To buy or not to buy British

[RollingRog]

We are looking to purchase a motorhome having just sold the Eldiss Evolution that we made the mistake of buying!

Looking around on different chat rooms etc, the overriding opinion seems to be that foreign vehicles are of better quality.

Your thoughts would be much appreciated

 

[Carpmart]

In reality there's only 3 British vans, Lunar, Swift & Bailey, the rest are either French or German/U.S.

Swift are cutting back production, Bailey have dropped a marque, Elddis are soon to be using Thor/Hymer build technology & Trigano/Auto Trail are building a 3rd production line.

It's going the same way with PVC's too. Westfalia & Wildax are owned by Rapido.

You mean only three larger volume British manufacturers… there are a number of excellent smaller volume manufacturers who are as good or indeed better than the Europeans.

 

[nicholsong]

Unlike other posters I have only had one S/H N&B Arto 2003 which I bought at 6 years-old, so 14 years experience of it.

Ours is, as posted in #22 aluminium construction without wood, so leaks are not a problem.

We have found the construction has held up well to 20+ years use. We have recently had some window seals replaced but I would expect that after 20 years.

Most of the comments above have been about buying new. I consider that as foolish, as there are good quality S/H MHs to be had at very reduced prices compared with new prices. It also means one can buy one which comes from the era when design, build and quality control were better.

Another aspect is whether you are looking at buying a MH under 3.5t, maybe because of lack of C1 driving licence. From reading on forums that seems to create problems in that many manufacturers are trying to target that market, because the numbers of drivers having C1 automatically from passing their driving test prior to 1st Jan 1997 is dwindling. The manufacturers are trying to fit lots of goodies in under 3.5t and to ensure at least some sort of decent payload they are downgrading the standard of materials and build quality.

My advice is to go for some of the good quality Continental MHs over 3.5t and S/H. If it means taking a C1 licence test it will be worthwhile in the end.

 

[Northernraider]

I've come to the conclusion they're all shit and you get issues with them all. So my theory nowadays is buy an older cheaper van and just deal with the issues as they come up. You'll get issues with newer vans too but they'll cost more to repair. You'll have no choice but to repair it as you'll already have a serious wad of cash invested in it...and you'll fall in to.the trap of always wanting to upgrade it to a newer model and lose more money.

Had lots of British caravans ...didn't have too much bother with them, my parents had a good few British motorhomes and had leaks etc with them. So that put me off buying British motorhomes.

I've had a 1995 euramobil coachbuikt .... it had leaks .

A 2000 mobilvetta eurayacht 190lx.... I had no issues with that whatsoever.


A 2003 burstner argos 747 ....again no issues whatsoever with that one.

A 2008 frankia i800 , no issues with that.

A 2004 hymer 654, it had a leak from rear high level brake light and 2 of the skylights but that was mostly lack of maintenance from previous owners. All skylights will leak if not resealed every so often.

A 2006 euramobil integra 810. It had a previous and recurring leak on one of the side seams along the roof. Had went unnoticed for some time which had caused a few soft spots on the base floor. Double floored model.

Current van is a 1998 mobilvetta eurayacht 170. It had leaks when I bought it. Every window leaked and the roof joint seal leaked. All leaks have been fixed now and resealed, interior stripped and renewed.


I'm not so concerned about a £10k van having a few leaks and needing a few repairs done


But when it was a £40k van it worried me

If it was a £70k plus van I'd be suicidal


I was lucky...I made a profit on every one I had when I sold it but I've seen horror stories of people losing thousands on newer vans with issues.

The build quality of newer vans seems to be shit unless you're spending upwards of £100k which I'll never afford to do.

 

[Northernraider]

Unlike other posters I have only had one S/H N&B Arto 2003 which I bought at 6 years-old, so 14 years experience of it.

Ours is, as posted in #22 aluminium construction without wood, so leaks are not a problem.

We have found the construction has held up well to 20+ years use. We have recently had some window seals replaced but I would expect that after 20 years.

Most of the comments above have been about buying new. I consider that as foolish, as there are good quality S/H MHs to be had at very reduced prices compared with new prices. It also means one can buy one which comes from the era when design, build and quality control were better.

