I won't use LiFePO4 Batteries

[Gromett]

But... but... but... I know people (including me) who have had no problems what so ever with AGM batteries.

JJ

I agree, if you treat AGM correctly they are brilliant. Mine last 8 years. most of them as a full timer.

 

[eddie]

Next time anyone goes to Van Bitz, in the corner of the car park there is a big green bounded battery box, normally nearly full of newish lead acid batteries that have failed

You won’t see a single Lithium

When I was working I sold a lot of Lithium batteries and I genuinely cannot remember changing one under the five year warranty they come with. Upgraded and additional ones added, yes, like for like replacement under warranty no

I’ve just turned 62 so my memory may be fallible, so maybe one or two I didn’t know about or forgot but nowhere near the failure rate of conventional lead acid batteries

But it’s a free world.

 

[Jo662]

Do folks really know what they require apart from what dealers, YouTube, people who have bought them, say on the internet.
If you really know how much electric you need fair enough but why would a bog standard motorhomer who has managed with one or two batteries for donkeys years suddenly need all these gizmos at anything up to £5000 just because it seems to be the fashion and then parkup on campsites with ehu where they don't need anything but a starter battery.

For 12 of the 14 years i have had Motorhomes iv managed with LA. And that means if parked up without EHU making sure we turn of things and are careful with power. Then a couple of years ago we stayed at a THS in Wells Next Sea and the batteries were running low after 4 days,and it was so dull even though it was June that the solar panel couldn’t top up the batteries,and we had 4 days left there.
So I decided to look into lithium and spoke to a few companies,which a lot said I could just drop in some lithium batteries, and decided to use a professional company and it’s been a great decision.

So I knew I needed more power,and this was the answer.

 

[Wissel]

Of course people are having problems with lithium. Just like they do with fridges, heating, engines, other types of battery and everything else on/in a motorhome. Sometimes, things go wrong. Sometimes, they are fitted badly.

But, I don't know anyone that's had a good install with reputable parts have their lithium fail. There was a well known and respected brand having settings in the BMS a bit optimistic and a lot of them failed. This was over 5 years ago though, before the tech (in motorhomes/boats) really evolved.

I'm not at all surprised that some of the cheap lithiums around do have more issues. Just because a battery is lithium and looks nice on the outside, it doesn't mean it has a good BMS inside with the right protection, features and reset capabilities. Doesn't even mean the wiring inside is up to scratch.

Also, it isn't just individuals that fit systems badly. I've seen a lot of professional installs that are anything but. Some from really well known suppliers (not VanBitz obviously).

For us, our van is our house. We choose to live in a van, but still want house like luxuries. I'm in it now typing away on my Mac connected to a 27" monitor sipping a fresh coffee after a nice shower from our instant hot water system. All this uses power and we need 2Kw per day to live how we like too.

This would be difficult without lithium. The weight and inferior charging being the hardest to overcome.

I'm not saying that lithium is for everyone, but it is the best option for quite a few. My system is 5 years old now and I rarely even look at how much capacity I have. It suits our needs and that's what we want.

The tech is also now quite affordable. Even with really good charging/inverting.

But, like with most things, it's down to individual needs or wants. If you don't need it or want it, don't buy it. Pretty simple.

But if you do, and have a well specced system installed properly, it is worth the outlay (IMO) and is far more reliable than than any other type of battery I've ever had.

Off to do some work now in the workshop. That's also lithium powered.

 

[funflair]

Read the forum. People are having problems. You as a seller of them isn’t an honest opinion. Why was this very post started, because someone wants a contact number as they are having problems. You want people to have them,

Help with lithium batteries

We are at present near Almería and having trouble with our lithium batteries. Twice in the last three days the batteries have gone down almost to zero , both overnight. Any suggestions of what I should check. Or does any one know of any retail business or mobile engineers in this area...

www.motorhomefun.co.uk

Cold Lithium, too cold?

Hi fellow Funsters, I have a 100 amp LiFeO. Has I fitted two years ago to replace x2 wet 110‘s and they’ve been great…, until this last cold snap. I noticed I couldn’t switch on the 12v lamp in garage and good that the vans 12v system had shut down with only 10.5v on the Lithium. I have the...

www.motorhomefun.co.uk

Dangerous Ecoflow kit?

I know we don’t think much of gadget John & Mandy but take a look at the section of this vid where he talks about a graded lead Ecoflow supplied in a bloody expensive new set up (I think best part of £6,000), it was getting very hot and could have burnt his van down to hubs 🤪. Story around 8.4t...

www.motorhomefun.co.uk

Lithium batteries - Parameter Settings for balancing

2 x 100Ah Sterling Power lithium batteries, 18 months old. One seems to be reluctant to balance cells. Volt diff as high as 0.3v on occasions and rarely volt diff below 0.2v The batteries arrived with different parameter settings. Sterling apologised and gave recommendations - see attached...

www.motorhomefun.co.uk

Lithium battery dropped to 10v !

