Buy British, why not?

[pandas]

As an aside on this point, the design or cars and motorhomes really isn't that dissimilar. Most large motoring consortiums will design a common "platform"/chassis that will then be used across multiple brands and models. Really the only difference you are paying for between those models is the badge on the front and some upholstery and minor styling differences.

totally disagree about your point about the only differences...the construction of the body is one of the the most significant differentiators. Bonded aluminium bodies, no joints etc etc. Saw on one of the several motorhome programs on the box earlier this year a walk around one of the largest UK motorhome manufacturers factory - basically a timber stud work timber frame stuffed with insulation and clad in aluminium panels.

 

[Coolcats]

totally disagree about your point about the only differences...the construction of the body is one of the the most significant differentiators. Bonded aluminium bodies, no joints etc etc. Saw on one of the several motorhome programs on the box earlier this year a walk around one of the largest UK motorhome manufacturers factory - basically a timber stud work timber frame stuffed with insulation and clad in aluminium panels.

Was that the one where they showed the furniture fitted to the side panels then lifted in to position when the walls were raised ?

 

[The Lord Squid]

VAG brands in pecking order by price and/or badge snobbery:

Bentley
Bugatti
Lamborghini
Audi
VW
Skoda
SEAT (and now Cupra)

Did I miss anything out?

Yes - Porsche (and Ducati).

 

[pandas]

How do you double the value of a Skoda?...Fill the petrol tank.

not with the price of fuel right now

 

[pandas]

Was that the one where they showed the furniture fitted to the side panels then lifted in to position when the walls were raised ?

not sure but I was surprised they thought it would present a positive spin on the brand.

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[jongood]

What an odd thing to say. A motorhome never gives you the same lifestyle as at home. The bathroom is just one example. You either accept walking to the shower block on a cold wet morning or make do with a lesser shower, and having to empty the loo fairly frequently. Completely different to going into the en-suite on a morning.

Yes, today there are many creature comforts in a motorhome, but it is a very different lifestyle as far as I am concerned. This is one of the things I have enjoyed over many years of camping/trailer tents/caravanning and motorhoming, otherwise I might as well just forget the motorhome and stay at home.

Travel always entails some level of discomfort. A 4 hour wait in an airport lounge is nothing like being in my sitting room watching TV. A long haul flight is inevitably . I do envy Harry Potter sometimes.

I would disagree totally with this. If you re finding travel very uncomfortable then you re doing something wrong. Our shower is better than some hotels and definitely better than a lot of campsites. Our insulated box has everything we need, is roomy and draughtfree. and unlike many hotels etc we can have it the temperature we want it.

 

[minesapint]

Imo UK manufacturers are still building caravans without the towbar, nothing I've seen from a home made brand would make me buy one but I know they have faithfull customers who love them

We have a Burstner, Sovereign, it was not built with a tow bar in mind either.
We had one fitted at £1250.

The quality of this van is nowhere near as good as our previous vans a 2004 Dethleffs, or our 2010 Hobby.

it seems weight and profit and volume is eating into quality.

 

[MikeMex]

We’ve had a Bailey Motorhome for 4 years now and we love it. As with anything, there will always be minor things that go wrong like the sliding door to the bedroom came adrift from one of the rollers. Simple fix using slightly longer and larger screws. Had a BMW 520D tourer from new for 5 years. Absolutely brilliant car, but now have a Ford Mustang Mach-e (fully electric). Wow the build quality on the Mach-e is superb, Ford certainly have put some real effort into this vehicle (built in Mexico apparently), and the gadgets it has are far more than the BMW. We love it, it drives well, accelerates like hell, vehicle tax free and to date the cost to charge in the 1000 miles of ownership is £20 (we live in Scotland where certain EV charging stations are free to use ). At the end of the day, buy what you believe suits your needs. We don’t unfortunately always get that right

 

[PaddyM]

I tend to agree with you.

There are no new British cars; even Morgan is foreign-owned. This national one-upmanship is based largely on bonnet badge snobbery and brand image. Reliability surveys are the the better measure of quality than subjective perceptions about interior plastics and the latest dashboard toys.

How many British-owned volume motorhome manufacturers / PVC converters are there today? Swift, and Bailey? For how much longer ...

Hymer Group itself is no longer German, having been acquired by Thor Industries of the USA.

FIAT Chrysler and PSA (which now includes Vauxhall) have merged into the forgettably-named Stellantis. They have over 80% of the motorhome chassis market in Europe. That's a monopoly by any other name, meaning customers like us have little else to choose from except a limited range of VW or Mercedes based conversions, and the premium pricing that goes with those badges. Unless you opt for the big MHs over 5 tonne GVW.

