Sterling Power Battery (abuse) Video. Test including LiFePO4

[Wissel]

Just seen this and thought it interesting. Sterling Power have just done a 6 month test of four different battery types - Lead-Acid, AGM, Lead Crystal and LiFePO4.

They basically abuse the hell out of each battery and show what happens to them over the 6 months.

 

[tacr2man]

He needs to put the same test with a low voltage cut out , as he mentions it frequently , and then see what happens , it poses nearly as many questions as it answers .

 

[jdk62]

Good exercise.....and really interesting results

 

[SomeoneElse]

SHOCK-HORROR - Cheapo lead-acid batteries don't like abuse!

 

[Two on Tour]

Interesting exercise but what is it really proving other that if your a berk and hammer your batteries then LiFePO4 is the way to go.
I still can not justify the cost of changing over to LiFePO4 until their price comes down a fair bit.

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[Gromett]

I saw a similar test some years ago which is what made me a big fan of Li batteries.
Now that LiFePO4 Cells have dropped down so much it is a no brainer especially for fulltimers.

 

[Gromett]

Interesting exercise but what is it really proving other that if your a berk and hammer your batteries then LiFePO4 is the way to go.
I still can not justify the cost of changing over to LiFePO4 until their price comes down a fair bit.

If you are prepared to do a little work they have come down a LOT;
https://www.ev-power.eu/Winston-40Ah-200Ah/

Take the default 100AH ones. 4 x $124 = $496 which at todays exchange rate of $1.35/£ comes to £367.00 which is only a little more than a good quality VRLA AGM battery.

 

[Wissel]

If you are prepared to do a little work they have come down a LOT;
https://www.ev-power.eu/Winston-40Ah-200Ah/

Take the default 100AH ones. 4 x $124 = $496 which at todays exchange rate of $1.35/£ comes to £367.00 which is only a little more than a good quality VRLA AGM battery.

Exactly.

For me (and I imagine most people thinking of going with LiFePO4) the kit with the smart BMS is a better buy:
https://www.ev-power.eu/Winston-40A...t-with-200Ah-cells-BMS-mobile-monitoring.html

This 200Ah kit with the BMS is $1215 (£900) and gives a protected battery with battery monitoring via a smart phone (so no need for a BM1 etc) for less money than most 100Ah LiFePO4 batteries.

For comparison, 4 x Varta LFD90 batteries would give similar power and cost around £400. If the LiFePO4 lasts just twice as long then they are no more expensive. Then there's the weight and size:
Varta (x4) - 96Kg, volume = 0.047 cubic metres
Winston - 31.6Kg, volume = 0.021 cubic metres

Good suitable chargers are quite pricey. But they are for lead-acid as well so no different.

 

[Two on Tour]

If you are prepared to do a little work they have come down a LOT;
https://www.ev-power.eu/Winston-40Ah-200Ah/

Take the default 100AH ones. 4 x $124 = $496 which at todays exchange rate of $1.35/£ comes to £367.00 which is only a little more than a good quality VRLA AGM battery.

Your forgetting the price of a suitable charger at $130. I put the 4 cells and the charger into the shopping cart on their website and then the VAT gets added and without the carriage we are up $758.95
Did I read a while back something about having to balancing the cells.

 

[Gromett]

Your forgetting the price of a suitable charger at $130. I put the 4 cells and the charger into the shopping cart on their website and then the VAT gets added and without the carriage we are up $758.95
Did I read a while back something about having to balancing the cells.

You are correct about the VAT however you would have to add that to others as well.
As for the ancillary equipment, this is a one off cost which you would recoup over time due to the batteries lasting a hell of a lot longer.
On the charger front. I always replace the default charger in my vehicle. Current one has a Stirling 50Amp charger which supports Li batteries.

I do understand your point. They ARE more expensive up front. But as the video above shows, you recoup this by not having to replace the batteries and getting an additional 40%+ of capacity for the same AH rating. Worth noting though the price has plumetted.
Those same cells I listed above were around $400 each the first time I looked.

