Build quality question

[SueRL]

Morning all

For those of you familiar with these makes, what order would you put them in overall in terms of build quality and/or reliability? 1 - 6 with 1 being best.

Pilote
Chausson
Fleurette/Florium
Rollerteam
Bailey
Burstner

Thanks!

 

[Lenny HB]

On our 4th German van, 3 Hymers and now a Carthago only ever had minor problems.

 

[Al n Val]

Only this morning our friends friend px’d their 12mth old Adria at a loss of £30k because no one wanted it for a Dethleffs

Good Luck to them

Frying Pan - Fire comes to mind

 

[daveclare]

Asking people to rate their van will always give mixed results. Some will be honest, others will never admit their van has problems. You only need read the posts on here to see that every make of van has is problems. The evidence is in the pages. Some even forget that they say their van doesn't have problems. But previous questions and posts show they do.

In some cases is like asking which arm to you want cutting off first.

It's always worth comparing feedback with your own experience of viewing vans. Both new and second hand.

I can only speak from our experience of spending a couple of years (literally) choosing a van. We compared many and got confused on a number of occasions.

With regard to Florium/ Fleurette and Pilot A classes. There are marked differences. Both have crap payloads on 3.5t chassis. Florium have Alko torsion bar independent rear suspension. Pilot have leaf spring. Florium have a heated double floor. Which is great for extra storage (with internal and external access) and cold winters. They also have larger water tanks. They're the sort of things that changed our minds. But you might feel different. The downside is they only have one uk dealer.

Fault wise. Our vans probably reflects every other make. Things break. What I do like is that every wire has what it's for, written on it. It makes it much easier to fix and/or add stuff. That is as long as the manufacturer connects it to the right bit!!

 

[L' Hobo]

My British van is as good if not better built than all German vans!

Yep, my Murvi's not bad!

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[Steve N Tracy]

Having had 6 caravans and 3 motorhomes my opinion is rather then the make the deciding factor maybe should be when it was built.
Manufacturers start building the next year's models in June to make sure they have stock for the autumn shows .dealer demonstraters and pre orders alongside the previous models so any ordered at the February shows are likely to be rushed to clear the lines for the incoming models. out of all the caravans and motorhomes we have purchased all brand new the only ones with bad manufacturing defects were a Compass caravan a insurance replacement in July and a Dethleffs A class that arrived in August. The others all purchased around October were ok.

 

[PeterCarole29]

Not the yr your looking at but I cannot complain at all at the build quality of our new to us Knaus 2009-2013 range it has been cared for and used little
I think one important thing when looking at a van is the roof to see when parked up on level ground will the water naturally run off as several we looked at with over an beds dip midway down the van
Depending how the roof construction is designed a recipe for leakage be it food vent to seams

 

[sfrain145]

Morning all

For those of you familiar with these makes, what order would you put them in overall in terms of build quality and/or reliability? 1 - 6 with 1 being best.

Pilote
Chausson
Fleurette/Florium
Rollerteam
Bailey
Burstner

Thanks!

I think it’s a tough one as depending on the year some made good quality vans then for whatever reason they went down hill we had a few German caravans and have to say the build quality was far superior. We also owned an old swift kontiki and it was solid looked at one last year at a show and it’s all poorly put together composite material. We ordered a Autotrial campervan and luckily we got out of the deal as it was total rubbish I did a video and wanted to publish it but decided not to. We then got a Slovak Adria and must say it does what it says on the tin build wise and insulation very good. Go to a show and knock on the side of a camper and you can tell who has good insulation and who hasn’t and most brands like swift bailey etc won’t be insulated very well. German is the best bet for quality as I think production standards are higher.

 

[Tom G]

Having been a member of FUN for 9 years I've read countless horror stories from most manufacturers.
We spent 2 years looking at vans and reading of thousands of members experiences before throwing our life savings at our current van, an Elddis Accordo 105 Prestige despite hearing bad things about Elddis build quality. Most peoples main fear is water ingress but the fact that Elddis gave a 10 year water ingress warranty showed their confidence in their product.
In 7 years of ownership the only issue we've had was our fridge wouldn't stay lit on gas which raised its head in the first month. No other issues at all. We may just be lucky.
On the other hand my brother in law bought a new Dethleffs and had nothing but trouble with build quality related issues. He got rid of it less than 2 years later.
He came across it in a dealers in November and made some enquiries and was shocked to hear that it's had 3 owners since he sold it 5 years ago!
I've long been of the opinion that motorhome build quality is a bit of a lottery. You pay your money and take your chances unfortunately.

We have an Accodo 105, very pleased with it, yes 'fridge wohld'nt stay alight. Wardrobe door hinges and magnets too strong for the wood (ha ha!!- more like cardboard). Otherwise happy, previous was a PVC Auto-trail V line 600 nice van.

