Why isn’t this at 100%

[Rudski01]

So I have 2 lithium batteries a battery master, b2b charger and lot of solar, the van is inside so the solar is not doing anything, but it’s on permanent hook up. When I first bought the van the panel used to say 100% charge

Forward on a couple of months and that same panel after being on hook up in my lock up hasn’t gone past 70% and after the mrs had the inverter on for something has dropped to 55% and doesn’t increase even though still on hook up.

If the leisure batteries aren’t getting to 100%
then I’m going to assume that the battery master won’t maintain my starter battery hence why it wouldn’t start the other week.

Why wont they charge back to full capacity, am I missing something? I’ve never had lithium before but can’t understand why they’re not showing as full.

Panel pic for reference

 

[Richard n Ann]

The mains charger must be off. Have you checked it's power supply?

 

[AdrianChen]

You could turn the charger off and after a minute or so then on again to start a new cycle, some stay on float at the end of a cycle which will be very slow to charge, some also have a setting to restart with bulk below a certain battery voltage. Not sure which charger you have, but the on/off thing should start a new cycle

 

[Lenny HB]

Sounds like mains charger has failed.
LifePO4 are fine to be charged to 100% in use but is storage you shouldn't leave them on perminant charge.

 

[Sleeveless]

Disconnect battery leads, check the actual voltage at the terminals, compare against manufacturer spec.

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[Kannon Fodda]

Dies the charger have a lithium profile, and is is set? Lithium has higher voltage than lead-acid. If a lead acid smart charger it may not yet be seeing voltage dropped low enough for it to come off float?

 

[Pausim]

What mains charger are you using? It might well be one as described by AdrianChen where the voltage simply hasn’t dropped low enough to kick start another charging cycle.

I would let the Li battery drop to between 40% and 80% and then turn it off or isolate it. You can then ignore it. A small mains trickle charger connected to the engine battery should look after that.

 

[Rudski01]

This is the set up, charger seems to be powered up, I was leaving it on mains as I thought that once the leisure batteries were charged then it would keep my starter charged.

 

[Rudski01]

The mains charger must be off. Have you checked it's power supply?

No, it’s switched on

 

[headlight]

No, it’s switched on

A battery master, assuming you mean a Vanbitz Battery Master, does not need the leisure battery to be at 100% SOC to work.
It just needs the leisure battery voltage to be 0.75v higher than the starter battery voltage.

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[Rudski01]

Dies the charger have a lithium profile, and is is set? Lithium has higher voltage than lead-acid. If a lead acid smart charger it may not yet be seeing voltage dropped low enough for it to come off float?

It was all set up before I bought it, I don’t mess with anything much electrical as I don’t understand it enough, and if I did I probably wouldn’t be able to get the setting back to where they should be

 

[Rudski01]

A battery master, assuming you mean a Vanbitz Battery Master, does not need the leisure battery to be at 100% SOC to work.
It just needs the leisure battery voltage to be 0.75v higher than the starter battery voltage.

Yes Vanbitz battery master, Ok, well maybe the starter battery is on the way out, looking at access to it I will need to strip the washer bottle and everything out

Although that doesn’t explain why the leisure batteries aren’t topping up to full

 

[Rudski01]

You could turn the charger off and after a minute or so then on again to start a new cycle, some stay on float at the end of a cycle which will be very slow to charge, some also have a setting to restart with bulk below a certain battery voltage. Not sure which charger you have, but the on/off thing should start a new cycle

I’ll give it a go, and unplug from mains if that doesn’t work, see if anything happens, got starter battery on a smart charger currently.

 

[AdrianChen]

I’ll give it a go, and unplug from mains if that doesn’t work, see if anything happens, got starter battery on a smart charger currently.

Yes most Victrons do have a re-bulk setting, normally if the voltage drops a little under the float/storage setting, it kicks in, so Its something else I guess. Cant see what lights are on from the photo.....

Whats the temp on the batteries, if below 5°c they might have switched off charging?

 

[StillGoing]

1. Have the batteries ever got to 100% without any solar power?

2. Can you post a current photo of the Votronic displays. I suspect the one in your first post was when solar was working given you say the battery hasn’t gone over 70% and the picture shows 91% and the solar at 14.4V

3. If you say the charger is on, then my guess is there is a blown fuse between the charger and leisure battery or the charger isn’t working (wrong settings?).

