Sleeping in one's vehicle

[wfdTamar]

Ha ha, in my post where it says itinerant I had typed the things I was called by charming English people. Suffice to say it was not 'itinerant'.

 

[tonyidle]

I agree with everything you’ve said. We always head through the tunnel when we go away. The exception to this was when had two months in Scotland earlier in the year thinking it may be a little different to England - it wasn’t. It just reinforced our view that the only way to enjoy life on the road is to travel away from the UK.

The problem is that the UK is a small country with a massive population. We simply don’t have the space to install aires, etc. France, for example, is twice the size with pretty much the same population.

The UK is approximately 243,610 sq km, France is approximately 551,500 sq km. The population of the UK is 66 million. The Population in France is 67 million.

I wish things were different and that provision could be made for independent travel but I can’t see how it can happen.

I agree with everything you say except the need for aires. I for one would be happy with the facility to inhabit the van legally for a short time (say 24h or 48h) wherever it could be legally parked. To that end street-level car parks would need a number of chargeable large spaces (number dependant on the locality). I don't believe any infrastructure or facilities are necessary - but would be a bonus (and if provided should be chargeable).

 

[tacr2man]

They (Gov) need to start by providing suitable stops for trucks first with suitable sanitary facilities, lay-bys were never designed to be used as they are today , and result in disgusting degradation of their condition .

 

[Southdowners]

I agree with everything you say except the need for aires. I for one would be happy with the facility to inhabit the van legally for a short time (say 24h or 48h) wherever it could be legally parked. To that end street-level car parks would need a number of chargeable large spaces (number dependant on the locality). I don't believe any infrastructure or facilities are necessary - but would be a bonus (and if provided should be chargeable).

I was only speaking about aires because that’s what Tamar referred to in his message. I agree with you in that all that is needed is to be able to fill and dump.

We’re in Scandinavia and here most garages allow you to dump and fill with fresh water. Some don’t allow you to dump black waste but that’s OK. In addition you get the free and paid for ‘aires’ and in a lot of large car parks there are bournes with fresh water and dump facilities.

I do still think that the UK is so overpopulated - especially in the south east, that even providing basic facilities may not be feasible.

 

[Baggydave]

Regardless of all the above we will continue to “wild camp” as long as we can. If a sign prohibits “camping” or “sleeping” we move on. We are respectful & leave no sign of having been there. Most times even litter pick on the morning walk & leave it tidier than when we came.
In 5 years we have never been fined or asked to move on.
We never usually stay longer than a single night.

Most problems I believe are caused by folk staying too long in the same place, which upsets the local population. Justifiably so I think.

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[tonyidle]

Most problems I believe are caused by folk staying too long in the same place, which upsets the local population. Justifiably so I think.

Precisely .

 

[GPW]

I do still think that the UK is so overpopulated - especially in the south east, that even providing basic facilities may not be feasible.

It's England, not Singapore .
Anywhere near a main sewage line could be added a grey and black-water dump point and fresh water goes to lots of places.

Some councils - particularly near the sea - could really clean up. Just £10 per night in Poole would probably get an easy 50 spaces full each night over the summer - that's 10 x 50 x 100 nights = £50k per annum on fees alone!, plus extra tourism.
They already almost have it - but with the 'no overnight sleeping' and 'no camping' signs.

The entire UK appears to be entirely geared toward 'don't stop (and spend your money) here', I suppose that's why most head south into France etc.

 

[gus-lopez]

As previous post. If you don't like it why don't you do something positive about it?

I always complain.Only thing they are interested in is selling and parking fine scams by the companies they use.
If you can't get roads fit to drive on ,some tarmac in the services is hardly likely.

 

[Southdowners]

It's England, not Singapore .
Anywhere near a main sewage line could be added a grey and black-water dump point and fresh water goes to lots of places.

Some councils - particularly near the sea - could really clean up. Just £10 per night in Poole would probably get an easy 50 spaces full each night over the summer - that's 10 x 50 x 100 nights = £50k per annum on fees alone!, plus extra tourism.
They already almost have it - but with the 'no overnight sleeping' and 'no camping' signs.

The entire UK appears to be entirely geared toward 'don't stop (and spend your money) here', I suppose that's why most head south into France etc.

Having lived three years in Singapore I know the difference!

I’m not suggesting that the main sewerage system isn’t available almost everywhere in the UK. What I’m saying is that the sheer level of numbers of folk wanting to use facilities would overwhelm them.

I mentioned the water and waste facilities available in Norway at garages. That’s at garages with hardly anyone using them and often no-one using them. Can you imagine the congestion at a garage in the UK if MH’s would turn up and queue to fill and dump alongside regular vehicles wanting fuel?

 

[vwalan]

It's England, not Singapore .
Anywhere near a main sewage line could be added a grey and black-water dump point and fresh water goes to lots of places.

Some councils - particularly near the sea - could really clean up. Just £10 per night in Poole would probably get an easy 50 spaces full each night over the summer - that's 10 x 50 x 100 nights = £50k per annum on fees alone!, plus extra tourism.
They already almost have it - but with the 'no overnight sleeping' and 'no camping' signs.