Hello, We had a sneeky few days away wild camping to test our new Lithium 230ah battery and our new 500w microwave, all went very well until I got up this morning and there was no power ! The Alde heating wouldnt work, I looked at the three way fridge and noticed it had switched from gas to...

www.motorhomefun.co.uk

Lithium charging at low temp !!

Hi all, I have 2 x 100 ampTransporter energy batteries, on the spec sheet it says they will discharge between -20 to 71C And charging between -4 and 57C. As our van is kept in our garage it gets no benefit from our solar panels. With the monitoring and parasitic load it consumes around 9 to 12 w...

www.motorhomefun.co.uk

But you go on promoting them, and I will stay with basic, known and working.

The last link on your list is simply somebody observing the system working correctly it is not an indication of a problem with Lithium, just because Lithium is in the title it doesn't mean it's a problem, I think you are looking for problems that don't exist

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[MichaelT]

Of course people are having problems with lithium. Just like they do with fridges, heating, engines, other types of battery and everything else on/in a motorhome. Sometimes, things go wrong. Sometimes, they are fitted badly.

But, I don't know anyone that's had a good install with reputable parts have their lithium fail. There was a well known and respected brand having settings in the BMS a bit optimistic and a lot of them failed. This was over 5 years ago though, before the tech (in motorhomes/boats) really evolved.

I'm not at all surprised that some of the cheap lithiums around do have more issues. Just because a battery is lithium and looks nice on the outside, it doesn't mean it has a good BMS inside with the right protection, features and reset capabilities. Doesn't even mean the wiring inside is up to scratch.

Also, it isn't just individuals that fit systems badly. I've seen a lot of professional installs that are anything but. Some from really well known suppliers (not VanBitz obviously).

For us, our van is our house. We choose to live in a van, but still want house like luxuries. I'm in it now typing away on my Mac connected to a 27" monitor sipping a fresh coffee after a nice shower from our instant hot water system. All this uses power and we need 2Kw per day to live how we like too.

This would be difficult without lithium. The weight and inferior charging being the hardest to overcome.

I'm not saying that lithium is for everyone, but it is the best option for quite a few. My system is 5 years old now and I rarely even look at how much capacity I have. It suits our needs and that's what we want.

The tech is also now quite affordable. Even with really good charging/inverting.

But, like with most things, it's down to individual needs or wants. If you don't need it or want it, don't buy it. Pretty simple.

But if you do, and have a well specced system installed properly, it is worth the outlay (IMO) and is far more reliable than than any other type of battery I've ever had.

Off to do some work now in the workshop. That's also lithium powered.

Interested in what instant hot water system you have?

 

[Wissel]

Interested in what instant hot water system you have?

iMass. Had it around 4 years now and very happy with it. Fitting another in our next van

 

[jongood]

I've fairly recently fitted a 200ah LiFePo4 in parallel with one of my old 220ah Gels, what they call a hybrid set up. I've changed no settings just advice from a boating group on FB and picked a battery with a good BMS . I have travelled over 2000 miles and spent about 35 days/nights and the only minor issue I'm having most of you wouldn't have. I have to say it's working pretty well

 

[MichaelT]

iMass. Had it around 4 years now and very happy with it. Fitting another in our next van

Looks like it works on gas only. I guess you need a seperate heating source for the van.

 

[Carpmart]

iMass. Had it around 4 years now and very happy with it. Fitting another in our next van

Just had a quick squizz at this, very interesting… Could you give me a rough price on these please? Need trade acc to log in…

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[Guigsy]

It depends on how you run your van. Our previous van, we had very few gizmos, just a few USB powered toys. And we moved pretty much every day, so driving and the solar panel kept our 90Ah lead acid topped up. It was fine. We toured for 6 months, rarely even bothering to plug in the van, even if it was available because we just didn't need it.

Now we've changed gears a bit. We've got a small a-class that's mostly lounge and table. We can leave for somewhere on a Wednesday night, stop most of the day on Thursday and Friday to work remotely on our laptops. By the time we've got to the weekend, we've travelled a fair distance. Then enjoy a few days doing touristy stuff and work our way back. But the laptops drink a fair amount of Ah through the day. We're having to rely on EHU to reliably have enough juice when it's not sunny or we're parked under a tree. So I'm getting a lithium battery and B2B to add flexibility.

 

[funflair]

It depends on how you run your van. Our previous van, we had very few gizmos, just a few USB powered toys. And we moved pretty much every day, so driving and the solar panel kept our 90Ah lead acid topped up. It was fine. We toured for 6 months, rarely even bothering to plug in the van, even if it was available because we just didn't need it.