4. Have you got the Victron app on your phone so you can see the charger settings and current status?

5. As some else has said, if the temperature drops below about 5C the leisure batteries may not charge anyway.

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[Gromett]

View attachment 998640
This is the set up, charger seems to be powered up, I was leaving it on mains as I thought that once the leisure batteries were charged then it would keep my starter charged.

There should be a fuse on the charger 12v side. Might be worth looking at that?

 

[scotzsue]

Managed to accidentally turn off our charger, took almost a year to discover. Its in the shoe cupboard can only think it got knocked when I threw some shoes in.

 

[StillGoing]

Pure speculation here! I wonder if there is a fuse from the leisure battery used by both the inverter and the charger? When the inverter was used could it have blown the fuse thus disabling the charger as well? If so, why did the fuse blow?

I think you need to go on a fuse hunt between the leisure battery, charger and inverter.

 

[Martynovo]

So I have 2 lithium batteries a battery master, b2b charger and lot of solar, the van is inside so the solar is not doing anything, but it’s on permanent hook up. When I first bought the van the panel used to say 100% charge

Forward on a couple of months and that same panel after being on hook up in my lock up hasn’t gone past 70% and after the mrs had the inverter on for something has dropped to 55% and doesn’t increase even though still on hook up.

If the leisure batteries aren’t getting to 100%
then I’m going to assume that the battery master won’t maintain my starter battery hence why it wouldn’t start the other week.

Why wont they charge back to full capacity, am I missing something? I’ve never had lithium before but can’t understand why they’re not showing as full.

Panel pic for reference


View attachment 998596

I have almost the same problem and was about to post when I saw yours:

Why is it only 95%? I have 2x100 AH lithiums and wondered what full charge is? A Renogy B2B, Victron Shunt and Victron charger complete the set. All voltage measurements at no load say 13.5v including on a meter. The Victron shunt says only 95% charge on main screen after 4 days on EHU. Looking at battery detail it says 94.6%. The synchronisation at 100% was set after a similar 4 days charge, Charge efficiency factor 98%, Tail current 2%, charge voltage is 14.3% but Victron suggests in blog 14v , .I assume 13.5v is acceptable full battery charge, but today it shows that as 94% on main screen of shunt.

Also I was very worried about a battery at 0’C being charged by solar. A 150watt panel set via MPPT B2B controller shows panels charging at quite low light. Recently we have low temperatures and enough light to show a significant charge. Before it got down to zero I installed a 20watt seed germination pad vertically alongside the batteries. It doesn’t quite touch the battery and the outside wall of site is insulated with thin Lidl silver insulation. So far battery has not gone below 5’C and on warm day (15’C) when I should have unplugged, it was 20’C. The pad is plugged into the mains van socket but it could be in to the inverter overnight if back in mountains again off grid. But before trying it that way Im concerned the inverter might draw more than the pad. So what would stop an inverter drawing the battery right down? - Thanks

 

[Rudski01]

Pure speculation here! I wonder if there is a fuse from the leisure battery used by both the inverter and the charger? When the inverter was used could it have blown the fuse thus disabling the charger as well? If so, why did the fuse blow?

I think you need to go on a fuse hunt between the leisure battery, charger and inverter.

Charger is definitely powered up and battery master has power to it, the van was outside today so charge went up to 65%, charge is showing this on app,
So does this mean the batteries are nearly charged? If so then why does the panel inside state only say 65 charged, I was of the thought they went into absorption mode when nearly or at 80%

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[pappajohn]

Mains charger may be plugged in/switched on but that doesn't mean it's working.
It needs checking with a meter.
Also, you say it was installed before you bought the van.......who's to say it was installed properly?

 

[Rudski01]

1. Have the batteries ever got to 100% without any solar power?

I’m not sure to be honest, certainly not for the past few months

2. Can you post a current photo of the Votronic displays. I suspect the one in your first post was when solar was working given you say the battery hasn’t gone over 70% and the picture shows 91% and the solar at 14.4V

I will next time I’m at the van

3. If you say the charger is on, then my guess is there is a blown fuse between the charger and leisure battery or the charger isn’t working (wrong settings?).

