Sliding sink waste pipe split (1 Viewer)

[Pablo19]

Hi all. I have a Knaus 650MEG Sun Ti with a sliding sink in the shower and there is a leak coming from the waste pipe. Investigation is quite tricky due to limited access but I now know exactly what the problem is but don't know how to get the sliding sink unit out. I have found a similar issue in a previous thread on a Weinsberg Pepper but the sink unit is different on mine with the runners being at 90 degrees from each other. I can't for the life of me work out how the thing comes off. There is a plastic "tab" marked with an A but this doesn't seem to do very much.

It looks like a poor design with the pipe being flexed repeatedly bound to cause the plastic to split. I don't think that where it's secured gives enough flex so the pipe has to bend far too much for this brittle kind of pipe top stand.

Assuming I can get the unit off, is there an alternative pipe that is stronger, more flexible to allow for the constant movement? I've posted some photos which hopefull show the issue. The runners are made by Häfele if that helps.

 

[The Coops]

Unscrew the runners and then slide sink off

 

[Pablo19]

Unscrew the runners and then slide sink off

The runners are partly inaccessible so taking them off is impossible.

 

[The Coops]

I think you have to move the sink and undo as you go had the same problem on a Hobby and was fiddly to say the least

 

[Pablo19]

I think you have to move the sink and undo as you go had the same problem on a Hobby and was fiddly to say the least

Hmm, I really don't think that's possible, there wouldn't be room to get a screwdriver in for most of the screws! Thanks for trying to help though.

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[Landy Andy]

Two thoughts.
Can you get to the underneath via the hatch for the toilet cassette once cassette is removed
And
Are you sure the haffle runners don’t have release leavers. Some of them have a little curved piece of spring plastic so they can slide out.

 

[Pablo19]

Two thoughts.
Can you get to the underneath via the hatch for the toilet cassette once cassette is removed
And
Are you sure the haffle runners don’t have release leavers. Some of them have a little curved piece of spring plastic so they can slide out.

Thought one - no, unfortunately not.

Thought two, I believe there will be a way to do it but I'm not able to work it out! I mentioned above there is a plastic tag marked with an A but I've pulled pushed, levered it in every direction and can't see how it can release the runner. I think there must be something to release top runner and maybe it has to be done at the same time. I'm just hoping someone has had the same issue with a sink using Hafele runners!

 

[lorger]

We have same van and same problem, you need to remove the end panel from sink (one nearest shower) then on the runners you will see a grey catch, if you use this the sink will slide off. There is enough pipe to rest the sink in the shower without disconnecting anything, I thought I’d repaired ours but still leaking so need to replace now.

 

[Pablo19]

We have same van and same problem, you need to remove the end panel from sink (one nearest shower) then on the runners you will see a grey catch, if you use this the sink will slide off. There is enough pipe to rest the sink in the shower without disconnecting anything, I thought I’d repaired ours but still leaking so need to replace now.

Hi Lorger

What does the grey catch look like? I've got the end panel off which helos with access but I can't see how it lifts off. Do you have to release both runners at the same time? Also, I assume the release "pull" catch needs pulling at the same time?

 

[lorger]

Can you take a photo of runners.
If you fully extend the runners there’s a little grey plastic bit that’s a stopper, I only found this after just about stripping the whole unit out
I fixed my temporary as we were heading away next day so will hopefully get to it next week for permanent fix.

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[Pablo19]

Can you take a photo of runners.
If you fully extend the runners there’s a little grey plastic bit that’s a stopper, I only found this after just about stripping the whole unit out
I fixed my temporary as we were heading away next day so will hopefully get to it next week for permanent fix.

Here is a pic that is as clear as I can make it. the lever marked with an A is I assume the release but as there is one on each runner, both need to be activated at the same time and even trying that they don't seem to release anything.

 

[Landy Andy]

Here is a pic that is as clear as I can make it. the lever marked with an A is I assume the release but as there is one on each runner, both need to be activated at the same time and even trying that they don't seem to release anything.

View attachment 921123

There. There. The pointing up bit is the release.

 

[Landy Andy]

This is the release. Push in a bit and then operate highlighted lever. The other runners lever may go the opposite way.

 

[lorger]

Here is a pic that is as clear as I can make it. the lever marked with an A is I assume the release but as there is one on each runner, both need to be activated at the same time and even trying that they don't seem to release anything.

View attachment 921123

As Landy Andy points out that little grey bit should release the slide, it’s just like a kitchen drawer slider.

 

[Pablo19]

Thanks both but still no joy. What do I do with the grey bit, lever it to one side or pull it? Also, do I have to do both runners at the same time (i.e. a 2 man job?)

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[Landy Andy]

Lever across to side

You can often do one at a time, by first making sure you are not putting pressure on release mechanism, by having runner at max extension, then operate leaver pushing it across towards the other side, then slide the other part of the runner backwards, exposing the release mech. Then do same other side.

Sorry not very good at explaining things.

 

[Landy Andy]

Get runner so you can see release leaver
Operate release lever


Then slider the other part of the runner backwards, until you have passed the release mechanism

 

[Pablo19]

Lever across to side

You can often do one at a time, by first making sure you are not putting pressure on release mechanism, by having runner at max extension, then operate leaver pushing it across towards the other side, then slide the other part of the runner backwards, exposing the release mech. Then do same other side.

Sorry not very good at explaining things.

Ok thanks, will give it another go! Its a bit awkward because one of the runners is on the top facing the floor and the other is on the side parallel to the side of the van. If they were opposite eachother it would be a lot simpler! I expect it will be awkward to put back as well!

