Suggestions for Folding or Inflatable Kayaks Please

[Armytwowheels]

Sea Eagle 473 does look the business.... has anyone considered (and discounted) the KXOne Slider?

Slightly wider, slightly shorter...so perhaps a little less tippy..which seems to be the only minor criticism of the Sea Eagle I've found so far ?

KXONE - SLIDER 445 (NEW 2017)

kxone-europe.com

I wouldn't let the term 'tippy' put you off. With kayaks like these, they don't tip over as in tip you out, but just lean to the side a bit just while you are getting used to where the sweet spot is. Within half an hour or so I suspect you wouldn't give the tippyness a second thought.

 

[Puddleduck]

Sea Eagle 473 does look the business.... has anyone considered (and discounted) the KXOne Slider?

Slightly wider, slightly shorter...so perhaps a little less tippy..which seems to be the only minor criticism of the Sea Eagle I've found so far ?

KXONE - SLIDER 445 (NEW 2017)

kxone-europe.com

I discounted it as I wanted to try before I bought. I couldn't find a retailer in the UK where I could go and sit in one. Having made a real mistake with the Kayacats I didn't want to get "bitten" again (although we did get our money back eventually - faulty and not fit for purpose)

I wouldn't let the term 'tippy' put you off. With kayaks like these, they don't tip over as in tip you out, but just lean to the side a bit just while you are getting used to where the sweet spot is. Within half an hour or so I suspect you wouldn't give the tippyness a second thought.

Like riding a bike, you need a bit of forward momentum and then it feels stable. The multi-person SeaEagle (473) was far more stable than the 393 when first getting into it (and I found the 473 VERY stable). The 393 took about 10 minutes to get used to and then I found it faster and lighter (sleeker?) than any other boat I have paddled. Once i was comfortable in the 393 I did the side to side rocking test and it went a long way before I wanted to right it. I did not capsize it but will need to do that and a self rescue maybe next time we are out.

We are thinking we might have a trip to Bala (Llyn Tegid) in October but it depends on if we are required for child minding during the school half term. Nothing yet decided.

 

[chenderson1965]

I’m late to this party but when my wife and I went to Canada last year she absolutely adored the kayak trip that we did in the sea between islands.

I’m thinking about buying her (us) a tandem kayak as a Christmas present to go with our new bus. There seem to be a few experienced kayakers on here so I’d be interested. In your views.

I did quite a bit of kayaking when I was younger with the scouts etc and also have a fixed hull at home as we live next to the River Trent. I haven’t been on it for a few years but I would describe myself as reasonably competent. My wife is a lot less experienced which is why we’d almost certainly buy a tandem.

It needs to be big enough to accommodate two of us (I’m 6’2” inches, my wife is 5’0” and our two medium-size dogs (if are going to Paddle for any length of time we can’t really leave them in the van). I don’t see us doing anything too adventurous in white water but would like to be able to do lakes and slow flowing rivers. I’m completely wowed by the Shetland pictures and would love to do some coastal paddling like this but am not sure if that is possible in an open topped inflatable kayak?

From this thread, and a good deal of googling, I’ve got to a shortlist of four, all of which have the drop stitched floor as that looks like it makes a big difference. Two have the dropstitch sides and two have inflatable sides - I’m not sure what the respective merits of both are?

THAYA | Gumotexboats.com

*The Dropstitch technology is based on the connection of the upper and lower layers of the fabric with thousands of polyester fibers. This fabric, equipped with an airtight coating, is protected from both sides by a resistant NITRILON® material. Thanks to the thousands fibers holding the both...

www.gumotexboats.com

Sea Eagle 473rl 2 person Inflatable Kayak. Package Prices starting at $1,199

Discover the 2 person RazorLite high performance inflatable kayak. A rigid 15'6 kayak that fits into a back pack! High pressure all drop stitch construction.

www.seaeagle.com

KXONE - SLIDER 485

kxone-europe.com

Any thoughts/recommendations?

I’m curious about the fourth - which is around half the price (I’ve seen this kit for under £500) of the other three for an apparently similar spec. I can’t find any reviews for it though. Does anyone have any experience of Riber?

Thanks a lot.

Chris

 

[Armytwowheels]

We have just ordered two of these. They also do a double. https://bluewavekayaks.com/glider-drop-stitch-single-inflatable-kayak-blue.html

Will do a review on here once we get our hands on them and try them out.

 

[Ernesto]

Hi Chris

I have broadly come to the same shortlist (although not seen the fourth one before). Have you also clocked (and ruled out) the Sea Eagle Fast Track version similar to the Thaya?

