues discovered, mostly with general purpose and plant trailers that resulted in immediate prohibition. These things used in this condition are death traps! I’m all in favour of spot checks!

Anyone who doubts the reasoning should Google #towsafe4freddie and/or Finlay Martin.
These 2 little kids (age 3 & 4) were both killed by runaway trailers…

I would add that on this day, there were other agencies involved too including immigration, HMRC etc… who had quite a productive day!

 

[Paul and Val]

Just a question which sadly you have not yet answered.

How do you want specialist road policing officers to spend their time. Surely their remit is the reduction of road crashes and associated injuries or deaths as well as travelling criminals?

Agencies have to decide where their resources go......most common sense is aimed at reducing death or serious injury. It’s why hospitals treat people on the potential for death first before a knee replacement. Few people die from their shed getting broken into. More people die on the roads every day. It’s a fact that speed is a high factor in road related deaths. Roads policing officers deal with road related offences first!

Getting a ticket for speeding doesn’t make you a criminal unless convicted in court. I wonder if you have the same line of argument for fire service.....how many fires do they put out sitting in their station. Why are they not out patrolling for fires.....because their time is better spent on prevention rather than putting a fire out........road casualty reduction is the same......try and improve driver behaviour reduces road crashes.

.....but it is easier just to see what you want rather than understand the practice!

In the opening line above you ask "Just a question which sadly you have not yet answered."
Well you are the first person to ask it I think. Probably because I have already made several points regarding that subject. For you especially I shall give some further examples.
Where shall we start? Motorcyclists with louder than standard exhausts spring to mind as a pet hate but first would be a point that I have made several times in the previous comments. POLICE SPEED TRAPS WHERE SPEEDING IS DANGEROUS, not where it is not dangerous.

Any idiot driving at 31mph outside a school when there are kids about deserves a ticket. At midnight it is probably very safe to drive past at 40 mph or whatever. Has anybody on this forum seen speed trap outside a school at start or finish time? I am sure that I will be told yes, but I have never seen one in over 40 years of driving.

If the traffic police focussed on aggressive driving it would be far more beneficial than just writing out tickets for so called 'offences' which have absolutely no danger to other road users or pedestrians.

With all respect the other part of you lecture it is rather a ridiculous argument. Do I think the fire brigade should put out fires? Er, yes. Do I think that limited Police resources are best used by concentrating on motorists breaking the arbitrary speed limit on open, fast stretches of road? No.

Does the above answer your question?
Have a good day
Paul

 

[Paul and Val]

I agree it is a shambles. But a government was elected that wished to defund the police. And they did so with gusto! A 20% hit to budgets is fairly devastating for any organisation. If the main component of the budget is wages that means that you lose a lot of people. There was a lot of sneering about “back office” roles but the job the civilian staff were carrying out was vital, and still had to be done. So a front line officer would end up behind a desk. Not a very bright solution.
Too early to be comforted by the recent recruiting figures. The instructive statistics are the number of serving officers who have under 4 years service. And the experience of those training and mentoring them. It takes years to acquire investigative and policing skills to be a competent detective or traffic patrol officer. The newly recruited cohort just will not be effective for a long time.
As a retired police officer I can only apologise for the appalling levels of service the public receive. My service finished long ago and I served during cycles of gross underfunding and times of plenty. Nothing compared to the decisions taken following the 2010 election. You get what you pay for.

A very fair and lucid response. I still wish that speed traps were more reasonably placed/timed but thank you.

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[Pausim]

Where shall we start? Motorcyclists with louder than standard exhausts spring to mind as a pet hate but first

You would find a lot of sympathy for that view in our village. Bury Hill on the A29 is very popular with bikers and the ones that have non standard exhausts shatter the peace of the National Park and South Downs Way when racing up the hill. The Government is about to launch a trial of noise cameras with a view to prosecuting for anti social noise nuisance. Bury Hill is one of the sites being considered, it will be interesting to see if it brings any improvements.

 

[Committed]

You are absolutely right except in the case of some PVCs , and I presume others but I only know about PVCs, to up-plate to 4250 it’s purely a paper exercise. So one day my van is safe at 3500 and then the next day it’s safe with 750kg more stuff in it just because of a bit of paper. Some rules are silly but I am very law abiding and stick to them.

We have our motorhome upgraded to 4000 and it wasn’t just a paper exercise as we had to make changes to the M/H. We always make sure we are within the right weight. Too many motorhomers are traveling over weight and many haven’t even a clue about weight. Because I am over 70 I need a C1 license and do a medical every 3 years. In 2019 I needed heart surgery and my C1 was taken off me because the M/H was over 3500 and I got it back again after surgery. So beware as there are a lot of things people do not know about.

 

[Stoosal]

In the opening line above you ask "Just a question which sadly you have not yet answered."
Well you are the first person to ask it I think. Probably because I have already made several points regarding that subject. For you especially I shall give some further examples.
Where shall we start? Motorcyclists with louder than standard exhausts spring to mind as a pet hate but first would be a point that I have made several times in the previous comments. POLICE SPEED TRAPS WHERE SPEEDING IS DANGEROUS, not where it is not dangerous.

