Should we travel abroad in the motorhome.

[jacksmith]

We have just come back from a week in the Netherlands and we stopped over twice in Belgium. The remoter Aires were mostly empty and even the Aire we normally cannot get into even in March (at Alblasserdam, near the Kinderdijk World Heritage windmills site) was less than 50% full. Relatively few motorhomes and caravans on the road and on the ferries, but no problems at all. Personally I feel that Motorhomes are very safe self-contained family living units and I would happily self-isolate in mine in a pandemic. Ferries will always run for freight anyway so unless isolating for two weeks on your return would be a problem then why not go for it?

 

[The Wino]

Its an example of how flawed our data collection is. To speculate on the excess deaths:- some will almost certainly be where diagnosis or treatment have been disrupted or refused

Exactly what I just said!. Did you read it?

 

[jongood]

I did and been back and rdad it again. I'm questioning the reliability of assigning excess deaths to covid. That's not how your thread appears to me.

 

[jacksmith]

Excess deaths is the measure of all deaths whatever cause. As the previous poster said unless you think there a lot more busses running over people this year it shows the likely effect of covid both directly and due to its effect on people dying more of other things due to resources being directed at covid.

There is anecdotal evidence that the suicide rates in the UK have gone through the roof, in all age groups and especially teenagers and the young. Certainly calls to mental health helplines have gone up by 200%. Add to this the excess deaths caused by people not going to the doctor or A and E with the likes of chest pains, infections or unexplained growths due to fear of covid or wanting to protect the NHS, leading to a decline in URGENT cancer referrals of 75%, and you can see why many of the excess deaths might be caused by the lockdown and the fear it generates rather than the disease itself. So I would say it is really important to get out and enjoy the sunshine and freedom whilst you can- if you are reasonably careful you have nothing to fear but fear itself.

 

[The Wino]

There is anecdotal evidence that the suicide rates in the UK have gone through the roof, in all age groups and especially teenagers and the young. Certainly calls to mental health helplines have gone up by 200%. Add to this the excess deaths caused by people not going to the doctor or A and E with the likes of chest pains, infections or unexplained growths due to fear of covid or wanting to protect the NHS, leading to a decline in URGENT cancer referrals of 75%, and you can see why many of the excess deaths might be caused by the lockdown and the fear it generates rather than the disease itself. So I would say it is really important to get out and enjoy the sunshine and freedom whilst you can- if you are reasonably careful you have nothing to fear but fear itself.

Suicide deaths are typically 7000 a year if they went up by 200%over the whole of the lockdown period it would account for very few of the excess deaths also don't you think there would be similar rises in that and other deaths in other countries in lockdown especially in countries with a stronger lockdown than us. If lockdown was the cause of excess deaths surely we would be better off than Spain France Germany and NZ where the lockdown has been stricter.

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[Wellington]

We’re already here, and it’s quiet but lovely. You can do everything outside, so risks are much lower, people are all masking up inside (or if places are crowded) with cheerful equanimity, and not all this tosh about government control. In small shops people queue outside and go in one at a time, in larger places quotas are in place to ensure they are not overcrowded. It’s very matter of fact, and seems to be working well. I am very comfortable here.

 

[jacksmith]

This is probably not the place for a covid statistics p***ing contest. There are no doubt many factors involved in the Uk figures. For example, the 20,000 care home deaths. Some of the excess deaths caused by the lockdown are people who do not even know they are ill yet because their health screening was cancelled. That could yet be you or I. The lockdown was necessary to stop the spread of Covid, and maybe came too late, I agree. All I am saying is, life is short. Follow government advice and take care but don't let fear rule your life. This virus is a control freak's paradise. Everyone is just making up new rules out of fear. Yesterday one of my family was sent home from work on leave for 14 days because she visited a hospital A and E. Last week my wife's leg wax was cancelled because we have been to Belgium. What's that all about?

 

[Barclaybasher]

How is social distancing managed between the vehicle deck and the cabins? Are they taking more time to transfer us to and from the vehicles so the staircases are less crowded?

