Rumours about dropping C1 test

[Googlebot]

I keep hearing rumours about C1 being dropped from the licence requirement.

This would mean Lucy can also drive up to 7.5t so we can uprate our van so that we aren’t struggling all the time to stay under the legal limits.

This in my view is great news for those of us with families who always struggle with weight.

Has anyone heard anything concrete or have any more information about the change?

I also need to find someone who can possibly do the uprating.

 

[Googlebot]

Well the consultation has been published.

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/1161186/driving-licensing-review-summary-responses.pdf

It is broadly supportive of the changes to drop C1 requirements.

Fingers crossed.

 

[Guigsy]

Will there be any licencing issues with the EU? Are drivers being gifted the licence to drive 7.5t, or is the 3.5t limit being shifted to 7.5t. It might make a difference when abroad.

 

[VXman]

Will there be any licencing issues with the EU? Are drivers being gifted the licence to drive 7.5t, or is the 3.5t limit being shifted to 7.5t. It might make a difference when abroad.

What is the current law in EU for driving different weight vehicles? Is there a 3.5 threshold?

 

[Lenny HB]

What is the current law in EU for driving different weight vehicles? Is there a 3.5 threshold?

Yes, we adopted their policy in 1997.
Germany has grandfather rights like us.Portugal I think if you passed your test in the 70`s you can drive up to 4250kg on a B licence.

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[Gellyneck]

What is the current law in EU for driving different weight vehicles? Is there a 3.5 threshold?

Are they not just the same as on current UK licence? Grandfather rights excluded?

 

[Soycd]

I keep hearing rumours about C1 being dropped from the licence requirement.

This would mean Lucy can also drive up to 7.5t so we can uprate our van so that we aren’t struggling all the time to stay under the legal limits.

This in my view is great news for those of us with families who always struggle with weight.

Has anyone heard anything concrete or have any more information about the change?

I also need to find someone who can possibly do the uprating.

It might be well and good for the UK to do that, but what might happen if the EU countries don't do the same. Could be interesting going abroad. Legal in UK but illegal in Europe?

 

[Gellyneck]

It might be well and good for the UK to do that, but what might happen if the EU countries don't do the same. Could be interesting going abroad. Legal in UK but illegal in Europe?

Do foreign countries, including UK, not recognise the drivers origin country's driving rights?

 

[Minxy]

It might be well and good for the UK to do that, but what might happen if the EU countries don't do the same. Could be interesting going abroad. Legal in UK but illegal in Europe?

If it's legal in the UK then should also be in the EU.

Do foreign countries, including UK, not recognise the drivers origin country's driving rights?

Yes they do

 

[enark]

It might be well and good for the UK to do that, but what might happen if the EU countries don't do the same. Could be interesting going abroad. Legal in UK but illegal in Europ

It might be well and good for the UK to do that, but what might happen if the EU countries don't do the same. Could be interesting going abroad. Legal in UK but illegal in Europe?

we already have a variation between UK and EU. Towing trailers? So somebody with only a cat B, can tow a caravan now and consequently take it to Europe.

on the other hand it’s clear that anyone that can maybe wobble on a push bike in some far off country, is allowed to drive an Uber in the UK - see that proved most days…..

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[DDJC]

It might be well and good for the UK to do that, but what might happen if the EU countries don't do the same. Could be interesting going abroad. Legal in UK but illegal in Europe?

Can't see it being a problem.
I already have: A, B1, B, BE, C1 and C1E
Mrs DDJC has AM, B1, B and BE

The UK government awarded me those licence categories either by test or because I passed before 1997. Mrs DDJC passed in 1999, so dibbed out on C1 and C1E. Europe had no say in the award of those licence categories, and it was only the Government trying to align with the EU rules that introduced the withdrawal of C1 from 1997.

And here is the salient bit. Following the harmonisation with the EU over categories in 1997, the EU has permitted thousands of >3500kg UK motorhomes to be driven by people who passed pre-1997 without a murmur. The reason is that harmonisation is about the licence categories; not the award of licence categories. And now as a non-member state, we can revert to the pre-1997 licence categories without deferring to the EU. The EU cannot tell the UK how to apply driving licence categories, because individual member states have their own driving test conditions (Latvia is considered by far the easiest in the EU, for example, while Croatia is the hardest in the world. UK is sixteenth hardest in the world)

So, unless the EU goes for complete harmonisation of driving testing, anything that UK does will be accepted. And if the EU is daft enough to go down the road of test harmonisation, it will establish millions of grandfather rights, and be extremely unpopular with the member states that currently have the easiest and the hardest tests.

 

[Jane And Rog]

What do the C1 and C tests actually cover? I see the theory tests are mainly about common sense, air brakes and tachographs.

