rb panel van conversion begins !

[Ralph-n-Bev]

[/QUOTE] Ralph the same applies to the foil foam it needs to be warm inside the van for it to stick good [/QUOTE]

Hi Terry, I know its not the best time of year to be converting with the low temperature. You only have to spend 10 minutes in the van and the ceiling is condensating. I wish i had the luxury of a heated business unit. If I have to wait till the weather picks up then so be it. For the mean time i will just do what i can do.
Thanks for the info on the window supplier.
As always , i spent a bit of time researching but found that some suppliers do certain size windows cheaper than others and some sizes dearer than others. CAK i found were the most reasonable all round for the type and sizes i wanted.

You certainly cant knock the service at CAK, Ordered and delivered the next day. Infact Bev said they were knocking on the door at 8.45am this morning !
I hope i can get going soon as i have filled the dining room with everything , including the kitchen sink , and now started on the back room

 

[Ralph-n-Bev]

One little detail I use which may help with your electrical installation is to use domestic sink waste pipe as conduit. you can usually drill through stiffening ribs with a hole saw to put it in but with planning you can use all the available fittings (tees,elbows etc) to provide large ducts for all your wiring. It makes installing the wiring and adding stuff later much easier and provides protection for the wires from drilling and screws.

D.

Thanks Dave, i have already purchase the flexi ribbed duct on a roll in various sizes
I intend to run every cable or bunch of cables in some form of duct or oval conduit.

 

[Ralph-n-Bev]

Use a "nibbler" for the holes you have to cut, its what the motor trade use when retro fitting sun roofs and it leaves a lovely "clean" edge and drops no "bits".. It removes a 4mm wide roll of metal... The old ones used to work off a compressor, but I'm sure they will have electric ones by now.. It does do a super job..
Good luck and hats off to you !!
Mitch.

Got one . You cant beat having the right tools for the job.
I have been practicing on an old car panel, it works a treat.

 

[Terry]

Hi Ralph I just put a leccy fan heater in the back and TRY to keep doors shut as much as poss
I have two extending props if you want to borrow them ?Handy for holding the ceiling KS up until its gone off-
- ALSO USE SOME INSTANT GRAB GLUE brill stuff @£4 a tube will look up name if you want some -I know it's made by siroflex but they do 3 or 4 versions -throw all gear in van down one side and do the opposite side keeping door closed Bloody cold today
terry

 

[Terry]

Hi again Ralph I have rolls of 8 mm copper pipe and gas fittings etc don't go buying / paying through the nose -Just ask when you are ready for them I also use and have 15mm water fittings (a lot cheaper than 12 mm stuff-then use 15 mm to 12 mm reducers for water pump etc -got lots of them too It gives a better water pressure/ flow
terry

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[Ralph-n-Bev]

For the sake of your payload I hope they understand "light".

Have you considered removing the back doors and replacing with a fixed panel ?
s.

Brian , I'm supplying the furniture board for him to then do the work. He's pointed me in the right direction for good quality , strong , light weight Stuff. Bespoke as in, how I want it.
As for the back doors. I think we've had this conversation before.
It's not going to look like a bodge job , dont worry , I know you don't like them
I know ih charge £3.5k for a back panel .
I feel if it's insulated properly , the doors will be fine. We are also copying the extra Removable insulation strip , that vantage do, to match the upholstery. That goes down the Back door joins. Click on the pic and it enlarges it.

Then we also have the option of having the back doors open in the lovely sunshine. As for the bike rack , if we decide to have one, it will go on the towbar, not the back door.

 

[Jack Russel]

Our van had been a minibus and was panelled already so we put rockwool behind every panel including the roof and doors. It wasn't the horrible fibre glass stuff so it was easy to handle and stuff in.
We got a lot of things from Magnum Motorhomes in Grimsby. A bit of an Aladdin's cave for motorhomers. All the usual things, lightweight finished ply, sinks, cookers, toilets and all sorts of trims etc. Not easy place to find though.
Get ideas from and help SMBCC site.

 

[mjltigger]

Have you considered removing the back doors and replacing with a fixed panel ?

I always think they just look like a van with the back doors whereas I saw one with a fixed real and big window and it looked fantastic. You also get no draughts, better insulation, stronger real for a bike rack and potential of a nice big window.

