Why are motorhomes so persecuted?

[Mark&Sue]

Hi Olley,

I wonder, how does someone who happily owns a large RV come accross as an "RV Hater"?
I believe that the comments made were based on a business sense opinion.

 

[olley]

Hi Mark we own a hairdressing shop, its a 95% female client base, if one of them complained about us doing men I would politely tell her "sorry but we do men and will continue to do men".

We charge £17.50 for a man's wash cut and blow dry, if you come in with long hair we don't charge more, in the same way if you come in with short you don't get a discount.

Some of your customers won't use your facilities hardly at all, so do they get a discount?
I stayed 1 night at Parc Verger last year, arrived at 19.00 left at 07.00 in the morning, didn't dump or fill up, electric only, did I get a discount? no, did I expect to no, its swings and roundabouts, some you lose most you win.

Olley

 

[GJH]

Graham - I'd never heard of this - do you know where I can find more details?
(snip)

Try these three threads for a start:
Link Removed
Link Removed
Link Removed.
I've also seen references elsewhere to Teignbridge Council providing overnight facilities later this year.

Overnight facilities still not widespread but daytime parking opportuinities are increasing. For instance, Bournemouth Council are to provide extra spaces this year - again because an individual approached them constructively.

I try to keep up to date on the web site.

Graham

 

[Mark&Sue]

Hi Olley,

Well we do accept RV's so thats the first one out of the window. We also charge the same for an RV as we do for a Tent or European so that levels that one.
The fee that we charge is based on average use of facilities and don't consider large dumping sessions by RV's hence the £15 charge for dumping if a stay is less than 3 nights.
If an RV dumps its full tank when staying for 3 nights then they effectively get a night for free.
At least I now know that I can have a night at Cornish Farm for less than the price of a hair do! lol
My next question to you would be this, If I came for a haircut and I weighed 30 stone and couldn't get my arse in the chair without breaking it, would you advertise that obese people were welcome or would you be honest when asked and reply with the argument that "We don't really like cutting the hair of people that break a chair every visit but we will still cut their hair because that is what we do"?

Best Regards,

Mark.

 

[scotjimland]

I believe that the comments made were based on a business sense opinion.

I think some remarks and opinions are better not posted .. and even more so when they could harm a business..

Gerald Ratner found that out to his cost.. the executive responsible for one of the most famous gaffes in corporate history...

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[Mark&Sue]

Well, there's another problem with our society, we start a forum so that we can share honest opinions and views with others and then worry about offending people when you use the the very medium in the way it was intended. Surely we can all have views and read others views without taking personal offence. Too many things are taken out of context by too many people.

Best Regards,

Mark.

 

[juliandavies]

Mark&Sue - I have accepted the business reasons.
What I still struggle with is the acceptance of the 'eyesore attitude' of caravanners.

 

[olley]

Hi Mark, so you do accept RV's and you charge if they stay less than 3 days to dump. So you don't lose money then. So your economic argument is spurious.

Right so what's Eddies problem???.................O that's right, other campers don't like the look of them. I don't like the look of some of our clients, but it doesn't stop me taking their money.

As for going on the grass, Rv's are they only ones to do this are they? You sound like the CC and there precious grass, which many people take the mick out off.

As for a 30 stone client? we have 2, one also gets on the couch for beauty treatments, like motorhomes clients are getting bigger, in our business you either accommodate them or lose trade.

Because of draconian planning laws campsites are in short supply, and good or bad you can fill your site so you can pick and choose, lucky you.

Olley

 

[Mark&Sue]

Hi Olley,

You miss the point, but I won't try to explain it to you, as with the original point of the thread, some will understand the point and some won't, some will agree, some won't.
We will warmly welcome everyone to the site, we are very proud of the site and the way that we run it. We don't whinge when people drive over grass but try to discourage it when the grass is sodden. The whole point is that Large RVs (around 40ft) are generally more hassle than everyone else, simples, eek!

