Heating Motorhome over winter parked up

[ozzyhufc]

Just a quick one again, while van is parked up over winter , what is the cheapest way to keep motorhome warm in rear, I have run the electric to van for heating to be on 24/7 but it’s taking a lot of electricity
How long would a 6kg gas bottle last if heating left on continuously , would that be cheaper or is there a better way.

Thanks.

 

[2ginjohn]

Just a quick one again, while van is parked up over winter , what is the cheapest way to keep motorhome warm in rear, I have run the electric to van for heating to be on 24/7 but it’s taking a lot of electricity
How long would a 6kg gas bottle last if heating left on continuously , would that be cheaper or is there a better way.

Thanks.

Coming to this late I see most of the discussion is about condensation. However, what about the batteries, especially lithium batteries? Batteries generally don’t like cold temperatures. A few years ago I left my garden tool lithium battery in the garage over a very cold winter and when I came to use it in the spring it was completely dead, couldn’t revive it and had to buy a new one. With the temperatures we have had recently (-15C where I live) I don’t think it’s a bad idea to keep the van above freezing and the batteries charged up. Anybody had any bad experiences with lithium batteries giving up due to the cold?

 

[oldiesontour]

Coming to this late I see most of the discussion is about condensation. However, what about the batteries, especially lithium batteries? Batteries generally don’t like cold temperatures. A few years ago I left my garden tool lithium battery in the garage over a very cold winter and when I came to use it in the spring it was completely dead, couldn’t revive it and had to buy a new one. With the temperatures we have had recently (-15C where I live) I don’t think it’s a bad idea to keep the van above freezing and the batteries charged up. Anybody had any bad experiences with lithium batteries giving up due to the cold?

Lithium as in power tool and lipo4 are very different beasts,also your power tool battery probably self discharged below the point it's /charger would allow charge...this can be over come by giving it a direct charge from another battery (plenty on U tube)
Your lipo4 battery should be stored around 50% charged and isolated from loads and charge it will be more than happy for the few months you are not using the van.The van battery however should be kept charged either by solar or mains.My lipo4 s are isolated and the van solar is diverted to only the starter battery (hab batteries have inbuilt heaters so I could leave them on and connected to solar but this would leave them sitting at 100% which is not good for them

 

[Tombola]

Pointless unless you seal all the vents in the van.

And that's impossible

 

[mikash]

I would not be so sure about the air change rate Our self built property came in well below current building regs of 10 air changes per hour( this is with all deliberate ventilation sealed) after some very careful construction and attention to detail but still managed 4.1 air changes per HR at 50pa.A van is full of holes and subject to external wind/breeze and both internal and external thermal activity.
But I think the general consensus would appear to agree that neither low heat or dehumidifier activity are likely to achieve any more than good ventilation.... However I doubt the van heaters will alter their habits and nor will the ventilators or dehumidifiers,so with the exception of the few undecided like the op no change.

Are you sure about 10 air exchanges per hour? That leads to some pretty astronomical heating bills I think. Here we have a minimum recommnendation of 0.5 exchanges / hour I think and old houses relying only on gravity for ventilation are struggling to attain even that during summers when there is no temperature difference.
At 10 air exchanger per hour a 150 cubic meter small house would expell 1500 cubic meters of air every hour. Air has a heat capacity of about 0.3Wh/m3/deg so that's 450W of heating capacity / 1 degree temperature difference required just to reheat intake air. Does not seem right, not even with heat rexchanger for recuperation, to be honest, but might be my math too.
On the other hand, my friend who studied a good bit in UK always complaiend his lodgings were cold and drafty....

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[Lenny HB]

And that's impossible

No problem, a can of expanding foam an a roll of duck tape.

 

[Terry]

Coming to this late I see most of the discussion is about condensation. However, what about the batteries, especially lithium batteries? Batteries generally don’t like cold temperatures. A few years ago I left my garden tool lithium battery in the garage over a very cold winter and when I came to use it in the spring it was completely dead, couldn’t revive it and had to buy a new one. With the temperatures we have had recently (-15C where I live) I don’t think it’s a bad idea to keep the van above freezing and the batteries charged up. Anybody had any bad experiences with lithium batteries giving up due to the cold?

I’ve had battery tools since I was 20 now 68 so 48 years and never left them flat/ always well chargedWhen I first got a battery drill they said if stored leave no charge. Mine were used and charged daily so never left flat. I worked with a lot of people who had battery drills after trying mine but left thier batteries flat. After a couple of weeks ( Hols) the batteries wouldn’t charge so I always charged batteries and left them without problems.Now all the tools I have that work via batteries seldom get used and such as hedge trimmers and strimers etc will not see any use until well into spring -all left fully charged and not had any problems or dead batteries

 

[hallhmik]

For much the same reason as we heat an empty house.

We heat an empty house because unlike a motorhone it is very difficult to drain down. All the water tanks, central heating system and all the pipes to sinks/basins/baths/showers/loos/dishwashers/washing machines would all need draining. Then refilling and removing air locks on return.

