Revenue weight????

[GWAYGWAY]

I have uprated my Sprinter based van to the top weight for it of 4200kgs. The V5 was sent off and has now come back with a revenue weight of 4200ks but the max vehicle mass of 3880kgs and a weight in service of 3250kgs.
As that seemed to be wrong , I rang the DVLA at Swansea and queried it. The person who answered the phone went off and contacted somebody else then cam and told me that the revenue weight had gone up to 4200 but the maximum weight the van can be is 3880kg ???????????????? WTF.
They said I should contact DVSA and ask them,as I asked what about being weighed at over the 3880kg. I was given the number to ring and after three attempts got to somebody at test station bookings wh o wanted to know if I had done changes and what the reg number was. I said no , standard weight from factory and gave them the reg number. He checked and came back saying it was not on their system as it was not a commercial vehicle. The vehicle checking number on the DVLA site says it is 4200kgs and that is the revenue weight. I am confused.
Anybody know what they are on about?

 

[Bill_OR]

This is exactly the same problem that I had when uprating my Apache from 3650 to 3850. I was advised (after contacting DVLA by phone) to write to them pointing out the error and they would fix it - and they did!

text from letter I send:

Error on replacement V5C for XX99YYY

I have recently uprated my motorhome from 3650Kg to 3850Kg and received my revised V5C yesterday.

While you have increased the Revenue Weight to 3850Kg I believe that an error has been made in that the Max Permissible Mass has been left at 3650Kg.

Please would you revise the Max. Permissible Mass to 3850Kg and send me a revised V5C. I enclose a photocopy of the declaration and the old V5C.
etc etc

 

[Stretto Boy]

@GWAYGWAY : you have had the same experience as me. The Revenue weight of my MH was upgraded from 3500Kg to 3700Kg a couple of weeks or so ago. When the logbook was returned, the Revenue Weight had been changed but the Maximum Permissible Mass is still showing as 3500Kg. I rang DVLA and the lady I spoke to checked with her supervisor and said that the logbook is correct and I may drive the vehicle with a mass up to 3700Kg. There are some posts on a related thread that say that you cannot exceed the Maximum Permissible Mass (which sounds right to me) and others which say that it is only the Revenue Weight which is used for enforcement purposes. It is clear that DVLA don't seem to have a clue what the correct answer is! I have tried to contact SV Tech a couple of times to check with them but on each occasion an engineer was not available. I will try again now.

 

[Stretto Boy]

Hi again @GWAYGWAY I managed to get straight through to an engineer at SV Tech this time. He confirmed, as others have said (although contradicted by some), that DVLA do not change the Maximum Permissible Mass and it is the Revenue Weight which is used for enforcement purposes. He did say that they may change the MPM if you write in with the original logbook and make a special request in writing. I was warned that it was quite likely that they will lose my application and logbook. Given that I have been given the same reply by DVLA and SV Tech I am minded to take this as the correct answer, although as I posted in the other thread on this topic I did find a government website which seems to contradict this!

 

[GWAYGWAY]

It seems that I have the correct things on mine then, and the vehicle plate is 4200kgs The VOSA people go by that and not the paperwork. The French might just think otherwise though . Interesting to be told they are not interested in the motorhomes though and as they are not commercial , unlikely to be pulled on the roadside.

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[gus-lopez]

Hi again @GWAYGWAY I managed to get straight through to an engineer at SV Tech this time. He confirmed, as others have said (although contradicted by some), that DVLA do not change the Maximum Permissible Mass and it is the Revenue Weight which is used for enforcement purposes. He did say that they may change the MPM if you write in with the original logbook and make a special request in writing. I was warned that it was quite likely that they will lose my application and logbook. Given that I have been given the same reply by DVLA and SV Tech I am minded to take this as the correct answer, although as I posted in the other thread on this topic I did find a government website which seems to contradict this!

Not a lot of use though when the Gendarme/Guardia civil look at MPM( PMA here .Peso maxima autorisado) as the max weight so if over that then You will be fighting a losing battle.
Revenue weight is just that. Means nothing to anyone outside the tax office & dvla.

 

[vwalan]

many vehicles dont show anything at all on the weights written on log book . but as said revenue weight is it .
mind i agree you would think its all important but authority couldnt get drunk in a brewery .
or perhaps authority is already drunk.
we have to follow the rules or get punished . they dont seem to know what the rules are or follow them and make it up as they go along .
no wonder the world is such a mess .
beam me up scottie . ha ha .

 

[Stretto Boy]

Not a lot of use though when the Gendarme/Guardia civil look at MPM( PMA here .Peso maxima autorisado) as the max weight so if over that then You will be fighting a losing battle.
Revenue weight is just that. Means nothing to anyone outside the tax office & dvla.

I think that, as it would be lawful in the UK, then we are on the right side of the law in EU and probably other European countries BUT if you get a fixed penalty abroad then most of us wouldn't have the will or the resources to contest it in court. What a mess!

 

[Lorryman100]

I had the exact same issue with the exact same answer from SV Tech. So my solution was to run it by a neighbor who is a traffic cop. He stated that they use the revenue weight logged by the DVLA on the vehicles V5.