I do however find it amusing that you point the good/bad finger, just because we don't encourage huge RV's makes us bad? Hmmm, ask our clients what they think, we do, they love it here, we have a great site and great customers in all shapes and sizes and this makes us able to pick and choose. This promotes the site, why would we lower standards. Read the reviews.

 

[scotjimland]

Too many things are taken out of context by too many people.

I don't see where that was done ...

The opening statement from Eddie.. which, by the way was unsolicited.

Put us on the list at Cornish Farm Touring Park, as we don't welcome very large RV's

Pure business sense! a couple of days stay for a large RV for us is simply not viable or desirable, and we do get complaints from other guests.

just dont want dirty great big ones on the campsite

Mark

When I see a Large RV (35ft +) arriving, I cringe, I hope that he is one of the good ones, I wonder how much damage will be done if he is a bad driver, I wonder who I'm going to annoy by pitching this monster next to someone else.

I see no ambiguity in these statements, large RVs are not welcome at Cornish Farm.. they cause problems, incur extra costs and annoy guests..

Where was anything taken out of context ?

I certainly wouldn't feel welcome.. I would be scared I upset a guest, run over the edge of the grass or pooed too much.. hardly relaxing..

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[lady jann]

hee hee, i am glad i aint got a biggn !!! :Blush:







morning all :thumb:

 

[dazzer]

Now Now Now...come along children this is all getting a bit out of hand :Blush:

If the owner of a site doesnt want RVs, so be it....just find another site, its not rocket science is it???

Cant we all just get along and have a big group hug???oh:

 

[Mark&Sue]

I'd like a hug, thanks Dazzer, we did of course say "Large RV's". We are talking 40ft sizes, we have RV's here, this is the context issue that I was talking about. LARGE RV's!

Hi Jim, you are right.

 

[eddie]

Scotland Jim, Gerald Ratner made stupid comment, in that he said his products were crap! To use this analogy doesn't make sense, I am simply saying that there is a very small sector of the market, that makes a disproportionate demand on resources so consequently, we don’t actively encourage that small sector.

I do not see by being honest and stating that the handful of 38' - 40' vans in the UK, represent an uneconomic business proposition for short stays. We are however, honest enough to say so. This has to be better than waiting for them to arrive and say that you have to pay extra to dump and if your car wont fit on your pitch you have to pay extra for car parking as well. This thread was about persecution after all.

It seems that I am being open and honest, yet a few here feel "victimised" because the trite arguments of withholding custom hold no value in this discussion.

Olley I am sorry that you feel that it is unlikely that you would ever stay at Cornish Farm, you, and your lovely wife would be extremely welcome. You said that my argument about waste being spurious as we charge anyway, as I pointed out in the penultimate paragraph, the thread is about persecution, to allow a 40 foot RV on site for a night and then slap a £15 dump fee on could be seen as persecution, which is why I pointed out the problem.

Mo and Dicks most excellent Big sites Guide is without doubt the best RV camp site guide available anywhere:thumb: We are listed in there stating that we have a size limit to avoid disappointment. :welcome: Again open sensible and honest.

We can cater for any size RV! But if a 38' - 40' RV (often towing a car) turns up on a busy weekend unannounced it can cause huge complications. We in fact have one huge space for the biggest RV towing anything.

RV's of this size do have a potential for a massive electrical consumption this is why on their own turf they would expect a 50 or 60 amp hook up (25 - 30 amp at circa 220 volts)

RV's of this size do have huge grey and blank tanks that are very expensive to empty, and tend to have 100 gallon (ish) fresh water tanks that have to be filled from metered water supplies.

RV's of this size are very heavy 15,000 - 16,000 Kgs Manoeuvring at slow speeds puts a tremendous strain of tarmac and gravelled areas. If the grass is clipped it is ruined.

It is fine to sneer about our “precious grass” But it is a stupid statement frankly as we have to maintain the pitch neat and tidy otherwise the next guest, complains that their pitch is all churned up, and it is left to us to flatten out the furrows to stop some stupid sod tripping over and suing us!

