Did Anyone Post This On Fun?

[frogijock]

I thought you had to insure in the country you are in if has been more than one year.
Vehicle must be registered in said country before insurance can be given irrespective to length of stay, if vehicle in country more than 6 months then must by law be registered

 

[Mayflower]

Easy . Show them the date on your outbound ferry /channel tunnel ticket.

 

[jumartoo]

It's a good job that no one seems to enforce that particular piece of legislation, there must be many thousands of motorhomes in the Iberian peninsula from all over Europe that would fall foul of that, 30 or 40 at a guess on our site alone.

Any of whom could be in for a shock if involved in an accident and the insurers are on the ball .

 

[Emmit]

Easy . Show them the date on your outbound ferry /channel tunnel ticket.

@Mayflower With respect, that doesn't prove diddly squat if, for instance, you use a Cross Channel ferry and go to the Iberian Peninsular for the winter.

The vast majority of problems will be with snowbirds in Portugal and Spain.

 

[Hilewaychile]

Prove what exactly? With open borders it would be impossible to prove length of stay either way unless someone trawls through any CCTV footage of the crossings for months at a time,highly unlikely.

It's up to you to be able to prove it. That is why it is essential to get a reciept for any sort of purchase, or an ATM reciept, as soon as you cross into the other country. A pit stop for a coffee and not only keep the receipt but photo it and send it to youself on an email, just to be sure. A newspaper of the day, a photo of something which gives the date ... It is your obligation to prove it.

And as for 'trawling thru ...' with ANPR they simply ask the system to find your plate. There are machines outside Tesco in Weston-super-Mare that do this! In order to get out of this Tesco after 30 mins without being sent a stupendous penalty, you have to punch in your vehicle reg. Up comes a photo - instantly - of your wheels, in its parking bay. The machine asks "Is this your vehicle?" On hitting "Yes" the system allows you x mins to get out of the car park.

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[Hilewaychile]

Please explain to me how I or anyone else could prove that a vehicle that is legal in the UK and once it has crossed the channel into the Schengen area could prove either way how long it had been in one particular country.

You have missed the point. You have to be able to prove that you have returned to UK or gone to some other non-Eu country on or before the 90 day d/line. It's your job to prove you were NOT in the Eu country 90 dys after crossing into the zone.

They would say "When did you enter Eu [shorthand for Schengen in this case]? Dover -Calais xx/yy? Prove it"

You come up with your ferry booking, which you have retained in paper or online. That establishes when you arrived. If you cannot do that, you've got problems. As someone has already pointed out, any 'trawling through ANPR records' is your job, not theirs. Maybe, for a fee, this can be done by your port of arrival .. dunno. It certainly will not be accepted as proof until you come up with it and how long might that take? This is one case where you are guilty until you can prove yourself innocent.

 

[Hilewaychile]

I am not doubting your word that they may do that in Spain and possibly Portugal but I think it highly unlikely to be asked if when stopped the vehicle is fully legal and with all the correct documentation from the UK.

I would think that the purpose of the Portuguese checks using UK customs and excise was possibly aimed at something other than vehicles overstaying 180 days and that any vehicles confiscated were not legal in the country of origin.

I agree with your first sentence. In fact, that m.o. is that I have been relying on in my rare trips out in my camper here in VLC. A camper on GB plates trundling about in Spain - along with all the NL, FR, DE etc mh's/campers. If stopped - so far have not - with a full complement of valid UK docs, as long as there has not been an incident of some sort, one should be of no interest to Plod.

But don't think that these countries traffic depts are not up for nailing people/vehicles that do not comply with their local registration and other regs. There's money in it for them. And cooperation with the insurance industry to catch uninsured drivers. And pressure from the politicos to see that these people are doing a job and enforcing the law.

 

[maxi77]

I don't know but the authorities can ask you to prove it. Receipts from fuel, supermarkets bank withdrawals etc.

The onus is on you.

Don't shoot me as the messenger, ask someone in authority.

As an acquaintance of ours found out they can and do use your plate being recorded by the toll cameras on the A22, they hit him with his back tolls and fines, over 1000 euros on the spot.

It was inevitable really, the fine income bounce from checking Portuguese drivers papers, speed traps and breathalyser traps was starting to dry up so who is next, the expats.

 

[Hilewaychile]

@Mayflower With respect, that doesn't prove diddly squat if, for instance, you use a Cross Channel ferry and go to the Iberian Peninsular for the winter.

The vast majority of problems will be with snowbirds in Portugal and Spain.