Sea Eagle SE 465 FT Deluxe 2 person - Low stock.

Sea Eagle SE 465 FT Deluxe 2 person The latest Sea Eagle FastTrack Kayaks are now sleeker, faster and lighter than ever!

shop.spindriftltd.com

I've had similar experience to you, and my views are mostly from interweb research - hopefully one of the Funsters with more real world experience can add to/completely correct this ....

From my research, the drop stich sides mean the kayak is narrower, and therefore usually faster though the water. The kayaks with inflatable sides are a bit slower and wider overall, but the cockpit not necessarily so, as the side pontoons take up far more space.

Whilst inflatable-sided kayaks are more stable (in flat water at least), narrower kayaks are easier to "lean" into swell/waves/rougher water, and this makes them less likely to tip you out - but whilst this is true for rigid kayaks, I'm not sure if its possible/advisable to do this in a drop-stitch inflatable kayak without any real deck cover.

It seems to me the 100% drop-stitch models will be great for zipping about on lakes and calm, flat rivers, but the Thaya and Fasttrack might be a bit more flexible if slower .....but both say they are rated for light white water use ...?

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[Puddleduck]

Once we know what is happening with the Grandsons for October half term we will be able to sort out a paddling week away either before or over the half-term holiday and will let people know what we are doing / where we are going if anyone wants to meet up. Not a rally just a meet up

At the moment the thoughts are Llyn Tegid (Bala, Wales), somewhere in the Lakes, or maybe Rutland Water if the blue-green algae problem has been resolved. There is also the possibility of a trip to Little Loch Broom but that might be too far for some people.

 

[Puddleduck]

I’m late to this party but when my wife and I went to Canada last year she absolutely adored the kayak trip that we did in the sea between islands.

I’m thinking about buying her (us) a tandem kayak as a Christmas present to go with our new bus.

Just be aware that if your paddling styles are different you may end up swimming a fair bit. That is why Martin and I have singles

 

[Jenben]

We have just ordered two of these. They also do a double. https://bluewavekayaks.com/glider-drop-stitch-single-inflatable-kayak-blue.html

Will do a review on here once we get our hands on them and try them out.

I think your local mh fun delivery point now has them

 

[chenderson1965]

Hi Chris

I have broadly come to the same shortlist (although not seen the fourth one before). Have you also clocked (and ruled out) the Sea Eagle Fast Track version similar to the Thaya?

Sea Eagle SE 465 FT Deluxe 2 person - Low stock.

Sea Eagle SE 465 FT Deluxe 2 person The latest Sea Eagle FastTrack Kayaks are now sleeker, faster and lighter than ever!

shop.spindriftltd.com

I've had similar experience to you, and my views are mostly from interweb research - hopefully one of the Funsters with more real world experience can add to/completely correct this ....

From my research, the drop stich sides mean the kayak is narrower, and therefore usually faster though the water. The kayaks with inflatable sides are a bit slower and wider overall, but the cockpit not necessarily so, as the side pontoons take up far more space.

Whilst inflatable-sided kayaks are more stable (in flat water at least), narrower kayaks are easier to "lean" into swell/waves/rougher water, and this makes them less likely to tip you out - but whilst this is true for rigid kayaks, I'm not sure if its possible/advisable to do this in a drop-stitch inflatable kayak without any real deck cover.

It seems to me the 100% drop-stitch models will be great for zipping about on lakes and calm, flat rivers, but the Thaya and Fasttrack might be a bit more flexible if slower .....but both say they are rated for light white water use ...?

Thanks. The Riber one does look interesting. It was reccemnded to me by one of the shops I spoke to when they told me they don’t stock IKs any more. There’s one on eBay with paddles etc for £470. On the one hand it looks hard to justify and extra £400-£800 for what look fairly similar specced boats, on the other £500 is still a lot to pay for a completely unknown quantity...

 

[Puddleduck]

I have paddled a relatively cheap Sevylor and the Sea Eagle and there is no comparison. I have come to the realisation that a boat you enjoy paddling and are comfortable with will be used. A boat you are not happy with will sit gathering dust.

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[chenderson1965]

I have paddled a relatively cheap Sevylor and the Sea Eagle and there is no comparison. I have come to the realisation that a boat you enjoy paddling and are comfortable with will be used. A boat you are not happy with will sit gathering dust.

I agree. I’m a believer in buy well, buy once! Which Sevylor did you paddle?

 

[Paddywack]

I’m completely wowed by the Shetland pictures and would love to do some coastal paddling like this but am not sure if that is possible in an open topped inflatable kayak?