The entire UK appears to be entirely geared toward 'don't stop (and spend your money) here', I suppose that's why most head south into France etc.

unfortunately not all places are on the true mains drains . plus some are only on small mains drains systems . 'having worked in the sewage industry i know that quite a few smaller sewage works get killed during summer as m,homers and caravaners put their blue sewage down toilets etc.
believe me i have spent weeks pumping out works then bringing in good sewage back in to get the works going again.
would be nice to have dump stops though .
its amazing how many beachside toilet blocks etc arent on mains sewage ,only septic tanks etc ,this also can be ruined by contaminated sewage.
it really can be a problem .
i found working in the sewage industry really interesting .
also did fresh water but did have to give the trucks a real good washout inbetween.
dont want fresh water contaminating the sewage . ha ha .

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[GWAYGWAY]

unfortunately not all places are on the true mains drains . plus some are only on small mains drains systems . 'having worked in the sewage industry i know that quite a few smaller sewage works get killed during summer as m,homers and caravaners put their blue sewage down toilets etc.
believe me i have spent weeks pumping out works then bringing in good sewage back in to get the works going again.
would be nice to have dump stops though .
its amazing how many beachside toilet blocks etc arent on mains sewage ,only septic tanks etc ,this also can be ruined by contaminated sewage.
it really can be a problem .
i found working in the sewage industry really interesting .
also did fresh water but did have to give the trucks a real good washout inbetween.
dont want fresh water contaminating the sewage . ha ha .

That is true, I cannot understand why people feel they must use the terrible formaldehyde based poison in the waste tank. I haveNEVER used it and a drop of mild detergent keeps it all civilised. All the strong chemicals do nothing until they get into a sewage system where it poisons the bacteria in the digester, causing it to fail, then make it impossible to restart afterwards. These chemicals are still being sold and should not . They were for the static potties which still have to be emptied somewhere when they are full, and it goes the same places a foul smelling dead goo of biologically dead matter.

 

[GPW]

quite a few smaller sewage works get killed during summer as m,homers and caravaners put their blue sewage down toilets

That's another thing I'd do: Ban formaldehyde in all camping products.

Perhaps Jim could run a campaign on here to kick start it. They are dangerous and have no benefit in any respect, that they are still legally sold in 2019 is madness.

 

[AXO66]

So can I sleep in my van, in any random street, as long as there is no sign saying you should not?

 

[vwalan]

That's another thing I'd do: Ban formaldehyde in all camping products.

Perhaps Jim could run a campaign on here to kick start it. They are dangerous and have no benefit in any respect, that they are still legally sold in 2019 is madness.

i know we are going abit off course .but there was a year i had to empty a caravan site sewage works because folk used the toilets not the chemical toilet drop point. i had to take it about 20 miles to a lagune that later was emptied by tankers and used on fields growing daffodils etc. a special lagune not river or stream water.
not food or grass if animals ate the grass. it took weeks. to empty the works then refill with good sewage. may seem daft to many but liquids came to the lagune from all over sw uk. blood etc from slaughter houses ,milk tanker washings , other factories that had chemical waste etc . its amazing cornwall is famous for daffodils , lincoln for tulips etc but liquid waste from all over uk goes to the fields in these counties . http://adlib.everysite.co.uk/adlib/defra/content.aspx?id=000HK277ZW.0A20T2LOHFKDS2
hope that works its a bit dated but is interesting reading .
really to have toilet drops in carparks septic tanks is the way just for chemical toilets . should lots get into mains sewage systems sewage works could go down and it costs lots to fix them

 

[GPW]

So can I sleep in my van, in any random street, as long as there is no sign saying you should not?

English law is based on a system that assumes you can do what you like unless told not to.

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[GJH]

Oh I do, I ignore all of these stupid laws whenever and wherever possible.

Oh, very clever. Let's just ignore any laws we don't like because we are special
That post sums up the pig ignorant, selfish, attitude that is the main problem with the UK today.
Have it your own way. I'm sick and tired of dealing with such moronic attitudes.

 

[Baggydave]

 

[PeteH]

English law is based on a system that assumes you can do what you like unless told not to.

Whereas, Laws on Continental Europe, are (mostly) fabricated around so called "Napoleonic" Law. which assumes guilt and leaves the defence to prove otherwise.

As for Breaking law`s we dont like, Many laws have been changed by just so doing. Like the "mass trespass" of the pre-war era. Which eventually led to a change, to the chagrin of many wealthy landowners, who`s ancesters stole or where given it by some despot king. (ie; Thieves), and the albeit in some area`s (still) restricted introduction of the "right to roam". There are many outdated "rules" in British life which the "jobsworths" love to use to satisfy their own lust for power, but to the the general population are just an irritation, not being legally allowed to sleep in your vehicle is one such.

