When is a Timberland PVC .. not a Motor Caravan ?

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scotjimland

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Answer... when the DVLA say so

I submitted my V5 to have it changed from Panel Van to Motor Caravan..it was converted by Timberland Motorhomes Ltd in 2003 .. Model Independence,..

I don't know if it was always registered as such or it was an error when it was registered to me.

I enclosed a covering letter explaining this and also photos of inside and out ..

Letter came back saying sorry, despite the internal being obviously converted to a motor caravan, it doesn't look like one from the outside .. so it can only be changed to ...... Van/Side Windows.

Screenshot 2023-09-28 at 15.37.34.png


so I have a Van with windows ..


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Hi. (y)
Had the same trouble when we went to import this one,first one was a doddle. " Wildax Constellation 3 " I had NOT noticed that it was not classed as a m/ho on the V5 and we had had it 4/5 yrs.? My fault for not checking,but who elses as well.
I sent photos of the inside/beds up/down-Fridge-loo-shower-Solar panels-Thule awning.In/Out. GRAPHICS EVERYWHERE and windows, came back " Van with windows" 4 times. Note. (.. SAME signature on the return form.....?.......Yes......?.. ) Hurdle for Importation......
Chap at the Portugues vehicle agency got involved....... Next time came back " Motor Home " and we are sitting in it now on site with its " Portuguese Numbers " front and back.
They said at the times of NOT changing the class of the vehicle.. " It does not matter,Police and everybody else knows its a m/ho........ ( Everybody that is, except DVLA.......)
Involve your MP if you have to,you never know your next change of address.................... and want to export it.
Tea Bag.
 
I think one off the critiria is 2 windows on one side if you appeal point out your windows are plastic double glazed not glass like most vans with windows
Could you get a letter from Timberland confirming the motorhome conversion was done by them (assuming its genuine)
I think as a converter should take some responsibility in helping ?
 
They have declared in the past, I believe, that they want to stop people using vans as motorhomes. I think they like plenty of graphics to make it look more like a motorhome. There have been plenty of threads on this subject on here and elsewhere. They are really being awkward. They should at least give you a clue as to what their requirements are.

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scotjimland said:
Answer... when the DVLA say so

I submitted my V5 to have it changed from Panel Van to Motor Caravan..it was converted by Timberland Motorhomes Ltd in 2003 .. Model Independence,..

I don't know if it was always registered as such or it was an error when it was registered to me.

I enclosed a covering letter explaining this and also photos of inside and out ..

Letter came back saying sorry, despite the internal being obviously converted to a motor caravan, it doesn't look like one from the outside .. so it can only be changed to ...... Van/Side Windows.

View attachment 815485

so I have a Van with windows ..


View attachment 815495
Click to expand...
You may also want to provide photos of other manufactures who do not have additional rear windows. For example our Hymer AyresRock does not have rear windows (it’s an option) I the same way the Yosemite Grand Canyon etc do not this also applies to many other main stream manufacturers. It is erroneous and needs to be corrected personally I would get a letter of conformity from wild axe along with photos of other manufacturers copy your MP and see what happens.
 
I think a blind man in a dark night would recognise this as a PVC .. maybe they DVLA are employing blind people

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Managed to upgrade (?) mine. Graphics, awning but they insist on a table that can be fixed inside. Mine was a folding leg type so just took the photos showing the table not how it kept itself in the air.
 
Mines similar I call it a camper :unsure:
 
Coolcats said:
You may also want to provide photos of other manufactures who do not have additional rear windows. For example our Hymer AyresRock does not have rear windows (it’s an option) I the same way the Yosemite Grand Canyon etc do not this also applies to many other main stream manufacturers. It is erroneous and needs to be corrected personally I would get a letter of conformity from wild axe along with photos of other manufacturers copy your MP and see what happens.
Click to expand...

scotjimland said:
View attachment 815606
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How would they know if it was a print of a 2nd window?
 
I've fitted graphics to many panel vans so dvla can see the bling. Some already had several eye catching images already in place. I fitted them using vaseline so just binned them after a photo shoot.
 
They won't reclassify it.

They changed their policy in 2019, unless it is done by the convertor at first registration you and me and everyone else is stuck with 'van with windows'.

There is an official appeal or investigation, but it is only into the DVLA's handling of their communication on the policy, rather than the policy itself, if I recall correctly.

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CAB96 said:
There is an official appeal or investigation, but it is only into the DVLA's handling of their communication on the policy, rather than the policy itself, if I recall correctly.
Click to expand...

DVLA letter ..last paragraph..

quote.

"Your application has been fully assessed and this decision is final. We will not consider any reviews of your case unless you make further changes to your vehicle.. "

unquote
 
Excuse my ignorance but what’s the advantage of it being classed as a motor caravan as opposed to a van with windows?
 
G7UXG said:
Excuse my ignorance but what’s the advantage of it being classed as a motor caravan as opposed to a van with windows?
Click to expand...
Main difference is VED .. it is lower when classed as a Motor Caravan,, If I recall correctly I paid £360 .. I think it's about £165 as a motor caravan.. others may clarify

Also.. other things like tolls... for example on the QE2 bridge I pay more as it's classed as goods vehicle .. not much but there is a principal involved..