Now we've changed gears a bit. We've got a small a-class that's mostly lounge and table. We can leave for somewhere on a Wednesday night, stop most of the day on Thursday and Friday to work remotely on our laptops. By the time we've got to the weekend, we've travelled a fair distance. Then enjoy a few days doing touristy stuff and work our way back. But the laptops drink a fair amount of Ah through the day. We're having to rely on EHU to reliably have enough juice when it's not sunny or we're parked under a tree. So I'm getting a lithium battery and B2B to add flexibility.

And I predict you won't regret it, I can't even remember where our gas kettle is

 

[Lenny HB]

7 years of a motorhome. No solar, no B2B, no lithium, just two batteries. Never run out of power, and money in my pocket, not someone else’s. I know we are all different but more toys, more problems and I like simple. The posts on this forum show lithium is not as simple as some suggest.

For your use you are never going to require Lithium so why keep knocking them so much. Your use is not typical of the average Motorhome, most with that setup couldn't survive more than a few days without EHU.

We currently have 3 Gel batteries & 300 watts of solar only come close to running out of power twice but once is enough.

Next van will have 460 ah of Lithium & as much solar as I can get on the roof as the way we use the van will change. Not having an oven so want to be able to run an air fryer and other electrical gizmos.
In the past allways been in the if it ain't 12v it no go in the van, camp. But times have changed & it's now possible with the event of Lithium to run all things without problems but I do draw the line at a microwave.

 

[Steve and Denise]

We had our 2x100amp NDS lithium, with 2000w inventor, 60 amp Votronic b2b and NDS solar charger all fitted by Damien at Roadpro. Andy, the owner very helpful, talked through what we wanted to use, how we would use it and no hard sell at all. Been using it for 2 years with no issues, main uses are nespresso maker, induction hob, Helens straighteners and occasionally the roof aircon just to cool the van down before bed when necessary. We use a mixture of sites in winter, but still useful for making lunch/coffee on journey, and stellpkatz/aires when abroad. I know it’s more expensive, but getting true professionals to fit lithium makes all the difference in my experience.

Exactly that’s why I did my research and fitted mine myself I only wanted to do it once

 

[chaser]

Interested in what instant hot water system you have?

Was very interested in this too, as I am in the opposite camp to many in this thread, I don't want more power, but I have been looking at water heating or something else for over a year now to use up my surplus power, as it seems such a waste to have everything full before dinner time when the sun hasn't really got going, the best part of the days solar is just going to waste.
But now I see it's gas so that's a non starter.

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[merl]

For 12 of the 14 years i have had Motorhomes iv managed with LA. And that means if parked up without EHU making sure we turn of things and are careful with power. Then a couple of years ago we stayed at a THS in Wells Next Sea and the batteries were running low after 4 days,and it was so dull even though it was June that the solar panel couldn’t top up the batteries,and we had 4 days left there.
So I decided to look into lithium and spoke to a few companies,which a lot said I could just drop in some lithium batteries, and decided to use a professional company and it’s been a great decision.

So I knew I needed more power,and this was the answer.

Just for clarity, you don't get more power from Lithium than you do from LA.
If your Lithium batteries were the same capacity as your LA batteries they'd have also been discharged after 4 days also.
I understand that LA batteries 'age' and lose capacity over time mainly caused by a poor charging regime, particularly letting the battery stand idle when not fully charged causing internal sulfation and this leads to a 100Ah battery quickly becoming somewhat less and often an awful lot less but just to avoid confusion and false information.
I've seen so many posts over the years on here and other forums from campers thinking that if they swap out their LA battery for a lithium they'll be able to run loads of 240v items from an inverter and have loads of power available and that's simply NOT the case.
A 100 Ah LA battery will give you 100AH and so will a lithium of the same capacity.

 

[Carpmart]

Was very interested in this too, as I am in the opposite camp to many in this thread, I don't want more power, but I have been looking at water heating or something else for over a year now to use up my surplus power, as it seems such a waste to have everything full before dinner time when the sun hasn't really got going, the best part of the days solar is just going to waste.
But now I see it's gas so that's a non starter.

Two on Tour has been creative and come up with an elegant solution for using solar to heat water, post charging the batteries.

 

[jongood]

Just for clarity, you don't get more power from Lithium than you do from LA.
If your Lithium batteries were the same capacity as your LA batteries they'd have also been discharged after 4 days also.
I understand that LA batteries 'age' and lose capacity over time mainly caused by a poor charging regime, particularly letting the battery stand idle when not fully charged causing internal sulfation and this leads to a 100Ah battery quickly becoming somewhat less and often an awful lot less but just to avoid confusion and false information.
I've seen so many posts over the years on here and other forums from campers thinking that if they swap out their LA battery for a lithium they'll be able to run loads of 240v items from an inverter and have loads of power available and that's simply NOT the case.
A 100 Ah LA battery will give you 100AH and so will a lithium of the same capacity.

