weight issue

[Whippet93]

Hello, I've recently bought a second hand motorhome and am puzzled with a weight issue. According to my paperwork (V5c and other) the MIRO is 3085 Kg and max gross weight is 3500kg so I should have just over 400kg payload. However the other day I had it on a weigh bridge and the weight was 3540kg. This was without and passengers/driver or water. I had a quick check of whats in the garage (which includes a wheel chair), and reckoned up other stuff such as gas bottles, hydraulic levelling system, leisure batteries, wind out awning, which all comes to around 250 kg. Inside is the usual bedding and kitchen stuff, so would expect to still have over 100 kg to play with. I'd thought that such as gas and leisure batterise would be included in the MIRO, but from what I've read maybe not. I can't figure out how I can loose any of this weight to make it legal. Is this a common issue?

 

[Manxcat]

Very common. Put simply you have bought a van which cannot be practically used (legally)

 

[ambulancekidd]

 

[gus-lopez]

(which includes a wheel chair), and reckoned up other stuff such as gas bottles, hydraulic levelling system, leisure batteries, wind out awning, which all comes to around 250 kg. Inside is the usual bedding and kitchen stuff,

all of which would come off of the available pay load

I'd thought that such as gas and leisure batterise would be included in the MIRO,

No ,nothing rarely is .if there are then they say in catalogue

Is this a common issue?

very.

 

[Captain Yoghurtpot]

Very common. Put simply you have bought a van which cannot be practically used (legally)

Or, put more positively, if you have a C1 classification on your licence, why not have the van calculated for up-plating by one of the tech firms.
May I ask, what is the documented weight of the van with 1 person, some water and diesel? , as in basically empty.
Might get this info from your v5 or any manuals from the van.
And what is the van?

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[HKF]

If you have category C1 on your licence, you could look at having it up-plated, if that's possible with your van.

EDIT Captain Yoghurtpot beat me to it

 

[pappajohn]

If you have category C1 on your licence simply uprate the gross weight 3850kg.
And its £165 road tax instead of well over £200.

Does it have more than one battery or a tow bar or solar panels..... It all adds up.
Only 75kg is allowed for the driver, any passengers are class as payload.
A full tank of fresh water can be 100kg.

 

[Lenny HB]

Also a 5% tolerance on the weight so it could be 3239kg before you add any options & accessories.

The MIRO normally incudes a driver at 75kg, 20Lt of water (20kg & one 11kg aluminium gas bottle aprox 17kg & 90% fuel.

The hydraulic jacks are around 64 kg awning 42kg so without any other extras you could be down to a payload of 155kg which would make the van unuseable.

Very few 7m A Class vans that can be run legally at 3500kg.

 

[Minxy]

What were the individual axle weights?

 

[Brains]

Hello & welcome

I'm sure many here will tell you, this is a common sales con.
Normally you insist on a weighbridge certificate before parting with any money.

There are many stories of people ordering brand new 3500kg motorhomes, specifying a load of normal extras (Awning, extra battery, solar etc) and then finding out it's overweight before they even drive off the forecourt.

IF you passed your driving test before 1997 you will have a C1 licence.
If you did not, then the cheapest solution is to get a C1 licence (about £1k).
And get the van up plated to whatever is reasonable (typically £200-300 if no mods are needed)

As said above there are very few (if any??) 7m, 4 berth motorhomes around the 3,100 kg mark

If you look at most of the adverts such as this one or this one for the Bavaria I700 they are described as being plated at 4,400kg

As it stands at the moment, if you do not have a C1 then it's unusable, undrivable and unsellable.
The only other option would be to upplate it and sell it next spring, which should get you most of the money back.

(Or you could try having an argument with whomever sold it to you, but if it was a private deal, then Caveat Emptor applies)

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[dunnah01]

As a last resort you could put everything heavy in a trailer and tow it but that is a real PITA if touring

 

[Whippet93]

all of which would come off of the available pay load

No ,nothing rarely is .if there are then they say in catalogue

very.

all of which would come off of the available pay load

No ,nothing rarely is .if there are then they say in catalogue

very.

