Advice please, New Motorhome sink draining issues. Right to return!

[SpeedyDux]

In my view withe the top of the fridge that close the sink is not in a good position and not fit for purpose there should be room for at least a flat type trap and the pipes.
My solution would be raise the worktop by an inch or two but without seeing it that may not be possible.
Good luck with it hope you get your money back.? these manufactures need to get interior designers that have practical experience before drawing up plans.????
What’s the point of fitting a sink unit that does not drain correctly absolutely ludicrous?

From the MMM review on youtube, raising the worktop by up to 5cm looks doable without spoiling the kitchen. A competent chippie could make it look acceptable.

 

[Servo]

From the MMM review on youtube, raising the worktop by up to 5cm looks doable without spoiling the kitchen. A competent chippie could make it look acceptable.

It’s a new van WHY ,!! It’s not up to the owner / buyer to sort out , this is the problem with the industry , sod the customer we’ve got his/her money.

 

[Jonno1103]

I don't really know what any dealer can do for you as they'll just refit everything to the manufacturers specs and that's where the problem lies. It's a design flaw not a faulty build issue. Many Elddis vans suffer the same problem. Sink above a fridge means warm smelly pipes and the Spinflo/Thetford sink fitted is on the large size for the remaining space, it's why the likes of
Swift and Roller Team who use a similar design in a couple of their MH's use a smaller round sink.

 

[SpeedyDux]

It’s a new van WHY ,!! It’s not up to the owner / buyer to sort out , this is the problem with the industry , sod the customer we’ve got his money.

I agree. I've been waiting for a new locker catch (warranty claim accepted) since 21 May.

It was only my opinion on the practicality of the suggestion by Speve.

 

[Servo]

I don't really know what any dealer can do for you as they'll just refit everything to the manufacturers specs and that's where the problem lies. It's a design flaw not a faulty build issue. Many Elddis vans suffer the same problem. Sink above a fridge means warm smelly pipes and the Spinflo/Thetford sink fitted is on the large size for the remaining space, it's why the likes of
Swift and Roller Team who use a similar design in a couple of their MH's use a smaller round sink.

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[tacr2man]

I think this thread shows up why things have got to this position , the amount of hassle people are prepared to put up with rather than sorting things out ! JMHO

 

[DBK]

Here's a couple of photos of our waste pipe routing.

Under the sink. It doesn't project down very far and there should be plenty of space above your fridge for this.

The waste pipe goes off to the right and into the another cupboard but then goes vertically downwards.

I suspect the vertical drop soon after the sink must help clear the water away quickly, that and no sharp bends.

 

[Riverbankannie]

In our old Autosleeper Topaz, there was less room than that shown above between the sink bottom and the top of the fridge. I couldn’t even store a flat wooden spatula under the bowl with the pipes there. It drained perfectly whether we were nose up or down. So it seems to me that the problem must be further along in the pipe flow.
However none of that is any help to the OP and I totally agree it’s not acceptable for him to have to do any remedial diy work. If the dealer has already had 2 chances to put it right, then it’s time for a refund.

He has weighed up the disappointment about the holidays against using a washing up bowl for a short time until any remedial work can be done and decided the way he has.

I really hope he gets his money back. I think the story should be shared on twitter and Facebook to shame the dealer and the manufacturer BUT, not yet, now legal proceedings are started.

 

[Ivory55]

When you see the problem people have with brand new houses and all the faults and the people get nowhere when complaining . Is it any wonder you stand no chance with a motorhome.

 

[pelican]

if only my sink drained even 1/10th of that speed I would not even be concerned.
Update.....
after a meeting with a solicitor he said I have a very strong case and perfectly within my rights for rejection and has already sent them a letter today.
lets hope this works.

I think the solicitor is going to make a pot out of this.

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[Minxy]

In my view withe the top of the fridge that close the sink is not in a good position and not fit for purpose there should be room for at least a flat type trap and the pipes.
My solution would be raise the worktop by an inch or two but without seeing it that may not be possible.

That's exactly the conclusion I was coming to too! But that presents other issues.

 

[pelican]

Thank you all for your time, I'm not sure if everyone has understood just how bad this sink is, its a design fault and ive given them my van twice and they have failed twice and admitted its a design fault and can't be fixed.
ive never once in my life needed to complain about a product, goods or services so this is a first for me and very stressful, we have booked and paid for two holidays this month 3 days and 14 days and we can no longer go so this decision was not taken lightly.
I shall be keeping this post updated with my progress for those interested.
for me £50k is a massive amount and all my life savings present and future.
my 3 young kids are gutted we can't take it or them to Spain for 14days.

If I had the problem I would rectify even temporarily so that the promised holiday happened even if it meant a washing up bowl. One life live it!

 

[Minxy]

Is there room to drop the fridge down closer to the floor? Or fit a slightly shallower sink?

 

[Waynesmith]

Ive got a video but will not let me upload it

 

[Waynesmith]

If I had the problem I would rectify even temporarily so that the promised holiday happened even if it meant a washing up bowl. One life live it!

I would take me out of my 30 day right to return and make it more difficult to get my money back

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[DBK]

Ive got a video but will not let me upload it

You have to upload the video to YouTube then post a link to it on here.

 

[DBK]

In our old Autosleeper Topaz, there was less room than that shown above between the sink bottom and the top of the fridge. I couldn’t even store a flat wooden spatula under the bowl with the pipes there. It drained perfectly whether we were nose up or down. So it seems to me that the problem must be further along in the pipe flow.
However none of that is any help to the OP and I totally agree it’s not acceptable for him to have to do any remedial diy work. If the dealer has already had 2 chances to put it right, then it’s time for a refund.

