Burnt out Sargent EM40 unit (2 Viewers)

[Cockers]

Well our road trip has come to an unexpected halt Today travelled down through France and into Spain driving passed Albox on the E-15 A-7 heading toward Almeria and smelt the dreaded electrical burning smell and smoke started coming from the drivers side footwell, we had a very quick stop and switched everything off.
contacted Sargent and explained what had happened, explained the earth wires from the vehicle battery in side had melted and burnt out. I asked if if they could send me a new unit which I’m waiting to find out if they will send a unit to Spain. Strangely they said I would need a new EM40 unit and the repair wiring harness, i found it strange they have a repair harness to hand, which makes me feel there has been a problem with their wiring. I asked if it’s happened a lot to be told a few have had this issue.
really interested if anyone else has had the problem. And if anyone know of anywhere in Spain that may be able to assist.
by unplugging everything from the unit I can still drive the van but nothing is working in the hab area. The van is an Autotrail Dakota 2015.

 

[Mick and Ruth]

It’s a simple replacement to do, however ……. Replacing it doesn’t solve the problem as it will happen again sometime in the future. I would consider it a “get me home” solution and then look for something more permanent (and safer).

Any ideas? I am a novice to this unfortunately.

hi Mick

it’s a very common issue especially on Autotrails, i’d urge you to also check the harness beteeen the 3 stage charger and Sargent unit, a completely different issue but once again very common and melted everything

Same thing, crap connectors and inferior capacity carryring cabling, if they charged us another £10 and used quality components this would never happen.

Hope you get sorted soon mate

Al

Thanks mate I will liaise with a motorhome electrician when I get home and see options open. Hope your both well, maybe see you in warmer climates early next year

 

[Al n Val]

Any ideas? I am a novice to this unfortunately.

Thanks mate I will liaise with a motorhome electrician when I get home and see options open. Hope your both well, maybe see you in warmer climates early next year

We arrived in Spain on friday Mick after a month in Germany Poland Switzerland and Italy.

BTW. Sargent advised my mate Tude to use the fridge on gas whilst travelling to lighten the load on the EM40, it’s not the correct solution imho but at least it’s not happened to him since.

He’s now done away with the problem by recently replacing his 3 way tec tower unit after replacing it 3 times due to them packing in with a compressor fridge/freezer and very pleased with it.

 

[Mick and Ruth]

Thanks for info mate I will do some digging when I get home. We are still out for another 4 weeks hopefully then heading south for winter.

 

[Al n Val]

Thanks for info mate I will do some digging when I get home. We are still out for another 4 weeks hopefully then heading south for winter.

you might want to check this out Mick

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[Mick and Ruth]

Thanks mate I’ve emailed them

 

[Mick and Ruth]

Just chased up my package from Sergeant after two hours find out it’s stuck in Irish customs since Sunday but have not informed me. €27 later it will now be with me within 3-5 days

 

[Al n Val]

Just chased up my package from Sergeant after two hours find out it’s stuck in Irish customs since Sunday but have not informed me. €27 later it will now be with me within 3-5 days

Don’t chuck the burnt one away Mick

 

[Mick and Ruth]

Don’t chuck the burnt one away Mick

He’s already contacted me and I will be sending once I get back to England next month.

 

[AlnJill]

I am currently stuck in Ireland with the same problem, your pictures could have been taken in my van. I managed to get to my cousins house in Sligo and parked on his drive waiting the delivery of the EM 40 panel. RAC diagnosed wrong as once they ruled out mechanical issues are a bit hit and mis re anything in hab so rang Sergeant whos technician immediately told me it would be EM40 and told me where it was once I lifted it out red fuse was melted. The technician told me the wires just need cutting and crimping and are sending me out a new RASC repair kit as well. I contacted a nearby motorhome dealer to see if he could do a temp job or had one on the shelf and he apologised and said he couldn’t and he asked how old van was I said 2019 and h0e said he had replaced 3 in last 6 weeks.Do I need to do anything else apart from that? I was wondering is it worth getting a mechanic to do or is is a simple replacement? Thanks in advance
PS one positive is my cousin lives on Wild Atlantic Way

View attachment 813561

Hi. Mick n Ruth. Hope you got home from the HUB safely. Rough crossing i.m sure. Appreciate the info on the EM40 and followed discussion here. So executive decision made not to use fridge on battery until such times a wiring upgrade is performed. So didnt get to say goodbye , the zzzzz's stiil coming outa your vents but we thought it was better staying ahead of the storm and had a good run up. Best wishes. AlnJill

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[Mick and Ruth]

We were just showering mate when you left as I said to Ruth Al and Jill have just gone we have just got to my cousins in Dublin as sailing tomorrow thankfully so missing the storm. Glad you got back safely and was good meeting you both

 

[Al n Val]

Did you get it sorted Mick?

 

[Mick and Ruth]

Did you get it sorted Mick?

Yes thanks mate for the time being. I’m going to sort something when I get back to England as I’m concerned about running the fridge now on the battery when driving.

 

[TheBig1]

Looks like Apuljak beat me to it, I was considering doing the same, Making a much better PCB to replace the one that is on the EM40. The connectors used allow the weight of the wires to pull on the plug which adds to the poor contacts in the plug. The burnt plug is the incoming power from the battery so handles the maximum current on the board, so the most likely to fail and a fire risk

 

[AlnJill]

Whilst you’re at it i’d also check the harness between the Sargent unit and the 3d rage charger, that also is prone to burning

Sorry, feeding you duff info. It is a while since I did it so thought I would have a look.
The theory is the red plug carriers to 12v supply from the battery. Reducing the demand on this plug by removing the fridge heater supply means the RED plug is carrying a lot less current.
So I have removed the GREEN plug.
I have a red wire from the battery +ve connected to the TWO Red/Yellow wires.
I have a Black wire from the battery -ve connected top the TWO White/Black wires. These were removed from the Black plug which is still in situ but just with the small yellow wire connected.
Photos to follow in a minute.