 

[DandJ]

Is the 'order' of the 6 based on buying a certain model of each at a set price point...in which case you may be able to buy a brand new 'lower' model or a 6 yr old Burstner? Does 'expectations' come into it? I have pretty moderate expectations of our first moho...a lowly Chausson...but so far, 18 mths in, it is exceeding them.

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[Jon Stewart]

I’m looking for something under 7m either electric drop down bed, preferably over a lounge area.

Good luck with that when it fails.

 

[Carpmart]

If a mass produced Motorhome, you want it building Tuesday to Thursday… slow start Monday and POETS Friday missed = higher quality build!

 

[Carpmart]

Talking to many Germans on sites around southern Spain and they all bemoan the fact that Germany design, engineering and production has really gone downhill in recent years.

Old men moaning? Maybe yes, but there is likely some truth in it too!

 

[Roby2008]

Thanks for that. The pilote 626 or 696 fit the bill for what we need I think, I’m just worried about making a wrong decision and regretting it. We’ve only had our current van for less than a year and love it really - wouldn’t be looking to change were it not for a couple of health issues making its layout impractical for me now.

We have a Pilote P696D (2023) with the drop down bed, previous MH was a Miller/Mobilvetta (2013).

The Pilote was decided purely through layout, size, and sub 3500 kg; the 626 was considered but was not so wheelchair accessible inside.

Quality: The pilote has cheaper materials compared to the 10 yr old Miller/Mobivetta (2013) we had , but unless you are cutting, moving, or drilling things, then its fine and a nice place to be.
We had a new hab door (de-laminated) and the hab control panel replaced under warranty in the first month, swiftly done, great dealer and these things happen. our Miller had issues that were just ignored by the dealer and I fixed them myself, so we never went back to them.
The drop down bed is a rattler until you find the right position/ technique for when you are travelling, The supplied mattress wennt out of the door after the first weekend and replaced by a more supportive one ( adjust the micro switch on the height to allow for the extra thickness.
The bed is great, madame is a wheelchair user and can transfer easily alone for night time bathroom visits, etc

When we looking for a new MH, we were in the Uk and visited DAVAN at Weston-Super-Mare, even though we were not buying, they let us crawl all over the 696 for an hour, Thats what made up our mind to order on return to Germany.

As pointed out by another poster, the payload is abysmal, if you add the toys, Automatic, Solar, Sat dish, and the obligatory Awning, we also have levellers (AL-KO) which are a godsend but also add weight, we do travel with wheelchair e-handbike, e-scooter and sometimes a 3m inflatable boat, we are on the limit , up-plating is not viable and even if it were, the chassis is 3650 kg, not worth the increased costs.. If you are kitchen sinkers, then the pilote is not for you, but the same applies for any sub 3500kg MH.

Overall, the 696 is great; it has the layout we want, is accessible inside, has a spacious accessible bathroom, good-sized, light airy lounge, and the daytime space makes up for the nighttime compromise of dropping the bed.
Yes, the MH is expensive and quality is not what it was but unless you build your own, you have to decide if it is worth it, we did and there are no regrets.

17000km since we got it, Italy, Hungary, UK, France and lots of Germany.

Would I change anything? Probably drop the sat dish setup and add a second lithium hab battery.

 

[Woody466]

Morning all

For those of you familiar with these makes, what order would you put them in overall in terms of build quality and/or reliability? 1 - 6 with 1 being best.

Pilote
Chausson
Fleurette/Florium
Rollerteam
Bailey
Burstner

Thanks!

Have a look at Westfalia. Not fancy but great build quality.

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[Lenny HB]

Only this morning our friends friend px’d their 12mth old Adria at a loss of £30k because no one wanted it for a Dethleffs

That's a hell of a drop, traded our Hymer last year for £5k less than we paid for it 7 years before.

 

[Al n Val]

That's a hell of a drop, traded our Hymer last year for £5k less than we paid for it 7 years before.

He told me only yesterday Lennie that most dealers simply didn’t want it and all offered him £85k which was a £50k drop after a year.

He went back to the dealer where he purchased and they offered £105k against the Burstner but still a £30k drop after 12mths which is a bitter pill to swallow isn’t it.

TBH we’ve looked at Adria ourselves, lovely looking from the outside in our opinion but just too dark and gloomy when inside for us.

we’re sticking with our Rapido for the foreseeable now all, “and there’s been a lot”, of issues have been sorted. It’s been a tough 3yrs i’ll admit but we love it now

Would I buy another Rapido - Yes

From the same dealer- Yes

Would I like to set fire to the Rapido Factory in Mayenne - Yes - everyday

 

[JulieP]

My British van is as good if not better built than all German vans!

My 2006 Autotrail cheyenne is still like new

 

[Coolcats]

Morning all

For those of you familiar with these makes, what order would you put them in overall in terms of build quality and/or reliability? 1 - 6 with 1 being best.