I realise this would come off the payload, but taking this 250kg off the current weight brings it down to about 3290kg, 200kg above the MIRO, and I can'f figure out what else would be counted as "extra" to bring the weight down to 3085kg

 

[Whippet93]

Hello & welcome

I'm sure many here will tell you, this is a common sales con.
Normally you insist on a weighbridge certificate before parting with any money.

There are many stories of people ordering brand new 3500kg motorhomes, specifying a load of normal extras (Awning, extra battery, solar etc) and then finding out it's overweight before they even drive off the forecourt.

IF you passed your driving test before 1997 you will have a C1 licence.
If you did not, then the cheapest solution is to get a C1 licence (about £1k).
And get the van up plated to whatever is reasonable (typically £200-300 if no mods are needed)

As said above there are very few (if any??) 7m, 4 berth motorhomes around the 3,100 kg mark

If you look at most of the adverts such as this one or this one for the Bavaria I700 they are described as being plated at 4,400kg

As it stands at the moment, if you do not have a C1 then it's unusable, undrivable and unsellable.
The only other option would be to upplate it and sell it next spring, which should get you most of the money back.

(Or you could try having an argument with whomever sold it to you, but if it was a private deal, then Caveat Emptor applies)

I do have a C1 licence so thats not a problem. I have original French paperwork for the van, stamped by the DVLA showing MIRO as 3085 and max mass 3500, and a copy of the brochure for the range, which lists the payload for my vehicle at 490kg, although doesn't list the max mass. The motorhome was advertised by the dealer as 3500kg, and as that is whats on the V5c, they haven't mis sold. Although I have found another plate in the engine bay that shows 3650kg, 6150kg (max train?) plus the to axle limits maybe up plate is the way

Hello & welcome

I'm sure many here will tell you, this is a common sales con.
Normally you insist on a weighbridge certificate before parting with any money.

There are many stories of people ordering brand new 3500kg motorhomes, specifying a load of normal extras (Awning, extra battery, solar etc) and then finding out it's overweight before they even drive off the forecourt.

IF you passed your driving test before 1997 you will have a C1 licence.
If you did not, then the cheapest solution is to get a C1 licence (about £1k).
And get the van up plated to whatever is reasonable (typically £200-300 if no mods are needed)

As said above there are very few (if any??) 7m, 4 berth motorhomes around the 3,100 kg mark

If you look at most of the adverts such as this one or this one for the Bavaria I700 they are described as being plated at 4,400kg

As it stands at the moment, if you do not have a C1 then it's unusable, undrivable and unsellable.
The only other option would be to upplate it and sell it next spring, which should get you most of the money back.

(Or you could try having an argument with whomever sold it to you, but if it was a private deal, then Caveat Emptor applies)

I do have a C1 licence so that's not a problem. Both the V5c and original French paperwork, stamped by the DVLA, show that MIRO as 3085kg and MAM as 3500kg, and the dealer advertised it as 3500kg, so they've done nothing wrong. I have found a plate in the engine bay stamped with 3650kg, 6000kg (max including a trailer?) plus the two axle weights 1850 & 2000, which suggests the MAM should be 3850kg (1850+2000). May be upplating is the answer.

 

[Whippet93]

What were the individual axle weights?

I didn't get axle weights at the weighbridge, but a plate in the engine bay shows 1850kg & 2000kg

 

[BouncyBoatFolk]

With a tyre upgrade, and rear air bags you can get to 4090kg or there abouts. BUT, the rear axle will max out at 2240kg, so careful loading is still required. Overloading the front 1850kg is very difficult due to vans designs. Additionally, check the loading.figures for the garage area, quite often this is only 150kg without additional supports, which also then bite into your pay load.
Mike.

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[Brains]

I do have a C1 licence so thats not a problem. I have original French paperwork for the van, stamped by the DVLA showing MIRO as 3085 and max mass 3500, and a copy of the brochure for the range, which lists the payload for my vehicle at 490kg, although doesn't list the max mass. The motorhome was advertised by the dealer as 3500kg, and as that is whats on the V5c, they haven't mis sold. Although I have found another plate in the engine bay that shows 3650kg, 6150kg (max train?) plus the to axle limits maybe up plate is the way

I do have a C1 licence so that's not a problem. Both the V5c and original French paperwork, stamped by the DVLA, show that MIRO as 3085kg and MAM as 3500kg, and the dealer advertised it as 3500kg, so they've done nothing wrong. I have found a plate in the engine bay stamped with 3650kg, 6000kg (max including a trailer?) plus the two axle weights 1850 & 2000, which suggests the MAM should be 3850kg (1850+2000). May be upplating is the answer.

