We've got loads of Data allowance...but sometimes...🤔

[jumar]

I been reading up on here...on Facebook and watched a few YouTube videos.
Our Data allowance is good....and generally here in Spain we rarely lack a good signal, but....there are times that we haven't got a good enough or even none at all...
Internet for us is fairly essential...planning bike routes, places to stay etc...and entertainment...TV (Footie) posting on here and Facebook...
I'm considering, and therefore asking, What's the latest external Aerial and Router solutions that would help us stay in contact with the outside world..
Just to add.... I've got a spare hole in the MH roof...actually it was where the TV Aerial used to be...the pole is still there.... advantage Me..
I await a bombardment of replies..

 

[DDJC]

All excellent advice.
On the basis of that advice, I am looking to get a Poynting MIMO-3-17 antenna, connected to a Teltonika RUTX50. I do have a couple of noob questions.

1. Roughly, what is the 'range' or distance from the Poynting that you can be before there is some signal drop off?
2. Is there anything else you need to get in order to get both connections from nearby WIFI antenna, or the 4g/5g signal? Is it just a MIMO antenna and a connected router with a sim?
3. As few of us need four LAN sockets, can you get one without any, but with the same SIM/WIFI connectivity?
4. What is the power supply for the RUTX50, i.e what is the power plug? Can it be (must it be) hardwired into the motorhome's 12V system?
5. Can you configure it to favour WIFI, and only switch to sim, when the WIFI is absent or weak? More importantly, can it switch back automatically?

As you may have guessed by my silly questions, I will not be fitting it myself

 

[DBK]

All excellent advice.
On the basis of that advice, I am looking to get a Poynting MIMO-3-17 antenna, connected to a Teltonika RUTX50. I do have a couple of noob questions.

1. Roughly, what is the 'range' or distance from the Poynting that you can be before there is some signal drop off?
2. Is there anything else you need to get in order to get both connections from nearby WIFI antenna, or the 4g/5g signal? Is it just a MIMO antenna and a connected router with a sim?
3. As few of us need four LAN sockets, can you get one without any, but with the same SIM/WIFI connectivity?
4. What is the power supply for the RUTX50, i.e what is the power plug? Can it be (must it be) hardwired into the motorhome's 12V system?
5. Can you configure it to favour WIFI, and only switch to sim, when the WIFI is absent or weak? More importantly, can it switch back automatically?

As you may have guessed by my silly questions, I will not be fitting it myself

The WiFi connections in the antenna are not for collecting free WiFi, their purpose is to broadcast the WiFi signal from the router. Normally these sort of router have a couple of stubby antenna attached to them for WiFi which will work fine in a MH. But using the WiFi antenna built into the roof mounted antenna you should get a much stronger signal outside the MH and from the reports I've read you get a good signal inside as well.

 

[DDJC]

All excellent advice.
On the basis of that advice, I am looking to get a Poynting MIMO-3-17 antenna, connected to a Teltonika RUTX50. I do have a couple of noob questions.

1. Roughly, what is the 'range' or distance from the Poynting that you can be before there is some signal drop off?
2. Is there anything else you need to get in order to get both connections from nearby WIFI antenna, or the 4g/5g signal? Is it just a MIMO antenna and a connected router with a sim?
3. As few of us need four LAN sockets, can you get one without any, but with the same SIM/WIFI connectivity?
4. What is the power supply for the RUTX50, i.e what is the power plug? Can it be (must it be) hardwired into the motorhome's 12V system?
5. Can you configure it to favour WIFI, and only switch to sim, when the WIFI is absent or weak? More importantly, can it switch back automatically?

As you may have guessed by my silly questions, I will not be fitting it myself

One other important question. I can't find the l x h x d dimensions of the Teltonika RUTX50 on any website. Anyone know? I have a likely looking cubby hole, right next to the TV 12v power socket and the old aerial socket (which we don't use). It would be perfect if we could use that space.