Eyesores! Well I agree entirely, it is a bit rich, as beauty is in the eye of the beholder, however, there must be a degree of sympathy when your sat there enjoying a quiet afternoons sun when a 40’ quad slide out arrives and obliterates the skyline. Conversely, For the guy that has got a super shiny beautiful 40’ quad with automatic everything, being pitched beside Mrs and Mrs Asbo and their 5 children in their £350 caravan also causes complaints.

We get complaints about children from people with no children, we get complaints about people's dogs from people that don’t have dogs, I don’t agree with all of the complaints, but we still have to listen to them and just not agreeing doesn’t make them go away.oh:

I was not supporting the complaint or condoning it, merely reporting it, there is a huge diffrence.

Marinas adopt a different tariff strategy. You pay by the meter, the bigger the boat the bigger the berth has to be to accommodate that size boat, so you pay more. I would hate to see this cross over to campsites, but it is possible.

So to sum up don’t lump motorhomes and RV’s together and say I am anti them:Angry: Use your own arguments to try to make me look a fool, don't misquote mine

All I said was that very large RV’s I then qualified what I said as very large 38’ – 40’

For the record I currently have a 30’ Minnie Winnie and have owned all sorts of vans, the biggest that I owned was 36’ We got rid of that as we started tow a RIB on a trailer which was 27’ so we thought that 57’ overall was quiet big enough.

Eddie Vanbitz

Motorhome lover

 

[moandick]

Can I thank Eddie Vanbitz for his comments on our Big Pitch Guide - and can I also re-iterate what Eddie has said about the Cornish Farm entry in the Guide:

For years he has maintained that he could only accept motorhomes up to 30ft in length at Cornish Farm and being very familiar with the road into Cornish Farm, (not easy at the best of times) I could quite understand why.

About six months ago I became aware of a situation where maybe he would allow slightly bigger RVs on site but that had to be at the discretion of the Wardens - again, another fact with which I thoroughly agree.

We made an alteration in the Guide to show that Cornish Farm would now allow up to 36ft RVs BUT only if they had telephoned in advance to ask permission - another fact with which I thoroughly agree.

So Eddie has not tried to be anti-RV or motorhome - he has not tried to over-charge anybody who has appeared at Cornish Farm - he has been honest and forthright all the way down the line by saying that, for various reasons, he does not want to accept RV's over 36ft on his site.

I am sorry - but what has he done to deserve such abuse from some of the members on this forum.

I deal with hundreds of site owners every year and I wish just half of them were as honest and truthful as Eddie!

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[olley]

Good idea:thumb: Put us on the list at Cornish Farm Touring Park, as we don't welcome very large RV's

The reality is that we get complaints from people with smaller vans and caravans "Do I have to look at "That" all day long" Can't you move them some where else"

Also when a large RV comes on site for one or two nights, after several days freeparking that they arrive with a 50 gallon black tank full, which they dump and wash away with 50 gallons of grey water into our holding tank

The tank that we have to pay to be emptied. The last time we had it emptied it cost us £130 for disposal of "1000 gallons of hazourdous waste" So the 100 gallon dump costs us £13.00

Add the water for washing the RV, the awning and the towed car and another dump before they leave knackering posts and the corners of the adjacent pitches and you will see why we dont jump for joy when a 40' RV pulls up.

Honest and truthfull as Eddie.
Lets look at his post paragraph by paragraph.
He gets complaints, can't argue with that as I am not on site.

Large RV's come on site for one or two nights after several days free parking:
What all of them! large RV's always free park somewhere do they, talk about blanket statements, this is clearly untrue or an exaggeration, so why say it.

They arrive with 50 gallons of black and grey.
Again all of them? and correct me if I am wrong but you told me sometime ago that only chemical waste goes into your holding tank, so the grey goes down the town sewer and if like a lot of other RV'ers I don't use chemicals my black can go there as well at no additional cost to you.
If that's correct then another exaggeration.