The only way that you will be able to legally drive the vehicle is to get it up-plated.

I'd suggest to the same weight as other identical vehicles (4,300kg)
There are a couple of companies that will do this for you, details are on this forum.

This will lower your road tax but may increase your insurance.

 

[Minxy]

I didn't get axle weights at the weighbridge, but a plate in the engine bay shows 1850kg & 2000kg

Is that the base vehicle weight plate or the converter's plate as the latter always over rules the former?

The converter's plate will give the max for each but doesn't tell you what the weight on them is with it loaded up which is why you need the actual weights if them to make sure they are not overloaded as can happen on the rear especially with a garage.

 

[Minxy]

This will lower your road tax but may increase your insurance.

Road tax will only be £165 a year and it shouldn't have any affect on vehicle insurance however breakdown cover may have limitations on weight so if it is part of the whole insurance package that's the only thing to check on.

 

[Minxy]

Just realised you've only got one free post left so use it wisely or join for £20 and we can continue to assist you with this and other stuff too.

 

[enark]

If you have category C1 on your licence simply uprate the gross weight 3850kg.
And its £165 road tax instead of well over £200.

Does it have more than one battery or a tow bar or solar panels..... It all adds up.
Only 75kg is allowed for the driver, any passengers are class as payload.
A full tank of fresh water can be 100kg.

£345 now for under 3500kg van

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[enark]

Ive uprated a couple of times, usually to 3850 is paperwork only, beyond that you may have to uprate wheels, suspension, tyres etc.

But it all depends on your specific van.

SV Tech or VWE (if hes re certified ) will gladly advise.

Positives are, legal, safe, cheaper ved. Negatives are maybe higher tolls, maybe higher ferry costs etc

 

[Orion]

Although I have found another plate in the engine bay that shows 3650kg, 6150kg (max train?) plus the to axle limits maybe up plate is the way

I have found a plate in the engine bay stamped with 3650kg, 6000kg (max including a trailer?) plus the two axle weights 1850 & 2000, which suggests the MAM should be 3850kg (1850+2000). May be upplating is the answer.

That will be the original base vehicle manufacturer’s plate and indicates that the original weight was indeed 3650kg and the converter, the second plate, has reduced it to 3500kg to be more attractive to a larger market with a sub 3500kg entitlement on their licence. The two axle weights are the maximum that can be carried on each and will not necessarily be added together for an overall figure of 3850kg - as you can see there’s a 200kg difference there. Up plating should be a paper exercise back to 3650kg, possibly 3850kg depending on vehicle spec, and maybe even higher with upgrades to suspension and maybe wheels, tyres, etc.

 

[f6c]

Welcome aboard

 

[Pausim]

Leisure batteries can be very heavy. 2 x 80Ah Gel batteries will weigh in at over 50kg but you could get a Lithium battery weighing 15kg with about the same useable power. Steel gas cylinders are heavy, an 11kg capacity one weighs 13.2 kg when empty. A composite 10kg capacity Safefill bottle only weighs 5kg empty. If you have the heavy kit you might save 50kg with lighter weight versions.

Do you have a spare wheel? These weigh about 35kg but a pump with puncture fluid is a legal alternative and might save you 30kg. Some would say they are a poor alternative but most new cars don’t have spare wheels. Without a spare wheel you could leave the jack and wheel brace kit at home, another 10 kg saved.

If you are desperate to cut down on weight are the wind out awning and hydraulic levelling essential? Both are heavy items.

Go through your kitchen stuff and be ruthless. Out with the crockery, bamboo plates and cups are lighter. An aluminium pan weighs less than a steel one too.

If you get desperate share a toothbrush and cut the handle off it. What I am trying to say is don’t panic there are ways of losing weight. In my case going on a proper diet would save many kgs.

 

[Minxy]

I assume this is the model of MH the OP has ... no way can it realistically be run at max 3500kg.

https://www.outandaboutlive.co.uk/buyers-guide/motorhomes/bavaria-i700c-class-2015

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