I know nothing about inflatable kayaks as we paddle composite sea kayaks, but I have coached at the Shetland Sea Kayak Symposium on a couple of occasions so am almost qualified to discuss that!

Firstly it is an amazing place, when the weather is good, it's even more amazing when the weather is wild, but in both conditions it is not a place for relative novices. Sorry to be so blunt but the level of potential exposure is too much to make it something I could recommend for you with your current skill set.

BUT don't despair, I can recommend https://www.seakayakshetland.co.uk/ , they will look after you and know where to go to make the most of the prevailing weather. Angus and his daughters will ensure that you and your good lady have a safe enjoyable experience - so much so that you'll want more.

 

[Southdowners]

We recently bought an inflatable kayak based on recommendations here. We bought a Gumotex Twist 2. We’ve now used it a few times with our dog onboard and think it’s very well made and stable.

 

[romany]

The only information for you to consider that I can add is that the full drop stitch kayaks is that they maybe a fair bit harder to balance for beginners due to their narrowness

 

[Minxy]

I’m thinking about buying her (us) a tandem kayak as a Christmas present to go with our new bus. There seem to be a few experienced kayakers on here so I’d be interested. In your views.

If you don't have any issues with both paddling the same kayak then a tandem will be fine, if you DO though go for singles, we had a Gumotex Palava many years ago and really was a 'palaver' for us as we argued about the paddling all the flaming time so eventually we got 2 single Junior models (no longer made). The Palava was great for us with our 3 dogs though and was extremely tough, the dogs could jump all over it with their claws and it never punctures/marked at all.

I did quite a bit of kayaking when I was younger with the scouts etc and also have a fixed hull at home as we live next to the River Trent. I haven’t been on it for a few years but I would describe myself as reasonably competent. My wife is a lot less experienced which is why we’d almost certainly buy a tandem.

It really depends on how much use you're gonna make of it and where, sometimes you might just want to go out on your own and some of the tandems, whilst being able to be converted to a single seat, can be too 'wieldy' for one person.

For a notice I would be careful about going for a full drop-stitch one as they will definitely be more difficult to use for a novice, the advantage of the 'tube sides' is that they give more stability. Additionally as you intend to take the dogs with you I'd stick with a 'tube sided' one as the dogs will move around in the kayak (if they're anything like ours as they're nosy beasts!) so are likely to change the balance and a narrower kayak could mean you get an early bath!

It needs to be big enough to accommodate two of us (I’m 6’2” inches, my wife is 5’0” and our two medium-size dogs (if are going to Paddle for any length of time we can’t really leave them in the van). I don’t see us doing anything too adventurous in white water but would like to be able to do lakes and slow flowing rivers. I’m completely wowed by the Shetland pictures and would love to do some coastal paddling like this but am not sure if that is possible in an open topped inflatable kayak?

Again it depends where exactly you want to go and in what conditions, I use my Gumotex Twist open top kayak on the open sea so long as the swells aren't more than 2ft or so, it actually rides over them really well, waves too and is great fun but obviously you do have to make sure you keep an eye open for side ones and although I've been hit occasionally I've never come close to tipping over.

From this thread, and a good deal of googling, I’ve got to a shortlist of four, all of which have the drop stitched floor as that looks like it makes a big difference. Two have the dropstitch sides and two have inflatable sides - I’m not sure what the respective merits of both are?

Its all down to quality and use ...

Gumotex: These are VERY tough and personally I'd be hard pushed to go for anything else as from my personal experience they are extremely durable and don't puncture - I've never done this to any of mine and that's despite sometimes hitting sharp rocks, coral etc as I weave in and out of bays etc (great fun in a single kayak!). The below is what they say about the construction and if you watch the video on their website you'll see how they are made up of multiple layers of material so are very much a quality product.

THAYA | Gumotexboats.com

*The Dropstitch technology is based on the connection of the upper and lower layers of the fabric with thousands of polyester fibers. This fabric, equipped with an airtight coating, is protected from both sides by a resistant NITRILON® material. Thanks to the thousands fibers holding the both...

www.gumotexboats.com

The Dropstitch technology is based on the connection of the upper and lower layers of the fabric with thousands of polyester fibers. This fabric, equipped with an airtight coating, is protected from both sides by a resistant NITRILON® material. Thanks to the thousands fibers holding the both layers together, these products can be inflated up to very high pressure. It enables the material to obtain robustness approaching the robustness of solid materials, and that is with the preservation of the same rollability as our existing boats. ​

SeaEagle and Slider: I can't find any real info on exactly how their are construction or what materials are used for the whole of the kayak so would be wary about how durable they will be especially since the longer guarantees for these types of kayaks seem to be excluded by some manufacturers.