As has been stated if motorhome is drained down (which is easy to do) then no reason to heat it. You don't heat your car on the driveway over winter.

 

[Paul Wilkins]

Keep ours at 8C @ 1kW, just to keep it ticking over. Never had a problem with damp or condensation.

 

[stuartholmes]

I’ve had battery tools since I was 20 now 68 so 48 years and never left them flat/ always well chargedWhen I first got a battery drill they said if stored leave no charge. Mine were used and charged daily so never left flat. I worked with a lot of people who had battery drills after trying mine but left thier batteries flat. After a couple of weeks ( Hols) the batteries wouldn’t charge so I always charged batteries and left them without problems.Now all the tools I have that work via batteries seldom get used and such as hedge trimmers and strimers etc will not see any use until well into spring -all left fully charged and not had any problems or dead batteries

Ditto!!

Not to dispute all the theory & stuff but ditto!!

(i.e. That's almost exactly my experience too. )

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[stevewagner]

Its probably not best to leave the heating on constant as it will send your meter spinning... And Gas will be used like no tomorrow.
What I have is a low consumption mains power Dehumidifier. Mine has a laundry mode so we use it in a spare room to dry washing etc.
I leave this in my Ducato PVC and it gently warms and also removes the dampness etc. Once or twice a week I empty the water collection tank.
It doesn't use much electric as it's not heating up..
Worth a look on Amazon or Argos etc..

You’ve proved the point. You are dragging moisture from the air which fills again.

 

[Apacheman]

The crystal moisture absorbing gubbins is also a waste of money and effort. see above posts.

Would disagree based on the ones we use always collecting water in them. Comes from somewhere? But each to their own and what works for one doesn’t work for everyone

 

[oldiesontour]

Would disagree based on the ones we use always collecting water in them. Comes from somewhere? But each to their own and what works for one doesn’t work for everyone

They will keep collecting water as the air is constantly changing,for more moist air,the question is can they collect that moisture as fast as it is being replaced ?

 

[Dean14]

Just a quick one again, while van is parked up over winter , what is the cheapest way to keep motorhome warm in rear, I have run the electric to van for heating to be on 24/7 but it’s taking a lot of electricity
How long would a 6kg gas bottle last if heating left on continuously , would that be cheaper or is there a better way.

Thanks.

A warm MH will be a magnet for cold vermin.

 

[poppycamper]

[/QUOTE]

A warm MH will be a magnet for cold vermin.

I raised same point on a recent thread ' Is It Safe' which was about heating van

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[roxburd]

This is our first winter too, and last year when I took my daughter's car out of over-winter storage the mould was horrific. So I got a bit paranoid about laying the van up over winter, too. I started the winter by keeping the heating on 5°C (LPG as it's in storage and I can't hook up to an electric supply). Very quickly realised that I didn't want to be burning that much gas over winter, especially if it wasn't necessary. So I turned the heating off and, being paranoid, I got a humidity monitor and just checked the van regularly. I also put a dehumidifier pot in there (can't hurt), opened all the cavities (cupboards, etc.) to allow airflow, drained down and emptied the water pump.
The monitor shows that the humidity never gets above 90%, relative. My understanding is that technically, condensation shouldn't happen below about 100%.
So far, so good - no condensation as far as I can tell from regular visits. With one exception - I did find significant condensate on the external wall behind the drawers under the hob. I wiped that all away and it hasn't reoccurred so far. I suspect that was just a cold spot that day when the humidity level was high.
When I visit the van I do bung the heating on and open a vent while I'm having a cuppa. I'm pretty happy that it's doing OK. Last time I visited there was ice all over the van but it was fine inside. I keep an eye on the wall under the hob, though, obviously.

 

[ozzyhufc]

Keep ours at 8C @ 1kW, just to keep it ticking over. Never had a problem with damp or condensation.

Thank you for your reply, i have set mine at 8c and 1kw tonight , see how much electric i use now going forward… do you leave yours on 24/7 . Thanks

 

[LithiumConvert]

i have set mine at 8c and 1kw tonight. do you leave yours on 24/7 .

Yes, 24/7. 8'C sounds good.
I can switch it between LPG and EHU - depending partly on the price of Octopus Agile electric. - so, gas tonight.

 

[GoCoeGo]

I have a maxxaire fan vent and leave it open but turned off in storage. It doesn't let any rain in even in a downpour and gives extra ventilation.
I can't think who would give advice to tape up vents totally counterproductive.