There are no new British cars …… Norwich is in Britain last time I looked …..

Emira - Lotus Cars Official Website - For the Drivers

www.lotuscars.com

And I do know Geely now own the company

 

[L' Hobo]

And I do know Geely now own the company

Who are, I believe, Chinese???

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[The Wino]

There are no new British cars …… Norwich is in Britain last time I looked …..

Emira - Lotus Cars Official Website - For the Drivers

www.lotuscars.com

And I do know Geely now own the company

I think we're back to the mini or Aston Martin question again. Maybe the previous poster ought to have said no practical affordable everyday modes of transport but just used the word car. I like classic cars but admit they're hobby vehicles .

 

[L' Hobo]

I think we're back to the mini or Aston Martin question again. Maybe the previous poster ought to have said no practical affordable everyday modes of transport but just used the word car. I like classic cars but admit they're hobby vehicles .

I have been driving my 1989 VW T25 Westfalia California (which is thought of as a 'classic') as an everyday driver (when I'm not out in my Murvi) for the past 10yrs and a similar 1984 self build version since 1987 (until I sold it earlier this year)

EDIT: ALL mine were built in Breman, I really do think it makes a difference WHERE your vehicles produced.

 

[Garry - June]

And there is a reason why a VW transporter is a desirable vehicle, comfy drives well and well built. Small enough to be used and parked on a drive not overly tall or long it’s about as perfect a van as you can buy. Also it has that camper icon lifestyle status that other vans do not have.

Maybe all this is just shallow nonsense but you pays your money and takes your choice. Mine has increased in price over the past two years.

Whilst they are great vans that drive like a car unlike the lotus it understeers when cornering which can be disconcerting….then I remember it’s just a van

Been there and got the T-shirt with VW transporters... some of the most overhyped overpriced vehicles on the road.... you are paying a huge premium because of one thing...the scene..

 

[L' Hobo]

Been there and got the T-shirt with VW transporters... some of the most overhyped overpriced vehicles on the road.... you are paying a huge premium because of one thing...the scene..

but isn't the 'scene', like belonging to FUN, worth it to some people? (but, I agree, NOT if it's costing a fortune to the detriment of other things)

 

[The Wino]

I have been driving my 1989 VW T25 Westfalia California (which is thought of as a 'classic') as an everyday driver (when I'm not out in my Murvi) for the past 10yrs and a similar 1984 self build version since 1987 (until I sold it earlier this year)

EDIT: ALL mine were built in Breman, I really do think it makes a difference WHERE your vehicles produced.

I'm sure there are quite a few who use various things as their everyday transport but on the scale of the population as a whole classics are a hobby.

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[cyberyacht]

Folkranger wrote: "My Elddis caravan cost me the best part of 2 grand to repair damp after only three years. My daughter's Elddis caravan leaked after three years (2 years ago). Solid construction it's called."

It's an acronym. Soggy Or Lets In Damp. I had the kitchen floor replaced in a three year old Elddis moho.

 

[Richard Mason]

Many on this forum, including myself, would say that continental models especially German are better than British. Now a typical German model could cost some £40k more than its British equivalent. But £40k more?

I think it may be an out of date theory based on British manufacturers chucking vans out before fixing them after delivery.
I had a brand new Rapido 650ff and got shut for a 2007 Rapido 7099f which is so much better built and after replacing a few things it’s better than a new Rapido in my eyes.
Amateur reviewers looking at new vans would be more interesting if they reviewed a manufacturers new release against the same manufacturers similar layout from say 10 years ago. I honestly think that all the manufacturers do is cut corners to make more profit. After all every van has a bathroom, bedroom and kitchen and lounge area.
An example, my new rapido had windows that opened outwards whereas the older one has slide windows where they might get damaged say by the hab door opening, Internal fittings are the same. Dometic make shelves and door fittings for its fridges designed to break. In my older van they were made of soft plastic which is impossible to break. Interestingly none of the old fittings fit the new fridge which is the same size externally.
I was quoted by Rapido £340 for a bathroom door handle! My new fridge which I was forced to replace due to the cooler matrix not being made now my Dometic, cost me £2500.
Ladies and gentlemen we are the fools for buying new vans. A 10 year old van costs half as much so even with a few things to sort you end up with a van that will last for years. WE should stop falling into the cheap and nasty trap set for us by manufacturers.
My Rapido 7099f cost £34000 at top end of the hike last year. Ive had a new clutch and fridge costing £4000 to sort. I should get most covered on the warranty but Serenity Leisure has the usual caveat filled warranty. ( avoid if you want serenity in your life and a Moho that’s been checked prior to delivery) Bottom line is that for £40000 I have a fab motorhome, well built FSH with 13000 miles on it ( yes 13 000 miles only) and a motorhome which I love to bits. Its like living in an arts and crafts refectory. NO rattles or squeaks and tons of storage and space. Think! You can poilish a turd but what’s more important is was the motorhome constructed with quality ingredients? Sorry.

