Fogstar Drift App

[headlight]

Anybody having problems with the app ?
I received 2 x 105AH Fogstar Drifts today.
I down loaded the app on to my phone but no matter what I do my phone just searches and searches and doesn't connect.
I have also down loaded the app on to my tablet but that won't connect either.
I have Bluetooth and location turned on on both devices and have uninstalled and re-installed the app several times on both devices but still no joy.
I can connect to other devices via Bluetooth no problem.

 

[dpsuk999]

When I buy a battery I expect it to work when I receive it, I do not expect to be mucking about recycling it to make it work properly. If I buy a new vehicle I do not expect to have to service it myself before using it.

Granted but the OP is paralleling together which is different to just using a single battery on its own. To use your own analogy, buying a single car and getting in and driving it is fine, if you then bought 2 cars and wanted to run them at the same time, you would have to do something different (i.e someone else is required to drive the 2nd car, or the 2nd car goes on a trailer but you need to modify the 1st car and fit a towbar).

So fitting 2 or more batteries together requires a different approach than just installing 1 battery.

 

[Peavy]

So fitting 2 or more batteries together requires a different approach than just installing 1 battery.

The OP coudn't pair to the batteries, he had to download different apps, even had to change the phone to connect to the BMS, after that, he could connect, the BMS is turning ON and OFF charge and discharge mode in both batteries...
something is not working from the begining here...
I wait with curiosity for the outcome. I hope we learn something

 

[headlight]

I brought the batteries home from the MH earlier today.
The discharge unit I ordered should arrive tomorrow.
I have spoken to Fogstar today regarding the best way to cycle the batteries and was told to discharge them until the BMS cut them off due to low voltage, let them rest for 2 hours then charge until voltage reaches 14.2v irrespective of what SOC says, let them rest, then discharge until the BMS cuts them off again.
I am to do this 5 times with each battery.

 

[Pausim]

Granted but the OP is paralleling together which is different to just using a single battery on its own. To use your own analogy, buying a single car and getting in and driving it is fine, if you then bought 2 cars and wanted to run them at the same time, you would have to do something different (i.e someone else is required to drive the 2nd car, or the 2nd car goes on a trailer but you need to modify the 1st car and fit a towbar).

So fitting 2 or more batteries together requires a different approach than just installing 1 battery.

I have never seen a car advert that says you can expect to drive 2 cars at the same time. However Fogstar clearly state that their batteries can be paralleled. Their Q&As include:
“Yes, we modified the JBD BMS at the manufacturing stage to add series and parallel support up to 4S OR 4P.”

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[Just smiffy]

I brought the batteries home from the MH earlier today.
The discharge unit I ordered should arrive tomorrow.
I have spoken to Fogstar today regarding the best way to cycle the batteries and was told to discharge them until the BMS cut them off due to low voltage, let them rest for 2 hours then charge until voltage reaches 14.2v irrespective of what SOC says, let them rest, then discharge until the BMS cuts them off again.
I am to do this 5 times with each battery.

That’s MORE cost to you then in electricity….

 

[Pausim]

I brought the batteries home from the MH earlier today.
The discharge unit I ordered should arrive tomorrow.
I have spoken to Fogstar today regarding the best way to cycle the batteries and was told to discharge them until the BMS cut them off due to low voltage, let them rest for 2 hours then charge until voltage reaches 14.2v irrespective of what SOC says, let them rest, then discharge until the BMS cuts them off again.
I am to do this 5 times with each battery.

That is ridiculous, why should you have to do this. Not fit for purpose.

 

[headlight]

That is ridiculous, why should you have to do this. Not fit for purpose.

Fogstar did say they would pay to courier the batteries back to them, cycle them and then courier them back to me.
Unfortunately as I live alone that would mean me taking 2 days off work and I already had to take 2 days off to take delivery of them due to a problem with the delivery, courier problem not down to Fogstar.

 

[headlight]

That’s MORE cost to you then in electricity….

I've spent so much money and time now that I'm past caring.
I just want the batteries working.

 

[Ian_H]

headlight said:
I brought the batteries home from the MH earlier today.
The discharge unit I ordered should arrive tomorrow.
I have spoken to Fogstar today regarding the best way to cycle the batteries and was told to discharge them until the BMS cut them off due to low voltage, let them rest for 2 hours then charge until voltage reaches 14.2v irrespective of what SOC says, let them rest, then discharge until the BMS cuts them off again.
I am to do this 5 times with each battery.