 

[Soycd]

Can't see it being a problem.
I already have: A, B1, B, BE, C1 and C1E
Mrs DDJC has AM, B1, B and BE

The UK government awarded me those licence categories either by test or because I passed before 1997. Mrs DDJC passed in 1999, so dibbed out on C1 and C1E. Europe had no say in the award of those licence categories, and it was only the Government trying to align with the EU rules that introduced the withdrawal of C1 from 1997.

And here is the salient bit. Following the harmonisation with the EU over categories in 1997, the EU has permitted thousands of >3500kg UK motorhomes to be driven by people who passed pre-1997 without a murmur. The reason is that harmonisation is about the licence categories; not the award of licence categories. And now as a non-member state, we can revert to the pre-1997 licence categories without deferring to the EU. The EU cannot tell the UK how to apply driving licence categories, because individual member states have their own driving test conditions (Latvia is considered by far the easiest in the EU, for example, while Croatia is the hardest in the world. UK is sixteenth hardest in the world)

So, unless the EU goes for complete harmonisation of driving testing, anything that UK does will be accepted. And if the EU is daft enough to go down the road of test harmonisation, it will establish millions of grandfather rights, and be extremely unpopular with the member states that currently have the easiest and the hardest tests.

The reason I mentioned it was that even if you have passed your driving test in the UK at 17 and decide to go on holiday to France and Germany you would not be able to as the legal age for driving there is 18, regardless of where you are from or what licence you have. I just thought there might be similar problems with vehicle weight restrictions.
As a slight aside, and the other way around my kids who were brought up in Germany (BFG) could go to a pub in Germany and drink beer and wine, aged 17. When they came to residential 6th form in UK they were mighty miffed that they could not go to a pub until they were 18! Not that they could afford to have a drink much anyway.

 

[Northernraider]

Do foreign countries, including UK, not recognise the drivers origin country's driving rights?

The reason I mentioned it was that even if you have passed your driving test in the UK at 17 and decide to go on holiday to France and Germany you would not be able to as the legal age for driving there is 18, regardless of where you are from or what licence you have. I just thought there might be similar problems with vehicle weight restrictions.
As a slight aside, and the other way around my kids who were brought up in Germany (BFG) could go to a pub in Germany and drink beer and wine. When they came to residential 6th form in UK they were mighty miffed that they could not go to a pub at all!

Has that always been the case as I drove through Germany aged 17 back In 1990. France Belgium Luxembourg Germany and Holland in an old vw camper that broke down more than it went.

If it was illegal I never knew and no one told me otherwise.

 

[Soycd]

Has that always been the case as I drove through Germany aged 17 back In 1990. France Belgium Luxembourg Germany and Holland in an old vw camper that broke down more than it went.

If it was illegal I never knew and no one told me otherwise.

Criminal!!!

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[Googlebot]

The reason I mentioned it was that even if you have passed your driving test in the UK at 17 and decide to go on holiday to France and Germany you would not be able to as the legal age for driving there is 18, regardless of where you are from or what licence you have. I just thought there might be similar problems with vehicle weight restrictions.
As a slight aside, and the other way around my kids who were brought up in Germany (BFG) could go to a pub in Germany and drink beer and wine, aged 17. When they came to residential 6th form in UK they were mighty miffed that they could not go to a pub until they were 18! Not that they could afford to have a drink much anyway.

Isn’t it covered by the Vienna convention and not the EU?

 

[Soycd]

Isn’t it covered by the Vienna convention and not the EU?

I really don't know

 

[DDJC]

The reason I mentioned it was that even if you have passed your driving test in the UK at 17 and decide to go on holiday to France and Germany you would not be able to as the legal age for driving there is 18, regardless of where you are from or what licence you have. I just thought there might be similar problems with vehicle weight restrictions.

In Germany they could drive at 17 if supervised by someone with a full licence. Same in many other countries, but not France, Spain or Portugal. This kind of proves my point. Each country defines its own rules for ages and veh weights/types. It would be extremely complicated for the EU to enforce a law that restricted UK drivers on the basis of a category change.

I'm optimistic! Five new 225 tyres, a new plate, and some Angles Morts stickers and we are up to 3850kg.

 

[DDJC]

Isn’t it covered by the Vienna convention and not the EU?

Not really. Vienna agrees reciprocity between vehicle type, legalities and licence categories, but not the awarding of those categories, which includes driver testing. Testing remains the sole purview of the individual state.

 

[The Wino]

Interesting reading the actual analysis of the responses. I think a broad summary is that most believe that the need for a test should be removed, over half think it ought to be added after a period of driving after the initial car driving test, most think an additional medical isn't required.
I suspect that the politics of this are going to play a big part if it can be sold as a success of us making our own rules I can see it happening. If it got a bad press as a likely cause of increased road accidents it's got no chance. I suspect that the interest of the motorhome minority will have no influence whatsoever!
One question of course is that if they allow the removal of additional licensing do they align road tax

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[Northernraider]

I can understand them wanting medicals done on older drivers to renew c1 etc but seriously can't understand why they removed it from new drivers.