 

[Richard Mason]

Many on this forum, including myself, would say that continental models especially German are better than British. Now a typical German model could cost some £40k more than its British equivalent. But £40k more?

I think it may be an out of date theory based on British manufacturers chucking vans out before fixing them after delivery.
I had a brand new Rapido 650ff and got shut for a 2007 Rapido 7099f which is so much better built and after replacing a few things it’s better than a new Rapido in my eyes.
Amateur reviewers looking at new vans would be more interesting if they reviewed a manufacturers new release against the same manufacturers similar layout from say 10 years ago. I honestly think that all the manufacturers do is cut corners to make more profit. After all every van has a bathroom, bedroom and kitchen and lounge area.
An example, my new rapido had windows that opened outwards whereas the older one has slide windows where they might get damaged say by the hab door opening, Internal fittings are the same. Dometic make shelves and door fittings for its fridges designed to break. In my older van they were made of soft plastic which is impossible to break. Interestingly none of the old fittings fit the new fridge which is the same size externally.
I was quoted by Rapido £340 for a bathroom door handle! My new fridge which I was forced to replace due to the cooler matrix not being made now my Dometic, cost me £2500.
Ladies and gentlemen we are the fools for buying new vans. A 10 year old van costs half as much so even with a few things to sort you end up with a van that will last for years. WE should stop falling into the cheap and nasty trap set for us by manufacturers.
My Rapido 7099f cost £34000 at top end of the hike last year. Ive had a new clutch and fridge costing £4000 to sort. I should get most covered on the warranty but Serenity Leisure has the usual caveat filled warranty. ( avoid if you want serenity in your life and a Moho that’s been checked prior to delivery) Bottom line is that for £40000 I have a fab motorhome, well built FSH with 13000 miles on it ( yes 13 000 miles only) and a motorhome which I love to bits. Its like living in an arts and crafts refectory. NO rattles or squeaks and tons of storage and space. Think! You can poilish a turd but what’s more important is was the motorhome constructed with quality ingredients? Sorry.

 

[SpeedyDux]

EDIT: ALL mine were built in Breman, I really do think it makes a difference WHERE your vehicles produced.

My V6 Vectra B was built in Belgium and that showed in the build quality compared with most other Vauxhalls of the same era built in the UK. I know, Clarkson despised all Vectras, but mine was one of the best cars to drive I ever owned or borrowed even Merc and Beemers. Sad to see it go.

 

[Otter Spotter]

My question wasn’t a serious question but rather intended to draw a parallel with the OP’s question; in reality it’s a non-question, a bit like comparing apples and pears.

Ian

Don’t worry, mine wasn’t a serious answer

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[Ian789]

We had a VW California for a long time before moving to a PVC. I wonder how much droends on volume manufactured. The scale of manufacturing meant the california finish was really excellent, all moulded trim and panels etc, no carpet trim. A big advantage was the VW manufacturers warranty, supported dealer wide. If Fiat partnered with van converter(s) and offered the same support I think they'd get a reaaly good market share and likely they'd force other converters and dealers to up their game.

 

[jongood]

We have a Burstner, Sovereign, it was not built with a tow bar in mind either.
We had one fitted at £1250.

The quality of this van is nowhere near as good as our previous vans a 2004 Dethleffs, or our 2010 Hobby.

it seems weight and profit and volume is eating into quality.

My understanding of that post was that some british manufacturers were not making a bespoke motorhome but marrying up a caravan layout with a van chassis.

 

[oggiebedworth]

We are on our second LHD imported HymerExcis-i - ex rental models - this one was rented out 4 times - we got it at the end of the season - via mobile.de The currency fluctuations are challenging - pound was at 1.41 for the fist one and 1.14 for this one, but still good value. Servicing is expensive - Travelworld - and parts, but it has to be undertaken for the first 5 years to maintain the habitation warranty. Any Fiat dealer will do the engine etc service, or any registered garage - under the Fiat scheme - which is much more flexible. If you dont fancy buying from the website - although its often Hymer dealers who are advertising, there is a large well recommended motorhome depot in Belgium where lots of folk get their habitation checks done - much cheaper than the UK equivalent - on their trip away, or on the way back. Everyone’s experience is different - we all make mistakes - so just crack on

 

[RubyOptics]

totally disagree about your point about the only differences...the construction of the body is one of the the most significant differentiators. Bonded aluminium bodies, no joints etc etc. Saw on one of the several motorhome programs on the box earlier this year a walk around one of the largest UK motorhome manufacturers factory - basically a timber stud work timber frame stuffed with insulation and clad in aluminium panels.