 

[fishplug]

1. Assuming you mean 'how far from the van can I still receive signal' - it's not a huge distance but it's perfectly good enough for sitting outside the van. I get something like 10m of good signal and it drops off a bit after that. If you want more range then you can plug a waterproof Wireless Access Point to one of the ethernet ports and just plug it in as and when needed.

2. No, you don't need to order anything more. You just need the router, the antenna and a SIM card. However, the vast majority of campsite WiFi is likely to be worse than the connection you'll get from your router on LTE (the SIM card).

3. Teltonika don't do any as far as I know. Other brands will have other options.

4. The power plug isn't something you'll commonly find. Teltonika will ship the router with a mains cable that you can cut if you don't want to power it from 240v AC or you can buy a cable that has the Teltonika socket on one end and bare wires on the other that you can plug in to a 12/24v system (it actually accepts 9-50v input) They also sell an optional cable to power it from a cigarette lighter socket if you prefer.

5. You can set the WiFi as the primary WAN with a failover to LTE as the secondary (and a failover to the second SIM if you're not getting signal from the first SIM slot). It's more advanced configuration, but it can be done.

Dimensions (W x H x D) 132 x 44.2 x 95.1 mm
Weight 533g

There are various optional mounting brackets / options you can buy if you want to screw it to a shelf or a wall or stick it on a DIN rail etc...

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[DDJC]

The WiFi connections in the antenna are not for collecting free WiFi, their purpose is to broadcast the WiFi signal from the router. Normally these sort of router have a couple of stubby antenna attached to them for WiFi which will work fine in a MH. But using the WiFi antenna built into the roof mounted antenna you should get a much stronger signal outside the MH and from the reports I've read you get a good signal inside as well.

So the four 'mobile' sockets get data in, and the two 'WIFI' sockets shove it out?
So whether the data signal is campsite WIFI or cellular 4/5g, it all comes into the RUTX50 via the four mobile connections?
So the Poynting is an antenna, i.e, it receives and transmits? (Flogging my brain for the right terminology when we set up an HF dipole antenna through PRC 320!)

 

[fishplug]

Almost, but not quite...

So the four 'mobile' sockets get data in, and the two 'WIFI' sockets shove it out?

Correct (although WiFi can also receive and not just transmit)

So whether the data signal is campsite WIFI or cellular 4/5g, it all comes into the RUTX50 via the four mobile connections?

Not quite.

The four "mobile" sockets on the back of the router handle cellular data

The 'WiFi' sockets handle WiFi data (receive and transmit)

So if the data signal is campsite WiFi then it comes in and goes out from the WiFi connections. If it's cellular (4/5g) then it comes in via the 'mobile' sockets and comes out from the WiFi sockets.

So the Poynting is an antenna, i.e, it receives and transmits? (Flogging my brain for the right terminology when we set up an HF dipole antenna through PRC 320!)

Yes, but they do different types that receive and transmit different things.

Some are just to receive cellular, some will also handle WiFi and others also include GPS and/or Bluetooth depending on which option you choose.

Some have 2 x 2 MIMO (two cellular antennas) others 4 x 4 (four cellular antennas) etc...

It can be confusing picking the right antenna. If you're not going to be using campsite WiFi or sitting any further than your awning then you probably don't strictly speaking need a Poynting antenna with WiFi. The Teltonika ships with some smaller antennas that connect directly to the router and are perfectly capable of broadcasting WiFi inside the van and outside to a shorter perimiter. If you're not going to be using any of the GPS features then you don't need a GPS capable antenna.

You could also mix and match. You don't need a Poynting that does everything. You could use the Poynting for cellular only and connect a separate GPS antenna, or a separate WiFi antenna... It really can be confusing!

 

[DBK]

So the four 'mobile' sockets get data in, and the two 'WIFI' sockets shove it out?
So whether the data signal is campsite WIFI or cellular 4/5g, it all comes into the RUTX50 via the four mobile connections?
So the Poynting is an antenna, i.e, it receives and transmits? (Flogging my brain for the right terminology when we set up an HF dipole antenna through PRC 320!)