Another aspect is whether you are looking at buying a MH under 3.5t, maybe because of lack of C1 driving licence. From reading on forums that seems to create problems in that many manufacturers are trying to target that market, because the numbers of drivers having C1 automatically from passing their driving test prior to 1st Jan 1997 is dwindling. The manufacturers are trying to fit lots of goodies in under 3.5t and to ensure at least some sort of decent payload they are downgrading the standard of materials and build quality.

My advice is to go for some of the good quality Continental MHs over 3.5t and S/H. If it means taking a C1 licence test it will be worthwhile in the end.

I've had 3 alleged no wood in construction vans that have leaked. And have caused damage. So whilst it's definitely better it isn't foolproof sadly.

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[Coastal Cruiser.]

The build quality of newer vans seems to be shit unless you're spending upwards of £100k which I'll never afford to do

Plenty of shit vans over £100k only good thing is that with mine I get a 10 year water ingress warranty, this claim going through now will give me a new table and roof trim, j would not fancy having to buy them

I think generally everything that is manufactured today Is just rubbish and not designed to work for to long Have had some issues with some fairly expensive kitchen appliances that are only 4 years old, when you ask about them it seems it’s a known issue but no bugger seems to look into making it better it seems to be the acceptable thing

 

[Northernraider]

Plenty of shit vans over £100k only good thing is that with mine I get a 10 year water ingress warranty, this claim going through now will give me a new table and roof trim, j would not fancy having to buy them

I think generally everything that is manufactured today Is just rubbish and not designed to work for to long Have had some issues with some fairly expensive kitchen appliances that are only 4 years old, when you ask about them it seems it’s a known issue but no bugger seems to look into making it better it seems to be the acceptable thing

Yeah that's commercialism for you unfortunately, they want people replacing things every few years to keep the businesses going. Old stuff was definitely better made.

The fridge in my mums house was 37 years old and still ran like a dream . She had a washing machine from 1986 that lasted till 2019 too. And then went through 2 others between 2019 and 2023.

That's why the push all the bullshit emission nonsense on cars too .. its nowt to do with the climate its just the second largest expense for most people and they want folk buying new every 2 or 3 years.

 

[Nanniemate]

Plenty of shit vans over £100k only good thing is that with mine I get a 10 year water ingress warranty, this claim going through now will give me a new table and roof trim, j would not fancy having to buy them

I think generally everything that is manufactured today Is just rubbish and not designed to work for to long Have had some issues with some fairly expensive kitchen appliances that are only 4 years old, when you ask about them it seems it’s a known issue but no bugger seems to look into making it better it seems to be the acceptable thing

Hoover fridge freezer 1 year and 50 weeks old packed in called them no it's out of guarantee. EU is 2 years UK 1.
Would you like to by extended cover that will cost you more than the fridgeover the next 3 years
NO

 

[Coastal Cruiser.]

Hoover fridge freezer 1 year and 50 weeks old packed in valled them no it's out of guarantee. EU is 2 years UK 1.
Would you like to by e tended cover that will cost you more than the fridgeover the next 3 years
NO

You go into curry’s or most other places, sales person has not got a clue about the item but knows plenty about trying to sell you extras and extended warranty

 

[Lenny HB]

The fridge in my mums house was 37 years old and still ran like a dream .

Our fridge/freezer is 35 years old, it's starting to get a bit noisy, I can just about hear it when one of the compressors kicks in.

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[Nanniemate]

Our fridge/freezer is 35 years old, it's starting to get a bit noisy, I can just about hear it when one of the compressors kicks in.

I'm back to using the 40 year old fridge it was supposed to replace

 

[Soycd]

I'm probably biased but we've only ever had European makes. Adria (Adriatik), Buerstner, Sunlight, Chausson, Challenger (all LHD) and now back to Adria. I think possibly that with so many makes/models in Europe there may be more competition, hence, in my opinion, better value for money? Adria, certainly have come on a lot since the 90s. Back then they were down at the cheaper end of the market, but well built. Our new Adria PVC, has a few minor glitches but I think in a brand new van that's sort of expected. My only gripe was that I could not get LHD. I have twice now got into the new van on the left side only to find some clown has moved the steering wheel!