Cars (including trailers), motorhomes and any minibuses that have 9 or less seats pay £2.50 as a one-off payment or £2 if they have an account.

Buses, coaches, vans and other goods vehicles that are vehicle class C with two axles pay £3 as a one-off payment or £2.63 with an account.

There may be other things I dont know about .. yet

It may affect insurance.. mine is insured with NFU as a camper van ..
 
I'm sure there's a whole long thread on here, but anyways....

It does not matter. The V5 does not define your vehicle (and mine), it only defines the appearance in traffic.

If it has the features of a motor caravan, it is a motor caravan.

Most importantly with regard to speed limits, you are not restricted to commercial vehicle limits, but passenger vehicle limits, assuming less than 3.05 tonnes unladen weight (i.e. Before conversion).
 
Blame the idiot vanlife YouTube muppets with the “stealth “ campers . They look exactly like a van with windows but they want to enjoy the benefits of being registered as a camper.

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CAB96 said:
It does not matter. The V5 does not define your vehicle (and mine), it only defines the appearance in traffic.
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maybe so, but it costs more to tax .. and also tolls can be higher for a van
 
scotjimland said:
maybe so, but it costs more to tax .. and also tolls can be higher for a van
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I wouldn't know about the tolls, I've managed to avoid them.

Isn't the tax just weight related? I.e. Less if you are over 3.5t?
 
I may be wrong about VED ..

but there is more to it.. eg

  • Cheaper ferry prices – Traveling on a ferry is typically cheaper for a campervan or motorhome than a commercial van. Most ferry companies look at a converted campervan and are happy for it to pay the cheaper campervan price. However, a few ferry companies will use the DVLA log book classification to determine whether to price the vehicle as a commercial vehicle or not.
 
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CAB96 said:
They won't reclassify it.

They changed their policy in 2019, unless it is done by the convertor at first registration you and me and everyone else is stuck with 'van with windows'.

There is an official appeal or investigation, but it is only into the DVLA's handling of their communication on the policy, rather than the policy itself, if I recall correctly.
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scotjimland Whilst the policy changes in 2019 this is a 2003 MoHo so an argument could be that the earlier rules apply in the same way as any model year build.

Edited to say, as in a previous post we do not have rear side windows, but the vehicle is classed as a Motor Caravan, you do need to speak with Wild Axe, if you can also obtain a model year brochure.

This is a link to the Solaris XL the image does not have rear windows in the same way other models are shown without a rear window so ask Wild Axe if those vehicles are registered as a Motor Caravan. As far as I can tell it is common for all main stream manufacturers have Motor Caravans without rear windows these are optional and quite often not fitted due to this being the sleeping area and no windows are required, here is an example by Adria (look at the layouts).

If you can find a member with the same model as your self who's vehicle is registered as a Campervan that may also help

Involve:
The Manufacturer
The Local MP
Get an example or more of Motor Caravans without rear windows that are registered as a Motor Caravan
Provide as many examples as you can and ask why you are being discriminated against considering this is a mainstream manufacturer conversion and not a DIY one.

I just paid my Vehicle duty its was £310 as you can see the taxation class is a PLG




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Hi Jim it needs to be changed to Motor Caravan not camper van - Send in pics of all the points that they need proof of
From memory (list available)
2 x windows on one side
Awning
Grapics
Bed or fixed seats that convert to bed
2 ring cooker/sink
Wardrobe (can be any cupboard you call wardrobe)
Fixed table ( can be clipped in place)
Also mention in your covering letter that it was converted by Timberland a recognised British converter in 2003 -
perhaps it has changed from Motor Caravan on the V5 by mistake ?
Edit also send your old pic showing your back box and alloys but don’t mention it’s old simply all your pics 😉
 
Terry said:
Hi Jim it needs to be changed to Motor Caravan not camper van - Send in pics of all the points that they need proof of
From memory (list available)
2 x windows on one side
Awning
Grapics
Bed or fixed seats that convert to bed
2 ring cooker/sink
Wardrobe (can be any cupboard you call wardrobe)
Fixed table ( can be clipped in place)
Also mention in your covering letter that it was converted by Timberland a recognised British converter in 2003 -
perhaps it has changed from Motor Caravan on the V5 by mistake ?
Click to expand...
Hi Terry .. yes I know it's correct class Motor Caravan.. and did everything you suggest ..
what I said in my first post
 
scotjimland said:
Hi Terry .. yes I know it's correct class Motor Caravan.. and did everything you suggest ..
what I said in my first post
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Send it in again (perhaps without reference to already been sent in ) stating that it may have been wrongly changed from MC on v5 with change of ownership and it’s clearly a MC from 2003 (always had been)
Perhaps ask if it does not meet criteria what does it need? as you have sent in photos of all met criteria
They could of course ask you to take to a DVLA exam place.
 
They won't change it :cry:

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