Problem with Comfortmatic clutch?

[Emmit]

It means either .

When we describe something as biannual, we can mean either that it occurs twice a year or that it occurs once every two years.

Biannual means twice a year.
Biennial means once every two years.

Just sayin' (No G!)

 

[TheLifeofBrian]

If it uses the same clutch, flywheel and gearbox as the manual, doesn’t the plastic bits come apart on the manual clutch also?

Apparently yes they do but with a manual clutch they just get broken up & drop to the bottom of the bellhousing.
With the cbox all the various 'safety' checks throw up faults that give the same 'gear not available' message & stop it working.
I personally think that is why there are so many answers to the problem, once the cbox is reset through whatever method - software, disconnecting battery etc it works as normal until another piece breaks off & it all starts again!
I had about seven pieces break off & there were still loads to go...
There is a massive forum on a Dutch site who are trying to take FIAT to court over it.
https://www.nkcforum.nl/topic/5-probleem-met-automaat-fiat-ducato-uit-2017/
Also a German site if you like a long read!:
https://www.kastenwagenforum.de/for...ential-zur-katastrophe-und-praevention.36687/
The worst part is many of the clutches are replaced under warranty or at customers expense with the same LOC clutchplate!

 

[TheLifeofBrian]

Perhaps they also do with the manual clutch, except there aren't similar sensors reporting to the ECU that operates the clutch hydraulics and the gear actuators.

I completely agree!
If anyone has the problem arise a quick BODGE that helped me was:
Turn ignition on, foot on brake then select neutral.
Start the engine & IMMEDIATELY put it into gear - with a crunch I might add!
Drive off!
After being stuck on a cliff in Wales for 4 days that worked for me & I drove over 100 miles home (very tentatively I have to say!)

 

[TheBig1]

The thing with motorhomes is they tend to do small annual mileage and as a percentage of vehicles compared to those on the same chassis used elsewhere is very small too. I know of a few minibus firms that got rid of their comfortmatic equipped fleets due to issues. Worse than that NHS ambulance authorities have also done the same. Those garages always had one or more of their fleet off the road with gearbox issues at any given time.
The design is at fault, with 2 fluid systems involved. The clutch fluid in the bottom cylinder of the brake master cylinder makes it hard to change. The fluid is hydroscopic and absorbs water from a damp environment and any contamination settles too the bottom when the vehicle is idle. Then there is a semi sealed hydraulic system for the the gearbox actuation. As I understand it, the valve between the two is prone to leaking over time contaminating the hydraulic fluid.
At 10 years old, my motorhome had never had the hydraulic fluid renewed. It was not on the service schedule, so not surprising. When I had the first failure, the fluid was described as like treacle, so not surprising it wasn't working as intended. The slave cylinder then let go and dumped fluid all over the clutch destroying it.

The second failure under a year later was put down to a failure to bleed the clutch properly so covered under warranty

 

[TheLifeofBrian]

The thing with motorhomes is they tend to do small annual mileage and as a percentage of vehicles compared to those on the same chassis used elsewhere is very small too. I know of a few minibus firms that got rid of their comfortmatic equipped fleets due to issues. Worse than that NHS ambulance authorities have also done the same. Those garages always had one or more of their fleet off the road with gearbox issues at any given time.
The design is at fault, with 2 fluid systems involved. The clutch fluid in the bottom cylinder of the brake master cylinder makes it hard to change. The fluid is hydroscopic and absorbs water from a damp environment and any contamination settles too the bottom when the vehicle is idle. Then there is a semi sealed hydraulic system for the the gearbox actuation. As I understand it, the valve between the two is prone to leaking over time contaminating the hydraulic fluid.
At 10 years old, my motorhome had never had the hydraulic fluid renewed. It was not on the service schedule, so not surprising. When I had the first failure, the fluid was described as like treacle, so not surprising it wasn't working as intended. The slave cylinder then let go and dumped fluid all over the clutch destroying it.

The second failure under a year later was put down to a failure to bleed the clutch properly so covered under warranty

I have to say personally I don't think this is as important as the clutchplate - as you say several thousand vehicles are driving around that have never had the fluid changed but I would like to see any old clutchplates taken out to see if the plastic parts are broken.
It would appear that they have to get quite hot to break in the first place (we had just spent 2 weeks in Scotland up hill & down Dale when ours first played up)
A the end of the day we can only take every precaution we can & cross our fingers!

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[Morning Major]

Biannual means twice a year.
Biennial means once every two years.

Just sayin' (No G!)