 

[Lenny HB]

My only gripe was that I could not get LHD. I have twice now got into the new van on the left side only to find some clown has moved the steering wheel!

As you know I've got that problem too. Not looking forward to having a RHD but didn't want to wait another year for LHD or pay the new price.

 

[Nanniemate]

I'm probably biased but we've only ever had European makes. Adria (Adriatik), Buerstner, Sunlight, Chausson, Challenger (all LHD) and now back to Adria. I think possibly that with so many makes/models in Europe there may be more competition, hence, in my opinion, better value for money? Adria, certainly have come on a lot since the 90s. Back then they were down at the cheaper end of the market, but well built. Our new Adria PVC, has a few minor glitches but I think in a brand new van that's sort of expected. My only gripe was that I could not get LHD. I have twice now got into the new van on the left side only to find some clown has moved the steering wheel!

Perhaps I expect too much but 'glitches are expected on a new van'

No you've paid a lot of money it should be perfect.

I do wonder if we have go so used to.poor service/workmanship its expected.

Glitches being excepted now will be blooming great faults in a few years. The manufacturer thinking we got away with that how far can we go.

Look how shoddy new build houses are now .my snagging list 40 years ago 3. New build 15 years ago 180

 

[Northernraider]

Our new Adria PVC, has a few minor glitches but I think in a brand new van that's sort of expected.

See that's why I think they turn out shite. Because it's somehow become the normal to expect problems with an expensive brand new item.



And would put me off ever buying one.


If I buy something brand new I expect it to be flawless or I return it for a refund or exchange. But from what I read they're not even willing to do that without a fight.


It's a naw from me.

If I buy something second hand then yeah I expect there to be issues. But not with something new. That's just poor workmanship and poor service

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[Peavy]

10 year water ingress warranty

You've got that straight from new or with annual inspection to renew up to 10 years?

 

[seasideBill]

Ooh! we might clash here Bill

That’s one of the reasons why we were put off a lot of Germans vans, dark gloomy reddy brown furniture

Another make which i’ll not mention, very dark grey cupboards/doors (which dropped off), leather seating and floor, god it was depressing

Don’t disagree really. Fashions change, some manufacturers get it very right some years, only to revert back to gloom a short time afterwards. At one time Globecar and Wildax were on the short list until they employed care home interior designers. Major reason for buying my Adria Twin was no wood veneer to be seen anywhere and lots of white(ish) panels. Light flooding in from big hatches over the cab enhance the feeling of space and airiness. However, dealer told me next season Adria designs would embrace dark wood veneer once more!

 

[ceejayt]

In reality there's only 3 British vans, Lunar, Swift & Bailey, the rest are either French or German/U.S.

Swift are cutting back production, Bailey have dropped a marque, Elddis are soon to be using Thor/Hymer build technology & Trigano/Auto Trail are building a 3rd production line.

It's going the same way with PVC's too. Westfalia & Wildax are owned by Rapido.

I think it's not entirely relevant who owns whom, British or continental build, ALL vans have problems, SOME vans have serious problems but not ALL vans from the SAME marque have those problems. I look at the various threads on these forums and the tales of woe are legion but probably still only a fraction compared to the owners who are basically happy.

Vans contain many many different pieces of kit from different manufacturers - the list is almost endless. Difficult to blame Swift if your Alde heating fails or Bailey if your Thetford fridge won't work properly.

Not only do we have all these devices, we then decide to bump and run them thousands of miles uphill and down dale and still expect to all to work OK.

I would conclude that buying any van from any manufacturer in terms of being happy is down to common sense and POT LUCK.

Buy from somewhere reputable, don't expect it to be perfect, expect to fix a few things along the way and above all make sure you trust the people who sold it to you to honour any warranty without question and to quickly fix whatever goes wrong.

In short, IMHO it is who you buy it from that counts!