Any idiot driving at 31mph outside a school when there are kids about deserves a ticket. At midnight it is probably very safe to drive past at 40 mph or whatever. Has anybody on this forum seen speed trap outside a school at start or finish time? I am sure that I will be told yes, but I have never seen one in over 40 years of driving.

If the traffic police focussed on aggressive driving it would be far more beneficial than just writing out tickets for so called 'offences' which have absolutely no danger to other road users or pedestrians.

With all respect the other part of you lecture it is rather a ridiculous argument. Do I think the fire brigade should put out fires? Er, yes. Do I think that limited Police resources are best used by concentrating on motorists breaking the arbitrary speed limit on open, fast stretches of road? No.

Does the above answer your question?
Have a good day
Paul

I typed a long reply but in the end I gave up.
You are, of course, absolutely correct in everything you state.

 

[mitzimad]

im all for proactive policing can the start with the stuff that really pee's everyone of i would start with hatching jumpers who dont like to join the que like the rest and push over the hatchlines at the sliproads its rife round here ive even seen a double decker bus do it on the north circular

 

[Dogstoat]

Which documents did you have checked? I didn't know we were required to carry any.

You are not.

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[gus-lopez]

Should you lose a loved one in a road crash, would you prefer a) a forensic examination of the vehicles and scene in support of eventual prosecution of the person responsible or b) the body stuffed in a bin bag, the road open as soon as possible and no further action?

B. Deads dead. If the other party is at fault I will be doing the judging .

A police officer can legally stop any vehicle at any time and ask to see driving documents, check the condition of the vehicle or deal with driving offences. T

Yes, but that doesn't include turning on a rear window sign saying" follow me". Could be any type if scum. I just stop. Want a chat ? We do it here.

The solution......the disclaimer: I am not endorsing or recommending just showing the art of the illegal possibility

Been about years. DifferentTypes as well. Pay more for the sliding metal arms rather than the rubber bands.
Problem now is obtaining yhem as most came from Russian suppliers.

and three years as far as points on your licence.

They "count" for 3 years but remain on the licence for 4 years. Same as endorsements did.

 

[Platelet]

Precisely my point, none of those would attend until scene made safe by police.

Unfortunately that is NOT the case, it used to be the case years ago that the motorway police would be on scene first, but these days with the lack of patrols ANY of the services could arrive first, make the scene as safe as possible, then treat any injured parties. The ONLY caveat to that is if there is a report of danger to life ie explosives, chemicals, weapons etc (37yrs ambulance service)

 

[Nigel P]

In the opening line above you ask "Just a question which sadly you have not yet answered."
Well you are the first person to ask it I think. Probably because I have already made several points regarding that subject. For you especially I shall give some further examples.
Where shall we start? Motorcyclists with louder than standard exhausts spring to mind as a pet hate but first would be a point that I have made several times in the previous comments. POLICE SPEED TRAPS WHERE SPEEDING IS DANGEROUS, not where it is not dangerous.

Any idiot driving at 31mph outside a school when there are kids about deserves a ticket. At midnight it is probably very safe to drive past at 40 mph or whatever. Has anybody on this forum seen speed trap outside a school at start or finish time? I am sure that I will be told yes, but I have never seen one in over 40 years of driving.

If the traffic police focussed on aggressive driving it would be far more beneficial than just writing out tickets for so called 'offences' which have absolutely no danger to other road users or pedestrians.

With all respect the other part of you lecture it is rather a ridiculous argument. Do I think the fire brigade should put out fires? Er, yes. Do I think that limited Police resources are best used by concentrating on motorists breaking the arbitrary speed limit on open, fast stretches of road? No.

Does the above answer your question?
Have a good day
Paul

The available data on speed enforcement shows that across the UK 96% of offences are detected by camera, which tends to suggest that there is relatively little police 'hands on' stuff with speeding. There will undoubtably be targetted speed checks derived from community requests, litter and speeding always seem pretty high on the agendas at parish council meetings. There are plenty of reported stories of complaints about speeding in local villages, resulting in local periodic enforcement; who do you think the main offenders are? Locals!

 

[Wack]

Similar thing happened to me approx 8 years ago on the M62 near Manchester. It was close to the Easter weekend and was set up to catch the potentially dangerous vehicles.
Delayed no more than 15 mins and no problems uncovered.
Having said that, I now avoid the M62 when heading in that direction.
Mike

That's a bit extreme , dvsa are in loads of places. I used to drive a commercial vehicle towing a trailer , been stopped loads of times as its a red flag for them but it didn't make me change my route , I've driven past dozens of their vans and not got stopped

 

[TinSte]

How much does it cost to go to a public weighbridge? Also, are there any in the Lincoln area? TIA.

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