I think you have got the wrong end of the stick here. I was replying to a post where it was stated that "cars, unlike motorhomes, are all different". I was showing how the car trade completely does the same thing as the motorhome trade.

 

[pandas]

I think you have got the wrong end of the stick here. I was replying to a post where it was stated that "cars, unlike motorhomes, are all different". I was showing how the car trade completely does the same thing as the motorhome trade.I agree forthe chassis

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[Riftzoner]

Agree about the caravan part but that mainly applies to layout and furniture quality, The rest is the same base vehicle, chassis and appliances as most others.

Yes, completely agree. We suffered a serious/unsafe fault on our brand new (March 2021) Pilote P696D Evidence but that was due to a build quality issue with the Fiat base chassis. Basically human or machine decided an extra bolt was required to be left floating around inside a rear wheel hub! Result, one destroyed ABS, Hub & stub axle inluding no stability nor ABS function 250 miles from home. As for layouts & furniture quality we fully researched the models available with the same or similar layout as ours, longitudal seating, bed in the ceiling, proper shower with independent cublice, decent garage (you get the picture) British, if possible. Results Bailey Adamo, dreadful build quality with cheap looking kitchen, light fittings that had been screwed so tight they’d distorted the chrome bases & a wood panel that was hanging off on the display model & on inspection it was no surprise as the screws weren’t the right size for the load, the list goes on, Burstner Lyseo, I liked but just too expensive with an option list that would have meant adding a massive additional cost just to get one or two additions, Chausson 650 Titanium, now I loved that vehicle with it’s Ford base but anecdotal quality issue evidence put me off which left me with the Pilote P696D Evidence, great price, very few extras you’d even want to fit (all dealer fit as there are no factory options on the Evidence range) plus a great build quality. Only downside, absolutely rubbish infotainment system (which ironically is being sorted on the 2022 models with a Pioneer unit replacing the rubbish idme unit). So that’s what lead me to where I am now & much the happier for it (Though I still like the Burstner & maybe a silver Adria but don’t tell the wife!), I love my Pilote.

 

[Tombola]

Tracker was lacking in quality of build due to lightweight plywood not holding doors on as I had to virtually bolt every hing back on as screws would not hold.

Same as ame on my Brand new Autotrail Imala.
And the cupbard locks all bar 2 fell off/came loose, towle rail, toilet roll holder, mesh door frme round door, sticky cupboard door close buffer cane away, stove top glass lid came loose and fell off mid drive, switch for hab elecs and cab elecs charging was wired wrong way round, extractor fan crackefd where screws had been over tightened came away after 1 week, revers cam didnt work after 3 weeks, audio unut was changed twice..
I could go on

 

[L' Hobo]

We had a VW California for a long time before moving to a PVC. I wonder how much droends on volume manufactured. The scale of manufacturing meant the california finish was really excellent, all moulded trim and panels etc, no carpet trim. A big advantage was the VW manufacturers warranty, supported dealer wide. If Fiat partnered with van converter(s) and offered the same support I think they'd get a reaaly good market share and likely they'd force other converters and dealers to up their game.

The story goes, that in the era (1989) when mine was built, Westfalia had a man, who's ONLY job was to stand at the end of the Transporter Mini-bus line and hand pick the vehicles destined for the Westfalia Works.
IF that's true or not, I don't know but it would make sense and I believe it!

 

[Speve]

Same as ame on my Brand new Autotrail Imala.
And the cupbard locks all bar 2 fell off/came loose, towle rail, toilet roll holder, mesh door frme round door, sticky cupboard door close buffer cane away, stove top glass lid came loose and fell off mid drive, switch for hab elecs and cab elecs charging was wired wrong way round, extractor fan crackefd where screws had been over tightened came away after 1 week, revers cam didnt work after 3 weeks, audio unut was changed twice..
I could go on

All irritating problems that could have been avoided if Autotrail had done there research and development a little more scrupulously keep your chin up the radio www rubbish in our Tracker

 

[Phileas Fogg]

My Autosleeper went wrong on our last trip, Truma Combi 4 wouldn't heat the water, really isn't good enough that is the second time in 11 years it has had a problem. The first one was unforgivable, the screw came out of the handle on the skylight and it fell off. I had to stop and screw it back on. Disgusting.
Would I pay £90K for a new one..... no.
Would I sell my 99% reliable and oh so comfortable van for the kudos of owning the latest model even though I could easily afford it... no.
Are foreign vans better than British, seems no matter where it was built you get a good 'un, you get a good 'un, if you don't ....... .

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