Just to add to what fishplug has said above. I would forget campsite WiFi, although these antenna with WiFi connections can receive WiFi the Teltonika router can't do anything with that, it isn't a WiFi booster. They only transmit WiFi which they generate from the broadband connection. If you are familiar with a mifi then they essentially do the same job but a bit better.

 

[DDJC]

1. Assuming you mean 'how far from the van can I still receive signal' - it's not a huge distance but it's perfectly good enough for sitting outside the van. I get something like 10m of good signal and it drops off a bit after that. If you want more range then you can plug a waterproof Wireless Access Point to one of the ethernet ports and just plug it in as and when needed.

2. No, you don't need to order anything more. You just need the router, the antenna and a SIM card. However, the vast majority of campsite WiFi is likely to be worse than the connection you'll get from your router on LTE (the SIM card).

3. Teltonika don't do any as far as I know. Other brands will have other options.

4. The power plug isn't something you'll commonly find. Teltonika will ship it with a mains cable that you can cut if you don't want to power it from 240v AC or you can buy a cable that has the Teltonika socket on one end and bare wires on the other that you can plug in to a 12/24v system (it actually accepts 9-50v input) They also sell an optional cable to power it from a cigarette lighter socket if you prefer.

5. You can set the WiFi as the primary WAN with a failover to LTE as the secondary (and a failover to the second SIM if you're not getting signal from the first SIM slot). It's more advanced configuration, but it can be done.

Dimensions (W x H x D) 132 x 44.2 x 95.1 mm
Weight 533g

There are various optional mounting brackets / options you can buy if you want to screw it to a shelf or a wall or stick it on a DIN rail etc...

Brilliant, thanks very much.

Those dimensions seem tiny. Little bigger than an old tobacco tin. Is it really that small?
Do the mounting brackets fit using the hex screws in each corner?

Almost, but not quite...



Correct (although WiFi can also receive and not just transmit)



Not quite.

The four "mobile" sockets on the back of the router handle cellular data

The 'WiFi' sockets handle WiFi data (receive and transmit)

So if the data signal is campsite WiFi then it comes in and goes out from the WiFi connections. If it's cellular (4/5g) then it comes in via the 'mobile' sockets and comes out from the WiFi sockets.



Yes, but they do different types that receive and transmit different things.

Some are just to receive cellular, some will also handle WiFi and others also include GPS and/or Bluetooth depending on which option you choose.

Some have 2 x 2 MIMO (two cellular antennas) others 4 x 4 (four cellular antennas) etc...

It can be confusing picking the right antenna. If you're not going to be using campsite WiFi or sitting any further than your awning then you probably don't strictly speaking need a Poynting antenna with WiFi. The Teltonika ships with some smaller antennas that connect directly to the router and are perfectly capable of broadcasting WiFi inside the van and outside to a shorter perimiter. If you're not going to be using any of the GPS features then you don't need a GPS capable antenna.

You could also mix and match. You don't need a Poynting that does everything. You could use the Poynting for cellular only and connect a separate GPS antenna, or a separate WiFi antenna... It really can be confusing!

Again, extremely helpful. Thanks so much.

I think that I will go for a a 7 or 6 in 1 type. I don't think I need GPS (what would you use it for?). I also only want one antenna that does 4x4 and 2x2. Do Teltonika routers accept E-SIM cards?

I do need the ability to get campsite or free wifi, as I have two boys with autism and they are really heavy data users on their laptops. We get away for 3 weeks in the summer and I reckon that I could get by with 300gb if we also use campsite wifi when available. I've seen that Holafly seems to be the best value unlimited data, but they are E-SIM. Reglo do a physical sim 300gb for less than 20 euro, but I think you have to get it activated in the shop (LeClerk)

 

[fishplug]

Do Teltonika routers accept E-SIM cards?

Not as far as I know.