 

[Landy Andy]

Ok thanks, will give it another go! Its a bit awkward because one of the runners is on the top facing the floor and the other is on the side parallel to the side of the van. If they were opposite eachother it would be a lot simpler! I expect it will be awkward to put back as well!

Yes. Normally they are on each side of a drawer, so you just operate both, and slide drawer out.

When you go to put back in you do the same type of method above where you hand feed one runner onto the fixed runner, then do the next one, rather than try and feed both at the same time.

 

[Pablo19]

Get runner so you can see release leaver
Operate release lever
View attachment 921508

Then slider the other part of the runner backwards, until you have passed the release mechanism

View attachment 921509

Ok, SUCCESS!!. Here is the offending pipe. This pipe is far too rigid for me, it takes some effort to get it to bend and moving the sliding sink is clearly going to break it again if I simply replace it. Are there any alternative pipes that are designed to flex more easily? Maybe a braided plastic pipe or something like that?
Thank you both for your patience!!

edit: would this work do you think? Do you think this might be the solution?
Collapz pipe

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[lorger]

I had the same thought however I think it needs to be semi ridged to prevent kinking, my thoughts when I have a go at permanent repair is to drop pipe into shower tray. In other words put a more flexi one on so that it will hang vertical when in out position, water should then land in shower tray and drain away as we only use sink in out position.

This is just a thought I haven’t really looked into it in detail yet, I just don’t want the same issue every few years.

 

[1967bowesj]

Look for something like the below but make it longer than what is original. You don’t want it to bend on the underside of the sink, you want it to cause a bend in behind the toilet false wall. More like a bow than a bend so when the sink is slid left it pulls the bow straight. The pond black hose is very rubbery so should be able to handle the flexing

 

[Pablo19]

I've decided to give the colapz hose a try and ordered one as it seems to be perfect diameter and length. The original pipe is about 750mm and the colapz extends from 500mm to 1m so I can adjust the length so that it's just enough and not too much. I can make use of it if it doesn't work in which case I will try the pond hose idea. Thanks a lot to both of you for your help with this, I hate to think I'd have had to have paid for a repair. When I had it repaired under warranty last time it was only about 9 months ago and their method was clearly inadequate for it to only last this long. The pipe they used was far too rigid.

 

[Landy Andy]

Not knowing the van, or all the details it’s difficult to recommend solutions.

If mine rather than a pipe continuing flex every time, I would rather have a hose going into a pipe. Not sure that makes sense reading it back. But what I’m thinking is like when you put a washing machine waste water pipe into a washing machine waste water stand pipe. I’d extend the solid pipe to as near the shut point of the basin, and have the hose from the basin so it is always inside the pipe and goes round the corner into the drop of the solid pipe. So rather than expanding, and contracting, or bending each time, it is just sliding out, then sliding back in. With the pipe being in the downward section it doesn’t need to be sealed.

 

[Pablo19]

Not knowing the van, or all the details it’s difficult to recommend solutions.

If mine rather than a pipe continuing flex every time, I would rather have a hose going into a pipe. Not sure that makes sense reading it back. But what I’m thinking is like when you put a washing machine waste water pipe into a washing machine waste water stand pipe. I’d extend the solid pipe to as near the shut point of the basin, and have the hose from the basin so it is always inside the pipe and goes round the corner into the drop of the solid pipe. So rather than expanding, and contracting, or bending each time, it is just sliding out, then sliding back in. With the pipe being in the downward section it doesn’t need to be sealed.

Hi Andy. I see what you are saying, it makes perfect sense. I will assess the suitability of the colapz hose when it arrives later. It should be fairly obvious if it's going to flex more than it will stand and if that happens I will look at your suggestion. The issue is that as the sink slides sideways quite a long way, the hose that's inserted into the waste pipe needs to be long enough but also not catch on the edge of the waste pipe and stopping it from sliding in. Thanks again.

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[RM_Marine]

PVC Flexible Braided Water Hose Fish Pond Plastic Pipe Hydrophonics Tubing RPVC | eBay

PVC fibre reinforced hose has excellent chemical and physical property, ideally for conveying water, oil and gas. It is widely used in construction, agricultural, fishery, project, household and industrial service.

www.ebay.co.uk

Would this help

 

[Pablo19]

PVC Flexible Braided Water Hose Fish Pond Plastic Pipe Hydrophonics Tubing RPVC | eBay

PVC fibre reinforced hose has excellent chemical and physical property, ideally for conveying water, oil and gas. It is widely used in construction, agricultural, fishery, project, household and industrial service.

www.ebay.co.uk

Would this help

I did consider this type of hose but with the thickness needed I don't know how flexible it would be.

For the benefit of anyone visiting this thread in the future, I have just fitted the Colapz hose. I discovered another split in a small section of pipe below the one I removed so took that out as well and found that the Colapz hose was long enough to connect directly to the section below. After a bit of jigging I managed to get the sink back onto the runners and the sink slid freely with no resistance anywhere. I have now tested it and there are no leaks anywhere and it's draining away fine with the sink in the "over the toilet" position but only very slowly in the open position. This used to be the case previously though and I think this is down to a poor bit of design with the concept of a sliding sink that moves the drain pipe behind into unknown angles. It also varies depending on how level the ground is so I will monitor it over a few trips and see how good a compromise the Colapz pipe is. At this point I'm just really pleased to have a sink that I can drain without a puddle forming on the floor!

Overall I'm really happy to have done this repair myself, or at least with some really useful help from the contributors to this thread. I hate to think what a "professional" repair would have cost!

 

[Landy Andy]

At least you now know how it works/comes apart, so you can deal/monitor it in the future should you need to.

 

[lorger]

Hope to get round to mine next week, will order same pipe.