 

[Jonno1103]

You mean only three larger volume British manufacturers… there are a number of excellent smaller volume manufacturers who are as good or indeed better than the Europeans.

Which British coachbuilders? You mean PVC's & Camper vans. Signature who also build boats have owned Vantage for about 8 years, Pheonix & Timberland have gone which, for PVC's, only really leaves I.H. & Wellhouse. The rest build camper vans.

 

[cyberyacht]

My Carthago is 8 years old now and going in for its damp check on Monday, so ask me on Tuesday.

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[Coastal Cruiser.]

You've got that straight from new or with annual inspection to renew up to 10 years?

Yes new van had it 3 years and have to pay the £150 a year inspection for them to see if they have done their job properly, seems twice so far they have not

Just emailed for a date for van to go in for repairs, nice 500 mile round trip

 

[ceejayt]

Yes new van had it 3 years and have to pay the £150 a year inspection for them to see if they have done their job properly, seems twice so far they have not

Just emailed for a date for van to go in for repairs, nice 500 mile round trip

That was my point above re buy close to home. When I was still working it was a day out of my life to take motorhome for repair and another day t get it back (eventually).

 

[funflair]

You've got that straight from new or with annual inspection to renew up to 10 years?

Annual inspection, chargeable of course so yes it's just an insurance policy really.

 

[Peavy]

Annual inspection, chargeable of course so yes it's just an insurance policy really.

Well, it's the same here in Spain.
We bought from a very reputable dealer in outskirts of Barcelona and is the same procedure.

 

[Coastal Cruiser.]

That was my point above re buy close to home. When I was still working it was a day out of my life to take motorhome for repair and another day t get it back (eventually).

Only dealer in the UK for my van, will drop it off and get the train back then go back a week or so later as there is a bodywork garage near there that I want to carry out a few repairs…

Normally have service and inspection done in Germany when away but I am not sure if we will be going into Europe this year

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[scotjimland]

A or B class coachbuilt,
I would only buy European ..

Panel Van Conversion.. (PVC)
there some excellent UK convertors, Murvi, IH, Wild Axe spring to mind.. and many more small independent companies doing sterling work..

There are also many good European PVC makers ..

a PVC is much less likely to give problems with water ingress and damp..

I have a UK built Timberland which was built to the highest spec in 2003 .. I've had to replace tired upholstery and wall coverings but other wise a solid PVC .. everything works as good as they day it was built..

it has never had any water ingress or leaks. I also like it beicuse it is built on a LWB Ducato 2.8JTD .. a solid plodder with none of the modern van problems such as a DPF .. it doesn't need molly coddled..

 

[Soycd]

See that's why I think they turn out shite. Because it's somehow become the normal to expect problems with an expensive brand new item.



And would put me off ever buying one.


If I buy something brand new I expect it to be flawless or I return it for a refund or exchange. But from what I read they're not even willing to do that without a fight.


It's a naw from me.

If I buy something second hand then yeah I expect there to be issues. But not with something new. That's just poor workmanship and poor service

You are quite right, however, we bought a new house once and the snagging list was a mile long. There are so many 'thing's that can go wrong. This is the first new van we have bought, all others were 6 month old ex-rentals. No problems to speak off, all the snags had already been rectified.

 

[Silver-Fox]

A garden pond that's posh

Don’t be fooled it’s a bit of a hole full of rain water

 

[Nanniemate]

Don’t be fooled it’s a bit of a hole full of rain water

I've got a pond then

 

[Ridgeway]

The theme in this thread seems to be that MoHo’s of any make/country seem to get leaking issues in the UK, I’m thinking the issue here is the location or more accurately the weather

Just buy a Swift and move to the South of France, sorted

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[Kelvin8tor]

I have no doubt that uk manufactured Motorhomes are as good as our European vans and it seems that most people like to support German French etc with their hard earned cash thus making it more difficult for UK vans to compete and lining the pockets of the European manufacturers still don’t worry the uk manufacturers will eventually go out of business giving us all little choice just like our once great car industry along with the accompanying loss of uk jobs that will be lost
Then the we don’t make anything in this country anymore comments
I WILL GET MY COAT