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[Nasher]

Interesting thread, My leisure battery is 2 years old, so I've stuck my toe in the water looking at options for replacement when needed (I like to be prepared so I can get a suitable replacement as soon as possible). That said, the leisure battery in my last camper was 7 years old!

I only have one 110ah leisure battery & a Victron 10a charger. Works really well as I'm normally on EHU or at a motorcycle event where I can use my gennie.

Current thinking is when it starts to go, try & fit 2 batteries. It would be a tight fit & I would have to re-locate the charger. As I prefer simplicity, I was thinking of a single Leoch 160ah AGM, laid on it's side would fit well and give me a bit more capacity......

Having seen the Lithium option and planning on keeping my Moho for at least the next 8 years, it might just be an option.....

 

[dave newell]

The most important piece of information in this video is that if you abuse your batteries you will kill them in short order but out of those tested lithium withstood the abuse best. If you great your batteries well then the cheapo lead acid are perfectly good. I just had to replace my two leisure batteries, Elecsol 100an yellow tops, they were at least ten years old and have given good service in our current and previous motorhomes and they were second hand when I got them. Look after your batteries and they will last years.

D.

 

[Reallyretired]

My cheapo lead acid will last about 5 years with my use, Lithium might last 50 years but will I?

 

[Wissel]

I think @dave newell lvs is right. In reality no one would treat their batteries this badly, but I'll bet most of us have on occasions (I have).

But for full-timers who have high demands on their 12v, I think LiFePO4 is the answer and now the best option. I'm glad we have gone this route but I wouldn't have bothered if just using the van at weekends.

 

[Reallyretired]

Absolutely, for full timing LiFePO4 is the answer. The weight saving is a big plus too.
We are usually away in our MH for 4months or so a year but a long way from full time.

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[Minxy]

Puts my 2 x 78ah gels to shame ... ... should I just shoot myself now???

 

[Fletton]

But for full-timers who have high demands on their 12v, I think LiFePO4 is the answer and now the best option

I think that heavy use must be a lifestyle issue - full-timer or not.

I full time and rarely use EHU... I’m not a heavy user of my 12v system... I have 2 LFD90’s and one 100w panel...
mid winter requires some hookup or gennie every four days or so.. but in the summer time the charger is on “float” by lunchtime..

Panel rarely reads less than 2.5v in a morn when settled.. 12.2 on the odd occasion when heating fan been on all night but settles back at 12.5 if I turn it off.

 

[Fletton]

Just watched vid... I think he makes a good point aiming the demo at say commercial boat hirers... where batteries may be prone to that type of abuse by “casual” users who would treat the system ( invertors) as if at home on 240v etc

 

[nicholsong]

Just watched vid... I think he makes a good point aiming the demo at say commercial boat hirers... where batteries may be prone to that type of abuse by “casual” users who would treat the system ( invertors) as if at home on 240v etc

I agree. Sterling are not only supplying to the Motorhome/Caravan market.

Boats are less likely when cruising to have access to EHU. Sailing boats do not have as much room for solar panels. Fridges are rarely gas, only electric. Sailing boats can be running for many hours without alternator output and/or at night with navigation lights drawing power.

All these items add up to a greater demand on the batteries, even with a careful owner, so in those circumstances Sterlings test can be seen as quite realistic for a lot of users.

Geoff

 

[DP+JAY]

I'm sticking with lead acid for now.
Just replaced one of my three 110a which was at least 7 & maybe 8 years old. Replaced one of the others 2 years ago which was at least 6 years old. At £77 Inc delivery with a 4 year warranty I can replace them many times over & still have change. Only possible advantage I can see is weight.

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[Wissel]

I agree @DP_JAY - LiFePO4 isn't worth it for most vans.

For me, I use about 80Ah per day and, as most of this power use is work related, battery power is paramount to us going full-time. I have at least 4 days worth of battery (mines 400Ah of which about 360Ah can be used) that can be quickly charged (an advantage of this type of battery) if the weather isn't good enough for solar.

Besides the great charging, I can accurately monitor my battery so I know exactly how long I have before a charge is needed. Then there's weight and size (I'd need around 700Ah of lead-acid just to get the same usable power).

These reasons make LiFePO4 a great choice for us.