Remap or not - pre adblue euro 6 Fiat

[Folkranger]

Mine is a 2017 150bhp 2.3
Quite a few people with these, both on this site and elsewhere, find them either underpowered or too high geared. Mine certainly is compared to my previous 2014 150bhp Ducato which flew along motorways without the need to change down on hills.

Has anybody any experience or knowledge of remapping these particular engines? There are many companies listing them and showing expected performance figures.

 

[Guigsy]

What is the problem with changing down to 4th gear? If you have dropped below the optimum point on the power curve surely that is the most efficient thing to do. An empty van might not need to change down but we are driving heavily loaded motor homes.

Even in my small'ish van, you can't leave it in 6th with the cruise on at 60mph on the motorway without it blinking at you that you need to change down to 5th for every hill.

 

[Lenny HB]

We went from a 2014, 150 to a 2017, 150.
It did seem a bit sluggish at first but once I'd done over 10k it loosened up. It's OK on hills providing you remember to press the up button. Also we are pulling around 700kg more than we were with the 2014 van.

It's also not particularly good on fuel. I think I'm averaging about 28mpg.

If you think that is poor you must live in cloud cuckoo land we get 22 to 24mpg.
Is your 28 from the computer or brim to brim?

 

[Guigsy]

We went from a 2014, 150 to a 2017, 150.
It did seem a bit sluggish at first but once I'd done over 10k it loosened up. It's OK on hills providing you remember to press the up button. Also we are pulling around 700kg more than we were with the 2014 van.


If you think that is poor you must live in cloud cuckoo land we get 22 to 24mpg.
Is your 28 from the computer or brim to brim?

You're pulling considerably more weight that I am. It's up to 15k miles now, so it's not that it needs running in. I've not checked the mpg with brim-to-brim at the pump, but the previous van's trip gauge was pretty accurate.

I was getting better mileage in the old PVC which I used to drive at 70mph. I knew the a-class has worse aero, but I thought it'd be offset by a more efficient engine. Nope!

 

[Lenny HB]

You're pulling considerably more weight that I am. It's up to 15k miles now, so it's not that it needs running in. I've not checked the mpg with brim-to-brim at the pump, but the previous van's trip gauge was pretty accurate.

I was getting better mileage in the old PVC which I used to drive at 70mph. I knew the a-class has worse aero, but I thought it'd be offset by a more efficient engine. Nope!

I'm running around 4300kg, when it was new I was getting 26-27 but dropped after about 25000 miles.
Previous van was running around 3700kg used to get 26—28.

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[dunnah01]

That's true with chip tuners as they deliberately muck around the the signals that the ECU sent to the injectors. But ECU remaps should remain roughly as accurate as before.

From my very limited dabblings with Winols maps I've never found a map file that that attempts to change the fuel computer map.

 

[Pausim]

Even in my small'ish van, you can't leave it in 6th with the cruise on at 60mph on the motorway without it blinking at you that you need to change down to 5th for every hill.

On cruise control my Comfort-matic regularly changes down for motorway hills, it is what is needed to keep the engine running efficiently. It will be no different with a manual. The 6th gear ratio is like an overdrive, fine for level driving but not going to lug a heavy motorhome up a hill.

 

[Steve and Denise]

You're pulling considerably more weight that I am. It's up to 15k miles now, so it's not that it needs running in. I've not checked the mpg with brim-to-brim at the pump, but the previous van's trip gauge was pretty accurate.

I was getting better mileage in the old PVC which I used to drive at 70mph. I knew the a-class has worse aero, but I thought it'd be offset by a more efficient engine. Nope!

we have had 3.0ltr plus 3.0 4/5/6 later being Iveco every time we changed our van we were told the engine was 20% more efficient, what they should have said we have stifled the new engine so much it uses 20% more fuel and to rub salt in you also have to buy gallons of adblue as the new engine drinks it

 

[Landy Andy]

i would think the vans running bigger wheels and tyres must really notice the hills, made a noticable difference in mine going from 215 to 225 x 15 tyres.

 

[Guigsy]

i would think the vans running bigger wheels and tyres must really notice the hills, made a noticable difference in mine going from 215 to 225 x 15 tyres.

I did the same in the previous van. It did make a difference. But some of that was down to the tyre circumference being bigger. At an indicated 70mph I was actually doing ~67mph instead of about ~64mph before.

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[Landy Andy]

I did the same in the previous van. It did make a difference. But some of that was down to the tyre circumference being bigger. At an indicated 70mph I was actually doing ~67mph instead of about ~64mph before.

I notice a lot more gear changes, so think a remap is on the cards.

 

[Jackd]

What is the problem with changing down to 4th gear? If you have dropped below the optimum point on the power curve surely that is the most efficient thing to do. An empty van might not need to change down but we are driving heavily loaded motor homes.

