Tolls to reappear in Spain, with EU interference?

[Silver-Fox]

As well as looking to cleaner air

Tolls don’t make the air cleaner.

The same as charging to go into parts of London.

 

[gus-lopez]

The real problem of tolls on most autovias is that regions have road tax. So you would not only be paying twice but dependent on where you live & cost of your road tax might already be paying 5 times what a similar vehicle is in a cheap area?
The level & cost of the road tax is set by individual local councils in each region. You can have hundreds of different road tax amounts for the same region.
I pay 180€/year . It is cheaper in Äguilas & even more so in San Juan de los Terreros. Go to Estepona & it is 60€/year ??
This is what the Policia Local are supposed to do ,amongst other jobs, ensure that you live where yu say you do. yets in some regions they allow it? & that is why 00's of 000's of rental cars are registered to a samll village in Cataluña as it has the lowest road tax.Even Gov.es does it registering all government vehicles in another region??

The imposition of tolls on all roads would lead to a complaint to the EU for discrimination due to the different taxation levels for vehicles.

 

[David and Sally]

Erm no, it’s no different to a credit card, the bank lends you money and imposes terms to which you agree to, if you don’t pay it back there are penalties. So then the bank is a big bad wolf (not) and let’s not forget who’s money is being lent either by the eu or a bank it is ours or at least those who have placed money in savings or bonds etc.

And didn’t America lend us money post 1945 and can you imagine what would have happened if we didn’t pay it back?

What Gus says ^^^^^^^ and

The banks don’t tell me what I can eat, where I park my car or if I have to charge a neighbour for parking on my drive occasionally.
However you explain it it is EU meddling.

 

[JockandRita]

The real problem of tolls on most autovias is that regions have road tax. So you would not only be paying twice but dependent on where you live & cost of your road tax might already be paying 5 times what a similar vehicle is in a cheap area?
The level & cost of the road tax is set by individual local councils in each region. You can have hundreds of different road tax amounts for the same region.
I pay 180€/year . It is cheaper in Äguilas & even more so in San Juan de los Terreros. Go to Estepona & it is 60€/year ??
This is what the Policia Local are supposed to do ,amongst other jobs, ensure that you live where yu say you do. yets in some regions they allow it? & that is why 00's of 000's of rental cars are registered to a samll village in Cataluña as it has the lowest road tax.Even Gov.es does it registering all government vehicles in another region??

The imposition of tolls on all roads would lead to a complaint to the EU for discrimination due to the different taxation levels for vehicles.

So in reality Richard, are you saying that the proposed reintroduction of tolls, is unlikely to be anytime soon for the reasons you mention above?

Cheers,

Jock.

 

[Coolcats]

It is different because is in the Euro, this means that when they face any kind of crisis they don't have the ability to unilaterally change interest rates or print more or less money, which is the way the UK dealt with the recent crises.

Then it is even more important that what is borrowed is payed back, I was using a simplistic argument to highlight when a country has assistance and agrees to pay it back they should. even if the UK prints more money I would still have to pay back money I borrowed.

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[Coolcats]

What Gus says ^^^^^^^ and

The banks don’t tell me what I can eat, where I park my car or if I have to charge a neighbour for parking on my drive occasionally.
However you explain it it is EU meddling.

But when you borrow money from said bank then you will pay it back, and regarding food there are UK food standards which do control what food you eat.

The laws of the land do say where you can park your car and of course you can let your neighbours park on your drive but you will still have to pay the bank for the Mortgage, if you do not have sufficient income to pay the mortgage you may have to rent a room or rent the drive.

Dont pay the mortgage there will be consequences how is this so different?

How you budget and finance your debts is of little interest to the bank unless it's ilegal. The argument you put forward has to be more robust than 'meddling' as it is a financial situation of a loan and agreed payback.