Bigger than a tobacco tin (well, at least the ones I used to buy tobacco in circa 1990!) but not much bigger than the palm of my hand. Pretty compact units and the dimensions I gave were from the Teltonika official website. Maybe three tobacco tins in old money? (I stopped smoking cigarettes when they went up to £2.50 sometime in the 80's so I'm probably not the best barometer!)

As someone with neurodivergence in the family I completely get your requirements.

I personally use a Three Unlimited SIM with mine, £17/month but you won't find that from Three directly. Third parties are often cheaper.

Completely frees you from 'free WiFi' requirements.

They have a 'fair use' limit when outside the UK but for £5 / day you can buy an unlimited 'data passport'

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[Manic]

ITV X is a bu@@er for sapping up the data, with no option to reduce it.

I’ve also found ITV x uses loads of data, I won’t use it abroad if I can help it for that reason, ok when in uk on unlimited data

 

[VXman]

Gosh - what a palava with all this complex tech talk.

I just switch on my hotspot on my £120 Chinese phone and stream away. (using my 90p Lebara sim) Just got bac from a week away at Silverstone, Winchester and the Cotswolds and never had a problem watching TV on the computer. 3 weeks in Scotland was fine. 2 months travelling across Europe each Autumn has always been spot on. Must be the quality of my cheap Chinese phone!!!

 

[fishplug]

I don't think I need GPS (what would you use it for?).

Missed that bit...

If you subscribe to their services (or put a fair bit of time and effort of your own into it) then you can use it as a vehicle tracker.

You can also set it up with a geofence so it notifies you if the vehicle has moved outside of your pre defined location

That's pretty much all I use mine for to be honest....

 

[fishplug]

Gosh - what a palava with all this complex tech talk.

I just switch on my hotspot on my £120 Chinese phone and stream away. (using my 90p Lebara sim) Just got bac from a week away at Silverstone, Winchester and the Cotswolds and never had a problem watching TV on the computer. 3 weeks in Scotland was fine. 2 months travelling across Europe each Autumn has always been spot on. Must be the quality of my cheap Chinese phone!!!

..um..

I work for a tech company, and my previous company used to provide the internet to Silverstone so....

It's nothing to do with your cheap Chinese phone and all about your Lebara SIM...

Or should I say Lebara's use of the Vodaphone network, because that's actually what you're using.

So, yes what a palaver (not palava) actually understanding it all is, and yes, how tedious all this complex tech talk is, but I have to say that it's also a breath of fresh air actually knowing how it all works is.

I'm just grateful to work in the industry so I can share my limited knowledge with fellow Funsters

 

[jumar]

..um..

I work for a tech company, and my previous company used to provide the internet to Silverstone so....

It's nothing to do with your cheap Chinese phone and all about your Lebara SIM...

Or should I say Lebara's use of the Vodaphone network, because that's actually what you're using.

So, yes what a palaver (not palava) actually understanding it all is, and yes, how tedious all this complex tech talk is, but I have to say that it's also a breath of fresh air actually knowing how it all works is.

I'm just grateful to work in the industry so I can share my limited knowledge with fellow Funsters

Your knowledge and others have helped us solve our initial problem...being in remote areas where data signal isn't up to much....and what WE need to solve this problem....
Silverstone is 1732 km from our current location...so this signal is a little on the weak side..

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[VXman]

..um..

I work for a tech company, and my previous company used to provide the internet to Silverstone so....

It's nothing to do with your cheap Chinese phone and all about your Lebara SIM...

Or should I say Lebara's use of the Vodaphone network, because that's actually what you're using.

So, yes what a palaver (not palava) actually understanding it all is, and yes, how tedious all this complex tech talk is, but I have to say that it's also a breath of fresh air actually knowing how it all works is.

I'm just grateful to work in the industry so I can share my limited knowledge with fellow Funsters

That was just one of the many locations mentioned, I actually find Europe much better than the UK in terms of signal so thats why I was particularly impressed with my UK use this last week.

