Schengen day counting

[nicholsong]

The ship holds your passport and they give you an identity card that you can use ashore.

Interesting.

Does a Cruise company's issued ID card have any legal standing in a foreign country? Is it biometric.

Can one keep it and use it on another land-based trip?

If one's passport stays on board it is not stamped so one's 90 days never start on that cruise trip and are available for the next time one enters Schengen, even if within the 180 days.

I can also start to see how MHomers could go to a immigration office at a port nd get stamped out of Schengen as a yacht's crew but never leave physically and then get stamped back in 3 months later for the rest of one's permitted 90 days.

I can envisage a lot of such scamming coming up. Probably not new but could be more frequent. Will the athorities bother, or will they have the manpower if it becomes widespread?

Geoff

 

[royandsharont]

I haven't watched this video but the title riles me up the wrong way.

If videos like this were made to explain how to get round the UK immigration laws most on here would rightly be furious. But when we are doing it to EU countries seems it is ok for some reason?

You should watch it Gromett. I have & it just confirms how you can spend more time in ‘Europe’ travelling and all within the restricted rules for the ‘EU’

Nothing illegal or even breaking the rules and confirms what I thought. The title is actually perfectly correct when you listen to what she is saying, I think you have misunderstood the message by not watching it.

 

[Lenny HB]

Does a Cruise company's issued ID card have any legal standing in a foreign country? Is it biometric.

Can one keep it and use it on another land-based trip?

If one's passport stays on board it is not stamped so one's 90 days never start on that cruise trip and are available for the next time one enters Schengen, even if within the 180 days.

Cruise companies use them all around the world don't think they are Biometric.

You can't get your passport back without handing in the card.

Either the ship has the authority to stamp the passports or they take them to immigration not sure which but they don't do it at every port just the 1st one.

 

[Emmit]

Ordinarily Pre br***t one produced the passport at Southampton and received a boarding/embarkation card that got you on and off the ship.
There was no producing the passport at each port but in certain countries ie Portugal, it was suggested that you carry the passport as a means of ID. that country having laws that insisted that one carry ID. at all times.
This is a good supplementary question to the original one.
Mrs Emmit is being a Guinea pig on this one because before we have our cruise she is going on one (or two?) when I walk the Camino Portugese next year

 

[Skez]

I haven't watched this video but the title riles me up the wrong way.

If videos like this were made to explain how to get round the UK immigration laws most on here would rightly be furious. But when we are doing it to EU countries seems it is ok for some reason?

I have watched it, and TBF it doesn't in any way try to explain how to 'break' the rules, or even 'bend' them,- purely how to maximise the amount of time you can be on the road on mainland Europe by leaving the Schengen Zone to stop the clock, and explaining how the 90/180 works. For those that are struggling with the concept of a rolling 180 day period it is informative and quite well explained.

Maybe the title is a bit 'click baity' but if you want to be on the road for more than 90 days it's worth a watch IMO.

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[The Wino]

Ordinarily Pre br***t one produced the passport at Southampton and received a boarding/embarkation card that got you on and off the ship.
There was no producing the passport at each port but in certain countries ie Portugal, it was suggested that you carry the passport as a means of ID. that country having laws that insisted that one carry ID. at all times.
This is a good supplementary question to the original one.
Mrs Emmit is being a Guinea pig on this one because before we have our cruise she is going on one (or two?) when I walk the Camino Portugese next year

It will be interesting to see what happens because pre brexit I think in theory you didn't need a passport to go into Europe just some form of ID so the embarcation card could well have done the trick.

 

[Lenny HB]

It will be interesting to see what happens because pre brexit I think in theory you didn't need a passport to go into Europe just some form of ID so the embarcation card could well have done the trick.

Cruise ships use that system all around the world so it shouldn't be a problem.

 

[royandsharont]

It will be interesting to see what happens because pre brexit I think in theory you didn't need a passport to go into Europe just some form of ID so the embarcation card could well have done the trick.

I think this is not quite right. If you are an EU National from a Schengen Country then my understanding was that you could travel with your local, formal , National ID card if it permitted you to do so.

It may have also been ok for other EU member countries to do the same, but I am not certain.

Unfortunately the UK has no National ID card system so we always had to show passports. My friend from Sweden used to fly to where we lived in Spain only carrying his ID card, not a passport as I recall.

Had we had one, which was on the cards at one time, then we may have been able to do so. The idea was ditched after protests that the next step would be we had to carry them here all the time, like most EU Countries insist for their Nationals, and that went against the grain with many Brits.

 

[Gromett]

You should watch it Gromett. I have & it just confirms how you can spend more time in ‘Europe’ travelling and all within the restricted rules for the ‘EU’

Nothing illegal or even breaking the rules and confirms what I thought. The title is actually perfectly correct when you listen to what she is saying, I think you have misunderstood the message by not watching it.

I have watched it, and TBF it doesn't in any way try to explain how to 'break' the rules, or even 'bend' them,- purely how to maximise the amount of time you can be on the road on mainland Europe by leaving the Schengen Zone to stop the clock, and explaining how the 90/180 works. For those that are struggling with the concept of a rolling 180 day period it is informative and quite well explained.

Maybe the title is a bit 'click baity' but if you want to be on the road for more than 90 days it's worth a watch IMO.

"Getting around the 90 day rule" implies not abiding by the rules to me. Really crappy title.

Perhaps

"Legal ways of staying for more than 90 days" would have been better and would have been informative?

The title still riles me up.

 

[Loney45]

Me and Mrs Emmit are going on a cruise!!! Its not for some time but as we will going in and out of Shengen countries with sea days in between it occurred to me that I will need assistance in working out just how many days have to be counted as part of the 90/180 rule.
Does anyone have any definitive knowledge as to the rules or have an address (old skool) where I could get the official answer.