Sea Eagle 473rl 2 person Inflatable Kayak. Package Prices starting at $1,199

Discover the 2 person RazorLite high performance inflatable kayak. A rigid 15'6 kayak that fits into a back pack! High pressure all drop stitch construction.

www.seaeagle.com

KXONE - SLIDER 485

kxone-europe.com

Riber: This seems to me to be just a step up from a standard 'play' kayak, again other than 2 layers of PVC it doesn't say much about the materials used or how it is constructed. Could be okay, but could prove to be an expensive mistake.

The Riber 420 Inflatable Kayak has two layers of glued high density PVC to increase the rigidity and strengthen the skin of the kayak. It also has a UV protected graphic print.​

​

Gumotex Twist: This comes in a single and tandem version. I have the single Twist and it's stonking, so light compared to a lot of others but extremely durable, easy to set-up, wipe down and put away. In use I find that putting a bit of weight* at the front end keeps the it a bit lower in the water so it cuts through rather than riding over so makes it travel more like a conventional solid kayak and you can get quite a speed up if you want. (*This is usually my dog Tazzy or if I'm on my own I use a collapsible water container with about 4 litres in ( can be adjusted to suit), or you could use a couple of old lemonade bottles shoved up its snout ... the kayak's not the dog's!!!)

TWIST 2/1 | Gumotexboats.com

Are you looking for a small, lightweight and space-saving kayak as a companion on the road and a watersport recreation? Then the TWIST is the right choice for you, whether exploring new places...

www.gumotexboats.com

Note that the Gumotex models used to come in different fabrics so if you do go for one second hand make sure it is the full Nitrilon model not the Heavalon, or part Nitrilon ones, although they are tough too due to them having a slightly 'flock' covering on the interior they take time to dry whereas the full Nitrilon ones you can just wipe over and put away even if damp.

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[Minxy]

Forgot to say, despite my having the Gumotex Twist single kayak I can still take my 2 smaller dogs or my larger one out in it without a problem.

 

[Puddleduck]

I agree. I’m a believer in buy well, buy once! Which Sevylor did you paddle?

It was an older type no longer on sale - similar to the Madison. It was also too narrow inside which is something larger people need to be aware of. The outside dimensions are usually quoted but not the internals and those side bladders are wide.

I have also sat in (on dry land) the Alameda which was too narrow internally for me - at that point I decided that Sevylor would be unsuitable.

The only information for you to consider that I can add is that the full drop stitch kayaks is that they maybe a fair bit harder to balance for beginners due to their narrowness

That is very true and I was a little unsure the first time I sat in/on the Sea Eagle but it only took a few minutes and I was balanced. A bit like a bike you need some forward momentum. It also helps to have someone to look at how you are sitting and tell you to move right or left until you are central in the boat.

As Minxy Girl says be aware that double skin boats need a lot of drying out between the skins before you can put them away.

Once we have the report back about the BlueWave we will order our second kayak. We didn't win either the premium bonds or lottery this month so will have to decide (can't afford both) between a single or a tandem that can be paddled as a single. Length is not an issue for either of us as our older expedition boats were both over 4m long.

Still waiting to hear about October half term grrrrrrrrrr

 

[chenderson1965]

It was an older type no longer on sale - similar to the Madison. It was also too narrow inside which is something larger people need to be aware of. The outside dimensions are usually quoted but not the internals and those side bladders are wide.

I have also sat in (on dry land) the Alameda which was too narrow internally for me - at that point I decided that Sevylor would be unsuitable.



That is very true and I was a little unsure the first time I sat in/on the Sea Eagle but it only took a few minutes and I was balanced. A bit like a bike you need some forward momentum. It also helps to have someone to look at how you are sitting and tell you to move right or left until you are central in the boat.

As Minxy Girl says be aware that double skin boats need a lot of drying out between the skins before you can put them away.

Once we have the report back about the BlueWave we will order our second kayak. We didn't win either the premium bonds or lottery this month so will have to decide (can't afford both) between a single or a tandem that can be paddled as a single. Length is not an issue for either of us as our older expedition boats were both over 4m long.

Still waiting to hear about October half term grrrrrrrrrr

Thanks. That’s all really helpful.

 

[chenderson1965]

So I’ve made my decision - in case it’s of value tosnyone, here’s what I found and the logic behind my decision.

I spoke today to Spindrift, their UK importer, to try to get a better understanding of the difference between the two models. It’s clear from talking to him that the 473 is much less stable than the 465. He said two things to illustrate the scale of the difference. The first is that you could stand up in the 465 but, unless you really had incredible balance, would struggle to do so in the 473. He also said that, if you stop to take a picture or look around then at least one of the paddlers needs to be paying attention to stabilise the boat.