Having seen a bike rack on a van back door twist the door like it was a bean can I'm not impressed with back doors.

Ours has the doors. The water is behind them. When I have a new MOT and I know the rust isn't terminal I plan to replace them to make them look good but stick to no Windows, then I will board across them inside to insulate but keep the ability to open them to access the water. I also plan to move the gas bottle and waste so they are accessible the same way.

Hi Ralph I just put a leccy fan heater in the back and TRY to keep doors shut as much as poss
I have two extending props if you want to borrow them ?Handy for holding the ceiling KS up until its gone off-
- ALSO USE SOME INSTANT GRAB GLUE brill stuff @£4 a tube will look up name if you want some -I know it's made by siroflex but they do 3 or 4 versions -throw all gear in van down one side and do the opposite side keeping door closed Bloody cold today
terry

That's why you're a legend.

 

[Ralph-n-Bev]

Hi Ralph I just put a leccy fan heater in the back and TRY to keep doors shut as much as poss
I have two extending props if you want to borrow them ?Handy for holding the ceiling KS up until its gone off-
- ALSO USE SOME INSTANT GRAB GLUE brill stuff @£4 a tube will look up name if you want some -I know it's made by siroflex but they do 3 or 4 versions -throw all gear in van down one side and do the opposite side keeping door closed Bloody cold today
terry

Thanks Terry i have some pretty good heaters i use at work but thought heat will just make it worse.
I may try using a quilt on the van roof to stop the heat meeting the cold surface.
Anyway the sun may shine yet

 

[Ralph-n-Bev]

Hi Ralph I just put a leccy fan heater in the back and TRY to keep doors shut as much as poss
I have two extending props if you want to borrow them ?Handy for holding the ceiling KS up until its gone off-
- ALSO USE SOME INSTANT GRAB GLUE brill stuff @£4 a tube will look up name if you want some -I know it's made by siroflex but they do 3 or 4 versions -throw all gear in van down one side and do the opposite side keeping door closed Bloody cold today
terry

Thanks Terry i have some pretty good heaters i use at work but thought heat will just make it worse. Does it not ?
I may try using a quilt on the van roof to stop the heat meeting the cold surface.
Anyway the sun may shine yet , you never know !

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[Ralph-n-Bev]

Hi again Ralph I have rolls of 8 mm copper pipe and gas fittings etc don't go buying / paying through the nose -Just ask when you are ready for them I also use and have 15mm water fittings (a lot cheaper than 12 mm stuff-then use 15 mm to 12 mm reducers for water pump etc -got lots of them too It gives a better water pressure/ flow
terry

Terry the copper pipe will come in very handy for the project... Thank you I will be in touch nearer the time.
The water pipe i already have its the John Guest type around 12mm from memory.

 

[Ralph-n-Bev]

We got a lot of things from Magnum Motorhomes in Grimsby. A bit of an Aladdin's cave for motorhomers. All the usual things, lightweight finished ply, sinks, cookers, toilets and all sorts of trims etc. Not easy place to find though.
Get ideas from and help SMBCC site.

Hi jackrussel
I did Try and join the SMBCc but found it very hard . It kept logging me out so I gave up in the end !
As for magnums, Terry very kindly pointed us in their direction. I've bought lots of little bits and bobs from them. But I've sourced all the larger items , eg cooker , fridge , sink , loo online else where.

 

[Terry]

Hi Ralph I can get the one piece panels that IH use for approx 1600

 

[Ralph-n-Bev]

Hi Ralph I can get the one piece panels that IH use for approx 1600

Thanks Terry, but we Already decided against one. I knew I could get them cheaper than the extra from ih , I'd have to have it sprayed up fitted etc. On top of that plus vat probably.
Plus I'm using the back doors to get in and out of to do the conversion. We did think of sealing off the back and not having a window , At one point, thought about lots of different combinations. But we like what we've decided on.

 

[Terry]

No probs I also like to use the back doors

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[Ralph-n-Bev]

No probs I also like to use the back doors

So its true

 

[Ralph-n-Bev]

So its true

Now....wheres my expanding foam

 

[veevee]

Weight distribution.

Although I built a MH from scratch (based on a Mercedes 609D LWB) it's about our new-ish works van and how it loads compared to the previous one.