Not last night or this morning on the ferry to Palma. Not easy walking down without holding the handrail either. Didn't bother me or anyone else it seemed.... and we had to stand on the staircase for about 5 minutes while someone figured out how to open the door to the deck.....nobody sneezed or coughed though.

The boat deck I was on was only a quarter full - why do they still then make you park inches from each other?

 

[BuilderBob]

Just back from Venice, Como, Freiburg and various in France,

Go, we saw no problems, be sensible, wear a mask and enjoy.

 

[mb567]

We came over on the P&O ferry to Calais yesterday. Was quite full, no system for unloading deck by deck, inside seating areas were cordoned off for social distancing, outdoor seating areas were not. At disembarkation everyone went to their cars at the same time including queuing at the stairwells to squeeze between the trucks. A few game staff members were telling people to put their masks back on, probably 90% mask compliance from what I saw. Plenty of sanitiser everywhere.

Have felt very safe in France though, plenty of restaurants and cafes have set up outdoor seating to tempt people back so there seems hardly any reason to ever go indoors other than the supermarket.

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[Rachelc]

I'm currently sitting in a municipal campsite in Bayeux, all fine here at the moment. I would happily spend my money in the UK, problem is that being a small island, it is rather overcrowded and there is a lack of campsites / parking for motorhomes. Good luck with your decision and go for it. With precautions all will be fine.

 

[jollyrodger]

Brother planning a trip for this month (12th--) regretfully I'll be sitting this one out as I'm committed to another project

I'll follow him on polarsteps

 

[Hellski]

Brother planning a trip for this month (12th--) regretfully I'll be sitting this one out as I'm committed to another project
View attachment 412403
I'll follow him on polarsteps

What a fantastic trip your brother has planned

How long as he allocated or does he not have a fixed plan and is his ploarsteps private or would we also be able to follow?

 

[mid4did]

What a fantastic trip your brother has planned

How long as he allocated or does he not have a fixed plan and is his ploarsteps private or would we also be able to follow?

It's a provisional plan at the moment.I'm hoping to be able to go the opposite way from the last times.Heading up through norway 1st.Cutting out sweden,not sure about border crossings to and from there so possibly coming back down through finland as the beer would have run out by the time we get as far north as we want to go..I'll put it on polarsteps if it happens.No time table both retired just steady plodding.

 

[jollyrodger]

Not fixed as yet hes still planning each poss stop ,and checking to see plan B options
We had planned on meeting up, him up from Spain and me up from Devon. To December time.
But now giving Sweden a miss.
You can download PS for free then send a request to follow
Our trip/route last year:

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[jollyrodger]

I Posted too late Pete
If you go up through Denmark/Norway dont forget the border shop for the cheap beer or lidl of course

 

[mid4did]

I Posted too late Pete
If you go up through Denmark/Norway dont forget the border shop for the cheap beer or lidl of course

Thats why finlands on the route mike

 

[anniej]

I have just cancelled our booking for 26th August as we felt that having to prebook visits to places of interest would be such a hassle. We were visiting Belgium and Holland for one month. We're both over 70 and don't need the worry. The shuttle have offered a voucher which lasts for one year which God willing we will use next year. We paid for the trip using Tesco points and that doesn't seem to make a difference.

 

[scousebird]

I have just cancelled our booking for 26th August as we felt that having to prebook visits to places of interest would be such a hassle. We were visiting Belgium and Holland for one month. We're both over 70 and don't need the worry. The shuttle have offered a voucher which lasts for one year which God willing we will use next year. We paid for the trip using Tesco points and that doesn't seem to make a difference.

We did the same with 2 tickets we should have used at Easter and in May. At least they are in the bag for next year.

 

[denisejoe]

We did the same with 2 tickets we should have used at Easter and in May. At least they are in the bag for next year.

Same here. Both Eurotunnel and Brittany Ferries.

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[leggings]

We gave been travelling in the UK since the 4th July using sites and cl/cs.
The ferry is booked Dover to Calais 21st August.
Should we go or should we stay.
Not even sure we could get bookings in the UK now.
The other choice is france turn left or turn right i.e or or stick to . We really are unsure. Don't need to be back into the UK till the end of October.