 

[Barclaybasher]

Anyone avoiding tolls heading from Bilbao or Santander will join all the HGVs doing the same.
Hardly used toll roads in perfect condition while the other roads and villages suffer the wear and pollution.....
Nuts!

 

[Steadycam]

I’m naturally inclined towards being a remainer in my views but n Europe and believe that together we are stronger in this world with China, India and USA being so big, powerful and increasingly disruptive; but this kind of bullying of a member state to implement something which they don’t want to, based on their population already being stretched by cost of living (as per the article), really challenges my view! I hope Spain (and the others) stand up to Brussels!

As the EU system is set up there is no option to not comply. That's was the Lisbon treaty was for , your Laws are set by Brussels. So like they have done with Poland and Hungery they set a €10Million a month fine (if you don't pay they deduct it at source from your hand out ) till eventually the state has to comply. So Spain will have to suffer financially or start charging tolls there is no appeal possible. Btw (only stating their procedures laid down not commenting on any B process from the past)

 

[jongood]

Then it is even more important that what is borrowed is payed back, I was using a simplistic argument to highlight when a country has assistance and agrees to pay it back they should. even if the UK prints more money I would still have to pay back money I borrowed.

It doesnt quite work like that, Spain can't print more money because it doesn't have control of its currency. If a country prints more money then its currency gets devalued accordingly so imported goods become more expensive but the countries debts become cheaper to repay. This was a big problem with the Greek debt crisis a few years ago, Greece was unable to devalue like in the Drachma days which in their case had the rather good effect of attracting more tourism.

 

[Coolcats]

It doesnt quite work like that, Spain can't print more money because it doesn't have control of its currency. If a country prints more money then its currency gets devalued accordingly so imported goods become more expensive but the countries debts become cheaper to repay. This was a big problem with the Greek debt crisis a few years ago, Greece was unable to devalue like in the Drachma days which in their case had the rather good effect of attracting more tourism.

Well on a personal level just as I do in France I don’t object to paying a toll.

Having given money to Spain (and others) Brussels would like it back please. Which doesn’t seem unreasonable exactly how these countries pay it back doesn’t matter as long as they do.

“A European Commission statement said that if it hears nothing, it ‘may decide to refer the matter to the European Union Court of Justice’.

Spain has been given large swathes of money from the EU for its ‘recovery plan’ in the wake of the Covid pandemic but that came on the condition that it would bring toll charging and rules to the same standard as the rest of the bloc.

The Sanchez government has slow-paced changes due to the likely backlash from motorists having to pay more to use motorway toll roads as well as charges being introduced to some secondary roads.”

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[mikebeaches]

Anyone avoiding tolls heading from Bilbao or Santander will join all the HGVs doing the same.
Hardly used toll roads in perfect condition while the other roads and villages suffer the wear and pollution.....
Nuts!

Agreed - the few times we've driven right across Spain from Santander and Bilbao in the past, it often felt like we were on our own private highway, with hardly any other vehicles - you could go for ages without seeing another one.

But on occasion, you would look out and see HGVs and other traffic nearby backed up on the non-toll roads.

Not sure if it's changed, but we thought the inland motorways we're really quite good value, especially compared to France!

 

[gus-lopez]

The Sanchez government has slow-paced changes due to the likely backlash from motorists having to pay more to use motorway toll roads as well as charges being introduced to some secondary roads.”

& ten days ago they categorically state it wouldn't be happening

So in reality Richard, are you saying that the proposed reintroduction of tolls, is unlikely to be anytime soon for the reasons you mention above?

Cheers,

Jock.

In reality Jock ,I have no idea? As above a gov.es minister stated that 10 days ago.

This ;

https://euroweeklynews.com/2023/10/...inate-implementation-tolls-spanish-motorways/

was the original agreement

 

[David and Sally]

We paid about 37€ to get from Santander to Zaragoza last winter and given it was snowy and the toll roads clear that seemed a sensible option.
Quite prepared to do so again this winter but now I know the EU want to money I might gag a bit