Re Silverstone - signal there is non existent one particular weekend in July. Odd because the French seem to manage with bigger numbers of people at Le Mans 24 hour race weekend.

 

[DDJC]

Missed that bit...

If you subscribe to their services (or put a fair bit of time and effort of your own into it) then you can use it as a vehicle tracker.

You can also set it up with a geofence so it notifies you if the vehicle has moved outside of your pre defined location

That's pretty much all I use mine for to be honest....

Got all that with my tracker and immobiliser

 

[jumar]

Gosh - what a palava with all this complex tech talk.

I just switch on my hotspot on my £120 Chinese phone and stream away. (using my 90p Lebara sim) Just got bac from a week away at Silverstone, Winchester and the Cotswolds and never had a problem watching TV on the computer. 3 weeks in Scotland was fine. 2 months travelling across Europe each Autumn has always been spot on. Must be the quality of my cheap Chinese phone!!!

Perhaps I should have asked you directly, I didn't know we were blessed with such a gifted person...
Have you any other Specialist subjects we should all know about....saves posting on an open forum wasting everybody's time..

 

[fishplug]

Silverstone is an odd setup. The circuit itself has different provision from the businesses around it.

We used to do the peripheral companies, but not the circuit and spectators.

Believe me when I say we invested a lot of time and effort into persuading them of a cheaper and better solution but....

I have to agree with you about Europe v UK in terms of service.

Given what I do for a living I'm slightly obsessive about these things and have to say that Europe for me is on average about 10Mbps above what I can get in the UK.

I'll step aside from making any political comments, but....

 

[DBK]

I do need the ability to get campsite or free wifi, as I have two boys with autism and they are really heavy data users on their laptops.

You will need to buy a separate WiFi booster from someone like Motorhome WiFi for that but if you are staying in the UK, as suggested, just get a sim with unlimited data. They are not expensive these days.

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[fishplug]

Got all that with my tracker and immobiliser

You illustrate my point perfectly.

If you already have it, then there's no point buying it again...

Mix and match.

 

[fishplug]

You will need to buy a separate WiFi booster from someone like Motorhome WiFi for that but if you are staying in the UK, as suggested, just get a sim with unlimited data. They are not expensive these days.

Not neccesarily.

It's one option, but there are others out there.

If I was travelling abroad regularly with young neurodivergent family members then I would probably look at Starlink as an affordable option.

Lots of ways of skinning this particular cat...

 

[DDJC]

Not neccesarily.

It's one option, but there are others out there.

If I was travelling abroad regularly with young neurodivergent family members then I would probably look at Starlink as an affordable option.

Lots of ways of skinning this particular cat...

Starlink seems prohibitively expensive.

 

[fishplug]

Starlink seems prohibitively expensive.

I'm on that cusp.

Doesn't quite economically make sense for me, but might for others.

I'm a whisper away..

 

[DDJC]

You will need to buy a separate WiFi booster from someone like Motorhome WiFi for that but if you are staying in the UK, as suggested, just get a sim with unlimited data. They are not expensive these days.

We don't stay in UK much. One trip a year maybe. We mostly head south and cross the water.

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[jumar]

Almost, but not quite...



Correct (although WiFi can also receive and not just transmit)



Not quite.

The four "mobile" sockets on the back of the router handle cellular data

The 'WiFi' sockets handle WiFi data (receive and transmit)

So if the data signal is campsite WiFi then it comes in and goes out from the WiFi connections. If it's cellular (4/5g) then it comes in via the 'mobile' sockets and comes out from the WiFi sockets.



Yes, but they do different types that receive and transmit different things.

Some are just to receive cellular, some will also handle WiFi and others also include GPS and/or Bluetooth depending on which option you choose.

Some have 2 x 2 MIMO (two cellular antennas) others 4 x 4 (four cellular antennas) etc...