Now i am not sure what bisexual means.

 

[Colin McCourt]

Blimey, what sort of mileage would necessitate changing the oil at least twice a year?

Bi-annual can mean twice per year or once every two years. The vagaries of the English language.

 

[Emmit]

Now i am not sure what bisexual means.

Ask your 'feminine' side.

 

[Morning Major]

I did and she said it means twice a year

 

[WESTY66]

I did and she said it means twice a year

Could be worse, could be every two years

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[Capitanjohn]

My friends was playing up because the hab door was not closing properly it was only on the third Fiat main dealer who spotted it. He had quotes up to 8k to fix it.

 

[Mr David]

I've had 2 years of problems with the 'cbox'.

I found the main problem was the plastic spring covers on the clutch plate breaking off & causing the computer to think there was a fault.
We replaced the clutch plate with one without plastic spring covers & it seems ok now.
You need Multiecuscan to reset faults & reset the parameters on the gearbox.
A quick test for the hydraulic pump (another common fault) is to open the driver's door after several hours & get someone to listen under the bonnet to see if they can hear the pump running. Also look to see if the hydraulic fluid in the clutch reservoir drops when the pump is run - it should return to normal level after a few hours.
If you search my name you should find endless posts about this!
Pm me if u want to speak & I'll give u my phone number.
Cheers Chris



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Thank you for that post and your subsequent post 62. I have just contacted the engineer that is investigating my Comfortmatic problem and emailed a link to this thread and your posts 58 and 62. He found the information I conveyed to him on the phone very intriguing and will follow up on it.
Thank you again for your input.

 

[AG 2602]

Could be worse, could be every two years

Or a 100,000 miles!!

 

[TheLifeofBrian]

Thank you for that post and your subsequent post 62. I have just contacted the engineer that is investigating my Comfortmatic problem and emailed a link to this thread and your posts 58 and 62. He found the information I conveyed to him on the phone very intriguing and will follow up on it.
Thank you again for your input

Hope it helps!
At least your motorhome is in a garage - we were stuck on a cliff once in Weymouth and once in Wales by Tywyn
both with spectacular views but absolutely no way of getting a recovery lorry there to pick a 7.3m motorhome up!
Hence I did a lot of research....

 

[TheBig1]

I have to say personally I don't think this is as important as the clutchplate - as you say several thousand vehicles are driving around that have never had the fluid changed but I would like to see any old clutchplates taken out to see if the plastic parts are broken.
It would appear that they have to get quite hot to break in the first place (we had just spent 2 weeks in Scotland up hill & down Dale when ours first played up)
A the end of the day we can only take every precaution we can & cross our fingers!

on a previous manual 3 litre, the clutch exploded and the garage suggested that was caused by one of the plastic lugs failing. I have searched but can't find the photos I took of the parts of the clutch plate recovered from inside the housing. I mentioned that I had never seen one grenade on any normal vehicle before. The mechanic said he saw fiats and ivecos regularly with the same. The clutch is under sized for the amount of stress put on it by a powerful engine and heavy load

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[Minxy]

We never even had a problem with ours but the number of issues with comformatic clutch/computer problems mean't We could not enjoy our travels with the unreliability. Like you we sold asap.

The only difference is the actual clutch electronics which tells the vehicle when to change gear instead of you using your left foot and the gear lever, the actual clutch mechanical bits are the same for manual and autos.

You do of course realise the manual box has the slave cylinder in exactly the same place??

Yup, everything is the same as I mentioned above so it can affect manuals as well as autos, it's just we hear of the issue more when it affects autos.

I read your post quite carefully enough. As you say you are 'fed up reading about the problems with Comfortmatics', it mystifies me as to why you were reading this thread in the first place.

I'm also fed up a bit and would love to hear how many manuals also have issues, people just don't appear to be as bothered about mentioning them.

 

[WESTY66]

The only difference is the actual clutch electronics which tells the vehicle when to change gear instead of you using your left foot and the gear lever, the actual clutch mechanical bits are the same for manual and autos.


Yup, everything is the same as I mentioned above so it can affect manuals as well as autos, it's just we hear of the issue more when it affects autos.


I'm also fed up a bit and would love to hear how many manuals also have issues, people just don't appear to be as bothered about mentioning them.

Theres a few clutch pedals dropped to the floor on here and via a relative who works for a fiat approved dealer out there in the real world
It’s not enough to compare but it does happen

 

[gus-lopez]

the plastic spring covers on the clutch plate breaking off & causing the computer to think there was a fault.

whoever thought that putting plastic parts in the clutch was a good idea wants horsewhipping

If it uses the same clutch, flywheel and gearbox as the manual, doesn’t the plastic bits come apart on the manual clutch also?