Mmmm. They didn't mention the 2 hour rests to me. Another reason for them to document what is required on website and in the manual that comes with the battery. I really get the impression they are learning as they go. When I first asked about how low to discharge to during cycling, Becca told me below 40%. Later Ben told me to discharge until bms low cut off. When my Victron charger didn't fully charge the battery on the default lithium setting, and Ben duplicated this on another underseat battery, he talked me through creating a custom profile on the Victron that charges to 14.4V, and appears to work OK. He was going to talk to EVE about it and get back to me, but didn't. And over a month later their website still says "We recommend Victron equipment is set to a Float of 13.5V and 14.2V Bulk". I think they are good guys doing their best, but lacking a bit of organisation. I'm not sure them starting a facebook group was a great idea, as there are well meaning posters putting up advice to customers with problems that probably causes even more confusion.

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[Just smiffy]

Sounds like there just grabbing the money while the sun shines… people buying on the back of YouTube promotions that get the free batteries to review….

I’d rather have good Customer service on an average battery then crap service on a good battery but it looks like their not that good after all….

 

[Outdoors Dad]

I'm sorry to hear of your disappointment with the batteries, it really sounds frustrating. I thought fogstar might of sorted it out within a reasonable timescale, but it doesn't appear so. I hope you get them sorted soon and that fogstar pull their finger out as many people are following this thread

 

[Raul]

I brought the batteries home from the MH earlier today.
The discharge unit I ordered should arrive tomorrow.
I have spoken to Fogstar today regarding the best way to cycle the batteries and was told to discharge them until the BMS cut them off due to low voltage, let them rest for 2 hours then charge until voltage reaches 14.2v irrespective of what SOC says, let them rest, then discharge until the BMS cuts them off again.
I am to do this 5 times with each battery.

In my opinion, I think will do nothing to the bms. Why do you have to hit low voltage disconnect? Five full cycles to reset a bms? I do about 35-40 full cycles per year, on the house batteries, just as a comparison to your 5 cycles. The rest are just partial cycles, never empty or low, and only occasionally full if I have the sun.
I’m very curious what you going to achieve when you done the 5 full cycles, keep us posted please.

 

[jwells]

Surely if headlight had returned them to be Fogstar to be cycled, as they offered, this saga would have now been satisfactorily concluded?

 

[headlight]

Surely if headlight had returned them to be Fogstar to be cycled, as they offered, this saga would have now been satisfactorily concluded?

They only offered to cycle them for me a few days ago.

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[Dave101]

Fogstar are a battery supplier and they cannot document and provide guidance on every leisure vehicle setup or else they would no doubt be blamed for bad advice if things go wrong. Installation is the responsibility of the end user.

Agreed, but the suppliers want to sell batteries and so make silly statements like "drop in replacement" , there is no such thing! Lithium batteries are very rarely just a drop in replacement, and each instalation can be different. A lot more knowledge is required than just installing simple lead acid batteries.

My opinion FWIW, I would never parallel connect two lithium batteries in that way, I know it is the accepted method for lead acid, but it will confuse the BMS's and always yield unpredictable results. ( I am surprised Fogstar have not picked up on this! )
A far better way is to use 2 busbars, two equal length positive cables (individually fused) to the positive busbar, and two equal length cables to the negative busbar, that way the BMS's will likely see similar loads and the batteries will share the load (or charge) more equally.

I doubt very much the OP has been that unlucky to recieve two faulty batteries, Fogstar sell hundreds!

 

[Dave101]

Good to hear, I think that is decided then I will have them fit the KS Energy.

One thing to mention, the original KS Energy batteries were all cylindrical cells, that, unfortunately that is no longer the case, since the new owners have taken over they have introduced all new batteries using prismatic cells. Not necessarily anything wrong with that, but just don't expect to get a cylindrical cell battery.
As it happens, I have just removed my original KS Energy underseat battery (which has worked flawlessly for over 2 years,) and have changed to a Fogstar battery.. so will probably be selling the KS in due course.

 

[Pausim]

One thing to mention, the original KS Energy batteries were all cylindrical cells, that, unfortunately that is no longer the case, since the new owners have taken over they have introduced all new batteries using prismatic cells. Not necessarily anything wrong with that, but just don't expect to get a cylindrical cell battery.
As it happens, I have just removed my original KS Energy underseat battery (which has worked flawlessly for over 2 years,) and have changed to a Fogstar battery.. so will probably be selling the KS in due course.

Shame about the move from cylindrical to prismatic but I think it is the only way to get higher Ah under seat batteries.

Any particular reason for changing from KS to Fogstar?