Exactly. It shows when you arrived. It shows the date when the 90 day clock started ticking. What interests Plod now is - "Why are you still here? 90 days was up X weeks ago?"

 

[Hilewaychile]

Drive from spain to france, buy a newspaper, take a pic of your car in front of a french town name sign with the newspaper in the windscreen
Drive back to spain ?

That will do until Brexit. Then you must leave the Eu - all of it.

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[JJ]

That will do until Brexit. Then you must leave the Eu - all of it.

Are you sure about that?

Source of information would be appreciated.


JJ

 

[Hilewaychile]

How was/is it possible to get a Spanish ITV on a UK registered vehicle?

Exactly. You can't

 

[Hilewaychile]

So every time a foreign vehicle is stopped for a check in Spain the driver will be asked to prove how long the vehicle has been in the country despite everything being legal otherwise?

Possibly. They could do that. Up to them. I've been stopped twice in France and only been asked for my p/port because what this bunch of Plod were interested in was 'suitcase money' first time [just before intro of the €] and drugs second time. I volunteered to show my UK vehicle docs - they didn't want to see them.

 

[Hilewaychile]

Are you sure about that?

Source of information would be appreciated.


JJ

I copied this from the European Commission 'Schengen Area - Entry And Stay" 4th papragraph

"The definition of short stay of non-EU citizens in the Schengen area is "90 days in any 180 days period" The short-stay calculator can be used for calculating the period of allowed stay."

Once we are Brexited, as per this €7 bit of paper they've come up with, 90 days it is.

 

[Deleted member 57092]

In the UK you can issue an MOT to whatever plate is on the car, including a foreign one (or you could when I last tested about three years ago)
If its a new import with no plates on it you could even type ‘none displayed’ in the number plate box and issue the mot on the chassis number.
Don’t know if this is the same in Spain etc ??

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[Hilewaychile]

Gus Lopez said "The same as in Spain it is not possible to legally register rh drive commercial vehicles which includes any van based motorhome".

This, I am assured, is not the case.

1] I know for a fact of a Brit builder in a village just south of VLV who has re-reg his plain vanilla Transit RHD van. My gestora did it for him.
2] There is an outfit in Orihuela that does this.

I have been in extensive correspondence with this guy and quote some of what he has assured me to be the case.

If you are going to buy a non-homologated vehicle, this in principle can be re-registered whether RHD or LHD and with or without a DIY unit! * However, to do so, you must have owned it (as per the registration document) before you obtained your FIRST Padron meaning that it can be inspected at the ITV station under the “change of residence” regime

* He is referring to my self-build camper.

I sent this, asking for his comment. It is from the Citizens' Advice Bureau for Brits in Spain.

He replied

The information is largely correct, but a vehicle such as yours being inspected and registered under “ change of residence” is not a problem. In practice this means that your first Padron is dated after the vehicle was registered to you in your home country. This is not the practice throughout all of Spain as certain regions require the residency document, but not in the Community of Valencia

On their website is this Cars, motorcycles and campervans, whether right or left- hand drive can be imported under "Change of Residence."

So, I will continue to question this assurance but as things stand, he is confident that he can do it, as he has "For over 1600 British vehicles so far"

Vamos a ver.

 

[maxi77]

Gus Lopez said "The same as in Spain it is not possible to legally register rh drive commercial vehicles which includes any van based motorhome".

This, I am assured, is not the case.

1] I know for a fact of a Brit builder in a village just south of VLV who has re-reg his plain vanilla Transit RHD van. My gestora did it for him.
2] There is an outfit in Orihuela that does this.

I have been in extensive correspondence with this guy and quote some of what he has assured me to be the case.

If you are going to buy a non-homologated vehicle, this in principle can be re-registered whether RHD or LHD and with or without a DIY unit! * However, to do so, you must have owned it (as per the registration document) before you obtained your FIRST Padron meaning that it can be inspected at the ITV station under the “change of residence” regime

* He is referring to my self-build camper.

I sent this, asking for his comment. It is from the Citizens' Advice Bureau for Brits in Spain.

He replied

The information is largely correct, but a vehicle such as yours being inspected and registered under “ change of residence” is not a problem. In practice this means that your first Padron is dated after the vehicle was registered to you in your home country. This is not the practice throughout all of Spain as certain regions require the residency document, but not in the Community of Valencia

On their website is this Cars, motorcycles and campervans, whether right or left- hand drive can be imported under "Change of Residence."

So, I will continue to question this assurance but as things stand, he is confident that he can do it, as he has "For over 1600 British vehicles so far"

Vamos a ver.