The downside of the extra stability is that the 465’s sides are little lower and, if the water gets choppy, The 465 is a little more likely to allow water to come in over the sides. It will still paddle fine with a little water in it but anything on the floor, be it you or your stuff, could get a little wet. The payoff for the 473’s greater instability is that it is a little sportier and will travel a little faster.

For us, I think that makes it a no-brainer. We will definitely be more in the leisure paddling category and wanting to stop and look around. Stability definitely trumps sportiness for us so the 465 is the way to go.

The 465 is currently out of stock and they normally get them in via containership in around February. They can, however, get them flown in within about a week.

I pushed him a bit on prices but there’s not a lot they can do. I did ask him, however, whether he was flexible on the price if we were to order more than one (Ernesto might be interested in one also) and he said there would be some scope.

My guess is that there would be a little more scope for price negotiation if they’re not having to airfreight one - I.e. waiting until February/March for delivery. It would be unlikely that we would need one before then so that might well be the way I go.

Is there anyone else who might be interested in piggybacking on our purchase to get us both/all a better price?

 

[Puddleduck]

Armytwowheels any report back yet?

A friend of ours has been taking drone footage of a "hidden loch" not far from us and is going to report back about access etc. He has permission to take drone footage of the "Tour of Britain" cycle event that passes close to us this afternoon - Martin and I thought we would cycle across and cheer them on - taking the car probably not an option as parking will be difficult and it's only 7 miles (each way) to the nearest point to us.

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[Armytwowheels]

Not yet. We are on our way to meet our new kayaks for the first time. They have been delivered to Jenbens house. I intend to try them out on the Thames later this week.

The hidden loch sounds fantastic.

 

[Armytwowheels]

We have just ordered two of these. They also do a double. https://bluewavekayaks.com/glider-drop-stitch-single-inflatable-kayak-blue.html

Will do a review on here once we get our hands on them and try them out.

Time to admit that we purchased these in haste and now regret it.

They are great kayaks but we don't have room for them in our motohome garage, as well as the two bikes, two paddle boards, 3 sets of skis and accompanying boots etc.

Our go to choice of floaty toy is now the paddle boards and having nowhere to store the kayaks we are going to sell them. What we ended up with is one tandem Kayak in blue and one single in yellow.

They are in near perfect condition as we have only used each kayak once and want £350 ono for each Kayak. Now here is the rub - we are in Spain until at least May, but I thought an early heads up on here would be a good idea, or someone may be coming out, or already here.

 

[Ernesto]

I'll drop you a PM about the double ....

 

[Puddleduck]

Armytwowheels bargain for someone.

Due to our on going issues we have only had our single out once but come the good (!) weather hope to be on the water again.

 

[Daniel-J]

Perhaps you would be interested in some of the things in the reviews? I think they have good options

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[Puddleduck]

One BlueWave (no used yet) and one SeaEagle (used once and I love it) at the moment. If the BlueWave is too big for one person to manage we'll get another SeaEagle (or similar) and keep the BlueWave for when we have other people with us.

 

[68c]

For a motorhome I recommend the Gumotex range, very tough with a single skin. The best part is they can be wiped down and dry off very quickly ready to repack in the van. Other types usually have a tough outer fabric with inner bladders, this holds water for ages making them heavy to repack and will drip for ages.

 

[Captain Pants]

I’ve owned a Z-pro Tango for 4 or 5 years now, we’ll made, robust and I’m happy with it.

 

[Puddleduck]

For a motorhome I recommend the Gumotex range, very tough with a single skin. The best part is they can be wiped down and dry off very quickly ready to repack in the van. Other types usually have a tough outer fabric with inner bladders, this holds water for ages making them heavy to repack and will drip for ages.

Yes it is important to have single skin that can be dried quickly and easily. If double skins aren't dried properly (I am told - no experience as ours are single skin) they go mouldy and stink. The double skin adds no more protection than modern single skins

Oh and if you have either double or single skin let some of the air out if you have them inflated when you store them as if it is hot the air will expand and can damage the kayak. Personally we would deflate ours and re-inflate just before we use them as they are so fast to inflate.

 

[Minxy]

Just to add a bit of an update ... I used my Gumotex Twist (full Nitrilon version) a few times in Spain in December/January/February and it was great ... I like heading for the big waves and going round rocks etc as it adds to the fun. When in the 'troughs' the waves were up to 2ft higher and the kayak went over them without an issue - Tazzy also loved it ... that was until she got splashed from my paddle then she sulked big style ... she does NOT like being wet!

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