& as said just lay in the bottom of the bell housing.

Theres a few clutch pedals dropped to the floor on here and via a relative who works for a fiat approved dealer out there in the real world
It’s not enough to compare but it does happen

Yes but the vehicle is still drivable by starting in gear & double declutching.

 

[dggriff]

Theres a few clutch pedals dropped to the floor on here and via a relative who works for a fiat approved dealer out there in the real world
It’s not enough to compare but it does happen

My last Ducato, a 2007 2.8 Hymer manual, had a slave cylinder failure. No clutch at all, just pedal to the floor. However it did recover once it cooled down And I could change gear. I had it fixed as soon as I could after that.

 

[Chris RJ]

A couple of weeks ago our motorhome suffered apparent clutch failure with inability to select any gear either in auto or manual mode. My last understanding from the repair garage is that the computer diagnostics doesn't indicate where the problem is but still the system says transmission failure and with no gear selection possible. Competent Fiat Comfortmatic engineers are rather thin on the ground here in Slovenia but I believe and hope that the garage looking into this problem are doing their best to understand the system through their various trade contacts. (They are an independent large truck maintenance company)
Please has anyone else had a similar problem with apparent clutch failure with contradictory computer diagnostics. Or can anyone suggest what could be causing this problem. Thanks in advance.

What

Bi-annually means twice a year. I did think Les probably meant every 2 years. Apologies if I sounded a bit flippant.

what Dave and sally said happened to me waited 15. Minutes turn on engine and away we went touch wood hasn’t happened again over a year and half now keep touching wood. C j

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[Clive G]

I have just had my clutch fluid changed in my Comformatic gearbox and and the Kiss point (whatever that is) relearned. The work was carried out by the experts at Adams Morey in Portsmouth and the total cost was £135.55. Amazingly cheap for an A class Hymer with lots of stuff in the way. At that price changing it every 2 years is a no brainer compared with the cost of repairing it if it goes wrong.

 

[Clive G]

I have just had my clutch fluid changed in my Comformatic gearbox and and the Kiss point (whatever that is) relearned. The work was carried out by the experts at Adams Morey in Portsmouth and the total cost was £135.55. Amazingly cheap for an A class Hymer with lots of stuff in the way. At that price changing it every 2 years is a no brainer compared with the cost of repairing it if it goes wrong.

Good advice!
I have a 2019 Swift 694 automatic. Booked into Adams Morey in Portsmouth for clutch fluid change in April.
Thanks.

 

[AG 2602]

Maybe it’s time to organise a rally at Adams Morey?
I’m down there in a couple of weeks!!

 

[pampam]

Perhaps comfortmatic problems appear on here more than manual gearbox problems, because they are so difficult to a,repair
B, find someone who can repair it
C,remortgage the house to pay for it
D,re arrange all plans made for holidays in said motorhome ,as its sat in service bay with its guts layed out on floor for months while one mechanic after another scratches his head wondering what to try next
Not that im bitter

 

[Pausim]

Perhaps comfortmatic problems appear on here more than manual gearbox problems, because they are so difficult to a,repair

Or is it that most motorhomes are ordered with automatic gearboxes? I don’t know the real answer to this question but I took a quick look at a page full of adverts for Carthago motorhome and 8 out of 10 of them were automatic not manual.

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[ontheroadagain]

Or is it that most motorhomes are ordered with automatic gearboxes? I don’t know the real answer to this question but I took a quick look at a page full of adverts for Carthago motorhome and 8 out of 10 of them were automatic.

Currently for sale on Autotrader -
Automatic = 3342
Manual = 6010
So almost twice as many manuals as automatics.

 

[dunnah01]

Can't wait to see the mechanics faces when you rock up with an intermittent problem with your EV if they can't get their head around a pretty basic Comfortmatic gear change.

 

[ontheroadagain]

Can't wait to see the mechanics faces when you rock up with an intermittent problem with your EV if they can't get their head around a pretty basic Comfortmatic gear change.

Only one gear in an EV (and no clutch) so a lot less to worry about

 

[KUSKUS]

I was searching for a manual Carthago and found it very difficult to find a used one, mostly on Comfortmatic gearboxes.

 

[dunnah01]

Only one gear in an EV (and no clutch) so a lot less to worry about

It's rarely those bits that are the problem in Comfortmatics, its usually the wiring - which EVs have plenty of.

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