It can be confusing picking the right antenna. If you're not going to be using campsite WiFi or sitting any further than your awning then you probably don't strictly speaking need a Poynting antenna with WiFi. The Teltonika ships with some smaller antennas that connect directly to the router and are perfectly capable of broadcasting WiFi inside the van and outside to a shorter perimiter. If you're not going to be using any of the GPS features then you don't need a GPS capable antenna.

You could also mix and match. You don't need a Poynting that does everything. You could use the Poynting for cellular only and connect a separate GPS antenna, or a separate WiFi antenna... It really can be confusing!

Then choosing my criteria, needing to bring in a cellular signal to use in the van only, in places where our phones are not providing much....and being compatible with the router I've ordered...is a Poynting mimo 4 17 still the best choice...or would a mimo 3 12 still do a good job...or a similar antenna from the Poynting range..? Like you said....confusing and you can mix and match., so can I..?

 

[JockandRita]

Then choosing my criteria, needing to bring in a cellular signal to use in the van only, in places where our phones are not providing much....and being compatible with the router I've ordered...is a Poynting mimo 4 17 still the best choice...or would a mimo 3 12 still do a good job...or a similar antenna from the Poynting range..? Like you said....confusing and you can mix and match., so can I..?

I chose the MiMo 3 V12 Martin, as it was 4G/5G compatible, and I wanted to increase the cellular signal in poor signal areas, but didn't require WiFi nor GPS. If there is a better model or type purely for cellular, that's the one I'd be going for if a new install.

Cheers,

Jock.

 

[fishplug]

The MIMO-4-17 will certainly do the job, but it has the GPS and WiFi antennas that you may never use.

For just cellular you could use the MIMO-4-4 however while the gain is the same and the frequency range is similar you'll find that the 4-4 is only WiFi 3 which is quite an old standard now. The 4-17 is WiFi 6E which means you'll get better signal in the van but also the signal will travel further outside the van.

Depends on the price difference and whether it's worth it to you or not.

For me personally it was worth it even though I don't really use the WiFi or GPS

 

[JockandRita]

The MIMO-4-17 will certainly do the job, but it has the GPS and WiFi antennas that you may never use.

For just cellular you could use the MIMO-4-4 however while the gain is the same and the frequency range is similar you'll find that the 4-4 is only WiFi 3 which is quite an old standard now. The 4-17 is WiFi 6E which means you'll get better signal in the van but also the signal will travel further outside the van.

Depends on the price difference and whether it's worth it to you or not.

For me personally it was worth it even though I don't really use the WiFi or GPS

If we are only talking of £20 - £30 (or Euros) difference, then it would be a no brainer for me, but it's looking nearer to £100 more.

Jock.

 

[zac]

Just to add to what fishplug has said above. I would forget campsite WiFi, although these antenna with WiFi connections can receive WiFi the Teltonika router can't do anything with that, it isn't a WiFi booster. They only transmit WiFi which they generate from the broadband connection. If you are familiar with a mifi then they essentially do the same job but a bit better.

Is this correct as my understanding is that the new RUTX's can act a Wifi repeater, i am sure i read somewhere that they can do this.

Found the wiki page Here although this shows connecting to another RUT i think it can connect to any Wifi that it scans and sees, certainly not as straight forwards as some others out there.

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[DBK]

Is this correct as my understanding is that the new RUTX's can act a Wifi repeater, i am sure i read somewhere that they can do this.

Found the wiki page Here although this shows connecting to another RUT i think it can connect to any Wifi that it scans and sees, certainly not as straight forwards as some others out there.

I thought as they only have two WiFi connections I couldn't see how they can receive and transmit at the same time.

However, a bit of Googling reveals they possibly can do this, which is very clever. However, the explanations I came across were all about setting it up and it sounds remarkably complicated.

The page you link to shows two routers but I think you can interprete the one on the left as being the campsite WiFi and the one on the right being the router in the MH. Interestingly this has a PC connected to it by what I assume is an ethernet cable. It doesn't show a second Wi-Fi signal. I can understand how it would work with ethernet, it's the WiFi bit which I'm struggling with.