 

[headlight]

I have found this in the battery protection history in the app.
BATTERY 1

BATTERY 2

So battery 1 has had 14 cell over voltages, 1 cell under voltage and 1 pack over voltage.
Battery 2 has had 5 cell over voltages and 1 cell under voltage.
Batteries are in parallel, charging sources are Fogstar 20 amp lithium charger, 14.4v charge and Victron MPPT and Sterling B2B both set to lithium 14.2v charge 13.5v float as per instructions.

 

[Lenny HB]

Sounds like one of your chargers is not performing to spec if the BMS reporting is correct.

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[Pausim]

Check your voltages as you turn the various charging sources on and off. My voltage surge happened when I stopped the engine.

 

[Dave101]

Any particular reason for changing from KS to Fogstar?

I have recently changed to a van that uses a compressor fridge and wanted more battery capacity, if KS still did the original underseat battery I would have got a second and paralleled it, sadly the new one will not play well in parallel with the original, so reluctantly, my only option was change to a different battery completely... hence the Fogstar 300ah Drift replaces it.
There is still one cylindrical cell based underseat battery on the market, but for the life of me, I can not remember which manufacturer it is... but it is pricey! 1300 odd..

 

[ChrisL]

I have found this in the battery protection history in the app.
BATTERY 1
View attachment 855754

BATTERY 2

View attachment 855756

So battery 1 has had 14 cell over voltages, 1 cell under voltage and 1 pack over voltage.
Battery 2 has had 5 cell over voltages and 1 cell under voltage.
Batteries are in parallel, charging sources are Fogstar 20 amp lithium charger, 14.4v charge and Victron MPPT and Sterling B2B both set to lithium 14.2v charge 13.5v float as per instructions.

Do you have a Victron shunt with a temperature sensor networked to the Victron MPPT? I'm just wondering if the cold weather is increasing the voltage from the MPPT causing the issue?

 

[Raul]

I have found this in the battery protection history in the app.
BATTERY 1
View attachment 855754

BATTERY 2

View attachment 855756

So battery 1 has had 14 cell over voltages, 1 cell under voltage and 1 pack over voltage.
Battery 2 has had 5 cell over voltages and 1 cell under voltage.
Batteries are in parallel, charging sources are Fogstar 20 amp lithium charger, 14.4v charge and Victron MPPT and Sterling B2B both set to lithium 14.2v charge 13.5v float as per instructions.

It means it activated the cell over voltage protection, not necessarily has been over voltage. And yes, your terminal charging voltage is to high if it triggered the pack voltage as well.

 

[Raul]

I have recently changed to a van that uses a compressor fridge and wanted more battery capacity, if KS still did the original underseat battery I would have got a second and paralleled it, sadly the new one will not play well in parallel with the original, so reluctantly, my only option was change to a different battery completely... hence the Fogstar 300ah Drift replaces it.
There is still one cylindrical cell based underseat battery on the market, but for the life of me, I can not remember which manufacturer it is... but it is pricey! 1300 odd..

Roamer

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[jwells]

Had something similar on mine when I first set it up! Not had anything since I cleared the history 6 months ago!
I did wonder if they were just something left over from the initial build set up.
Now I am trying to get get my head out of the bloody app and just get on with living , just waiting for the bms to go down below freezing so I can see the heater mats work!!
Never had this problem with lead acid, but didn't have an inverter, induction plate, electric kettle, loads of solar, b2b, chargers, fans!!!
Isn't modern off ridding fun!!

 

[headlight]

Sounds like one of your chargers is not performing to spec if the BMS reporting is correct.

On initial first charge at home using Fogstars charger the app reported 14.7v, even though the charger only charges at 14.4v. I immediately turned the charger off.
After half an hour the app was reporting 13.4v so I turned the charger back on and it charged to 100% fine.
This happened with one battery only.

 

[headlight]

It means it activated the cell over voltage protection, not necessarily has been over voltage. And yes, your terminal charging voltage is to high if it triggered the pack voltage as well.

Can you explain what you mean please ?
I have never seen cell voltages above 3.55v on either battery.
The only time I saw high pack voltage was on the initial charge at home on one battery and although the app showed 14.7v my multimeter showed 14.4v when the charger was on and 13.4v when it was off.

 

[DT]

Crikey all this for a battery, technical people will understand everything but as for a layman like me makes me not want the aggravation.

 

[Dave101]

Roamer

No, I don't think so. They always used prismatic cells, and I don't believe they have changed.. same cells as are used in their 460ah battery according to their info..

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[Raul]

No, I don't think so. They always used prismatic cells, and I don't believe they have changed.. same cells as are used in their 460ah battery according to their info..

Pretty sure the roamer 230ah seat base are cylindrical cells. The 460ah came well after their first seat base generation.