Motorhome weight limits

[GWAYGWAY]

When I bought my MLi 580 with a similar spec to GWAYGWAY the dealer said Hymer would downplate it to 3500kg in the future, even though it would leave a very small payload. It has a MIRO of 3281kg. I don’t plan on doing this but it did not seem to involve any weighing, just Hymer working from their records.

It is the accessory parts that do it gearbox is automatic and load heavier, awning is 32 kilos oven 26 kilos toolbar 62kg tv and dis12 kg it all adds up, the micro quoted is the basic van with no extras at all, I can’t even fill the fuel tank or carry water without needing the 3860 so that is whyI went to4200max weight. I went through the Homer price list to get the figures, I bought it as it was on the showroom floor as a demonstrator with loads of bits on it.

 

[pandas]

Two very different dealer stories, the first one trying to convince me that an excess of 300kg would be more than sufficient. I knew better. The second provided a breakdown of all the accessories in terms of cost and weight with a bottom line tally of each. I cannot see why all dealerships should not take this responsible approach.

 

[Pausim]

It is the accessory parts that do it gearbox is automatic and load heavier, awning is 32 kilos oven 26 kilos toolbar 62kg tv and dis12 kg it all adds up, the micro quoted is the basic van with no extras at all, I can’t even fill the fuel tank or carry water without needing the 3860 so that is whyI went to4200max weight. I went through the Homer price list to get the figures, I bought it as it was on the showroom floor as a demonstrator with loads of bits on it.

Yes I understand this, the MIRO I quoted was from my Certificate of Conformity which includes the factory fitted extras. The MIRO in the brochure was about 230kg less.

 

[Tude]

No point being stuck behind lorries cos you cant overtake them .what a load of nonsance !!!!!

 

[funflair]

There is always the option to tow an enclosed box trailer behind van and load that with whatever you want and before anyone knocks towing a box trailer there are a lot of people towing motorbikes and cars behind their vans only difference is what you put inside will probably be cleaner after a trip

Only up to a MAM of 750kg if you don't have the C1 on your licence.

Martin

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[nicholsong]

Anyone one with a C1, if aquired through 'grandfather' rights, probably also has C1E. which has a train weight limit on one's licence of 8250kg. If one acquired C1 and C1E through the test the trailer limit is 1250kg, subject to train weight of towing vehicle.

Thus the weight of a trailer could be the lesser of

Plated train weight of the towing MH, less the MH's MAM

or

8250kg


Just taking our own MH at MAM of 3850kg and train weight of 5000kg, then we could tow a trailer of 5000kg - 3850kg = 1150kg

 

[Pausim]

Only up to a MAM of 750kg if you don't have the C1 on your licence.

Martin

I think you will find that it is B+E not C1 that you need to tow more than 750kg at 70. I think you will also find that if you already have B+E on your license it will be retained after 70, without jumping through all the medical hoops required for C1. There would be far fewer caravans if B+E was lost at 70.

 

[mfw]

I have lost my c1 entitlement at moment but still have B+E on license

 

[john lillie]

I recently purchase a Hymer C544SL rated at 3500kg. On board are 2 solar panels, towbar, sattelite dish,air suspension kit, 3 litre engine, microwave. Recent trip to weighbridge with half full water and diesel, no driver, 3440kg! ADD driver, passenger, 2 dogs, food and clothing I reckon I must be around 3650kg! I am now having to apply for my C1 and uprate the van to 3850kg. A weight certificate at point of purchase may have influenced my decision, surely there is a strong argument for dealers to produce one prior to any potential sale?

 

[nicholsong]

I recently purchase a Hymer C544SL rated at 3500kg. On board are 2 solar panels, towbar, sattelite dish,air suspension kit, 3 litre engine, microwave. Recent trip to weighbridge with half full water and diesel, no driver, 3440kg! ADD driver, passenger, 2 dogs, food and clothing I reckon I must be around 3650kg! I am now having to apply for my C1 and uprate the van to 3850kg. A weight certificate at point of purchase may have influenced my decision, surely there is a strong argument for dealers to produce one prior to any potential sale?

The 'strong argument' should come from the potential buyer who has control of the money the dealer wants.

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[Lenny HB]

I recently purchase a Hymer C544SL rated at 3500kg. On board are 2 solar panels, towbar, sattelite dish,air suspension kit, 3 litre engine, microwave. Recent trip to weighbridge with half full water and diesel, no driver, 3440kg! ADD driver, passenger, 2 dogs, food and clothing I reckon I must be around 3650kg! I am now having to apply for my C1 and uprate the van to 3850kg. A weight certificate at point of purchase may have influenced my decision, surely there is a strong argument for dealers to produce one prior to any potential sale?

Dealer don't give a toss as long as they get your money.

 

[Lenny HB]

Yes I understand this, the MIRO I quoted was from my Certificate of Conformity which includes the factory fitted extras. The MIRO in the brochure was about 230kg less.

Should be two lines on the C of Course, then MIRO and the Technical MIRO, the second one includes factory fitted extras.

 

[Wagoneer]

I recently purchase a Hymer C544SL rated at 3500kg. On board are 2 solar panels, towbar, sattelite dish,air suspension kit, 3 litre engine, microwave. Recent trip to weighbridge with half full water and diesel, no driver, 3440kg! ADD driver, passenger, 2 dogs, food and clothing I reckon I must be around 3650kg! I am now having to apply for my C1 and uprate the van to 3850kg. A weight certificate at point of purchase may have influenced my decision, surely there is a strong argument for dealers to produce one prior to any potential sale?