Pilote
Chausson
Fleurette/Florium
Rollerteam
Bailey
Burstner

Thanks!

They all use Dometic Thetford etc so components will be as reliable from one MoHo to another the real question should be how easy or accessible are the components for repair

You missed N&B and Hymer

 

[DandG5515]

Talking to many Germans on sites around southern Spain and they all bemoan the fact that Germany design, engineering and production has really gone downhill in recent years.

Old men moaning? Maybe yes, but there is likely some truth in it too!

For me hit the nail on the head, 20 years of working on domestic appliances, my opinion has changed that German badged products have gone from excellent to struggling to be average.

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[Lenny HB]

He told me only yesterday Lennie that most dealers simply didn’t want it and all offered him £85k which was a £50k drop after a year.

He went back to the dealer where he purchased and they offered £105k against the Burstner but still a £30k drop after 12mths which is a bitter pill to swallow isn’t it.

TBH we’ve looked at Adria ourselves, lovely looking from the outside in our opinion but just too dark and gloomy when inside for us.

we’re sticking with our Rapido for the foreseeable now all, “and there’s been a lot”, of issues have been sorted. It’s been a tough 3yrs i’ll admit but we love it now

Would I buy another Rapido - Yes

From the same dealer- Yes

Would I like to set fire to the Rapido Factory in Mayenne - Yes - everyday

I think it depends a lot on what you are exchanging for, a friend with the same van and year as mine got £17k less for his.
Dealer who took mine put it up for £3k more than he gave me and sold it in a few weeks.

 

[Al n Val]

Let’s be honest

they are all sh!te, you have to pay more to get more sh!te or less to get less sh!te

it’s how the dealers and manufacturers respond that’s key as you will need them

Edit: it’s also how you approach the dealer as well imho when you have an issue

Go in shouting and cursing only gets you to the bottom of the pile very quickly I think

 

[PeterCarole29]

That's a hell of a drop, traded our Hymer last year for £5k less than we paid for it 7 years before.

We met a really nice couple had a 2022 tag axle Cathargo part ex it for small Payed £235,000 new still In warranty only got £160,000
Obviously not good negotiating

 

[PeterCarole29]

We met a really nice couple had a 2022 tag axle Cathargo part ex it for small Payed £235,000 new still In warranty only got £160,000
Obviously not good negotiating

they exchange vans in a months time

 

[wildcampers69]

Have a look at Westfalia. Not fancy but great build quality.

We bought a Westfalia amundsen in 2018 it was very poor quality cracked shower tray turned out to be not supported properly, very little insulation , i virtually dismantled the thing to insulate it and stop rattles. Looked to change to a Hymer grand canyon(Merc) at dealer and the front overhead control panel was hanging of so i reach in and found no insulation what so ever above the cab. In my opinion if its PVC the best on the market is Murvi, Vantage and Consort all far better build than most German vans. We change it to a Murvi morrello not a single issue with build, for me the answer is buy with your eyes not with other peoples opinions as feedback is good but everyone has a different experience and i including myself in that.

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[Lynne Roy]

Don’t go near Florium, they are absolutely beautiful inside, but my god the way they are built is shocking watch the you tube manufacturers video. They use top quality fixtures inside, most expensive hobs, fridges, fantastic shower cubicle, nice upholstery but within weeks the back was loose and banging and the roof, took it back to manufacturer, didn’t trust a dealer, their answer was to put a bike rack on but the banging has stopped. It has to go and yes we will lose a lot of money we had Elddis ( load of rubbish) Dethleffs Globebus loved it Malibu was great , Florium worse than an Elddis, all bought brand new x

 

[Tony50]

We have had a mix of 10 caravans / motorhomes over many years, a mix of Premium makes an cheap makes , non faultless, at the moment not wishing to chuck more money at a caravan on a pickup chassis we have a Chausson 788 , in many ways it seems to be a slightly altered model ( side bench seats) of past models but, improved build, had a great small faults, just waiting for water ingress !! , apart from above in comparison with cars and trucks they are all crap build .

 

[Al n Val]

Have to say we really admire our friends daveclare ’s Florium Black Pearl

The interior is beautiful and they like it as well

He’s also made some great improvements

 

[Jerrywh]

Morning all

For those of you familiar with these makes, what order would you put them in overall in terms of build quality and/or reliability? 1 - 6 with 1 being best.

Pilote
Chausson
Fleurette/Florium
Rollerteam
Bailey
Burstner

Thanks!

1. La Strada
2-7 the rest

 

[vzac]

Have just put a post up on our experience with a German van frankia that we purchased in November. It's not what the op is looking at but does show a (imo) a quality mh from Germany.
Vzac ( Phil and Janette)

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[L' Hobo]

Have a look at Westfalia. Not fancy but great build quality.

My 1989 VW Westfalia California is VERY well made!