I passed my test at 17 in 1990 , I was immediately towing large 4 wheeled trailers with cars on them , drove my mum and dad's motorhomes , etc ... at 20 I was driving 7.5t curtain siders as a courier.

None of that would have been possible had the c1 category not been included on my licence.

 

[Nanniemate]

Criminal!!!

Driving offences are not criminal so he's more of a dodgy geezer

 

[Gellyneck]

Driving offences are not criminal so he's more of a dodgy geezer

You've, obviously, not seen the way he drives! It's criminal!!!!!

 

[enark]

Interesting reading the actual analysis of the responses. I think a broad summary is that most believe that the need for a test should be removed, over half think it ought to be added after a period of driving after the initial car driving test, most think an additional medical isn't required.
I suspect that the politics of this are going to play a big part if it can be sold as a success of us making our own rules I can see it happening. If it got a bad press as a likely cause of increased road accidents it's got no chance. I suspect that the interest of the motorhome minority will have no influence whatsoever!
One question of course is that if they allow the removal of additional licensing do they align road tax

Think there is significant pressure from the courier fraternity as they are struggling to recruit delivery drivers to drive 4250kg vans.

think a clause has already been allowed for electric vans as they are heavier?

 

[The Wino]

Think there is significant pressure from the courier fraternity as they are struggling to recruit delivery drivers to drive 4250kg vans.

think a clause has already been allowed for electric vans as they are heavier?

That's a big part of the assessment of the answers.

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[Lenny HB]

I can understand them wanting medicals done on older drivers to renew c1 etc but seriously can't understand why they removed it from new drivers.

But one of the stupid bits is at the moment anyone can drive a 3500kg van they then uprate it to 3850kg exactly the same van running at the same weight but you need a C1 & a medical if over 70 just to drive the same vehicle.

What has been mentioned before was to increase the B license to cover vehicles up to 4250kg. That would be more sensible as a new driver couldn't jump straight into a 7.5t truck. And on a selfish note it would satisfy over 95% of Motorhome owners.

 

[The Wino]

But one of the stupid bits is at the moment anyone can drive a 3500kg van they then uprate it to 3850kg exactly the same van running at the same weight but you need a C1 & a medical if over 70 just to drive the same vehicle.

What has been mentioned before was to increase the B license to cover vehicles up to 4250kg. That would be more sensible as a new driver couldn't jump straight into a 7.5t truck. And on a selfish note it would satisfy over 95% of Motorhome owners.

The limit has to come somewhere though. Why is 4250 more logical than 3500 or any other number?

 

[mikebeaches]

The limit has to come somewhere though. Why is 4250 more logical than 3500 or any other number?

Because a lot of commercial vans - similar in size to the ones we drive - are, or could be, plated to that sort of value, hence providing additional weight capacity/greater efficiency. So helpful to courier companies, for example.

Also, electric vans have been mentioned, and the weight of the propulsion batteries make them somewhat heavier than an equivalent ICE van.

 

[stewartwebr]

Why not just go ahead and do the C1 test? I bit the bullet a few years ago doing my C1+E to allow me tow a heavier car and went on to do my C for my heavier Motorhome, moving from 7.5t to 15t. It was amazing what I learned at the few days training, I thought I knew it all until I started the training and with the experience I already had passed both on the first attempts. Instead of waiting for possible change in the law, which may never happen, bite the bullet and do the training and test. I can say I learned a lot and actually enjoyed it.

 

[The Wino]

Because a lot of commercial vans - similar in size to the ones we drive - are, or could be, plated to that sort of value, hence providing additional weight capacity/greater efficiency. So helpful to courier companies, for example.

Also, electric vans have been mentioned, and the weight of the propulsion batteries make them somewhat heavier than an equivalent ICE van.

They're good reasons to have a Europe wide agreement. The vehicle designs are going to be at least Europe wide

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[Googlebot]

Why not just go ahead and do the C1 test? I bit the bullet a few years ago doing my C1+E to allow me tow a heavier car and went on to do my C for my heavier Motorhome, moving from 7.5t to 15t. It was amazing what I learned at the few days training, I thought I knew it all until I started the training and with the experience I already had passed both on the first attempts. Instead of waiting for possible change in the law, which may never happen, bite the bullet and do the training and test. I can say I learned a lot and actually enjoyed it.

I took the extra tests, whilst I don’t disagree that any extra training is good, the cost has to be paid somewhere. For the Motorhome that’s us, it isn’t cheap either!

Couriers also pass the cost onto us, they don’t lose the profit. It seems an easy win to save everyone money.