Before you uprate to 3850kg check which axle is close to it's permissible axle weight.

If it's the rear axle, then suggest you get this increased from say 2000kg to 2240kg. This shouldn't be a problem if you already have air suspension.

 

[john lillie]

thanks for that, I will check before going ahead

 

[gus-lopez]

I cannot see why all dealerships should not take this responsible approach.

They wouldn't sell as many.

I think you will find that it is B+E not C1 that you need to tow more than 750kg at 70. I think you will also find that if you already have B+E on your license it will be retained after 70, without jumping through all the medical hoops required for C1. There would be far fewer caravans if B+E was lost at 70.

I think he was talking about the under 38's who have to take a C test to go over 3,5T they can only tow 750kgs unless passing the C1 test. Nothing to do with age 70.

surely there is a strong argument for dealers to produce one prior to any potential sale?

You wouldn't have bought it though if they had told you ?

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[john lillie]

probably not, if I were to be going down the route of over 3500kg, there were many more options to consider. My previous van, a Burstner Aviano, weighed in at 3220kg in the same state, minus towbar

 

[Crazylegs]

But if you are involved in an accident one of the first thing they do is take the vehicle to a weigh bridge - invalidates the insurance so maybe you might want to consider this. Plus there is some thought that the DVLA might at some point in the near future reduce the weight from 3.5 to 3 ton.

This is incorrect, just think about it, you have a bump, exchange details and away you go. If the vehicle is incapable of driving a recovery truck will pick it up and take the van to a storage compound or salvage yard to await a decision on the viability of a insurance repair from an assessor.

 

[pandas]

Bad accident and they certainly investigate why you didn’t stop in time, road condition, tyres, weight.

 

[Crazylegs]

But it’s not “ one of the first things they do” is it ? @pandas. A more accurate comment might be in exceptional circumstances an accident may be investigated, that could involve checking the plated and actual weights. If this was to be done there would be no people to weigh, personal belongings would have been removed, liquid tanks may have been damaged and lost there contents, parts of the van eg bumpers may have become detached etc etc. Folk making inaccurate comments like yours on public forums help nobody.

 

[pandas]

Not sure what your point is - are you advocating that people travel overweight and....I think that is irrsponsible. Talk to an insurance broker and see what the answer is.

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[Happy1]

Increasing weight to 3850 from 3500 takes you to the maximum loading for a standard fiat or AlKo chassis, are you then on the maximum as far a the brakes are concerned?

 

[Pausim]

I think he was talking about the under 38's who have to take a C test to go over 3,5T they can only tow 750kgs unless passing the C1 test. Nothing to do with age 70.

Perhaps. However my understanding is that if the younger driver wants to tow over 750kg with a vehicle of up 3500kg they do not have to do the C1 test, they can up their B license to B+E by doing a less onerous towing test.

 

[PeteH]

Increasing weight to 3850 from 3500 takes you to the maximum loading for a standard fiat or AlKo chassis, are you then on the maximum as far a the brakes are concerned?

The recomendations can be found here:- http://www.al-ko.co.uk/edit/files/downloads/al-ko-amc-commercial-brochure-2010.pdf

Page 12 for Fiat etc; Your plate gives the build code and that can be adjusted LEGALLY withing the parameters shown.

 

[Happy1]

Agree legally but still higher end of tolerances, better to start with a higher rated chassis say 4.what ever and run at 3.850? I.e. well within limits on a chassis with better brakes etc.

 

[Happy1]

There’s also a newer commercial brochure available page 10 lists ten different AlKo chassis’s.
http://www.alko-tech.com/en/vehicle-technology-catalogues
Fiat Ducato AlKo chassis technology

Not all can have the rear axle loading increased hence getting a bigger chassis on day one?

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[john lillie]

As I understand it, lots of people have done the
chassis upgrade with no ill effects, and the all up weight will be the same whether rated at 3500 or 3850 so loading on brakes etc will be the same regardless, and as I have already done around 1500 miles unknowingly possibly being illegally overweight with no noticeable problems, once my C1 comes back I shall go ahead

 

[PeteH]

Surely, Better to do any changes legally?. Than to risk heavy fines and no insurance cover?. The Design parameters are set by the manufacturers and will be more than adequate for the maximum load and have been tested as such to avoid possible challenges by the operators if an item failed. Especially those which may end up in the US market where suing and "class action" is far more common.

 

[mfw]

Uprating can get expensive especially if you have to replace wheels and tyres from 15 in to 16 in probably better to negotiate the upgrating with seller or reduce price to cover upgrade costs

 

[Blue Knight]

Dealer don't give a toss as long as they get your money.

I couldn't agree more with that sentiment after our most recent van hunt.

The majoity (circa 95%) of the sales guys which we spoke with about weights had absolutely no idea whatsoever.

If was as if the weight question was being asked for the very first time.

Most have the view that you can fill the van up to the roof

 

[Pausim]

I couldn't agree more with that sentiment after our most recent van hunt.

The majoity (circa 95%) of the sales guys which we spoke with about weights had absolutely no idea whatsoever.

If was as if the weight question was being asked for the very first time.

Most have the view that you can fill the van up to the roof

I don’t doubt this is usually the case but there are exceptions. Our dealer went through the weights of the extras and discussed payload and plating with us.

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