Water for washing the RV, awning and tow car.
I use a bucket to clean the screen, as for the rest I am on holiday, the last thing I am going to do is clean the RV, awning and towcar, and I venture to suggest I am not the only RVer like this. So clearly and exaggeration.

Dump before leaving.
Hang on you said I dumped when I arrived, now you complaining about the waste I produce while staying on your site, or do you believe RV's produce more crap then others?

They knacker posts and the grass.
Can't comment as I am not on site, but doesn't seem to be a particular problem for the CC, maybe your site roads are a bit small? If so your 30' limit makes sense, so why not stick to it?

I don't have a problem with him charging more for RV's, coaches, dogs, cats whatever as long as its clearly stated on his price list, its his site and he makes the rules if I don't like them I don't go there.

My conclusion is that Eddie, in the heat of the moment posted a load of half truths and exaggerations, if he's got a limit of 30' that's fine, their was no need to go off on one to justify why.

Olley

PS Susan said flattery will get you everywhere.

 

[eddie]

Thanks Olley, and I'll put your reply down to having not actually read my post, and once having got the wrong end of the stick, refusing to accept the logical reasoned arguement that I have put forward.

And to top it off posted an out of character stupid response! Why let what I actually said spoil a good rant!

I don't even know why your getting hissy, given that your van is too small to be included anyway?

Perhaps it is the stress of fixing your windows Olley

Well, I have said my piece, I will now drop out knowing that I have the moral high ground for having the balls to explain the situation as it really is. What would you prefer? having your egos massaged?

Got to go as we have a very busy campsite to run with at least SIX RV's on site enjoying the large open well laid out award winning campsite and facilities

Love Eddie

 

[haganap]

So Eddie,
If I come to your site, (only 23ft) based on what you say about dumping charges, if I dont dump either waste's on your site, promise to stay of the grass, does it mean I get a discount?

I thought not.

We rarely dump waste and tend to bring it home if onlly away for a weekend, but yet some sites still want to charge us more than a caravan?

 

[eddie]

So Eddie,
If I come to your site, (only 23ft) based on what you say about dumping charges, if I dont dump either waste's on your site, promise to stay of the grass, does it mean I get a discount?

I thought not.

We rarely dump waste and tend to bring it home if onlly away for a weekend, but yet some sites still want to charge us more than a caravan?

Don't know about charging more for a caravan as most sites have a fixed pitch fee.

do you have a thetford cassette loo? 3.5 ltrs? We are talking about the problems of dumping 100 + US Gallons There is a bit of a difference! in fact hundreds of litres every dump instead of 3.5!

Or would you prefer that every campsite in the UK worked out their costs based on every vehicle dumping hundreds of litres of waste? No? I thought not!

I would also guess that at circa 3500 kilos you would do less damage than 15,000 kilos

Bugger I said that I was going withdraw:Cool:

 

[olley]

Bugger I said that I was going withdraw:Cool:

That's caused many a pregnancy.

Olley

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[eddie]

:thumb:

 

[thehutchies]

That's caused many a pregnancy.

Olley

And why I've got five kids :Blush:

 

[Road Runner]

Mark&Sue - I have accepted the business reasons.
What I still struggle with is the acceptance of the 'eyesore attitude' of caravanners.

Especially some of the awnings, windbreaks and tents.

I was a tugger and may one day be one again.

Caravans can be ugly things but I wouldn't complain, also most vanners like to stop and chat about my bus anyway.

Do all 38 to 40 footer poo more than a 30 footer?

 

[MicknPat]

Hi Funsters......or should that read Battlesters

We intend to ship our 39ft A class back to the UK in Aug / Sept 2009 and one of the top requirements is to have a Strike Back alarm installed at Van Bitz, I'm afraid that after reading your comments Eddie although we may still attend we will now feel some what uncomfortable. :Sad:

For the record so far we have always arrived at a camp ground with empty grey & black tanks, emptying them before leaving where ever we last stayed. :thumb:

Previous to our buying an RV we owned a caravan with the toilet cassette, now I'm sure that owning an RV with a black tank doesn't case Pat & I to use the toilet any more than if we had a caravan with cassette, I do think that more water is used in a black tank but only to prevent any blockages.