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[AlnJill]

Looks like Apuljak beat me to it, I was considering doing the same, Making a much better PCB to replace the one that is on the EM40. The connectors used allow the weight of the wires to pull on the plug which adds to the poor contacts in the plug. The burnt plug is the incoming power from the battery so handles the maximum current on the board, so the most likely to fail and a fire risk

To the big1. Following this thread with interest. Can i ask ? If you mostly use the fridge on 12v whilst engine running thereby using the d+ alt connection. Could you just pull fuse on battery direct to fridge heater or does the d+ connector have same problems with wiring and contacts?
Alan.

 

[TheBig1]

To the big1. Following this thread with interest. Can i ask ? If you mostly use the fridge on 12v whilst engine running thereby using the d+ alt connection. Could you just pull fuse on battery direct to fridge heater or does the d+ connector have same problems with wiring and contacts?
Alan.

The D+ from the alternator is used to switch a relay on, that takes power direct from the battery to the fridge. The same is true for charging the battery on most motorhomes, unless upgraded to a battery to battery B2B charger.

Modern 3way fridges in motorhomes select the power source automatically and prioritises as, if the engine running will use the battery, when stopped it will look for mains 240v first then if not light the gas. Some folk override this and run on gas when driving, but this presents a danger when topping up the fuel.

 

[AlnJill]

The D+ from the alternator is used to switch a relay on, that takes power direct from the battery to the fridge. The same is true for charging the battery on most motorhomes, unless upgraded to a battery to battery B2B charger.

Modern 3way fridges in motorhomes select the power source automatically and prioritises as, if the engine running will use the battery, when stopped it will look for mains 240v first then if not light the gas. Some folk override this and run on gas when driving, but this presents a danger when topping up the fuel.

Many thanks for taking time to respond. I havent had the problem as yet but wish to avoid, having met with mick and ruth who had this problem on a recent trip away.

Thanks again
Alan

 

[TheLifeofBrian]

Hi all,
slightly off this topic but my friend has an Autotrail Warwick XL 2019 and is having intermittent problems with his wiring.
The EC480 controller keeps showing the vehicle battery as 4.7v when it has over 12.5. Could this Em40 have anything to do with that? Hi leisure battery also keeps going flat and is only weeks old?

 

[GeoffnDee]

TheLifeofBrian , When the EM40 module is faulty there is often signs of burned/poor connections on the rear of the unit or at the 20 amp vehicle battery fuse on the front of the EM40 , either could cause odd EC480 controller readings for the vehicle battery.
Has the new leisure battery been checked to confirm it is ok ?

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[Jonno1103]

Both the EM40 & EM55 have the same thermal runaway issue. The EM55 has recently been replaced by the EM56.

 

[TheLifeofBrian]

TheLifeofBrian , When the EM40 module is faulty there is often signs of burned/poor connections on the rear of the unit or at the 20 amp vehicle battery fuse on the front of the EM40 , either could cause odd EC480 controller readings for the vehicle battery.
Has the new leisure battery been checked to confirm it is ok ?

I checked as much as I could at the time but have since found out about the EM40 so will have a look at that & check the leisure battery next time I can get over to him.

 

[GeoffnDee]

TheLifeofBrian , I do not know if you are aware , but there is useful information regarding the EM40 connections and their functions to be found at www.sargentltd.co.uk , in their support section, which also shows the rear of the unit and its layout.

 

[pjay]

I've got an ENC Fifer which is fitted with the EM40, I've just had a look on the Sargent site and they now have an updated EM41 fuse box to cope with higher currents and lithium.
No problems so far but I don't want any of the above happening to me in the middle of nowhere so do you think it be worth upgrading to the new fusebox? I have a factory fitted compressor fridge too if thats relevant...

EM41 Kit | Shop | Sargent Electrical

TIA

Pete

 

[Cockers]

That almost sound like Sargent are admitting there may have be a problem with their EM40 unit. ???

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[pjay]

That almost sound like Sargent are admitting there may have be a problem with their EM40 unit. ???

Yep, realise that, my van is 3 years old and no probs so far, just wondering if its worth upgrading, although it ain't cheap.

 

[Mick and Ruth]

Yep, realise that, my van is 3 years old and no probs so far, just wondering if its worth upgrading, although it ain't cheap.

Mines 4 years old next month and has done a lot in warmer climes, but I'm a bit miffed they didn't even suggest this when replacing my EM40 in Ireland a few weeks ago, knowing it was probably the high pull from the fridge by diagnosing the issue it in about 10 seconds over the phone.

 

[pjay]

Thanks, was it a compressor fridge?

 

[Mick and Ruth]

Thanks, was it a compressor fridge?

Its a Thetford 3000 model C1 and I've already had to replace the PCB under warranty as something on that had burnt out, don't know if its related to the other issue with EM40.

 

[geordiesteve]

Forgive my stupidity but where is the EM40 (if I have one) located in my 2013 Apache 634

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[Cockers]

The EM40 is normally behind the driver’s seat Sargent have now upgraded the EM40 to the EM41 I think they have now realised the EM40 wasn’t up to the job