Don’t think it will be set up wrong the previous owner was electrical engineer I think, but I’ll check the fuse if I can find it

4. Have you got the Victron app on your phone so you can see the charger settings and current status?

Pic posted below of current status

5. As some else has said, if the temperature drops below about 5C the leisure batteries may not charge anyway.

That’s why I have the van on hook up as I’m using the Alde heating on 1KW, as it’s -2 in the garage currently

 

[Raul]

Don’t think it will be set up wrong the previous owner was electrical engineer

Take that as gospel, dead give away few pointers that an electrical engineer will NOT ever do to its own van:
Fine stranded wires in chock blocks without ferule, wires unsecured not clipped or zip tied in a mobile moving installation, dc +/-no markings etc...and evidence of existing neat install, then spoiled later by amateur enthusiast by add ons. I would take that electrician skills with a pinch of salt.

With two months standing, from full to 70% the lithium lost somehow 30%. What's the size of lithium?
As already mentioned, having the mains charger on is not sufficient proof charging. You have to confirm the batteries receives a charge from charger with a multimeter. It may have a fuse buried somewhere from charger to batteries. That charger is a victron with lithium profile, even if in storage mode, the battery that low will kick the charger in.
Also the blue photo if thats the charger, then the charger is in absorb at 14.2v, but 0amps; looks like open circuit to me, or no battery connected.
Try to find a fuse.

 

[Lenny HB]

Looking at battery detail it says 94.6%. The synchronisation at 100% was set after a similar 4 days charge, Charge efficiency factor 98%, Tail current 2%, charge voltage is 14.3% but Victron suggests in blog 14v , .I assume 13.5v is acceptable full battery charge, but today it shows that as 94% on main screen of shunt.

13.5v is the float voltage if the battery is fully charged the battery will not take any charge at 13.5v.
I would set the charged voltage to 14.1 then discharge the battery to below 80% then recharge. Do this 2 or 3 times them see what the results are.

 

[Martynovo]

13.5v is the float voltage if the battery is fully charged the battery will not take any charge at 13.5v.
I would set the charged voltage to 14.1 then discharge the battery to below 80% then recharge. Do this 2 or 3 times them see what the results are.

Thanks Lenny, will do

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[Martynovo]

13.5v is the float voltage if the battery is fully charged the battery will not take any charge at 13.5v.
I would set the charged voltage to 14.1 then discharge the battery to below 80% then recharge. Do this 2 or 3 times them see what the results are.

Lenny
I was about to follow your suggestion but found this morning had dropped to 84% showing and 13.5v battery. Switched off charger and put a 650watt kettle on inverter. By the time it had boiled voltage dropped to 12.9v but still 84% Switched off load put charger on and in 3 minutes back to 13.5v but still 84%. There is a solar running but today but so cloudy shows 2watt charge only. At the end still 84% charge showing. Just doesn’t make sense to me.

 

[Lenny HB]

Lenny
I was about to follow your suggestion but found this morning had dropped to 84% showing and 13.5v battery. Switched off charger and put a 650watt kettle on inverter. By the time it had boiled voltage dropped to 12.9v but still 84% Switched off load put charger on and in 3 minutes back to 13.5v but still 84%. There is a solar running but today but so cloudy shows 2watt charge only. At the end still 84% charge showing. Just doesn’t make sense to me.

The 12.9v is the on load votage it would have recovered to at least 13.3v without the charger on.
you don't say what your charger is apart from being Victron or the amp hours of your batteries.
If you have 400ah of batteries and a 20 amp charger it would take an hour to put 5% back into the batteries, if the charger is running at full power, so in practice it would be a bit longer.

 

[GeoffnDee]

Martynovo , Not sure if it is any help but , if you have not seen it , there is a Schaudt item regarding Display voltage / % on page 2 of Motorhome technical articles that is in the Resources section

 

[Raul]

Lenny
I was about to follow your suggestion but found this morning had dropped to 84% showing and 13.5v battery. Switched off charger and put a 650watt kettle on inverter. By the time it had boiled voltage dropped to 12.9v but still 84% Switched off load put charger on and in 3 minutes back to 13.5v but still 84%. There is a solar running but today but so cloudy shows 2watt charge only. At the end still 84% charge showing. Just doesn’t make sense to me.

All sounds normal, load -no load ; as expected. What about the temperature? If battery is under 5 deg C, it will not charge, but, allow to discharge.

 

[Martynovo]

Martynovo , Not sure if it is any help but , if you have not seen it , there is a Schaudt item regarding Display voltage / % on page 2 of Motorhome technical articles that is in the Resources section

Thanks. I had a look but I'm ignoring anything said on schaudt system. Fuse removed. I'm 30amp victron charger and shunt which is what's reading 84%. But 13.5v

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