 

[Pausim]

My Sprinter/Hymer was registered from the start at 4200 (2015) and that is the only weight given in the V5, the max vehicle mass and weight in service have both been left blank. It suggests that the DVLA don't think these other figures are important. Perhaps they leave the original figures in because they have no idea what to change them to once it is over 3500. It might prove easier if you asked them to leave them blank rather than update them. Is the weight in service another name for MIRO if so that would not change?

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[Crazylegs]

It seems that I have the correct things on mine then, and the vehicle plate is 4200kgs The VOSA people go by that and not the paperwork. The French might just think otherwise though . Interesting to be told they are not interested in the motorhomes though and as they are not commercial , unlikely to be pulled on the roadside.

I have been trying to make exactly this point on several platforms recently to combat the near paranoia that seems to exist regarding the weight subject. Some talk of huge fines, others claim if your a tad overweight your not insured!! If folk would look at the advice given by the DSA on overweight vehicles they would discover that non commercial drivers are regarded entirely differently from freight carrying vans and trucks.

 

[GWAYGWAY]

All this still allows me to drop the weight DOWN to 3500kgs in two years time, I have the options of transferring the heavier items to a trailer and still be able to have it with us. Silly rules really as with the trailer it will be the same total weight as before PLUS the trailer weight. Only the built in things like gas bottles, will be in the van. That is why I chose this model in the first place. If I actually make it to seventy, that is.

 

[gus-lopez]

I'm sure you will.

 

[nicholsong]

I had the exact same issue with the exact same answer from SV Tech. So my solution was to run it by a neighbor who is a traffic cop. He stated that they use the revenue weight logged by the DVLA on the vehicles V5.

I am assembling information on this subject in preparation for a letter to the DfT, which is HM Ministry overseeing both DVLA and DVSA.

May I ask you to please enquire of your traffic cop friend the following

What are they checking for? Are these just for Police checks or when they are assisting DVSA checks?

Is it that the VED has been paid and in which category?

Is it for checking possibly exceeding wieght limits?

If for weight limits, what to they do if the revenue weight is higher than the Max Permissible Mass on the V5C? Which do they adhere to then?

Thanks in advance

Geoff

 

[Lorryman100]

I only know him to say hello too whenever I see him out with his dog and we sometimes small talk which was when I took the opportunity to ask him about the MoHo weight on the V5. From what I can remember is that when a vehicle is pulled into the weighbridge the VOSA officer carries a small blackberry type device and they can then put the vehicle reg into this and get back the vehicle details held by the DVLA if it is not obvious what the revenue weight is. Police at Ports use the same device, you see it sometimes when sat in the boarding line as a Police officer walks up the line of vehicles who appears to be texting on a mobile phone. The last time I was pulled into a weighbridge they just ran me over the weight plate and waved me out of the checkpoint without checking the weight plates on the Landrover or Caravan.

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[nicholsong]

I only know him to say hello too whenever I see him out with his dog and we sometimes small talk which was when I took the opportunity to ask him about the MoHo weight on the V5. From what I can remember is that when a vehicle is pulled into the weighbridge the VOSA officer carries a small blackberry type device and they can then put the vehicle reg into this and get back the vehicle details held by the DVLA if it is not obvious what the revenue weight is. Police at Ports use the same device, you see it sometimes when sat in the boarding line as a Police officer walks up the line of vehicles who appears to be texting on a mobile phone. The last time I was pulled into a weighbridge they just ran me over the weight plate and waved me out of the checkpoint without checking the weight plates on the Landrover or Caravan.

That gave me a good laugh

Thanks for reply.

From this and other posts, here and elsewhere, it is obvious that DVLA records have a ficticious connection to the physical attributes of the vehicles.

They are a revenue collection agency and what they know about vehicles could be written on a postage stamp.

Geoff

 

[mpdcymru]

"revenue weight" relates only to the Vehicle Excise and Registration Act 1994 and its' only relevance is with reference to the taxation class of the vehicle.
"Maximum Authorised Mass" (or MAM) derives from the EU Directive 2006/126/EC and relates only to driving licences.
"maximum permissible laden weight" generally relates to the limits set (or recommended) by the manufacturer. This can be confusing, especially in relation to a motorhome because it will often have a maximum permissible laden weight issued by the base vehicle manufacturer and another once the body manufacturer has completed their job and even sometimes, a third, because of an up or down-plating by a third party like SVTech.
All (modern) vehicles will have a "manufacturers plate" which will give the maximum permissible weight for the vehicle (gross weight), the vehicle and any trailer towed by it (train weight) and the maximum for each axle.
A goods vehicle over 3.500 kgs subject to plating and testing will also have a "Ministry plate" generally giving the same, or often, lower weights for each of the above that will restrict the vehicle while being used in the UK.
So, DVSA will look at the revenue weight if they are checking the vehicle excise situation, the MAM if they are checking the driving licence of the driver, and the Ministry or Manufacturers plate if they are weighing the vehicle.
As drivers, we are expected to know all of that of course!