Mick

 

[PeteH]

Nobody luvs us boo hoo?

Hi

Sat here in Espania, I was moved (what poo again??, too much roughage!!) by the comments on the subject of (for want of better words) "bloody R-V's". Eddie, has perhaps opened the can of worms, and I suspect that SOME R-V owners DO arrive with full tanks after several days on a car park somewhere. However I suspect that most don't. I have known CC ralliers who go to a "follow-on" rally on a CC Club site or commercial site with a FULL cassette too. Just as MOST people do not abuse the Social Services, just the "usual suspects" (on £100K+ yachts!!) will "crap it up" for the rest, to continue the "poo" vein!!!.

I am currently in some sort of dispute with the CC over much the same thing (size) and the term "reasonable" comes into play in all this, It is not reasonable to ban R-V's "over X feet" JUST because they ARE over X feet, It may, as I have shown before be that fact that I HAVE been on that Site, I always advise the warden, by phone of size AND the fact that I have been on Pitches X Y Z etc;. Same as when going to a new site. one of the ploys I use is to ask if they have had (say) a delivery vehicle on site? as If they can get a 7.5 tonne truck on site then I WILL get on!!!. No fear!!. AND without cutting your grass!! But then I used to park a 21ft+ twin axle caravan into tiny spots too!! which along with the tow vehicle was well over 40ft on the road. Abuses are a fact of life, but not as prevalent statistically as rumour would have it

To return to "poo", well I suppose at my advanced age, I might? produce a little more? BUT I reckon that a caravan load of Kids will produce a H*ll of a lot more!! along with the "mischief" (can't say vandalism any more its not PC) and mayhem. Its just spread over the Portapotie AND the camp toilets that's all!. The last cassette I had was MUCH larger than 3 Litres Full!!, when you have to carry it You Know!!! (10lbs+ per gallon!!) I had arms like a gorilla back then!!!. Its not acceptable to dump anywhere?, No?, hang on?, Years ago the "night soil" from MOST major cities was put on the land, at the end of the day it's manure, Aint it?. OK so it smells a bit, but that's no worse than the barn yard that used to be next to Eddies farm is it?. (might still be, it was well over 10 years ago that I used to go there) I suspect the problem is that we are remote from the "facts of life" these days, after all most kids think meat comes from the supermarket!!!. Eh?!!. So whats wrong with getting a slurry tanker and spreading it a bit?. No I'll bet the "elves" (and safety) will have a lot to carp about over that suggestion too.

I'll sign off with this thought. How much of the "resentment" against R-V's (any size) has to do with the perception that "your a rich B*****d"?. (that thought is NOT aimed at Eddie by the way, as I am aware of his situation and DO have some sympathy).

P.s at 8-30pm its still 16C outside after a nice sunny day!!!. I am on connected water, connected dump and 10amp power, how's that? (10E p/n) though the Internet connection is "hit and miss" to say the least!! Ah! well you can't have everything in this life!. peace and love campers!!

Pete

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[oldun]

Hi I am a keen supporter of motor homes but I find that many of my friends(!!!) dislike them intensely because (to them) they are large, noisy, slow, clutter-up the place and leave mess behind them.

Rather than thinking the owners are rich "whatever" they think of the owners as often being poor dossers who want everything for free.

This idea that others resent us because we are rich seems rather strange to me. I think they resent us as they associate us with "travellers" who do sometimes behave irresponsibly.

I see us as a very varied bunch of characters who wish to roam around enjoying ourselves and I would like us to be treated as a respected part of the community and not denied access wherever i go.

 

[Road Runner]

I often fancy just being a dosser:thumb:

 

[scotjimland]

I often fancy just being a dosser:thumb:

Don't dream John .. just do it .. .. it's easy