I have heard of Mazda Bongos being matriculated in Spain and there is actually a Spanish company which will convert the headlamps to LDH

 

[gus-lopez]

Maybe we are unlucky but we are often pulled.
I have been stopped twice in one day. Bob.

Dodgy looking that's why.

In the UK you can issue an MOT to whatever plate is on the car, including a foreign one (or you could when I last tested about three years ago)
If its a new import with no plates on it you could even type ‘none displayed’ in the number plate box and issue the mot on the chassis number.
Don’t know if this is the same in Spain etc ??

They'll itv (mot) it here but it has no actual value.

Gus Lopez said "The same as in Spain it is not possible to legally register rh drive commercial vehicles which includes any van based motorhome".

This, I am assured, is not the case.

1] I know for a fact of a Brit builder in a village just south of VLV who has re-reg his plain vanilla Transit RHD van. My gestora did it for him.
2] There is an outfit in Orihuela that does this.

I have been in extensive correspondence with this guy and quote some of what he has assured me to be the case.

If you are going to buy a non-homologated vehicle, this in principle can be re-registered whether RHD or LHD and with or without a DIY unit! * However, to do so, you must have owned it (as per the registration document) before you obtained your FIRST Padron meaning that it can be inspected at the ITV station under the “change of residence” regime

* He is referring to my self-build camper.

I sent this, asking for his comment. It is from the Citizens' Advice Bureau for Brits in Spain.

He replied

The information is largely correct, but a vehicle such as yours being inspected and registered under “ change of residence” is not a problem. In practice this means that your first Padron is dated after the vehicle was registered to you in your home country. This is not the practice throughout all of Spain as certain regions require the residency document, but not in the Community of Valencia

On their website is this Cars, motorcycles and campervans, whether right or left- hand drive can be imported under "Change of Residence."

So, I will continue to question this assurance but as things stand, he is confident that he can do it, as he has "For over 1600 British vehicles so far"

Vamos a ver.

It is down here. You cannot re.register any type of commercial vehicle on the grounds of reduced visibility which is what we are always told that exists under spanish law.
as I said in Alicante area you can. I've seen rhd vans on spanish plates & also rhd van based pvc's but you cannot get it done here.
I was in an itv station in Lorca re-registering a lhdrive van & assisted the staff & owner of a Ford transit motorhome as to where the chassis number was stamped on the chassis.
Whilst waiting the reply came from Madrid that they could not do it as the steering wheel was on the wrong side for a commercial vehicle based motorhome.& this was a purpose built multi windowed campervan.
With actual rh drive vans that have been re-registered I often wonder what would happen in an injury accident that went to court? At the back of my mind I am sure there was a case which went to court & the judge just removed the vehicles registration as it "was not correct & illegal under spanish law" .

 

[jockaneezer]

Do they have RHD road sweepers (commercial vehicle) in Spain, same as we have LHD ones over here ?

 

[Hilewaychile]

Gus said "It is down here".

As we know, the rules in Spain seem to be interpreted or applied differently in different areas, even in the same province. I have seen threads on the expatforum where people have said they could not get residency before signing up on Padrón and others the other way round, in VLC Communidad. Before I commit any money to this - total is quoted as about 1000€ - I will mosey down there and have a 'dry run' with his ITV man and whoever else is involved.

But this guy has a business doing this.

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[Hilewaychile]

I have heard of Mazda Bongos being matriculated in Spain and there is actually a Spanish company which will convert the headlamps to LDH

Headlamps to LHD is a doddle. I have already bought a set and my auto-electrician pal back in UK says it should take me 10 mins. Videos on the web seem to indicate that that's about right - for my van.

 

[Emmit]

Exactly. It shows when you arrived. It shows the date when the 90 day clock started ticking. What interests Plod now is - "Why are you still here? 90 days was up X weeks ago?"

But it's 90 days per country, Not 90 days in the whole of Europe. Therefore, it's not when you arrive, but where you are 90days after. If you're not in the country you arrived in, then, no problem.

 

[Deleted member 57092]

Unfortunately its 90 days in 180 in the shengen zone .
Unless you have a residents visa somewhere.
But
Hopefully our government might get some improvements on that for some countries.

 

[maxi77]

Headlamps to LHD is a doddle. I have already bought a set and my auto-electrician pal back in UK says it should take me 10 mins. Videos on the web seem to indicate that that's about right - for my van.

Only if they make LHD headlights, they have never been made for the Mazda Bongo. Mine in Portugal used headlights out of an astra with some minor surgery. Not only passed IPT here but also UK MOT when it was brought back into the UK