 

[42208]

Oh, very clever. Let's just ignore any laws we don't like because we are special
That post sums up the pig ignorant, selfish, attitude that is the main problem with the UK today.
Have it your own way. I'm sick and tired of dealing with such moronic attitudes.

I wouldn't let it get to you, not worth it, however, you should be aware that you rather lecturing style of response does prompt one to reply with 'wind up' replies, you see the world in black and white, there is room for a little surrounding colour me thinks

 

[Baggydave]

It’s a shame that so many threads end up along the abuse/argument route.
What happened to common sense & live & let live? Life is stressful enough for some.

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[GPW]

Oh, very clever. Let's just ignore any laws we don't like because we are special

We ARE special.

God didn't make the townhall drone more powerful than us, he put him in an office pushing paper while we explore the wonders of creation.

We ARE important, special, multi-dimensional beings, not robots and drones. I can recommend you read the Azimov inspired 'Robot-City' series (in order is best) if you want an insight into the wonders of colonies of robots:


What do you want to be remembered for by mankind - obeying all no-camping signs? Etched on your gravestone: "He never broke any parking rules, indeed he proudly upheld them!"

For PERSPECTIVE you'll notice if you take the time that the arrogant elite who run the UK don't take any notice at all of these laws, indeed they not only make them up as they go along in Brussells and London but they change, delay, twist and ignore them whenever it suits them. Not just for car parking either - they all have taxpayer funded car parks, but selling weapons to Saudi Arabia to blow kids arms off in Yemen.

Perspective is everything. Special is what we are, nothing we can do about it, however much you try.

 

[busby]

So can I sleep in my van, in any random street, as long as there is no sign saying you should not?

Why not,,BUSBY.

 

[AXO66]

Why not,,BUSBY.

No reason that i know.

We do it when appropriate.

 

[Baggydave]

Why not indeed. We do too.

 

[MyrtleGuru]

Why not indeed. We do too.

Absolutely, I have also slept on trains -- even under hedges occasionally. I hope sleeping hasn't been outlawed yet.

But, back to vehicles, I seem to remember a UK road safety campaign with adverts imploring us to take a break, have a nap, don't drive when tired, etc. We are just following the latest Health & Safety advice if challenged.

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[AXO66]

Absolutely, I have also slept on trains -- even under hedges occasionally. I hope sleeping hasn't been outlawed yet.

But, back to vehicles, I seem to remember a UK road safety campaign with adverts imploring us to take a break, have a nap, don't drive when tired, etc. We are just following the latest Health & Safety advice if challenged.

But not in your PJs and face cream.

 

[MyrtleGuru]

But not in your PJs and face cream.

One wouldn't want to risk scaring the horses

 

[RobWid]

Hi I do live in my van more than anywhere else at the mo and almost never use campsites - only once in the last year. Rarely have problems finding somewhere to park up for the night. If anything urban areas are easiest and often feel safer to me than remote rural locations. I think carefully where I park and avoid parking in front of people houses or anywhere that feels potentially sensitive. Near parks and other quiet spaces seem fine. Where possible I always ask and have never been turned away. I use pubs car parks at times, Pub stops UK is helpful, but most other pubs are fine if you ask. Just respect the locations and at least buy a drink if not food. Churches have been obliging about the use of their car parks (perhaps helps that I am a church attendee). I tend to arrive late and depart early, even if only moving about 1/4 mile before breakfast. I don’t make any noise and have good blackouts to avoid attracting attention.

Picking up water can be more of a challenge but I have friends all over the UK and often time stop overs on their drives to fill up with clean water. I’m on my own and so my water usage is low which does make it easier. But again many pubs are really obliging. Carry your own hosepipe and you never know who might offer you a fill up if you subtly include it in the conversation.

The other issue is dumping my loo but again being on my own and using cafes reduce the usage. Again I time my visits to friends who are used to me by now?. I do have manhole keys and am careful where I dump of needs be.

The real issue has been a few others spoiling it for everyone else. Those who park up and set up a campsite around their vehicle, those who make noise and aren’t considerate of others. Those who leave a mess. Sadly we all get included in the same group. Those who park up for days on end in a very public space.

So I’d just say act considerably, ask permission when ever possible. Chat to people - you’d be amazed how many will offer water, a parking space etc. It also helps when you’re challenged, and I have been only twice this last year, to be able to stay who said you could park where you are. Equally when challenged don’t be defensive just be polite and if it really does become an issue move on.

I’d add that one of those challenges was the police who simply asked a few questions and went away without any realm comment.

Rob

 

[RobWid]

Meant also to add that having a small motorhome at 5.3mtrs and as a van conversion narrower than many does make it much easier to fit into parking spaces - width wise as well and length and so be less noticeable. My height at 3mtrs isn’t as helpful in that respect although does making living in it more pleasant.

 

[Baggydave]

Hi. Well we are very very visible & obviously a camper. We are a converted disabled (wife is disabled) bus & tag axel . Big green stripe both sides & blue spots too?. Our kids think it’s a hippy bus & are quite embarrassed by it. ???
However that’s us. It’s our fun time.

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