I disagree. you can run LifePo4 down to 20% as opposed to 40% for L.A. and you can use mains power for longer.

 

[Two on Tour]

Two on Tour has been creative and come up with an elegant solution for using solar to heat water, post charging the batteries.

As well as our excess solar heating our secondary hot water tank, I can also heat this water via our B2B while we are driving, so if we stop to make lunch or arrive at a site we have a supply of hot water ready to be used.

 

[eddie]

A 100 Ah LA battery will give you 100AH and so will a lithium of the same capacity.

No it won't well it may once before you scrap it

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[DuxDeluxe]

But Landy Andy are the examples you show mostly people who have just drop in lithium batteries?
I had mine fitted along with a charger with lithium settings by AshVanBitz ,and it’s worked perfectly in all temperatures for over 16 months.

Same here, even in very low temperatures

 

[treblid]

A 100 Ah LA battery will give you 100AH and so will a lithium of the same capacity.

The point you are missing is the difference in the safe level of depth of discharge (DOD) and available capacity. Typical safe DOD is 50% for LA, 60% for GEL and 95% for Lithium.

 

[Guigsy]

Lithium can also be charged and discharged hard throughout most of its capacity range. Lead-acid and gel batteries need to be slow charged once they reach a certain level (particularly if you want them to last). So you can find that Lithium will absorb more energy from solar or B2B purely because it'll accept a higher charge rate right up until it's pretty much full.

 

[Carpmart]

Just did a quick Google and looks like they are currently around £700.

Just a simple control panel to switch on/off and set temperature. For a shower, we set it at 35 degrees and spend as long as we like in there (until we run out of water ). To wash up, turn it to 60. Works out very economical with gas as it's only on when needed.

This looked great until I realised it’s an external wall mount required rather than just a vent.

I keep looking at diesel heater heat exchangers as an option for hot water, but I’m not convinced they will heat, in a meaningful way, quickly enough.

 

[Ernesto]

Read the forum. People are having problems. You as a seller of them isn’t an honest opinion. Why was this very post started, because someone wants a contact number as they are having problems. You want people to have them,

[

I’ve not seen anyone arguing Lithium is an ultra low cost, 100% trouble-free, suitable for everyone power solution. There is nothing that is 100% fault-free. But correctly installed, it has a number of positive benefits. Some people might not value those benefits but thats their call. Lead Acid is certainly cheaper but I’ve read loads of posts on here from people struggling with that technology as well.

Occasionally there will be issues as with any power solution, but highlighting a handful of issues on a forum, does not prove anything….people don’t post to say their system is working perfectly.

I’ve seen absolutely nothing to suggest Eddie is not being honest. its good to debate the point but facts and real world examples are better than opinion

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[Guigsy]

iMass. Had it around 4 years now and very happy with it. Fitting another in our next van

So it's basically a combi-boiler for mobile use?

 

[steve69]

It’s easy to say take away the cost, but it’s a very big cost, and as per this post, paying the money, doesn’t equal reliability.

If you bring cost into the equation, you would never buy a motorhome in the first place.....

 

[Steve and Denise]

This looked great until I realised it’s an external wall mount required rather than just a vent.

I keep looking at diesel heater heat exchangers as an option for hot water, but I’m not convinced they will heat, in a meaningful way, quickly enough.

I thought you had Alde heating ?

 

[Reallyretired]

We are currently functioning on a single gel battery and 200w of solar. The battery is of uncertain age and certainly when it needs replacing I will look for lithium that will fit in the limited space. The way prices are going, by the time I need it, the lithium will probably not cost much more.

 

[DavidCh]

Here is my 'three penny worth'. People seem to see lead acid as 'simple' and lithium as 'complicated'. It is just as easy (in fact much easier) to wreck a lead acid battery than a lithium because it has no protection. However that seems to be accepted. We all know if you dischsrge your house (or starter) battery completly than it is unlikely to survive but that is seen as just something you live with. By comparison the BMS in a LIthium will protect it and the issues with a 'drop in' replacement are more to do with destroying other equipment than the actual battery, Secondly, the lithiums have lots of settings and changes that can be made to their configuration which people love playing with. Lead acids have seperate cells and I have never heard of anyone measuring them and complaing they are a few millivots different! If you read the problems that people have with lithium's it is almost always the electrical systems in the vehicle, not the battery and would have happened just the same with lead acid ones. Reading some of the links above they are all related to non lithium issues. With regard to charging, assuming the battery manufacturers have set the battery up properly then I cant see the problem. Certainly if its too cold to discharge then I am not going in the van and not if its below 3 degrees so I cant charge either!

Becuse of the amount of infornation one them and the many differening viees on their use (I am as much at fault here) they are seen as problematic when really it is just to much information. The truth is that if you stopped worrying about them and treated them just like you do lead acids you would be fine.

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