As usual we have driven from Amsterdam to Denmark always lovely summer weather here. Good safe bathing lovely beaches and little sign of coronavirus. The British have become an impoverished people too much wealth in the hands of too few.

 

[1ten]

We have the opposite question. We are booked to come to the UK next week and travel up to Scotland to see the MIL who has been alone in her flat since it started. We'll be in our bubble that is the MH and feel relatively safe but the concern is that the UK or Scots gov bring some new rule that makes it all a waste of time and money.

sounds like you have a great excuse to avoid the MIL! Avoid Scotland at all costs, men in skirts and a crankie running the country. Just head south for better food and great wine.

 

[Mike Rivers]

Don’t hesitate. You’re safer abroad in any event. Seriously, go while you can. No one knows what’s round the corner so seize your opportunity with both hands.

 

[Jagtazman]

Brother planning a trip for this month (12th--) regretfully I'll be sitting this one out as I'm committed to another project
View attachment 412403
I'll follow him on polarsteps

Does he had a blog to follow as this is the exact route we are planning in a few years. Be intetested to follow his travels

 

[Chris CM]

If the Goverment change their "No Travel Advisory" for Spain we will be off, via Rosoff ASAP, down to our apartment in Southern Andalusia. A question for any insurance buffs, once over there, in Spain or France, can the insurance companies then void your insurance if the Government performs yet another U turn Travel Advisory and would they then expect you to turn tail and return back to the "safety" of Blighty?

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[jollyrodger]

Does he had a blog to follow as this is the exact route we are planning in a few years. Be intetested to follow his travels

Usually a daily/regular (when signal allows) post up on Polarsteps with photos route tracker etc.
Leftlegger on this forum

Polarsteps free to download and use from app store.
I use android I believe Pete has ifone but not sure on that one.

He's still in the planning stage at the moment re checking everything.

And of course the big question of Borders in the present pandemic crisis.
Gutted not to be going but other commitments that I'm behind on.

 

[BRND]

Excess deaths is the measure of all deaths whatever cause. As the previous poster said unless you think there a lot more busses running over people this year it shows the likely effect of covid both directly and due to its effect on people dying more of other things due to resources being directed at covid. Now if you're a covid doubter you might say its due to more of those related deaths until you realise that other countries where they had stricter lockdown have less excess deaths.
Exces deaths should be fairly reliable unless you look at countries that might forget to count a few (maybe Russia etc) I don't think anyone would expect under counting of deaths in western civilised countries.

And currently excess deaths are less than the previous five year average. Oh and by the way the ONS death statistics are taken from the death certificate which the Doctor will complete so will not record Covid if you had had it previously but will record Covid if the doctor thinks it maybe a contributing factor at time of death, I think up to three causes can be recorded. He may put it down as a possible cause even without a test.

 

[Woofer wills]

We have just come back from France after doing Plymouth Roscoff travelling and stopping all the way East to Alsace then up around Champagne area to the coast and back via Caen Portsmouth. French very Friendly and seeing the French are on holiday then it wasn't too busy either. Never felt insecure and the Ferries were very well organised and plenty of room. I think you need to try it we are glad we did.

 

[madroy]

Just returned from dordogne Valley beautiful not many about if you keep away from big towns.

 

[The Wino]

And currently excess deaths are less than the previous five year average. Oh and by the way the ONS death statistics are taken from the death certificate which the Doctor will complete so will not record Covid if you had had it previously but will record Covid if the doctor thinks it maybe a contributing factor at time of death, I think up to three causes can be recorded. He may put it down as a possible cause even without a test.

Exactly why the excess deaths show the truer figure as the medical officer said deaths due to covid directly and due to other causes maybe linked to less care for other conditions.
I think most developed countries count deaths as deaths so comparing figures gives a good idea how the various countries have acted. I for instance it was a total hoax countries like Sweden would do really well compared to the other Nordic countries with stronger measures as they would see excess deaths from other causes due to overreacting on covid.
If we have just had a lot of excess deaths you would expect a lower than average rate for a while after as some of the"low hanging fruit"as someone else described the elderly have been harvested by the grim reaper.

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