It could be that i have interpreted it wrong, but the taping up of vents was from this site. Scroll to the bottom.
https://www.motorhomefun.co.uk/portal/winterising-your-motorhome/

 

[CAB96]

This is our first winter too, and last year when I took my daughter's car out of over-winter storage the mould was horrific. So I got a bit paranoid about laying the van up over winter, too. I started the winter by keeping the heating on 5°C (LPG as it's in storage and I can't hook up to an electric supply). Very quickly realised that I didn't want to be burning that much gas over winter, especially if it wasn't necessary. So I turned the heating off and, being paranoid, I got a humidity monitor and just checked the van regularly. I also put a dehumidifier pot in there (can't hurt), opened all the cavities (cupboards, etc.) to allow airflow, drained down and emptied the water pump.
The monitor shows that the humidity never gets above 90%, relative. My understanding is that technically, condensation shouldn't happen below about 100%.
So far, so good - no condensation as far as I can tell from regular visits. With one exception - I did find significant condensate on the external wall behind the drawers under the hob. I wiped that all away and it hasn't reoccurred so far. I suspect that was just a cold spot that day when the humidity level was high.
When I visit the van I do bung the heating on and open a vent while I'm having a cuppa. I'm pretty happy that it's doing OK. Last time I visited there was ice all over the van but it was fine inside. I keep an eye on the wall under the hob, though, obviously.

Condensation like that often occurs with a change in the weather.

Before Christmas there was a cold spell, the weather then changed to milder and damp.

I went into my house garage, all the tins, beer bottles etc which had cooled right down were covered in condensation.

A day later when everything had warmed back up it was all as dry as before.

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[Mark1965]

Pointless unless you seal all the vents in the van.

Yea probably but I'm happy with the results.

 

[B-JandBella]

Keep ours at 8C @ 1kW, just to keep it ticking over. Never had a problem with damp or condensation.

I'm with you on this one, Paul.

Just keep a small oil heater ticking over on low, and that keeps the van nice a dry and warm.
It's a lot cheaper than having to constantly repair where damp and condensation has ruined the interior every year.

Sometimes, I go and sit in the van as it's warmer than the house

 

[poppycamper]

It's a lot cheaper than having to constantly repair where damp and condensation has ruined the interior every year.

Have never used heat in an empty van over last 30+ yrs of moho and c'vanning...
Also never had annual, or indeed any other repair costs where damp and condensation has ruined the interior.
So therefore my costs by not heating and with no repair costs are infinitely cheaper than your heating also with no repair costs ££££££.

 

[Anneg]

I do have a convector heater in our van, but set on the frost setting of 5 degrees, just in case there's any water anywhere that I haven't been able to drain, like in the pump. It's very rarely on - it doesn't tend to get down to that here in Pembrokeshire, though it did for a couple of days a week ago. It's wifi connected so I can actually increase or decrease temp, put its fan on and turn it off and on from my sitting room.

I also ventilate on sunny days, and check batteries, though hab and vehicle are on solar. Heat is not really needed as your just heating the air that is coming in from outside. Only had condensation on windscreen on one sunny day so far, and when I looked both our cars had condensation on their windscreens as well. All was gone by the next day on all three vehicles. Heat is required in vacant houses as they usually don't have anywhere near the ventilation that motorhomes do.

 

[LostInSpace]

I went into my house garage, all the tins, beer bottles etc which had cooled right down were covered in condensation.

I suspect some attention to detail is needed there. We have never seen that in 80 years.

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[robnchris]

I suspect some attention to detail is needed there. We have never seen that in 80 years.

I agree with 100% CAB96. Yesterday I left a plastic bottle of water in my car, this morning after a frosty night the bottle was covered in condensation. Same happens in my workshop no heat on in there overnight.
I really don't know how people can get the better of basic physics.

 

[CAB96]

I suspect some attention to detail is needed there. We have never seen that in 80 years.

The garage is not nearly air tight. There is a gap under the up-and-over door, and a gap in the backdoor. No heating apart from the big fridge-freezer and tumble dryer.

It does not entirely reflect the outside temperature, as it is beside and under the heated house, but is significantly influenced by the air temperature.

It was a significant change in the weather. It had been very cold for several days, and the bottles, tins etc. had naturally cooled to match the chilly air temperature.

The weather went suddenly very mild and damp. High RH, foggy, temperatures up to 10 degrees higher overnight than previously, significantly more moisture in the air. The bottles which were still chilled from the cold snap met the warm, damp air, which quite naturally condensed on them.

A day later, no condensation, as all the cold bottles had warmed up from the warmer air. It just takes a while to transfer that energy into the bottles.

The same happens in cold spells. When the beer is chilled after a cold spell, and I bring a bottle into the warm kitchen, it is soon covered in condensation. It doesn't happen in milder weather, as the bottles are not cold enough.

 

[Paul Wilkins]

Thank you for your reply, i have set mine at 8c and 1kw tonight , see how much electric i use now going forward… do you leave yours on 24/7 . Thanks

Yep.

 

[BouncyBoatFolk]

Do people leave their cars heated overnight in the winter?
One of our sons has a fan heater he puts on in his car on the driveway for 10 mins in the morning,but that's so he can drive off straight after starting his car and not have it running for 10mins at "sparrows fart" o'clock. Just a thought.
Mike.

 

[Jonno1103]

We've used the heating 24/7 in all of our moho's for the best part of 15 years now. Never had an issue. Don't care how much it costs, it works for us.

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[LostInSpace]

and tumble dryer.

now we know where the moisture came from. even condensing dryers produce some moisture in the room.