He has weighed up the disappointment about the holidays against using a washing up bowl for a short time until any remedial work can be done and decided the way he has.

I really hope he gets his money back. I think the story should be shared on twitter and Facebook to shame the dealer and the manufacturer BUT, not yet, now legal proceedings are started.

I agree, the location above the fridge is a red herring. There is plenty of room - see the image I posted above of the underside of our sink. We even have room for egg cups below it.

 

[Waynesmith]

Elddis sink draining

This is the best the dealer could make it flow.

 

[Waynesmith]

 

[Southdowners]

That’s really bad. I can see why you’re so annoyed.

I can’t help thinking that if this is a design fault there must be hundreds, perhaps thousands, of vehicles out there with the same problem. There would be loads of posts to be found online complaining about the issue. A quick google search hasn’t come up with any recent posts and only one in 2006. Now I admit it was a very quick search but you’d think there would be lots.

Do you know what else the dealer is prepared to do to resolve the issue? It seems a shame to have to abandon your holidays.

I’d advise caution going down the legal route. Unless your solicitor’s letter results in a refund it could get very expensive to take the matter to court and of course no guarantee you’d win. The fact that the dealer said ‘see you in court’ gives an idea of his stance. He must have been pretty sure of his position before upping the ante in that way.

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[Waynesmith]

I feel like the dealer thinks with his response I will back down but all along he has been telling me "its draining look" yes it is but incredibly slow "but it is draining"

 

[pelican]

I would take me out of my 30 day right to return and make it more difficult to get my money back

Surely you want the problem solved not your money back.

 

[Waynesmith]

That’s really bad. I can see why you’re so annoyed.

Do you know what else the dealer is prepared to do to resolve the issue? It seems a shame to have to abandon your holidays.

I also asked for a exchange of Motorhome at the same time as the reject as an alternative solution but his response was see you in court, ive called him everyday since but he is not returning my calls.
Tomorrow or Monday he should receive the Solicitors letter and I'm sure that will make my position clearer than my email and carry more weight.

 

[Camping Gaza]

Looking at the video and the sink placement there MUST be a connection to the sink as in DBKs picture with a hose going to the side or back of the fridge space (to the back as there will be more room.

There MUST be a vertical drop to the floor of the pipe and to the tank mounted under the van, OR it goes along the floor then down.

Even with the fridge being so close this should drain away unless your tank is on the same level as your sink.

You dont have a design fault. You have a blockage, or the pipe is trapped and crushed, probably by installing the fridge and crushing it, and a bloody lazy dealer who can't be arsed to look into the problem fully.

 

[Waynesmith]

Surely you want the problem solved not your money back.

twice they have tried and twice failed, he is telling me this drain speed is ok, what chance do I possibly have of getting it fixed if he thinks that speed is ok.
I might also add our bathroom was only sealed on two walls the other two had none, it took them two attempts to get that right, now come on really! I can't trust them.

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[Campervan_man]

I had a similar issue. The 'fall' of the pipe was bad, once the fall was improved and the pipe going in to the tank was cut so that it just entered the tank the draining of the water is now sorted. Maybe change your sink 'drain' under the sink from a slow slope drain to a straight down type ?

 

[Servo]

I had a similar issue. The 'fall' of the pipe was bad, once the fall was improved and the pipe going in to the tank was cut so that it just entered the tank the draining of the water is now sorted. Maybe change your sink 'drain' under the sink from a slow slope drain to a straight down type ?

I am sure it can be fixed . However there are reports on here op did “ fix” them selves and lost the warranty then what?

 

[Sandancers]

Looking at the video and the sink placement there MUST be a connection to the sink as in DBKs picture with a hose going to the side or back of the fridge space (to the back as there will be more room.

There MUST be a vertical drop to the floor of the pipe and to the tank mounted under the van, OR it goes along the floor then down.

Even with the fridge being so close this should drain away unless your tank is on the same level as your sink.

You dont have a design fault. You have a blockage, or the pipe is trapped and crushed, probably by installing the fridge and crushing it, and a bloody lazy dealer who can't be arsed to look into the problem fully.

In engineering we quickly learned there are two four letter words which should never be used;

The first is JUST, as in "can you just xxxx while you are there" which means it won't be straightforward and it won't be a quick job.

The second is MUST, as in"the fault must be in there" which means that you will spend lots of time looking for a fault in the wrong place.

 

[Southdowners]

Can you give a couple of Elddis dealers a call and ask if they’d experienced issues with the sink? I can’t imagine many people putting up with the problem so if the dealers haven’t heard about issues it may narrow it down to being a blockage rather than a design fault.

Did you see the plumbing when they removed the fridge?

As I said earlier, if I were you I’d collect your vehicle. Leave a letter with the dealer saying something along the lines of you need to store it at home to comply with your insurance t’s&c’s (which is probably true) and that you are taking the matter further, despite removing the vehicle from their premises.

Once home you could do a little bit of investigation yourself - perhaps taking the fridge out, etc. Hopefully your holiday plans won’t be ruined.

Good luck!

 

[hilldweller]

There is much talk but no real facts.

I would say, if you like the van, get a decent MH person to fix it and then send them the bill. You could not fail to get paid in the small claims court.

I'll bet dave newell lvs would fix it.

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