We've used 4 Maxi Ducatos for the last 12 years, in November 2013 received our first new van from the factory. It's an L3H2 180 Maxi panel van, at 5.99m it's 40cm shorter than your van. It replaced a 2.8 JTD LWB Maxi that was 5.5m long.

Over 12 years we have delivered our product which is heavy, no that's very heavy. 100+ or so deliveries on we know how to load our van to give balance to the load to make the van ride correctly. Long ago I used to race saloon cars and paying attention to weight distribution was one of the more important points of race car building.

First time we loaded the 'new' van taking into account the longer floor area by loading the lighter items at the front, I was surprised at the noticeable nose down attitude but put that down to possibly un updated suspension design, but drove cautiously.
My first suspicions were confirmed when the front bump stops were making contact over undulations, the rest of that journey was driven with great caution. I thought at first I had made a mistake loading, so the next trip I spaced the weight backwards with strong empty containers towards the front, much better but still not right. After a third trip I knew that I had to load the van through the whole length although we are using only about half of the floor area.

My answer is to build two strong horizontal retaining bars between the 'C' pillars, load the correct amount of weight to the rear of that and the rest in the front section. We do know the weights of our products and also the maximum weight we can carry, so now it will be easy to get the right balance with everything secured correctly. When we load next we will also visit a weighbridge to confirm we have it right. We tend to travel loaded to within 150 - 200 kgs of MGW, that allows us to have a little leeway.

I've mentioned all this here as I was so surprised the extra length has made to weight distribution, especially as I knew how to load properly. Hope this little story adds info to your knowledge base.

In the last 15 months we haven't made many deliveries but they are increasing again, but still only 7500 miles from new. I think this is the best model of Ducato yet, and really enjoy driving it. Having the 3.0 ltr 180 bhp engine allows you to drive at car speeds, that has it's penalty in fuel consumption. When we travel it's over longer distances, each trip around 1500 to 1800 miles and we are not in a hurry, but have to say that even at the end of a trip it's as much of a pleasure to drive as at the start, I'm sure you will enjoy yours.

Also think your van looks really nice, and hope get a lot of enjoyment out of the build and have many adventures in it.

 

[Ralph-n-Bev]

Thankyou for taking the time to comment on the thread. It's good to see you use your van for business and are happy with it.
I'm glad you like the longer version. We have upgraded the rear suspension as an extra , on ours. We may even upgrade the vehicle pay load. Once I've finished the build I shall take it to a weigh bridge to see what's left of the pay load. We should be ok . As we are only copying existing models with 3/400kg pay loads.

Weight distribution.

Although I built a MH from scratch (based on a Mercedes 609D LWB) it's about our new-ish works van and how it loads compared to the previous one.

We've used 4 Maxi Ducatos for the last 12 years, in November 2013 received our first new van from the factory. It's an L3H2 180 Maxi panel van, at 5.99m it's 40cm shorter than your van. It replaced a 2.8 JTD LWB Maxi that was 5.5m long.

Over 12 years we have delivered our product which is heavy, no that's very heavy. 100+ or so deliveries on we know how to load our van to give balance to the load to make the van ride correctly. Long ago I used to race saloon cars and paying attention to weight distribution was one of the more important points of race car building.

First time we loaded the 'new' van taking into account the longer floor area by loading the lighter items at the front, I was surprised at the noticeable nose down attitude but put that down to possibly un updated suspension design, but drove cautiously.
My first suspicions were confirmed when the front bump stops were making contact over undulations, the rest of that journey was driven with great caution. I thought at first I had made a mistake loading, so the next trip I spaced the weight backwards with strong empty containers towards the front, much better but still not right. After a third trip I knew that I had to load the van through the whole length although we are using only about half of the floor area.

My answer is to build two strong horizontal retaining bars between the 'C' pillars, load the correct amount of weight to the rear of that and the rest in the front section. We do know the weights of our products and also the maximum weight we can carry, so now it will be easy to get the right balance with everything secured correctly. When we load next we will also visit a weighbridge to confirm we have it right. We tend to travel loaded to within 150 - 200 kgs of MGW, that allows us to have a little leeway.