On a French motorway when the speed limit is 110 or 130?
4th gear is probably in the region 85ish.
It’s not a loaded artic. It would be nice to be able to maintain 100km per hr in 5th or 6th surely?

 

[Pausim]

On a French motorway when the speed limit is 110 or 130?
4th gear is probably in the region 85ish.
It’s not a loaded artic. It would be nice to be able to maintain 100km per hr in 5th or 6th surely?

No but it is a loaded Ducato. My car has 150bhp and I expect that to maintain a high cruising speed, my motorhome is based on a 150bhp commercial van and I don’t expect the same performance. It also weighs in at 2000kg more than my car.

 

[Steve and Denise]

Modern vehicles have such tall gear ratio to keep the revs low at higher speed it stands to reason if your engine is not reving very little power is produced quite simple really.

 

[Folkranger]

What is the problem with changing down to 4th gear? If you have dropped below the optimum point on the power curve surely that is the most efficient thing to do. An empty van might not need to change down but we are driving heavily loaded motor homes.

But if it's like mine you are forever changing up and down and that on motorways. You feel the drag just before the screen says to change down, which you do and then almost straight away it tells you to change up again..... And that'swhy I should have got an automatic and let it have the hassle. But my previous enging just used to fly along. Same cc, same bhp just 3 years newer.

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[Folkranger]

I recently asked a local garage who are a Viezu approved workshop. Mine is comfortmatic and he said he wouldn't remap it for that reason.

 

[Folkranger]

My 2019 150bhp Comfortmatic trundles along nicely with a toad on the back. Sometimes can’t decide which gear it wants to be in but so did my Hymer/Mercedes auto. With such a complex bit of machinery I will stick to “if it ain’t broke don’t fix it”.

You might think differently if yours was manual and you were forever doing the changing.

 

[Folkranger]

I think the op has particular concerns about his twin egr model, it is considerably more complex than engines before or after. And wishes to know if anyone with such a beast has had it mapped, so do I.

Exactly!

 

[Jamesh]

I did the same in the previous van. It did make a difference. But some of that was down to the tyre circumference being bigger. At an indicated 70mph I was actually doing ~67mph instead of about ~64mph before.

Me too going from 235 65 16 - 245 75 16.

I have to change down sooner.

But in the plus side 1st and second aren't so ridiculously short gears when driving around town. Also I'm doing 67 mph on a 62mpg limiter! Which is 67 according to GPS!!

225 75 16 are probably the sweet spot and much cheaper tyres too.

 

[Folkranger]

I have seen companies like Celtic Tuning videos before, sods law cant find the 2.3 150BHP re-map video now, but they do use a rolling road, a 130BHP is on you tube, see below.

I think this guys re-map below, done using Quantum software offers a fair view of what to realistically expect, again he has the Fiat 130, not the 150, but worth a look, no mention of cost you may notice.
LES

Thanks Les

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[MartinandBev]

No but it is a loaded Ducato. My car has 150bhp and I expect that to maintain a high cruising speed, my motorhome is based on a 150bhp commercial van and I don’t expect the same performance. It also weighs in at 2000kg more than my car.

But not at a blink of an incline , 5th is fine but to have to drop to 4th is ridiculous surely…..

 

[Pausim]

You might think differently if yours was manual and you were forever doing the changing.

I might. The gear ratios are probably aimed at getting optimum economy and emissions in normal van usage, which unlike motorhomes probably doesn’t involve them using their full payload all the time.

 

[Guigsy]

I might. The gear ratios are probably aimed at getting optimum economy and emissions in normal van usage, which unlike motorhomes probably doesn’t involve them using their full payload all the time.

Or pushing several extra square metres of additional bluff frontal area into the wind.

 

[funflair]

Modern vehicles have such tall gear ratio to keep the revs low at higher speed it stands to reason if your engine is not reving very little power is produced quite simple really.

Which is why we all want a bit more torque

 

[Jackd]

Modern vehicles have such tall gear ratio to keep the revs low at higher speed it stands to reason if your engine is not reving very little power is produced quite simple really.

And max torque is reached at 1800 revs

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[jezport]

On my older van I had a vortex exhaust system fitted and it increased power on hills meaning I didn't have to drop gears half as much. That was with no remap. Plus I got 11% better fuel economy (real world)

 

[dunnah01]

On my older van I had a vortex exhaust system fitted and it increased power on hills meaning I didn't have to drop gears half as much. That was with no remap. Plus I got 11% better fuel economy (real world)

Prove it Max Power

 

[Steve and Denise]

And max torque is reached at 1800 revs

What RPM @ 60 mph ?

 

[jezport]

Prove it Max Power

I checked mileage over 3 years. 11% brtter economy.

 

[dunnah01]

I checked mileage over 3 years. 11% brtter economy.

Sell it to the manufacturers quick you could get very rich

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[Jackd]

What RPM @ 60 mph ?

Approximately 2000, but will report back tomorrow with the exact rpm.