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[Loney45]

Me and Mrs Emmit are going on a cruise!!! Its not for some time but as we will going in and out of Shengen countries with sea days in between it occurred to me that I will need assistance in working out just how many days have to be counted as part of the 90/180 rule.
Does anyone have any definitive knowledge as to the rules or have an address (old skool) where I could get the official answer.

Hi all, a google search on ’schengen calculator’ shows various apps. to help sort days ‘In or Out’

 

[JonP]

Recently returned from P&O cruise stopping off in Portugal, Spain, and most Canary Islands. Not once were we checked for Covid, or passport. So not sure how local foreign government could count the days in their country!

The cruise company advises your details and cruise itinerary at the first Schengen Port.

 

[JonP]

Cruise companies use them all around the world don't think they are Biometric.

You can't get your passport back without handing in the card.

Either the ship has the authority to stamp the passports or they take them to immigration not sure which but they don't do it at every port just the 1st one.

You don’t need to hand in the card to get your passport back, just pay your onboard ship account.

 

[Emmit]

Cruise ships use that system all around the world so it shouldn't be a problem.

Unless you go (from memory) into the good ol' USA where we All had to troop down to the caberet lounge and prostrate ourselves before USA Immigration.
But having said that, 99% of the other countries we just walk off the ship with nothing more than a room card and credit card.

 

[Loadofmischief]

The ship holds your passport and they give you an identity card that you can use ashore.

Nope. On our recent Spain, Portugal and Canaries cruise we kept our passports and when going ashore they were not checked off or on the ship. We were given a card from P&O which covered identity for exit and entry from the ship but was also used for all activities on ship such as shopping, paying for drinks.....

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[Don Campbell]

Can anyone please tell me how the EU authorities are going to police this seemingly unworkable scheme and how any Governments computer system is going to keep tabs on millions of people and report it all to the great EU HQ so they can record for example the number of days Joe Bloggs has spent out of his skull in Magaluf?

 

[Don Campbell]

Can anyone tell me how the EU plan to administer this seemingly unworkable rule. Which countries computers will report all comings and goings to the great central EU HQ just so they will know how many days Joe Bloggs has spent out of his skull in Magaluf and how many more days they have to put up with it before they can ban him?

 

[Lenny HB]

Update:
My mate is on a cruise at the moment and has now been given different information, he asked about it. They said only counted if onshore overnight but they are not 100% certain.
If that is the case, good news for the cruisers. Crazy that no one really knows the answer.

 

[royandsharont]

I’m pretty certain I read in official documents online that whole days are counted as part there of.

So if you arrive at 2355 on a Sunday then that Sunday is day one and if you leave at 0100 on the following Monday it means you have spent 2 days of you allowance despite only spending 65 minutes there.

If your flying through and do not leave the flight side terminal it doesn’t count

 

[philann]

Can anyone please tell me how the EU authorities are going to police this seemingly unworkable scheme and how any Governments computer system is going to keep tabs on millions of people and report it all to the great EU HQ so they can record for example the number of days Joe Bloggs has spent out of his skull in Magaluf?

They are already doing it. It is not a new scheme, it has been in operation for many years for 3rd countries’ citizens (e.g. Aus, US, NZ etc) travelling to the Schengen area. The existing scheme has just been extended to include UK citizens.

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[Captain Birdseye]

From the the first port the ship stops at in the shengen zone until it docks back in the UK is counted as time in the zone.

Just enter your dates in here https://www.schengenvisainfo.com/visa-calculator/

 

[DT]

Having completed over sixty cruises including very recently a three week European cruise I can say for certain that the cruise or medallion you are issued by the cruise ship has no legal standing it is simply a ship ID that serves as your stateroom door key, method of payment on the ship and ID to reboard the ship having visited a port. With European cruises my passport remains in my possession and stays in our cabin safe the whole cruise. I never take it ashore. Recently cruise companies have only asked for passport details and a scan or picture Of the document. I doubt very much that US companies like Carnival will want to get involved or commit to information or instruction on the 90 day rule.

 

[Platelet]

Somewhere on the journey it stops at Gib. I'm hoping that will(temporarily) stop the clock.

The last and only time I was in Gib was certainly memorable and my clock stopped. I was a volunteer medic during the Falklands War. I was given 12hrs notice to pack, I boarded a Hercules at Brize Norton and flew to Gib. I then boarded the SS Uganda which was being refitted to a Hospital ship. We set sail to what I thought could possibly be be my last days on earth. The next few hours turned out to be be frustrating and hilarious, we docked in Portsmouth!! Only the MOD could come up with something like this! We then took on supplies and then headed south. It is a period in my life which still haunts me to this day, would I do it again, yes in a heart beat. So yes, for me my clock stopped in Gib.

 

[Garry - June]

I was looking at the rules a few months ago after chatting to a young couple from Ipswich on a small yatch heading down to Gibraltar, as I understand it, its pretty much the same rules as overland, as Lenny Lenny HB said and only if you go out of the zone the clock stops, apparently even if you don't leave the ship unfortunately it's still ticking.
I had a easy to understand link but can't find it now. Bob.

Sailing yachts are totally different... you are not entered in to Schengen until you actually dock in a Schengen country...

 

[Emmit]

We, well actually I, bottled it this morning.
This is not directly connected to my OP but it is related to the 90/180.
No info. obviously but on a Shengen trip Mrs Emmit got a touch of the collywobbles on thinking about us being 'over there' for 89 days.

As a result the very nice man at BF moved the goalposts, so to speak by knocking off a week of our trip, at no expense to us!!!

Happy wife = Happy life. (49yrs and still breathing counting)

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