I've mentioned all this here as I was so surprised the extra length has made to weight distribution, especially as I knew how to load properly. Hope this little story adds info to your knowledge base.

In the last 15 months we haven't made many deliveries but they are increasing again, but still only 7500 miles from new. I think this is the best model of Ducato yet, and really enjoy driving it. Having the 3.0 ltr 180 bhp engine allows you to drive at car speeds, that has it's penalty in fuel consumption. When we travel it's over longer distances, each trip around 1500 to 1800 miles and we are not in a hurry, but have to say that even at the end of a trip it's as much of a pleasure to drive as at the start, I'm sure you will enjoy yours.

Also think your van looks really nice, and hope get a lot of enjoyment out of the build and have many adventures in it.

 

[dave newell]

You should be ok for weight, I did a preliminary weigh on the one I'm doing a couple of weeks ago and it came in at 2560KGs although that was with no water, gas or fuel on board (well about a gallon and a half of diesel in tank) plus the kitchen was still not in then so I expect a finished weight of around 2600-2700 giving a payload of 700-800 KGs.

D.

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[Ralph-n-Bev]

That's great Dave. Is yours an extra long wheel base? I know we lose a bit being that. If we could get your figures we'd be very happy with it. Though I'm not expecting it. Going on what ih etc get. I was thinking more 500 max.

 

[Terry]

Morning Ralph -what are you doing on here you should be out insulating the van
terry

 

[dave newell]

That's great Dave. Is yours an extra long wheel base? I know we lose a bit being that. If we could get your figures we'd be very happy with it. Though I'm not expecting it. Going on what ih etc get. I was thinking more 500 max.

Just the long wheelbase Ralph. Here's a picture of the kitchen and lounge areas taken yesterday afternoon, still some edging to apply to the kitchen unit and some other finishing jobs to do but getting close now.

D.

 

[Ralph-n-Bev]

He's just this second gone out Terry.
I think he's going to put some windows in today
He's had a very restless sleep last night.
I'm off to do a day at whiterose sainsburys , sampling posh coffee. Keeping out of the way
That looks very nice Dave. I like your colour scheme and fabric too.

 

[dave newell]

I didn't choose the colours Bev (but I do like it) I inherited the job (its a long story explained in my blog on my website) and the customers chose the layout and colours. Cupboard doors are from a caravan that previous converter had stripped. Careavan did the upholstery.

D.

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[Terry]

Hi Bev -You should be keeping him supplied with copious amounts of coffee not trotting/hiding in Sainsbury's
terry

 

[Ralph-n-Bev]

I know. But I'll be home for 5 , to cook him a nice tea. I know he'll still be in there.
Who knows he may manage to get a bit done today , its forecast to be a bit warmer.
Careavan did our total refurb on the MIZAR , we are selling. But we're getting regal to do it this time, as they do the ih and we want all the extra Fabric padded bits for the roof and walls like they have.
Anyway I'm off to work. Have a good day what ever your up to.

 

[busby]

ralph & bev sounds like you're going about this the right way..i'm impressed! I wish some of the manufacturers were as thorough. neither adria or Possl (globecar/possl) insulate either the sliding or rear doors.

Look at Trigano Tribute 650 s....no insulation at all hardly. BUSBY.

 

[busby]

I know. But I'll be home for 5 , to cook him a nice tea. I know he'll still be in there.
Who knows he may manage to get a bit done today , its forecast to be a bit warmer.
Careavan did our total refurb on the MIZAR , we are selling. But we're getting regal to do it this time, as they do the ih and we want all the extra Fabric padded bits for the roof and walls like they have.
Anyway I'm off to work. Have a good day what ever your up to.

RH are brilliant.....nice friendly co. BUSBY.

 

[veevee]

Morning Dave

It wasn't weight capacity but weight distribution that surprised me. I was surprised how far rearwards I'm having to put the same load to retain a good weight balance front to rear when the van is only 40cm longer than the previous one.
Not sure how much the OP has thought about balance when planning the layout but assuming the new empty van is riding level at the moment it is easy to get the proportions of front to rear axle weights at the beginning by weighing each axle separately. On top of which all these vehicles have the maximum front and rear axle loads shown under the bonnet so it's easy enough to check as the build progresses that one end or the other the maximum weight per axle is not being exceeded.

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